Can Sir Keir Starmer revive the Labour Party?

[Murph7355]

budgie smuggler said:

Maybe Kier doesn't actually want him to resign but rather to limp on doing a terrible job until the next GE. If Boris resigns and somebody vaguely competent gets into power it's going to make his job a lot harder.

That suggests political intelligence and forethought.

So unlikely.

[Brave Fart]

budgie smuggler said:

Maybe Kier doesn't actually want him to resign but rather to limp on doing a terrible job until the next GE. If Boris resigns and somebody vaguely competent gets into power it's going to make his job a lot harder.

You cynical old thing, you!
But there's some truth in what you say; Boris might be Labour's best chance of winning the next election. Except that Keir Starmer might be the Tories' secret weapon. Hmm. Perhaps they'll cancel each other out.

Have we ever had (combined) two poorer Con + Lab leaders, from Thatcher onwards, than we have now?

[swisstoni]

Brave Fart said:

budgie smuggler said:

Maybe Kier doesn't actually want him to resign but rather to limp on doing a terrible job until the next GE. If Boris resigns and somebody vaguely competent gets into power it's going to make his job a lot harder.

You cynical old thing, you!
But there's some truth in what you say; Boris might be Labour's best chance of winning the next election. Except that Keir Starmer might be the Tories' secret weapon. Hmm. Perhaps they'll cancel each other out.

Have we ever had (combined) two poorer Con + Lab leaders, from Thatcher onwards, than we have now?

I recon a lot of them were utterly rubbish in the past. It’s just that their every facial expression and fart wasn’t analysed 24/7 like it is today.

[anonymoususer]

swisstoni said:

. It’s just that their every facial expression and fart wasn’t analysed 24/7 like it is today.

Sorry to snip your post but I think this is incredibly accurate
Every bloody thing is immediately poured over and argued about.
I think way too much news time is spent on politicians it's simply an industry now. I will never forget the self important point scoring that went om in the early days of lockdown and the daily briefings

[bristolracer]

Boris blurts out an idea

Kier says 'it doesn't go far enough'

Repeat ad nauseam without an idea of his own.

[biggbn]

Brave Fart said:

You cynical old thing, you!
But there's some truth in what you say; Boris might be Labour's best chance of winning the next election. Except that Keir Starmer might be the Tories' secret weapon. Hmm. Perhaps they'll cancel each other out.

Have we ever had (combined) two poorer Con + Lab leaders, from Thatcher onwards, than we have now?

No, I don't think we have. The Labour leadership has always been a bit of a joke to me, but like them or not, the Tories usually had strong, disciplined leaders. Them was the days....

[Cobnapint]

Starmers pausing for effect is, in part, due to the fact that he's reading his questions (very badly) off a pre-written crib sheet in front of him.
Which, for a guy with the experience of the careers he's had, is pretty piss poor.

[anonymous-user]

Cobnapint said:

Starmers pausing for effect is, in part, due to the fact that he's reading his questions (very badly) off a pre-written crib sheet in front of him.
Which, for a guy with the experience of the careers he's had, is pretty piss poor.

He doesn't strike me as the finest mind our legal profession has to offer.

[Gecko1978]

AstonZagato said:

loafer123 said:

Vasco said:

Agreed, I too was somewhat surprised at the 'highly articulate' comment. He reminds me a bit of that other grey man with no personality - John Major (though I believe he was more intelligent than he appeared).

Major was supposed to have charisma in person, though…

I knew someone who used to flat share with Major. His view was that, if everyone in the country were to spend half an hour with him, he'd get every single vote. Zero charisma on the goggle box but engaging face-to-face.

Met him 12 years ago.....he was interesting and engaging and did not come across like a

[Derek Smith]

Gecko1978 said:

AstonZagato said:

loafer123 said:

Vasco said:

Agreed, I too was somewhat surprised at the 'highly articulate' comment. He reminds me a bit of that other grey man with no personality - John Major (though I believe he was more intelligent than he appeared).

