US Riots

[amusingduck]

Gadgetmac said:

Re the bit in bold above I don't believe it is. The Taser has been issued for these kind of situations, he didn't have a firearm he had a knife and was at enough of a distance to be tasered. His colleague had a gun aimed at the guy and could have taken him down if the taser had failed to stop him. The knifeman did not run at the officers giving them no time to use the taser.

Rightly or wrongly incidents like this are just asking for people to questions the police officers actions.

They didn't have Tasers, apparently

https://patch.com/pennsylvania/philadelphia/philad...

[Greendubber]

Gadgetmac said:

Greendubber said:

Gadgetmac said:

amusingduck said:

Gadgetmac said:

Looking at that video why didn't they taser him? In the UK he'd have been tasered.

Tasers aren't always effective, check the other video I posted, in that case the taser was virtually useless

That's not an argument. If it were the US police wouldn't have Tasers at all. From what I've read it's the fact that the Police went straight for their guns and didn't bother with their issued Tasers that concerns people in this instance.

If you're not going to use them why have them? It's not like they aren't trained in their use.

It's a reason not to use it though. The Male with the knife is clearly going for the officers, a Taser wont work every time, I'm sure it's less than 50% of the time actually yet people think they're the best thing since sliced bread. They're a great tool but are severely limited.

When faced with those odds I'd suggest they're perfectly justified to use their firearms over a taser that might stop him but also might not make a bit of difference.

Re the bit in bold above I don't believe it is. The Taser has been issued for these kind of situations, he didn't have a firearm he had a knife and was at enough of a distance to be tasered. His colleague had a gun aimed at the guy and could have taken him down if the taser had failed to stop him. The knifeman did not run at the officers giving them no time to use the taser.

Rightly or wrongly incidents like this are just asking for people to questions the police officers actions.

And you'd be wrong. The fact they carry a taser doesnt mean it HAS to be used before the option of a firearm.

If you knew the odds of a taser working correctly you wouldn't want to take that chance either.

[andy_s]

Escalation protocol says: 1. presence -> verbal -> command -> physical restraint -> tazer -> gun. 2. These do not have to be gone through in order, depending on situation.

[A Winner Is You]

Pro life tip - when liberating goods to end racism, go to the aisle that sells sack barrows first. It will make the rest of the night much easier.

https://twitter.com/SVNewsAlerts/status/1321279672...

[Gadgetmac]

Greendubber said:

Gadgetmac said:

Greendubber said:

Gadgetmac said:

amusingduck said:

Gadgetmac said:

Looking at that video why didn't they taser him? In the UK he'd have been tasered.

Tasers aren't always effective, check the other video I posted, in that case the taser was virtually useless

That's not an argument. If it were the US police wouldn't have Tasers at all. From what I've read it's the fact that the Police went straight for their guns and didn't bother with their issued Tasers that concerns people in this instance.

If you're not going to use them why have them? It's not like they aren't trained in their use.

It's a reason not to use it though. The Male with the knife is clearly going for the officers, a Taser wont work every time, I'm sure it's less than 50% of the time actually yet people think they're the best thing since sliced bread. They're a great tool but are severely limited.

When faced with those odds I'd suggest they're perfectly justified to use their firearms over a taser that might stop him but also might not make a bit of difference.

Re the bit in bold above I don't believe it is. The Taser has been issued for these kind of situations, he didn't have a firearm he had a knife and was at enough of a distance to be tasered. His colleague had a gun aimed at the guy and could have taken him down if the taser had failed to stop him. The knifeman did not run at the officers giving them no time to use the taser.

Rightly or wrongly incidents like this are just asking for people to questions the police officers actions.

And you'd be wrong. The fact they carry a taser doesnt mean it HAS to be used before the option of a firearm.

If you knew the odds of a taser working correctly you wouldn't want to take that chance either.

The odds appear to be different in different states.

Carrying a Taser dosen’t mean it HAS to be used but prudence would dictate that in the current climate all other options are exhausted first. Like I say, a similar incident in the UK would result in a Taser being used. American gun culture appears to demand that the police use deadly force first.

Of course if they didn’t have tasers then that begs its own questions.

