CV19 - Cure worse than the disease? (Vol 5)

[anonymous-user]

king arthur said:

Already the government has u-turned on gym closures in Liverpool. .

Yes great news. I hope the gov listens to the people more.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-merseyside-5...

[Twinfan]

pussinboots said:

If everyone wore masks and practised a bit of social distancing and good hygiene, then life could continue as normal. We don't need a full lockdown. I'm not sure why so many people refuse to wear one. We don't need concrete proof of their effectiveness. Wearing a mask is only a very mild inconvenience.

Err, I do if it's going to be mandated by law long term. I'm still waiting for the evidence to support our current position. You may not be bothered by masks but plenty of people are. Facial expressions are very important for communication which is no good if they're hidden behind a mask for no benefit.

[MDMetal]

pussinboots said:

If everyone wore masks and practised a bit of social distancing and good hygiene, then life could continue as normal. We don't need a full lockdown. I'm not sure why so many people refuse to wear one. We don't need concrete proof of their effectiveness. Wearing a mask is only a very mild inconvenience.

Giving me £1 is only a mild inconvenience, we don't need to prove it's effective to combat the disease. Sounds ridiculous doesn't it? Say it out loud then if you and everyone else wants to give me your £1 I'll get on solving this issue, why wait?

[cymatty]

pussinboots said:

If everyone wore masks and practised a bit of social distancing and good hygiene, then life could continue as normal. We don't need a full lockdown. I'm not sure why so many people refuse to wear one. We don't need concrete proof of their effectiveness. Wearing a mask is only a very mild inconvenience.

Well it is a minor inconvenience however if they were effective then the govt would release the studies and shout from the roof top. Be interesting to see the Dutch study if it ever comes out.

People can wear masks but they need to wear them correctly.

[SCEtoAUX]

pussinboots said:

If everyone wore masks and practised a bit of social distancing and good hygiene, then life could continue as normal. We don't need a full lockdown. I'm not sure why so many people refuse to wear one. We don't need concrete proof of their effectiveness. Wearing a mask is only a very mild inconvenience.

No it isn't. It is an imposition by a COVID-obsessed government, to put people in their place and keep them scared. Here in Somerset we have not had a single COVID death in any of our hospitals since the first of June. We have had just seven COVID deaths in the last three months. Overall deaths are 13% down on a rolling five-year average.

Yet if I dare to stand up in the pub I am breaking the law if I don't wear a muzzle. That's not a minor inconvenience, it is tyranny.

[Taylor James]

isaldiri said:

JagLover said:

If Coronavirus carries you off when you reach that point then it is a natural end to a life hopefully well lived, not something to be feared or avoided.

All very true but that's a rather big 'if' there isn't it? If covid was simply bopping off oldies that were going to die soon as is often said here, we should have been seeing far lower excess deaths over summer into now.

We haven't and given 50+k excess deaths happened over March to June, that 'if' doesn't seem quite so plausible looking at what has happened subsequently.

I think that if it did just kill 80yo+ very infirm people - forget that it overwhelmingly does - it would be accepted. We treat old people pretty poorly in this country and out of sight and out of mind is pretty commonplace. We've had the odd furore over MRSA and geriatric abuse but generally the subject old people, caring for them, their death, etc stays in the shadows.

Unfortunately the way this has been positioned is that it represents an existential threat to humanity, bigger than anything since the Black Death and including world wars. We're told it doesn't just kill old people, that it will overwhelm healthcare and kill vast amounts of younger people. How long before it mutates or long covid is confirmed and think what the reaction to that will be. In the face of all that I can see no way out of it. I just can't see how every government in the world is going to backtrack. Just imagine the political fallout if Boris changed tack now, to adopt many of the policies favoured in this thread. It won't happen. The best way out was the vaccine but in the absence of a sterile vaccine that we know is beyond us, this situation is going to continue indefinitely.

How I wish I lived with some preppers in the States. I imagine they're quite happy with what's happening and even feeling quite smug about being right. Their day to day life is probably unchanged. People aren't going to rise up and revolt. All that will happen is that the quality of life for just abut everyone will decline but for a lot more it will become quite awful.

This thread is getting close to redundant. No minds are changed and it has become an echo chamber for people to agree with each other that the current strategy is wrong. Yet we're on volume 5.

