CV19 - Cure worse than the disease? (Vol 5)
Discussion
Biker 1]We should have a sweepstake on what rules will be in force over the festive season. Assuming the stupid 'tiers'/firebreak/rule of 6/[insert daft rule here said:
are in place, how many millions will stick two fingers up & do a decent Christmas party?
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-54713802
Won't be doing a party but will be visiting all my immediate relatives over the christmas holidays, the police can go fhttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-54713802
k themselves. Alucidnation said:
johnboy1975 said:
Nicola Sturgeons findings on care homes us out " no statistical evidence that releasing covid positive people into carehomes caused covid outbreaks"
This is the scale at which they are prepared to lie to cover themselves
Have you got evidence to the contrary then?This is the scale at which they are prepared to lie to cover themselves
Alucidnation said:
johnboy1975 said:
Nicola Sturgeons findings on care homes us out " no statistical evidence that releasing covid positive people into carehomes caused covid outbreaks"
This is the scale at which they are prepared to lie to cover themselves
Have you got evidence to the contrary then?This is the scale at which they are prepared to lie to cover themselves
The whole Scottish set of tiers and restrictions are based on reducing contact between those who have the virus and those who don't.
They are now saying there is no statistical evidence that allowing those who have tested positive with Covid to mix with those who have not, does not cause Covid outbreaks.
You don't see any conflict in those two points of view?
johnboy1975 said:
Nicola Sturgeons findings on care homes us out " no statistical evidence that releasing covid positive people into carehomes caused covid outbreaks"
This is the scale at which they are prepared to lie to cover themselves
Sturgeon is an expert at carefully choosing her precise words to convey a certain meaning but without lying. This is the scale at which they are prepared to lie to cover themselves
No "statistical" evidence is meant to imply no evidence to the casual reader. What it actually means is there was lots of other evidence, just not in a statistical format.
This is what we should fear the most:-
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/global-health/science-...
"Latest coronavirus news: Vaccine is 'likely to be imperfect' and 'might not prevent infection', warns head of UK task force"
This is the only justification they will need to maintain some forms of NPI "until they have a "better" vaccine"...
I have to confess that if they don't lift all restrictions in the face of an imperfect vaccine, I will gladly become a conspiracy theorist!!!
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/global-health/science-...
"Latest coronavirus news: Vaccine is 'likely to be imperfect' and 'might not prevent infection', warns head of UK task force"
This is the only justification they will need to maintain some forms of NPI "until they have a "better" vaccine"...
I have to confess that if they don't lift all restrictions in the face of an imperfect vaccine, I will gladly become a conspiracy theorist!!!
i4got said:
Alucidnation said:
johnboy1975 said:
Nicola Sturgeons findings on care homes us out " no statistical evidence that releasing covid positive people into carehomes caused covid outbreaks"
This is the scale at which they are prepared to lie to cover themselves
Have you got evidence to the contrary then?This is the scale at which they are prepared to lie to cover themselves
The whole Scottish set of tiers and restrictions are based on reducing contact between those who have the virus and those who don't.
They are now saying there is no statistical evidence that allowing those who have tested positive with Covid to mix with those who have not, does not cause Covid outbreaks.
You don't see any conflict in those two points of view?
EDIT - found the previous story - https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-53797462 - it was Borders & only involved 2 patients.
Edited by alangla on Wednesday 28th October 12:44
Wayne E Edge said:
Newc said:
Looks like the French are going to go for Le Lockdown part Deux for the whole of November.
They call it a more apt name here...'confinement' but reconfinement if it happens tonight. Depressing!
The only thing that the much maligned Ferguson was right about is that nothing short of a full lockdown appears to slow the growth of the virus.
Sadly, where France and other countries go we will follow for the sake of remaining part of the herd.
ChocolateFrog said:
Biker 1]We should have a sweepstake on what rules will be in force over the festive season. Assuming the stupid 'tiers'/firebreak/rule of 6/[insert daft rule here said:
are in place, how many millions will stick two fingers up & do a decent Christmas party?
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-54713802
Won't be doing a party but will be visiting all my immediate relatives over the christmas holidays, the police can go fhttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-54713802
k themselves. 
ChocolateFrog said:
Won't be doing a party but will be visiting all my immediate relatives over the christmas holidays, the police can go fk themselves.