[Greendubber]

Gadgetmac said:

Greendubber said:

Gadgetmac said:

Greendubber said:

Gadgetmac said:

amusingduck said:

Gadgetmac said:

Looking at that video why didn't they taser him? In the UK he'd have been tasered.

Tasers aren't always effective, check the other video I posted, in that case the taser was virtually useless

That's not an argument. If it were the US police wouldn't have Tasers at all. From what I've read it's the fact that the Police went straight for their guns and didn't bother with their issued Tasers that concerns people in this instance.

If you're not going to use them why have them? It's not like they aren't trained in their use.

It's a reason not to use it though. The Male with the knife is clearly going for the officers, a Taser wont work every time, I'm sure it's less than 50% of the time actually yet people think they're the best thing since sliced bread. They're a great tool but are severely limited.

When faced with those odds I'd suggest they're perfectly justified to use their firearms over a taser that might stop him but also might not make a bit of difference.

Re the bit in bold above I don't believe it is. The Taser has been issued for these kind of situations, he didn't have a firearm he had a knife and was at enough of a distance to be tasered. His colleague had a gun aimed at the guy and could have taken him down if the taser had failed to stop him. The knifeman did not run at the officers giving them no time to use the taser.

Rightly or wrongly incidents like this are just asking for people to questions the police officers actions.

And you'd be wrong. The fact they carry a taser doesnt mean it HAS to be used before the option of a firearm.

If you knew the odds of a taser working correctly you wouldn't want to take that chance either.

The odds appear to be different in different states.

Carrying a Taser dosen’t mean it HAS to be used but prudence would dictate that in the current climate all other options are exhausted first. Like I say, a similar incident in the UK would result in a Taser being used. American gun culture appears to demand that the police use deadly force first.

Of course if they didn’t have tasers then that begs its own questions.

No, you use the most suitable bit of equipment available which in this circumstances was a firearm. You cant have politics, social movements, protest groups etc interfering with how a threat is dealt with. If you went to taser him and it didnt work you'd have to holster the taser, draw your firearm, get on aim and take the shot. By that point you'd probably have a knife in your neck.

I agree the person would probably have been tasered here but thats because the cast majority of officers dont have a conventional firearm on them.

[Gadgetmac]

Greendubber said:

Gadgetmac said:

Greendubber said:

Gadgetmac said:

Greendubber said:

Gadgetmac said:

amusingduck said:

Gadgetmac said:

Looking at that video why didn't they taser him? In the UK he'd have been tasered.

Tasers aren't always effective, check the other video I posted, in that case the taser was virtually useless

That's not an argument. If it were the US police wouldn't have Tasers at all. From what I've read it's the fact that the Police went straight for their guns and didn't bother with their issued Tasers that concerns people in this instance.

If you're not going to use them why have them? It's not like they aren't trained in their use.

It's a reason not to use it though. The Male with the knife is clearly going for the officers, a Taser wont work every time, I'm sure it's less than 50% of the time actually yet people think they're the best thing since sliced bread. They're a great tool but are severely limited.

When faced with those odds I'd suggest they're perfectly justified to use their firearms over a taser that might stop him but also might not make a bit of difference.

Re the bit in bold above I don't believe it is. The Taser has been issued for these kind of situations, he didn't have a firearm he had a knife and was at enough of a distance to be tasered. His colleague had a gun aimed at the guy and could have taken him down if the taser had failed to stop him. The knifeman did not run at the officers giving them no time to use the taser.

Rightly or wrongly incidents like this are just asking for people to questions the police officers actions.

And you'd be wrong. The fact they carry a taser doesnt mean it HAS to be used before the option of a firearm.

If you knew the odds of a taser working correctly you wouldn't want to take that chance either.

The odds appear to be different in different states.

Carrying a Taser dosen’t mean it HAS to be used but prudence would dictate that in the current climate all other options are exhausted first. Like I say, a similar incident in the UK would result in a Taser being used. American gun culture appears to demand that the police use deadly force first.

Of course if they didn’t have tasers then that begs its own questions.

