Can Sir Keir Starmer revive the Labour Party?
Discussion
REALIST123 said:
Andy 308GTB said:
98elise said:
ash73 said:
I think Keir has the potential to be the best Labour leader since John Smith. He's got a good reserved statesman quality about him, and generally speaks sense.
If he sidelines Momentum and pitches centre-left policies I could see him being PM.
Boris' handling of the crisis has been poor; if we're going to have a socialist government we might as well do it properly.
Keir spent his first day writing point scoring sound bites to bIf he sidelines Momentum and pitches centre-left policies I could see him being PM.
Boris' handling of the crisis has been poor; if we're going to have a socialist government we might as well do it properly.
h from the sidelines. If he has any sensible alternate plans let's hear them. I won't hold my breath.He had the chance to contribute positively, with Boris open to a bipartisan approach. Kier just acted like any other politician and opposes anything that wasn't done by their side.
He could of thrown a curved ball in & said how willing he was to co-operate and left it at that.
It augurs badly for his future. If he can’t see the obvious how’s he going to deal with the ingrained, hidden nastiness within his party?
Very disappointing.
were own goals.
In fairness to Starmer, the other candidates would have acted no differently.
It's a shame that's how Starmer kicked off, but when you have the media we do, he's just fueling the fire.
How much hate must you have for humanity, to have voted to inflict Rayner on everyone, for anything other than ministry of poster paint?
Starmer sounds less convincing that a Cillit Bang advert.
Lets see if he comes out batting for what's good for society & the country, or the usual, dogged, expected, same-old.
For just a minute, benefit of the doubt.
Starmer sounds less convincing that a Cillit Bang advert.
Lets see if he comes out batting for what's good for society & the country, or the usual, dogged, expected, same-old.
For just a minute, benefit of the doubt.
BBC said:
(Starmer) also called for a "national vaccine programme" against the virus.
Not surprised they put it in quotes. Calling for something that isn't yet possible just makes him look like an idiot, and it is frickin' obvious that if/when a vaccine is developed then all effort will go into distributing it.Plank!
I can’t believe anyone in here still thinks Brexit is or will be relevant again. There is one slightly more pressing issue that’s led to another. That being a virus described as a national emergency, leading to the global economy being thrown under a bus. There may well be quite a bit of pressure for us to focus on things other than a flag waving separation.
unident said:
I can’t believe anyone in here still thinks Brexit is or will be relevant again. There is one slightly more pressing issue that’s led to another. That being a virus described as a national emergency, leading to the global economy being thrown under a bus. There may well be quite a bit of pressure for us to focus on things other than a flag waving separation.
In 5 years time I don't believe that the electorate in the northern heartland will have forgotten who the architect of the policy to frustrate the result of the referendum was.Right now I agree that the virus is top of the list but the election isn't now.
Steve H said:
I don’t follow this well enough to comment on how likely Starmer is to turn Labour round but if his first move is to take shots at the government while a crisis is still ramping up, I’m unimpressed.
Demanding a precise Corona exit policy right now shows either the same level of stupidity or the same intention to disrupt the process as when the remainers were asking for all Brexit negotiating positions to be detailed in public
.
Hi SteveDemanding a precise Corona exit policy right now shows either the same level of stupidity or the same intention to disrupt the process as when the remainers were asking for all Brexit negotiating positions to be detailed in public
.
Can't disagree, we don't know when we will be able to exit or what state the world and country will be in so how can you build an exit strategy.
He is also saying a mass vaccination program should be implemented, interesting where he thinks this vaccine is coming from!,,
Same old same old from Labour, critical of everything and nothing constructive to add.
On another note i may have to avail myself of your services, just getting another 25bhp or so released from my car and then when all this virus is behind us I need to get back on track!
Edited by gruffalo on Sunday 5th April 11:05
unident said:
I can’t believe anyone in here still thinks Brexit is or will be relevant again. There is one slightly more pressing issue that’s led to another. That being a virus described as a national emergency, leading to the global economy being thrown under a bus. There may well be quite a bit of pressure for us to focus on things other than a flag waving separation.
Do you think if after we've returned to something like normal, the govt says "oh by the way we aren't leaving the EU after all" there won't be a bit of a kerfuffle? 
Johnnytheboy said:
unident said:
I can’t believe anyone in here still thinks Brexit is or will be relevant again. There is one slightly more pressing issue that’s led to another. That being a virus described as a national emergency, leading to the global economy being thrown under a bus. There may well be quite a bit of pressure for us to focus on things other than a flag waving separation.
Do you think if after we've returned to something like normal, the govt says "oh by the way we aren't leaving the EU after all" there won't be a bit of a kerfuffle? Johnnytheboy said:
unident said:
I can’t believe anyone in here still thinks Brexit is or will be relevant again. There is one slightly more pressing issue that’s led to another. That being a virus described as a national emergency, leading to the global economy being thrown under a bus. There may well be quite a bit of pressure for us to focus on things other than a flag waving separation.
Do you think if after we've returned to something like normal, the govt says "oh by the way we aren't leaving the EU after all" there won't be a bit of a kerfuffle? When do you think we’ll “return to something like normal”? There’s already talk of this clampdown lasting for another 6 months and social distancing for 2 years. We’ve got an economy that’s effectively non-existent, we’ll have millions unemployed, industries that were considered strong will be virtually extinct, others will be a fraction of what they were. I know there will be opportunity as a result, but your Average Joe isn’t an entrepreneur despite what many claim.
Few will be sitting there demanding Brexit in whatever form, they will be demanding a job, a way to pay their mortgage, a way to feed themselves etc. That’s what the next few years are going to look like, not some flag waving, about some petty bickering in Brussels.