[TheJimi]

pussinboots said:

If everyone wore masks and practised a bit of social distancing and good hygiene, then life could continue as normal. We don't need a full lockdown. I'm not sure why so many people refuse to wear one. We don't need concrete proof of their effectiveness. Wearing a mask is only a very mild inconvenience.

Wearing masks =

You can't see people's facial expressions, nor they yours. This is an intrinsic aspect of human interaction.

Wearing glasses and a mask is a fking nightmare, especially with temp changes - ie going from outside to inside, and even worse if you've been moving about a lot outside before going inside.

I need to see people's lips to hear effectively - masks fk that up.

Wearing a mask just stresses me out, period.

and that's without even touching on the incorrect use of masks.

[chrisgtx]

In regards to masks most research is done in clinical settings where they work.
Has anyone done a proper test on general public wearing a scabby overused mask of any description, fiddling with it,on/off, in and out of pocket, touch the wet bit, touch face then touch door handles tins of beans etc is more probably worse than catching a sneeze or cough. The figures were doing well before they were introduced in the usual U turn, however they do keep the image of being seen to do somthing.
Masks aren’t natural in the slightest, I don’t want people to get used to wearing them so that hopefully when this finishes it’ll be easier to stop it.
Keeping symptomatic people in isolation would work far better.

[JagLover]

pussinboots said:

If everyone wore masks and practised a bit of social distancing and good hygiene, then life could continue as normal. We don't need a full lockdown. I'm not sure why so many people refuse to wear one. We don't need concrete proof of their effectiveness. Wearing a mask is only a very mild inconvenience.

Extremely unlikely

In the right environment this seems to be spread very easily. A mask that isn't fitted properly wont change that fact. Social distancing will no doubt help but isn't always possible and in any case this can follow air trails caused by aircon to infect at far greater distances than 2 metres.

[Willhire89]

pussinboots said:

If everyone wore masks and practised a bit of social distancing and good hygiene, then life could continue as normal. We don't need a full lockdown. I'm not sure why so many people refuse to wear one. We don't need concrete proof of their effectiveness. Wearing a mask is only a very mild inconvenience.

You wait 146 months and come up with that as a maiden post ......top lurking

[monkfish1]

pussinboots said:

If everyone wore masks and practised a bit of social distancing and good hygiene, then life could continue as normal. We don't need a full lockdown. I'm not sure why so many people refuse to wear one. We don't need concrete proof of their effectiveness. Wearing a mask is only a very mild inconvenience.

I think you are clutching at straws.

Compliance is high. Very high.

Lots of people grumbling, but still complying.

If you genuinely think that the few % not complying would have made the virus go away, you are deluded.

[anonymous-user]

monkfish1 said:

pussinboots said:

If everyone wore masks and practised a bit of social distancing and good hygiene, then life could continue as normal. We don't need a full lockdown. I'm not sure why so many people refuse to wear one. We don't need concrete proof of their effectiveness. Wearing a mask is only a very mild inconvenience.

I think you are clutching at straws.

Compliance is high. Very high.

Lots of people grumbling, but still complying.

If you genuinely think that the few % not complying would have made the virus go away, you are deluded.

Tend to agree with this. I go to my local Sainsburys daily. It's a large store, but not the largest certainly. I see perhaps 1, maybe 2 adults per day in there not wearing a mask, the odd person failing to cover their nose(whats the point, just don't wear it) and even more rarely someone sporting a mask in chin diaper mode.

So that's perhaps 3-4 people non-compliant out of a couple of hundred in the store.

Compliance is high in my experience too.

[monkfish1]

king arthur said:

teapea said:

I am really starting to feel the cure is worse than the disease.

This is going to go on a few years and if we keep spending like we currently what will happen.

It won't go on for a few years because people won't accept that. Already the government has u-turned on gym closures in Liverpool. Eventually when enough people realise that all the things that make life worth living are under threat their opinions will change and the government will lose what little control it had.

I think you are in for a major disappointment.

They likely will accept it, and frankly, have no choice anyway. HMG are out of control with their new found powrs such that they operate by decree.

[EddieSteadyGo]

This is the first good bit of research I've seen regarding 'long covid' which didn't seem to have a specific agenda.