No, you use the most suitable bit of equipment available which in this circumstances was a firearm. You cant have politics, social movements, protest groups etc interfering with how a threat is dealt with. If you went to taser him and it didnt work you'd have to holster the taser, draw your firearm, get on aim and take the shot. By that point you'd probably have a knife in your neck.

I agree the person would probably have been tasered here but thats because the cast majority of officers dont have a conventional firearm on them.

They had 2 officers. One could have fired a taser with the second officer prepared with the gun if the taser didn’t work.

I agree with the ITV News that the knifeman did not present an immediate threat.

[andy_s]

Gadgetmac said:

They had 2 officers. One could have fired a taser with the second officer prepared with the gun if the taser didn’t work.

I agree with the ITV News that the knifeman did not present an immediate threat.

ITV News know nothing.

Did he have a knife? Was he within 21 feet of anyone? Was he 'agitated', was he 'responsive to command'? Then he's a potential lethal threat, [US court precedent, police protocol]. How you deal with that - to save life - is a matrix of snap judgement under pressure, resources, protocols, risk management and balls.

[g4ry13]

Gadgetmac said:

Greendubber said:

Gadgetmac said:

Greendubber said:

Gadgetmac said:

Greendubber said:

Gadgetmac said:

amusingduck said:

Gadgetmac said:

Looking at that video why didn't they taser him? In the UK he'd have been tasered.

Tasers aren't always effective, check the other video I posted, in that case the taser was virtually useless

That's not an argument. If it were the US police wouldn't have Tasers at all. From what I've read it's the fact that the Police went straight for their guns and didn't bother with their issued Tasers that concerns people in this instance.

If you're not going to use them why have them? It's not like they aren't trained in their use.

It's a reason not to use it though. The Male with the knife is clearly going for the officers, a Taser wont work every time, I'm sure it's less than 50% of the time actually yet people think they're the best thing since sliced bread. They're a great tool but are severely limited.

When faced with those odds I'd suggest they're perfectly justified to use their firearms over a taser that might stop him but also might not make a bit of difference.

Re the bit in bold above I don't believe it is. The Taser has been issued for these kind of situations, he didn't have a firearm he had a knife and was at enough of a distance to be tasered. His colleague had a gun aimed at the guy and could have taken him down if the taser had failed to stop him. The knifeman did not run at the officers giving them no time to use the taser.

Rightly or wrongly incidents like this are just asking for people to questions the police officers actions.

And you'd be wrong. The fact they carry a taser doesnt mean it HAS to be used before the option of a firearm.

If you knew the odds of a taser working correctly you wouldn't want to take that chance either.

The odds appear to be different in different states.

Carrying a Taser dosen’t mean it HAS to be used but prudence would dictate that in the current climate all other options are exhausted first. Like I say, a similar incident in the UK would result in a Taser being used. American gun culture appears to demand that the police use deadly force first.

Of course if they didn’t have tasers then that begs its own questions.

No, you use the most suitable bit of equipment available which in this circumstances was a firearm. You cant have politics, social movements, protest groups etc interfering with how a threat is dealt with. If you went to taser him and it didnt work you'd have to holster the taser, draw your firearm, get on aim and take the shot. By that point you'd probably have a knife in your neck.

I agree the person would probably have been tasered here but thats because the cast majority of officers dont have a conventional firearm on them.

They had 2 officers. One could have fired a taser with the second officer prepared with the gun if the taser didn’t work.

I agree with the ITV News that the knifeman did not present an immediate threat.

Well it's very easy to make that decision from the warmth of a studio in London and not when some guy is about to potentially plunge a knife in you.

[vulture1]

Did the USA not have a black president for 8 years? How did he not sort out inequality in that time?

[Greendubber]

Gadgetmac said:

Greendubber said:

Gadgetmac said:

Greendubber said:

Gadgetmac said:

Greendubber said:

Gadgetmac said:

amusingduck said:

Gadgetmac said:

Looking at that video why didn't they taser him? In the UK he'd have been tasered.

Tasers aren't always effective, check the other video I posted, in that case the taser was virtually useless

That's not an argument. If it were the US police wouldn't have Tasers at all. From what I've read it's the fact that the Police went straight for their guns and didn't bother with their issued Tasers that concerns people in this instance.