I'd love to have the same attitude (I have already made plans for Christmas in fact, at someone else's house) but the reality is that it will come with the risk of significant fines that will be, for the vast, vast majority, deterrent enough. k themselves. All lets not forget the curtain twitching Stasi wannabee
s who will be only too willing and happy to report their neighbours to the police. We all know they're around.Thought this was quite funny re the imminent Pfizer vaccine:-
https://www.statnews.com/2020/10/27/no-news-on-pfi...
"Pfizer and BioNTech are under a white-hot spotlight because their Covid-19 vaccine, by design, is likely to be the first to have any efficacy data. But that first analysis will come when there have been a total of only 32 cases of Covid-19 across the company’s entire 42,000-volunteer study. It would be considered to be positive, Pfizer has said, if six or fewer of those 32 cases occurred in the group that received the vaccine, with the rest occurring in the group that received the placebo. The trial is expected to continue until 150 of the volunteers in the study have had Covid-19."
Out of 42,000 people, they still can't reach the threshold of 32 cases after 4 months...
What does that tell you about prevalence?
https://www.statnews.com/2020/10/27/no-news-on-pfi...
"Pfizer and BioNTech are under a white-hot spotlight because their Covid-19 vaccine, by design, is likely to be the first to have any efficacy data. But that first analysis will come when there have been a total of only 32 cases of Covid-19 across the company’s entire 42,000-volunteer study. It would be considered to be positive, Pfizer has said, if six or fewer of those 32 cases occurred in the group that received the vaccine, with the rest occurring in the group that received the placebo. The trial is expected to continue until 150 of the volunteers in the study have had Covid-19."
Out of 42,000 people, they still can't reach the threshold of 32 cases after 4 months...
What does that tell you about prevalence?
scrubchub said:
ChocolateFrog said:
Won't be doing a party but will be visiting all my immediate relatives over the christmas holidays, the police can go fk themselves.
I'd love to have the same attitude (I have already made plans for Christmas in fact, at someone else's house) but the reality is that it will come with the risk of significant fines that will be, for the vast, vast majority, deterrent enough. k themselves. All lets not forget the curtain twitching Stasi wannabee
s who will be only too willing and happy to report their neighbours to the police. We all know they're around.alangla said:
i4got said:
johnboy1975 said:
Nicola Sturgeons findings on care homes us out " no statistical evidence that releasing covid positive people into carehomes caused covid outbreaks"
This is the scale at which they are prepared to lie to cover themselves
Seriously.?This is the scale at which they are prepared to lie to cover themselves
The whole Scottish set of tiers and restrictions are based on reducing contact between those who have the virus and those who don't.
They are now saying there is no statistical evidence that allowing those who have tested positive with Covid to mix with those who have not, does not cause Covid outbreaks.
You don't see any conflict in those two points of view?
EDIT - found the previous story - https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-53797462 - it was Borders & only involved 2 patients.
Edited by alangla on Wednesday 28th October 12:44
Alucidnation said:
Have you got evidence to the contrary then?
Evidence? You don't need evidence when you have instinct.....But seriously, its a slam dunk. Coronavirus spreads with close contact. Put infected people in with vunerable people and you will have an outbreak (and deaths) on your hands. Or I've misunderstood the point of what we've been trying to achieve these past 8 months
johnboy1975 said:
If the Christian (and let's face it, the non religious who enjoy a good piss up) population got a break in lockdown for Xmas, do you think muslims would be entitled to feel agreived they didn't get one for Eid?
All in this together, and all that?
If it helps they can regard it for what it truly is, a celebration of the winter solstice. For most there are no religious aspects to it these days. All in this together, and all that?
I've been away from this thread for a few weeks, partly for my sanity and partly because I wanted to catch up with everything, but I'm not reading 100+ pages... lol
So this might have been posted already, but if not, it looks like 'the easy wins' are being secured first in the plan to test everyone all the time forever...
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-54697113
So this might have been posted already, but if not, it looks like 'the easy wins' are being secured first in the plan to test everyone all the time forever...
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-54697113
BBC said:
Covid Christmas: Rapid tests could get students home
Covid tests with results within an hour are being piloted in universities - which could help students in England get home for Christmas.
More than a million students will have to travel from their term-time accommodation in December.
This has raised concerns about spreading coronavirus as students move across the country between areas with different levels of infection.