Prevalence of long covid seems to be higher than I thought (1 in 20) and seems to be linked to the number of the main covid symptoms first experienced together with a person's age and weight.

The definition of long covid they are using is symptoms lasting beyond 8 weeks.

In fact they have built a predictive model which seems pretty good at assessing your chance of getting long covid based on some personal stats and your initial symptoms.

https://covid.joinzoe.com/post/long-covid

[richardxjr]

monkfish1 said:

pussinboots said:

If everyone wore masks and practised a bit of social distancing and good hygiene, then life could continue as normal. We don't need a full lockdown. I'm not sure why so many people refuse to wear one. We don't need concrete proof of their effectiveness. Wearing a mask is only a very mild inconvenience.

I think you are clutching at straws.

Compliance is high. Very high.

Lots of people grumbling, but still complying.

If you genuinely think that the few % not complying would have made the virus go away, you are deluded.

Utterly that.

Mega lurking though! Over 12 years! I wonder if this will be 'under control' when she next posts?

[pussinboots]

I think it's very much cultural. If you look at the East Asian countries, wearing masks is much more prevalent. Although difficult to prove any causal link, the Asian countries are doing far better in controlling the virus than the West. These countries are much more densely populated and have not instituted the kind of lockdowns to the same extent as here. They have not made mask wearing mandatory because they don't need to - it's become a social norm. To me it's just common sense that wearing masks may help reduce infection rates, and at worst does very little. The alternatives are either harsh lockdowns, or large number of deaths. I think the choice is clear?

[anonymous-user]

monkfish1 said:

I think you are in for a major disappointment.

They likely will accept it, and frankly, have no choice anyway. HMG are out of control with their new found powrs such that they operate by decree.

Agreed. The chickens won’t realise until they are on the conveyor belt heading for the oven by which time it will be far too late.
HMG are thrilled that they can now operate seemingly without limit

[markyb_lcy]

Sam.M said:

monkfish1 said:

pussinboots said:

If everyone wore masks and practised a bit of social distancing and good hygiene, then life could continue as normal. We don't need a full lockdown. I'm not sure why so many people refuse to wear one. We don't need concrete proof of their effectiveness. Wearing a mask is only a very mild inconvenience.

I think you are clutching at straws.

Compliance is high. Very high.

Lots of people grumbling, but still complying.

If you genuinely think that the few % not complying would have made the virus go away, you are deluded.

Tend to agree with this. I go to my local Sainsburys daily. It's a large store, but not the largest certainly. I see perhaps 1, maybe 2 adults per day in there not wearing a mask, the odd person failing to cover their nose(whats the point, just don't wear it) and even more rarely someone sporting a mask in chin diaper mode.

So that's perhaps 3-4 people non-compliant out of a couple of hundred in the store.

Compliance is high in my experience too.

Yep.

Measures are strict and compliance is high, yet the numbers still aren’t doing what the govt and a large portion of the public want and expect.

When will we wake up to the fact these measures don’t actually work? Maybe they chip away a little at the numbers and they kick the can of the epidemic a little down the road, but ultimately we will have to find a way to live with this thing. The big question for me is ... just how much damage will we inflict on the economy and the social fabric of society before we accept this as a nation?

I reckon we are in for a fair bit more yet.

[ORD]

JagLover said:

pussinboots said:

If everyone wore masks and practised a bit of social distancing and good hygiene, then life could continue as normal. We don't need a full lockdown. I'm not sure why so many people refuse to wear one. We don't need concrete proof of their effectiveness. Wearing a mask is only a very mild inconvenience.

Extremely unlikely

In the right environment this seems to be spread very easily. A mask that isn't fitted properly wont change that fact. Social distancing will no doubt help but isn't always possible and in any case this can follow air trails caused by aircon to infect at far greater distances than 2 metres.

The Govt itself says that masks make a very small difference, if any.

[V1nce Fox]

Willhire89 said:

pussinboots said:

If everyone wore masks and practised a bit of social distancing and good hygiene, then life could continue as normal. We don't need a full lockdown. I'm not sure why so many people refuse to wear one. We don't need concrete proof of their effectiveness. Wearing a mask is only a very mild inconvenience.

You wait 146 months and come up with that as a maiden post ......top lurking

I could have waited another 146 months for that tbh.