Starmer has today been clear about not scoring political points while we’re going through this, I’m not convinced that will hold true throughout, but the fact he’s questioned our exit strategy and the admission has been that we don’t have one is a decent start. However, as has been said on here, it doesn’t matter what he does, he’s not who you’ll be voting for no matter what he does.
I had/have a very low opinion of Boris...yet he has done a much better job than I thought he would, credit where it's due. (Admittedly i had not set him a high bar of expectation!). We wont know how well he handled this current situation till the dust settles and the unavoidable enquiry is done. I have a similarly low opinion of Starmer, but who knows, he may surprise in the way Boris has. I do see he makes Labour a more palatable repast for many, taking them back into a compromised centre ground in an attempt to be all things to all men. But, If I'm going to have a centrist government I would rather it was led by johnson the starmer at the minute. A starmer led labour party runs the risk of being a Blair lite affair, so not a party for me
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Edited by biggbn on Sunday 5th April 11:20
biggbn said:
I had/have a very low opinion of Boris...yet he had done a much better job than I thought he would, credit where it's due. We wont know how well he handled this current situation till the dust settles and the unavoidable enquiry is done. I have a similarly low opinion of Starmer, but who knows, he may surprise in the way Boris has. I do see he makes Labour a more palatable repast for many, taking them back into a compromised centre ground in an attempt to be all things to all men. But, If I'm going to have a centrist government I would rather it was led by johnson the starmer at the minute. A starmer led labour party runs the risk of being a Blair lite affair, so not a party for me
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I agree, but would always reference the election at the end of WWII. Churchill was out on ear then despite the way history looks back on him and this is often forgotten. ______________
I don’t know what Starmer is going to be like, he’s been in the job for a day. As I’ve said before I hope he can do something to provide a credible opposition, especially at a time where parliament in effectively shut down for the foreseeable future.
unident said:
biggbn said:
I had/have a very low opinion of Boris...yet he had done a much better job than I thought he would, credit where it's due. We wont know how well he handled this current situation till the dust settles and the unavoidable enquiry is done. I have a similarly low opinion of Starmer, but who knows, he may surprise in the way Boris has. I do see he makes Labour a more palatable repast for many, taking them back into a compromised centre ground in an attempt to be all things to all men. But, If I'm going to have a centrist government I would rather it was led by johnson the starmer at the minute. A starmer led labour party runs the risk of being a Blair lite affair, so not a party for me
______________
I agree, but would always reference the election at the end of WWII. Churchill was out on ear then despite the way history looks back on him and this is often forgotten. ______________
I don’t know what Starmer is going to be like, he’s been in the job for a day. As I’ve said before I hope he can do something to provide a credible opposition, especially at a time where parliament in effectively shut down for the foreseeable future.
unident said:
Johnnytheboy said:
unident said:
I can’t believe anyone in here still thinks Brexit is or will be relevant again. There is one slightly more pressing issue that’s led to another. That being a virus described as a national emergency, leading to the global economy being thrown under a bus. There may well be quite a bit of pressure for us to focus on things other than a flag waving separation.
Do you think if after we've returned to something like normal, the govt says "oh by the way we aren't leaving the EU after all" there won't be a bit of a kerfuffle? When do you think we’ll “return to something like normal”? There’s already talk of this clampdown lasting for another 6 months and social distancing for 2 years. We’ve got an economy that’s effectively non-existent, we’ll have millions unemployed, industries that were considered strong will be virtually extinct, others will be a fraction of what they were. I know there will be opportunity as a result, but your Average Joe isn’t an entrepreneur despite what many claim.
Few will be sitting there demanding Brexit in whatever form, they will be demanding a job, a way to pay their mortgage, a way to feed themselves etc. That’s what the next few years are going to look like, not some flag waving, about some petty bickering in Brussels.
Starmer has today been clear about not scoring political points while we’re going through this, I’m not convinced that will hold true throughout, but the fact he’s questioned our exit strategy and the admission has been that we don’t have one is a decent start. However, as has been said on here, it doesn’t matter what he does, he’s not who you’ll be voting for no matter what he does.
its that simple !!!
gruffalo said:
This but I don't think Starmer will be the leader, his is useful to try and turn Labour round but I think he is damaged goods to many of the heartland voters.
So who else is there?That’s why I wonder if we wouldn’t all be better off seeing the end of the current Labour Party and allow a completely new opposition to develop.
I’m just not sure they’re recoverable from where they now are.
As I said up thread to deafening silence, it's not Starmer that is toxic to the heartlands (e.g. old Labour predominantly white working class seats).
It's not even the Labour Party really.
It's centre left parties in general; across Europe their vote shares are in rapid decline.
Put simply, their old core vote look at them tying themselves in knots over things like whether feminism is better or worse than transgender rights, and think "that offers me nothing, I'm more worried about having a job, and controls on immigration".
Meanwhile, if said parties try and move one iota to address their core vote's concerns, they alienate their other constituency: the 'right on Left' so to speak, who then defect to parties like the Greens.
I wouldn't want to be planning a long career as a centre Left politician.
It's not even the Labour Party really.
It's centre left parties in general; across Europe their vote shares are in rapid decline.
Put simply, their old core vote look at them tying themselves in knots over things like whether feminism is better or worse than transgender rights, and think "that offers me nothing, I'm more worried about having a job, and controls on immigration".
Meanwhile, if said parties try and move one iota to address their core vote's concerns, they alienate their other constituency: the 'right on Left' so to speak, who then defect to parties like the Greens.
I wouldn't want to be planning a long career as a centre Left politician.
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