...
"Enhanced testing capacity - including faster turnaround of results and effective contact tracing - will help to contain outbreaks at universities and limit transmission to the wider community," says a Universities UK spokesman.
The 'lateral flow tests' now being piloted are intended to find out whether someone has "high enough levels of Covid-19 in their body to make them infectious to others", says a statement from Durham University.
Using a nose and throat swab, the tests would be self-administered and would not need a laboratory to process the results.
...
The Department for Health and Social Care says the aim of the pilots would be to "turn around rapid results within an hour at the location of the test".
And the DHSC says the pilots at Durham and De Montfort will see how such tests could be used "at scale".
Durham says the pilot project, beginning this week for staff and students in two of its colleges, will be able to deliver results within 20 to 30 minutes.
...
The DHSC says the testing pilots are "building the foundations for a mass testing programme" which could also help reduce the number of school pupils having to be sent home in Covid outbreaks.
Covid tests with results within an hour are being piloted in universities - which could help students in England get home for Christmas.
More than a million students will have to travel from their term-time accommodation in December.
This has raised concerns about spreading coronavirus as students move across the country between areas with different levels of infection.
...
"Enhanced testing capacity - including faster turnaround of results and effective contact tracing - will help to contain outbreaks at universities and limit transmission to the wider community," says a Universities UK spokesman.
The 'lateral flow tests' now being piloted are intended to find out whether someone has "high enough levels of Covid-19 in their body to make them infectious to others", says a statement from Durham University.
Using a nose and throat swab, the tests would be self-administered and would not need a laboratory to process the results.
...
The Department for Health and Social Care says the aim of the pilots would be to "turn around rapid results within an hour at the location of the test".
And the DHSC says the pilots at Durham and De Montfort will see how such tests could be used "at scale".
Durham says the pilot project, beginning this week for staff and students in two of its colleges, will be able to deliver results within 20 to 30 minutes.
...
The DHSC says the testing pilots are "building the foundations for a mass testing programme" which could also help reduce the number of school pupils having to be sent home in Covid outbreaks.
scrubchub said:
I'd love to have the same attitude (I have already made plans for Christmas in fact, at someone else's house) but the reality is that it will come with the risk of significant fines that will be, for the vast, vast majority, deterrent enough.
All lets not forget the curtain twitching Stasi wannabees who will be only too willing and happy to report their neighbours to the police. We all know they're around.
And yet, if we were experiencing a genuine pandemic with lots of people dropping dead, we wouldn't need the threat of fines to ensure compliance, we would simply be genuinely scared for our health and future. All lets not forget the curtain twitching Stasi wannabee
s who will be only too willing and happy to report their neighbours to the police. We all know they're around.Like I said back in March... This is not about a virus.
RSTurboPaul said:
I've been away from this thread for a few weeks, partly for my sanity and partly because I wanted to catch up with everything, but I'm not reading 100+ pages... lol
So this might have been posted already, but if not, it looks like 'the easy wins' are being secured first in the plan to test everyone all the time forever...
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-54697113
How many will go back in January? Why bother to pay for Halls when all of the learning is online? I suspect that the students may not be allowed to return home for self serving financial reasons that suit the universities and the government...So this might have been posted already, but if not, it looks like 'the easy wins' are being secured first in the plan to test everyone all the time forever...
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-54697113
BBC said:
Covid Christmas: Rapid tests could get students home
Covid tests with results within an hour are being piloted in universities - which could help students in England get home for Christmas.
More than a million students will have to travel from their term-time accommodation in December.
This has raised concerns about spreading coronavirus as students move across the country between areas with different levels of infection.
...
"Enhanced testing capacity - including faster turnaround of results and effective contact tracing - will help to contain outbreaks at universities and limit transmission to the wider community," says a Universities UK spokesman.
The 'lateral flow tests' now being piloted are intended to find out whether someone has "high enough levels of Covid-19 in their body to make them infectious to others", says a statement from Durham University.
Using a nose and throat swab, the tests would be self-administered and would not need a laboratory to process the results.
...
The Department for Health and Social Care says the aim of the pilots would be to "turn around rapid results within an hour at the location of the test".
And the DHSC says the pilots at Durham and De Montfort will see how such tests could be used "at scale".