Major was supposed to have charisma in person, though…

I knew someone who used to flat share with Major. His view was that, if everyone in the country were to spend half an hour with him, he'd get every single vote. Zero charisma on the goggle box but engaging face-to-face.

Met him 12 years ago.....he was interesting and engaging and did not come across like a

I've a son who works in TV news. He meets lots of the cabinet/shadows. He reckons that a lot of those who are regarded as lacking in charisma are very pleasant and engaging when you chat to them. They've got no reason to be nice to him, or influence him in any way. A number of the bête noires on PH are different once off camera. One or two of the heroes of PH are absolute weirdos.

We tend to make judgements on how they appear on TV, and this is probably what gave us Johnson. Starmer has been criticised for lacking in charisma and seeming poor on TV. That's the way to judge 'em.

It's difficult, almost impossible I'd suggest, to work out what people are like by how they appear on TV. The only way is by what they do.

I did a screen test and more or less failed. That was bad enough. However, they picked someone who was a dolt. You could wind him up and send him on his way knowing he'd do as much as he was told and no more. That was him at work.

[Mojooo]

Keir wont win voters over alone - but another year of Boris and edging closer to an election - he may win by default.

[OzzyR1]

Mojooo said:

Keir wont win voters over alone - but another year of Boris and edging closer to an election - he may win by default.

Given how quiet Momentum and other far-left factions of the Labour party have been of late, I would guess that is what they are gambling on too.

If Labour get into power with the seemingly innocuous Starmer at the helm, I wouldn't take bets on his longevity as leader. He would have served his purpose and they would quickly vote to remove him and replace with the likes of Angela Rayner.

I'm not a fan of Boris, but the prospect of that eventuality fills me with dread.

[glazbagun]

Derek Smith said:

I've a son who works in TV news. He meets lots of the cabinet/shadows. He reckons that a lot of those who are regarded as lacking in charisma are very pleasant and engaging when you chat to them. They've got no reason to be nice to him, or influence him in any way. A number of the bête noires on PH are different once off camera. One or two of the heroes of PH are absolute weirdos.

We tend to make judgements on how they appear on TV, and this is probably what gave us Johnson. Starmer has been criticised for lacking in charisma and seeming poor on TV. That's the way to judge 'em.

It's difficult, almost impossible I'd suggest, to work out what people are like by how they appear on TV. The only way is by what they do.

I did a screen test and more or less failed. That was bad enough. However, they picked someone who was a dolt. You could wind him up and send him on his way knowing he'd do as much as he was told and no more. That was him at work.

I wonder at this in the US when we see grand speeches. On the left it's all liberty this and equality that, on the right it's all freedom and individualism and God and guns. As a Brit I just think they all saw the speech from Independence Day and tried to replicate it, they all look as fake as anything. There's something about what makes a great movie moment that is just mental when you see it in the real world. Imagine having coffee with one of Nicolas Cage's characters!

Likewise guys like Rory Stewart seem rather odd on TV, but have lived a thousand lives.

[Timothy Bucktu]

OzzyR1 said:

Given how quiet Momentum and other far-left factions of the Labour party have been of late, I would guess that is what they are gambling on too.

If Labour get into power with the seemingly innocuous Starmer at the helm, I wouldn't take bets on his longevity as leader. He would have served his purpose and they would quickly vote to remove him and replace with the likes of Angela Rayner.

I'm not a fan of Boris, but the prospect of that eventuality fills me with dread.

Rayner as PM...the stuff of nightmares!!
I mean, no. Come on now...you're just being silly, LOL.

[swisstoni]

Timothy Bucktu said:

OzzyR1 said:

Given how quiet Momentum and other far-left factions of the Labour party have been of late, I would guess that is what they are gambling on too.

If Labour get into power with the seemingly innocuous Starmer at the helm, I wouldn't take bets on his longevity as leader. He would have served his purpose and they would quickly vote to remove him and replace with the likes of Angela Rayner.

