How many have been vaccinated so far?

[Vanden Saab]

gruffalo said:

Matty3 said:

98elise said:

Matty3 said:

Serious Question?

If I dont have the 'jab' how am risking others? Apart from taking NHS space - which there is plenty at the mo.

It can't be a serious question.

That cant be a serious answer.

The virus mutates in people who carry the virus.

If your immune system is not prepared for the virus, it will take longer to adapt and fight the virus during which time it could mutate into a new vaccine resistant strain and you pass that on to more people.

Basically you could become the host responsible for another lockdown, many deaths and more months of the crap we are all going through right now. Personally, I couldn't bear that risk however small so I got jabbed up as soon as I could.

Once again you are ignoring the fact that the vaccine does not give you sterilizing immunity so the virus will reproduce and mutate even in vaccinated people and those people can and do infect others. It might reduce the number of mutations but it will not stop them altogether.
The vaccine may stop you from being hospitalized or dying but it does not always stop you from infecting others it will only reduce that risk.

[turbobloke]

Vanden Saab said:

Once again you are ignoring the fact that the vaccine does not give you sterilizing immunity so the virus will reproduce and mutate even in vaccinated people and those people can and do infect others. It might reduce the number of mutations but it will not stop them altogether.
The vaccine may stop you from being hospitalized or dying but it does not always stop you from infecting others it will only reduce that risk.

New variants: Other nations matter.

[vaud]

NerveAgent said:

stemll said:

NerveAgent said:

All very dramatic

I think MX5Biologist will benefit from a bit of time away from the internet!

Why? Because you don't agree with their expert and fact-based posts?

No, just the dramatic flounce and profile notes

There is a theme on PH, especially in NP&E.

Domain expert with significant qualifications post polite, constructive posts based on extensive experience
PH masses don't agree and attack
Domain expert with significant qualifications post less polite, but still constructive posts based on extensive experience
PH masses don't agree and attack
Exit expert

See the various barristers (and baristas) through the years.

At some point posters need to take a step back and ask why NP&E has few experts posting anymore? Is the issue the poster or the environment? NP&E has increasingly become a toxic subculture within PH.

The sad thing for PH overall is that we don't just lose the poster, but we also potentially lose all their content under the "right to be forgotten"

[isaldiri]

gruffalo said:

The virus mutates in people who carry the virus.

If your immune system is not prepared for the virus, it will take longer to adapt and fight the virus during which time it could mutate into a new vaccine resistant strain and you pass that on to more people.

Basically you could become the host responsible for another lockdown, many deaths and more months of the crap we are all going through right now. Personally, I couldn't bear that risk however small so I got jabbed up as soon as I could.

Or.... you're also equally guaranteeing that given the vaccine does not prevent people from getting infected you are pushing the virus to the mutation that allows for vaccine escape in order to be able to spread successfully amongst mostly vaccinated people as mutations will always happen that favour transmission.

You could still (with no obviously less probability) be that host responsible for a new lockdown. Short of isolating yourself forever I think you might want to start to get used to bearing that risk (however small).

[aparna]

vaud said:

NerveAgent said:

stemll said:

NerveAgent said:

All very dramatic

I think MX5Biologist will benefit from a bit of time away from the internet!

Why? Because you don't agree with their expert and fact-based posts?

No, just the dramatic flounce and profile notes

There is a theme on PH, especially in NP&E.

Domain expert with significant qualifications post polite, constructive posts based on extensive experience
PH masses don't agree and attack
Domain expert with significant qualifications post less polite, but still constructive posts based on extensive experience
PH masses don't agree and attack
Exit expert

See the various barristers (and baristas) through the years.

At some point posters need to take a step back and ask why NP&E has few experts posting anymore? Is the issue the poster or the environment? NP&E has increasingly become a toxic subculture within PH.

The sad thing for PH overall is that we don't just lose the poster, but we also potentially lose all their content under the "right to be forgotten"

He didn’t just flounce. He got a 7 day for ‘trolling’ then left.