If you're not going to use them why have them? It's not like they aren't trained in their use.

It's a reason not to use it though. The Male with the knife is clearly going for the officers, a Taser wont work every time, I'm sure it's less than 50% of the time actually yet people think they're the best thing since sliced bread. They're a great tool but are severely limited.

When faced with those odds I'd suggest they're perfectly justified to use their firearms over a taser that might stop him but also might not make a bit of difference.

Re the bit in bold above I don't believe it is. The Taser has been issued for these kind of situations, he didn't have a firearm he had a knife and was at enough of a distance to be tasered. His colleague had a gun aimed at the guy and could have taken him down if the taser had failed to stop him. The knifeman did not run at the officers giving them no time to use the taser.

Rightly or wrongly incidents like this are just asking for people to questions the police officers actions.

And you'd be wrong. The fact they carry a taser doesnt mean it HAS to be used before the option of a firearm.

If you knew the odds of a taser working correctly you wouldn't want to take that chance either.

The odds appear to be different in different states.

Carrying a Taser dosen’t mean it HAS to be used but prudence would dictate that in the current climate all other options are exhausted first. Like I say, a similar incident in the UK would result in a Taser being used. American gun culture appears to demand that the police use deadly force first.

Of course if they didn’t have tasers then that begs its own questions.

No, you use the most suitable bit of equipment available which in this circumstances was a firearm. You cant have politics, social movements, protest groups etc interfering with how a threat is dealt with. If you went to taser him and it didnt work you'd have to holster the taser, draw your firearm, get on aim and take the shot. By that point you'd probably have a knife in your neck.

I agree the person would probably have been tasered here but thats because the cast majority of officers dont have a conventional firearm on them.

They had 2 officers. One could have fired a taser with the second officer prepared with the gun if the taser didn’t work.

I agree with the ITV News that the knifeman did not present an immediate threat.

I'm sure you would if you had a bloke chasing you with a knife ignoring your commands to drop it.

Meanwhile, back on planet earth....

Edited by Greendubber on Wednesday 28th October 20:25

[Gandahar]

It's bit like when you drive through Whipsnade monkey enclosure, but rather than ripping the windscreen wiper off they are all armed with Glock 9mm and like to protest and get a free pair of sneakers as well.

Luckily the monkeys at Whipsnade don't have to worry about the 2nd amendment.




God bless America.

The land that God blessed with volcanoes, hurricanes, wild fires and earthquakes.

Well done God.

He rocks.

Litterally, on the San Adreas fault...


PS Forgot tornadoes.

Edited by Gandahar on Wednesday 28th October 20:40

[Gandahar]

Greendubber said:

Gadgetmac said:

Greendubber said:

Gadgetmac said:

Greendubber said:

Gadgetmac said:

Greendubber said:

Gadgetmac said:

amusingduck said:

Gadgetmac said:

Looking at that video why didn't they taser him? In the UK he'd have been tasered.

Tasers aren't always effective, check the other video I posted, in that case the taser was virtually useless

That's not an argument. If it were the US police wouldn't have Tasers at all. From what I've read it's the fact that the Police went straight for their guns and didn't bother with their issued Tasers that concerns people in this instance.

If you're not going to use them why have them? It's not like they aren't trained in their use.

It's a reason not to use it though. The Male with the knife is clearly going for the officers, a Taser wont work every time, I'm sure it's less than 50% of the time actually yet people think they're the best thing since sliced bread. They're a great tool but are severely limited.

When faced with those odds I'd suggest they're perfectly justified to use their firearms over a taser that might stop him but also might not make a bit of difference.

Re the bit in bold above I don't believe it is. The Taser has been issued for these kind of situations, he didn't have a firearm he had a knife and was at enough of a distance to be tasered. His colleague had a gun aimed at the guy and could have taken him down if the taser had failed to stop him. The knifeman did not run at the officers giving them no time to use the taser.

Rightly or wrongly incidents like this are just asking for people to questions the police officers actions.

And you'd be wrong. The fact they carry a taser doesnt mean it HAS to be used before the option of a firearm.

If you knew the odds of a taser working correctly you wouldn't want to take that chance either.