I'm not a fan of Boris, but the prospect of that eventuality fills me with dread.

Rayner as PM...the stuff of nightmares!!
I mean, no. Come on now...you're just being silly, LOL.

Sounds plausible. Starmer could be a inoffensive Trojan Horse to get elected, designed to be discarded.

[leef44]

glazbagun said:

Derek Smith said:

I've a son who works in TV news. He meets lots of the cabinet/shadows. He reckons that a lot of those who are regarded as lacking in charisma are very pleasant and engaging when you chat to them. They've got no reason to be nice to him, or influence him in any way. A number of the bête noires on PH are different once off camera. One or two of the heroes of PH are absolute weirdos.

We tend to make judgements on how they appear on TV, and this is probably what gave us Johnson. Starmer has been criticised for lacking in charisma and seeming poor on TV. That's the way to judge 'em.

It's difficult, almost impossible I'd suggest, to work out what people are like by how they appear on TV. The only way is by what they do.

I did a screen test and more or less failed. That was bad enough. However, they picked someone who was a dolt. You could wind him up and send him on his way knowing he'd do as much as he was told and no more. That was him at work.

I wonder at this in the US when we see grand speeches. On the left it's all liberty this and equality that, on the right it's all freedom and individualism and God and guns. As a Brit I just think they all saw the speech from Independence Day and tried to replicate it, they all look as fake as anything. There's something about what makes a great movie moment that is just mental when you see it in the real world. Imagine having coffee with one of Nicolas Cage's characters!

Likewise guys like Rory Stewart seem rather odd on TV, but have lived a thousand lives.

But you have to wonder, maybe the speeches are written by the same script writers as Independence Day and Armageddon. Politicians will have professional script writers.

[williamp]

swisstoni said:

Timothy Bucktu said:

OzzyR1 said:

Given how quiet Momentum and other far-left factions of the Labour party have been of late, I would guess that is what they are gambling on too.

If Labour get into power with the seemingly innocuous Starmer at the helm, I wouldn't take bets on his longevity as leader. He would have served his purpose and they would quickly vote to remove him and replace with the likes of Angela Rayner.

I'm not a fan of Boris, but the prospect of that eventuality fills me with dread.

Rayner as PM...the stuff of nightmares!!
I mean, no. Come on now...you're just being silly, LOL.

Sounds plausible. Starmer could be a inoffensive Trojan Horse to get elected, designed to be discarded.

I keep saying it: the next labour leader cannot have a willy. Of if they do, they must be thihking about getting the chop. The only major political party in the western world to never have female leader???

[General Price]

williamp said:

swisstoni said:

Timothy Bucktu said:

OzzyR1 said:

Given how quiet Momentum and other far-left factions of the Labour party have been of late, I would guess that is what they are gambling on too.

If Labour get into power with the seemingly innocuous Starmer at the helm, I wouldn't take bets on his longevity as leader. He would have served his purpose and they would quickly vote to remove him and replace with the likes of Angela Rayner.

I'm not a fan of Boris, but the prospect of that eventuality fills me with dread.

Rayner as PM...the stuff of nightmares!!
I mean, no. Come on now...you're just being silly, LOL.

Sounds plausible. Starmer could be a inoffensive Trojan Horse to get elected, designed to be discarded.

I keep saying it: the next labour leader cannot have a willy. Of if they do, they must be thihking about getting the chop. The only major political party in the western world to never have female leader???

Ah but,Sir Keir has come out and said that some women can have a penis.

Therefore Labour can have a Women leader with a penis and it can still count as a Women.

[Cold]

Observer poll suggests Starmer is a worse choice for PM than Johnson.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/jun/11/p...

[Vanden Saab]

Bearing in mind Starmers woeful performance at PMQs I do wonder if he had already had the nod that he is going to be fined for kormagate and has given up...There does not seem to be any other explanation unless this is another of his forensic, lawyery things designed to come to fruition in two years time...