[simoid]

isaldiri said:

Or.... you're also equally guaranteeing that given the vaccine does not prevent people from getting infected you are pushing the virus to the mutation that allows for vaccine escape in order to be able to spread successfully amongst mostly vaccinated people as mutations will always happen that favour transmission.

You could still (with no obviously less probability) be that host responsible for a new lockdown. Short of isolating yourself forever I think you might want to start to get used to bearing that risk (however small).

It doesn’t?

[isaldiri]

simoid said:

It doesn’t?

It certainly reduces the chances of infection. By a large degree within a certain time period of vaccination, much less likely to continue to do so longer term imo. But it still is that quite a % of vaccinated people can still be infected. Especially with the AZN one. in any case it is quite clearly not in any way similar to something like measles vaccination that provides a very high level of sterilising immunity and long term.

[simoid]

I’m following that logic but not your previous post. If people aren’t getting infected, then I would expect the virus is having fewer opportunities to replicate and mutate? Ergo more vaccinations = (even) lower chance of catastrophic mutations.

[Muddle238]

simoid said:

I’m following that logic but not your previous post. If people aren’t getting infected, then I would expect the virus is having fewer opportunities to replicate and mutate? Ergo more vaccinations = (even) lower chance of catastrophic mutations.

This is how I understand it.

The risk of mutations is never eliminated, but it’s significantly reduced by a higher proportion of folk being vaccinated, regardless of age.

[spikeyhead]

Today's jabs, highest first jabs in a day since March

First, second, total
280,241 236,363 516,604

percentage of adults jabbed
81.6% first, 59.5% second

Progress continues

[NRS]

Muddle238 said:

simoid said:

I’m following that logic but not your previous post. If people aren’t getting infected, then I would expect the virus is having fewer opportunities to replicate and mutate? Ergo more vaccinations = (even) lower chance of catastrophic mutations.

This is how I understand it.

The risk of mutations is never eliminated, but it’s significantly reduced by a higher proportion of folk being vaccinated, regardless of age.

That's just for the UK. However, unless you keep the borders closed until the rest of the world is jabbed then you're not reducing the chance of a mutation, just where it happens to start. As we saw with the Delta mutation. If teens here don't use the vaccines they'd be used elsewhere in the world. And given the high level of vaccine coverage in the UK those teens are already less likely to catch it as there will be less covid in the UK compared to very poorly jabbed areas.

(And given the amount of stuff the UK needs to import even closed borders for holidays etc would not likely stop it forever as we need food etc).

[MiniMan64]

spikeyhead said:

Today's jabs, highest first jabs in a day since March

First, second, total
280,241 236,363 516,604

percentage of adults jabbed
81.6% first, 59.5% second

Progress continues

Oddly thought it might be higher than that

[Northernboy]

NRS said:

That's just for the UK. However, unless you keep the borders closed until the rest of the world is jabbed then you're not reducing the chance of a mutation, just where it happens to start. As we saw with the Delta mutation. If teens here don't use the vaccines they'd be used elsewhere in the world. And given the high level of vaccine coverage in the UK those teens are already less likely to catch it as there will be less covid in the UK compared to very poorly jabbed areas.

(And given the amount of stuff the UK needs to import even closed borders for holidays etc would not likely stop it forever as we need food etc).

That’s not correct. You get the best outcomes by getting to herd immunity region by region, rather than by a uniform roll-out.

[Vanden Saab]

MiniMan64 said:

spikeyhead said:

Today's jabs, highest first jabs in a day since March

First, second, total
280,241 236,363 516,604

percentage of adults jabbed
81.6% first, 59.5% second

Progress continues

Oddly thought it might be higher than that

Not sure how, We are now over the 31 million target which we were told was the numbers in the top 9 groups and we are now into the second dose period when we were only giving 100,000 first jabs a day ie. the under 50s and we have limited quantities of non-astra vaccine to give to the under 40s. Even with bringing forward the time between jabs for astra the possibilities are limited.
We also have to balance whether giving a first dose to the under 30s is more important than getting the 30-50 age group fully vaxxed bearing in mind what we know about the delta variant.