The odds appear to be different in different states.

Carrying a Taser dosen’t mean it HAS to be used but prudence would dictate that in the current climate all other options are exhausted first. Like I say, a similar incident in the UK would result in a Taser being used. American gun culture appears to demand that the police use deadly force first.

Of course if they didn’t have tasers then that begs its own questions.

No, you use the most suitable bit of equipment available which in this circumstances was a firearm. You cant have politics, social movements, protest groups etc interfering with how a threat is dealt with. If you went to taser him and it didnt work you'd have to holster the taser, draw your firearm, get on aim and take the shot. By that point you'd probably have a knife in your neck.

I agree the person would probably have been tasered here but thats because the cast majority of officers dont have a conventional firearm on them.

They had 2 officers. One could have fired a taser with the second officer prepared with the gun if the taser didn’t work.

I agree with the ITV News that the knifeman did not present an immediate threat.

I'm sure you would if you had a bloke chasing you with a knife ignoring your commands to drop it.

Meanwhile, back on planet earth....

Edited by Greendubber on Wednesday 28th October 20:25

You mispelt USA as earth. Funny how one word after all that makes so much difference ...

[Red 4]

You misspelled misspelt.

[Gandahar]

Red 4 said:

You misspelled misspelt.

I blame my phone and my mother at the same time.....

Great post by the way

[Red 4]

Gandahar said:

Red 4 said:

You misspelled misspelt.

I blame my phone and my mother at the same time.....

Great post by the way

I'm 'ere all week.

[Gadgetmac]

andy_s said:

Gadgetmac said:

They had 2 officers. One could have fired a taser with the second officer prepared with the gun if the taser didn’t work.

I agree with the ITV News that the knifeman did not present an immediate threat.

ITV News know nothing.

Did he have a knife? Was he within 21 feet of anyone? Was he 'agitated', was he 'responsive to command'? Then he's a potential lethal threat, [US court precedent, police protocol]. How you deal with that - to save life - is a matrix of snap judgement under pressure, resources, protocols, risk management and balls.

ITV News were showing the footage at the time. He had stopped moving at the point he was shot. We'll see how this pans out.

[Pan Pan Pan]

Gadgetmac said:

andy_s said:

Gadgetmac said:

They had 2 officers. One could have fired a taser with the second officer prepared with the gun if the taser didn’t work.

I agree with the ITV News that the knifeman did not present an immediate threat.

ITV News know nothing.

Did he have a knife? Was he within 21 feet of anyone? Was he 'agitated', was he 'responsive to command'? Then he's a potential lethal threat, [US court precedent, police protocol]. How you deal with that - to save life - is a matrix of snap judgement under pressure, resources, protocols, risk management and balls.

ITV News were showing the footage at the time. He had stopped moving at the point he was shot. We'll see how this pans out.

People often tend to stop moving a bit, when they have been shot!
It was what he was doing just prior to that, which is the important bit.

[JagLover]

Pan Pan Pan said:

People often tend to stop moving a bit, when they have been shot!
It was what he was doing just prior to that, which is the important bit.

Well exactly

If there are injustices and abuses by the police against BAME suspects I am sure the vast majority will condemn them. I cant really see the point of making martyrs out of violent criminals charging the police with weapons in hand.

[Gadgetmac]

Pan Pan Pan said:

Gadgetmac said:

andy_s said:

Gadgetmac said:

They had 2 officers. One could have fired a taser with the second officer prepared with the gun if the taser didn’t work.

I agree with the ITV News that the knifeman did not present an immediate threat.

ITV News know nothing.

Did he have a knife? Was he within 21 feet of anyone? Was he 'agitated', was he 'responsive to command'? Then he's a potential lethal threat, [US court precedent, police protocol]. How you deal with that - to save life - is a matrix of snap judgement under pressure, resources, protocols, risk management and balls.

ITV News were showing the footage at the time. He had stopped moving at the point he was shot. We'll see how this pans out.

People often tend to stop moving a bit, when they have been shot!
It was what he was doing just prior to that, which is the important bit.

He was shot AFTER he'd stopped.

But thats irrelevent if the officers didn't have Tasers.