Durham says the pilot project, beginning this week for staff and students in two of its colleges, will be able to deliver results within 20 to 30 minutes.
...
The DHSC says the testing pilots are "building the foundations for a mass testing programme" which could also help reduce the number of school pupils having to be sent home in Covid outbreaks.
Covid tests with results within an hour are being piloted in universities - which could help students in England get home for Christmas.
More than a million students will have to travel from their term-time accommodation in December.
This has raised concerns about spreading coronavirus as students move across the country between areas with different levels of infection.
...
"Enhanced testing capacity - including faster turnaround of results and effective contact tracing - will help to contain outbreaks at universities and limit transmission to the wider community," says a Universities UK spokesman.
The 'lateral flow tests' now being piloted are intended to find out whether someone has "high enough levels of Covid-19 in their body to make them infectious to others", says a statement from Durham University.
Using a nose and throat swab, the tests would be self-administered and would not need a laboratory to process the results.
...
The Department for Health and Social Care says the aim of the pilots would be to "turn around rapid results within an hour at the location of the test".
And the DHSC says the pilots at Durham and De Montfort will see how such tests could be used "at scale".
Durham says the pilot project, beginning this week for staff and students in two of its colleges, will be able to deliver results within 20 to 30 minutes.
...
The DHSC says the testing pilots are "building the foundations for a mass testing programme" which could also help reduce the number of school pupils having to be sent home in Covid outbreaks.
Argentina
Locked down early and hard like a champ. #FollowedTheScience, #TakingItSeriously
Now in the top 5 worldwide for cases rising. They had < 200k cases in August, now its over 1 million. 1 in 44 have caught it and they now have 28,000 dead. So their lock down has only succeeded in delaying. Which might be nicer for them since its their summer now, but it seems like a lot of the population are at the end of their ropes having endured all those restrictions only for it go mental when they are finally released. Gutted.
https://archive.is/BaYkM
Archive link to avoid paywall.
Locked down early and hard like a champ. #FollowedTheScience, #TakingItSeriously
Now in the top 5 worldwide for cases rising. They had < 200k cases in August, now its over 1 million. 1 in 44 have caught it and they now have 28,000 dead. So their lock down has only succeeded in delaying. Which might be nicer for them since its their summer now, but it seems like a lot of the population are at the end of their ropes having endured all those restrictions only for it go mental when they are finally released. Gutted.
https://archive.is/BaYkM
Archive link to avoid paywall.
Edited by Otispunkmeyer on Wednesday 28th October 13:12
ant1973 said:
This is what we should fear the most:-
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/global-health/science-...
"Latest coronavirus news: Vaccine is 'likely to be imperfect' and 'might not prevent infection', warns head of UK task force"
This is the only justification they will need to maintain some forms of NPI "until they have a "better" vaccine"...
I have to confess that if they don't lift all restrictions in the face of an imperfect vaccine, I will gladly become a conspiracy theorist!!!
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/global-health/science-...
"Latest coronavirus news: Vaccine is 'likely to be imperfect' and 'might not prevent infection', warns head of UK task force"
This is the only justification they will need to maintain some forms of NPI "until they have a "better" vaccine"...
I have to confess that if they don't lift all restrictions in the face of an imperfect vaccine, I will gladly become a conspiracy theorist!!!
Gates on 12 Oct said:
The only way we’ll get completely back to normal is by having, maybe not the first generation of vaccines, but eventually a vaccine that is super effective, and that a lot of the people take, and that we get the disease eliminated on a global basis
https://www.cnbc.com/2020/10/12/bill-gates-dont-ca...RSTurboPaul said:
I've been away from this thread for a few weeks, partly for my sanity and partly because I wanted to catch up with everything, but I'm not reading 100+ pages... lol
So this might have been posted already, but if not, it looks like 'the easy wins' are being secured first in the plan to test everyone all the time forever...
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-54697113
Under what authority do the government think they can stop students going back to their home for Christmas? What are they going to do, weld the doors of student halls and shared houses shut?So this might have been posted already, but if not, it looks like 'the easy wins' are being secured first in the plan to test everyone all the time forever...
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-54697113
BBC said:
Covid Christmas: Rapid tests could get students home
Covid tests with results within an hour are being piloted in universities - which could help students in England get home for Christmas.
Covid tests with results within an hour are being piloted in universities - which could help students in England get home for Christmas.
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