[isaldiri]

simoid said:

I’m following that logic but not your previous post. If people aren’t getting infected, then I would expect the virus is having fewer opportunities to replicate and mutate? Ergo more vaccinations = (even) lower chance of catastrophic mutations.

Yes, less infections mean less potential mutations. However, with a large vaxxed up population that still can be infected, that essentially guarantees any mutation favouring vaccine escape will be favoured and be the one that continues to replicate.

for the unvaxxed population where a vaccine escape variant doesn't necessarily have that same advantage in being the variant that will become dominant.

So it's a lower probability of generating said mutation but a considerably higher one of that mutation being the dominant one. Whether that's lower than the higher probability of getting a variant but a lower chance it then becomes dominant is....a little less clear I'd suggest.

And unless you attempt eradication, given a reasonable % of recovered/vaccinated people are always going to be able to be infected, attempting to longer term keep infections low by getting everyone to vax up (and continually do so for all eternity) is somewhat of a lost cause.

[anonymoususer]

I am alright Jack said:

MX5Biologist said:

My posts won't exist for much longer, as I have requested my account to be deleted. At least one of the moderators has been banning people for reporting posts that contain objectionable content, ie a moderator is seeking to promote objectionable content. I cannot be part of that.

Have you posted your concerns in Website feedback?

You are kidding right ?
The most that will happen is that it gets a one line brush off answer. That or a copy n paste one line answer from a C

[jesusbuiltmycar]

LaurasOtherHalf said:

MX5Biologist said:

My posts won't exist for much longer, as I have requested my account to be deleted. At least one of the moderators has been banning people for reporting posts that contain objectionable content, ie a moderator is seeking to promote objectionable content. I cannot be part of that.

That's an incredible shame, both the loss of your content and the behaviour of any moderator if true.

Big shame - and a big loss to this forum

[turbobloke]

jesusbuiltmycar said:

LaurasOtherHalf said:

MX5Biologist said:

My posts won't exist for much longer, as I have requested my account to be deleted. At least one of the moderators has been banning people for reporting posts that contain objectionable content, ie a moderator is seeking to promote objectionable content. I cannot be part of that.

That's an incredible shame, both the loss of your content and the behaviour of any moderator if true.

Big shame - and a big loss to this forum

[speedy_thrills]

spikeyhead said:

Today's jabs, highest first jabs in a day since March

First, second, total
280,241 236,363 516,604

percentage of adults jabbed
81.6% first, 59.5% second

Progress continues

I think they've started to open walk-in appointments in some areas, I'm hopeful we will see a new leg upwards in people coming forwards to get their jab as more centres do this.

[GnuBee]

vaud said:

There is a theme on PH, especially in NP&E.

Domain expert with significant qualifications post polite, constructive posts based on extensive experience
PH masses don't agree and attack
Domain expert with significant qualifications post less polite, but still constructive posts based on extensive experience
PH masses don't agree and attack
Exit expert

See the various barristers (and baristas) through the years.

At some point posters need to take a step back and ask why NP&E has few experts posting anymore? Is the issue the poster or the environment? NP&E has increasingly become a toxic subculture within PH.

The sad thing for PH overall is that we don't just lose the poster, but we also potentially lose all their content under the "right to be forgotten"

Have to agree with this sentiment. MX5Bioligst is just one of a list of examples. Brave enough to put their head above the parapet ultimately to leave.. I've considered responding to some of the inflammatory content across this discussion from the POV of someone on the inside of the Big Pharma effort with direct contact with safety and efficacy monitoring but what's the point?

It, like other emotive subjects, has become a "religious" argument, a binary discussion all be it one heavily loaded in a one direction with a certain narrative.

To try and offer counter points based on direct experience, per MX5Biolgist, it the virtual equivalent of taking a p!ss in the wind caused by the shouting from the "new experts".