Scottish Referendum / Independence - Vol 10
Discussion
MrMan001 said:
ettore said:
Not the same at all. Czechoslovakia was an artificial construct that wasn't that old anyway. The borders in central Europe have been mobile for centuries so there are really very few direct analogies. The breakup of the various Empires are nowhere near as complex either.
This is a completely (almost inextricably) linked mature liberal democracy with kith, kin, political, societal, historical, economical and emotional links. Putting aside the economic case which is - realistically - piss poor, it's the division that would be the real worry. How many complicated independence processes haven't resulted in serious unpleasantness?
You are correct. Though I would suggest that Czechoslovakia did squeeze quite a lot of history into that 90 or so years, in the same way that the UK and EU did a significant amount of integration in a relatively short time, which is now gradually being unlinked with (relatively?) little drama.This is a completely (almost inextricably) linked mature liberal democracy with kith, kin, political, societal, historical, economical and emotional links. Putting aside the economic case which is - realistically - piss poor, it's the division that would be the real worry. How many complicated independence processes haven't resulted in serious unpleasantness?
https://capx.co/what-scotland-can-learn-from-the-v...
There also seems to be a fair amount of regret refusing to go away on both sides to this day.
Evercross said:
biggbn said:
So, using that logic, it is also quote possible one/some/many of us are 'shills
' for the Unionists?
Not at all! Many of us (you and I included) have stated our cases openly (and fallen foul of those who then want to label us - calling you a commie and me a Tory Yoon). ' for the Unionists?When asked I have said my allegiance is 'anything but the SNP' because I think that they have fomented division and base-tribalism as a platform for their cause.
You have previously stated you support independence but not under the control of the current SNP leadership, and indeed have softened your attitude towards something much short of full independence (largely for the same reasons that I resist the SNP - that their ideology and method is too divisive).
Just today Quisling made no secret of his allegiances!
Then you get those who enter the ring stating no allegiance and indeed an ignorance of the subject, yet within days seem to be able to present the partisan spin on the topic of the day, sometimes before it is even expressed officially........
Greedydog said:
Wings does have an amusing turn of phrase at times:
https://wingsoverscotland.com/plough-on-regardless...
Good heavens. The seriousness of the implications of that article cannot be overstated. The Scottish Government knowingly withheld documentation from both their lawyers and a judicial review, to pursue a case that was ultimately unstatable. This was done in latter part, allegedly, with the full knowledge of the First Minister. Any bit of wonder they didn't want this little lot to be public knowledge prior to Wednesday past...https://wingsoverscotland.com/plough-on-regardless...
Let's see if any of the main media touch this with a pointy stick.
Roderick Spode said:
Good heavens. The seriousness of the implications of that article cannot be overstated. The Scottish Government knowingly withheld documentation from both their lawyers and a judicial review, to pursue a case that was ultimately unstatable. This was done in latter part, allegedly, with the full knowledge of the First Minister. Any bit of wonder they didn't want this little lot to be public knowledge prior to Wednesday past...
Let's see if any of the main media touch this with a pointy stick.
Plus we are presumably supposed to think it's an unfortunate coincidence that the document that implicates NS in the decision to carry on regardless just happened to be omitted from the information released before she was questioned by the committee.Let's see if any of the main media touch this with a pointy stick.
Dr Jekyll said:
Roderick Spode said:
Good heavens. The seriousness of the implications of that article cannot be overstated. The Scottish Government knowingly withheld documentation from both their lawyers and a judicial review, to pursue a case that was ultimately unstatable. This was done in latter part, allegedly, with the full knowledge of the First Minister. Any bit of wonder they didn't want this little lot to be public knowledge prior to Wednesday past...
Let's see if any of the main media touch this with a pointy stick.
Plus we are presumably supposed to think it's an unfortunate coincidence that the document that implicates NS in the decision to carry on regardless just happened to be omitted from the information released before she was questioned by the committee.Let's see if any of the main media touch this with a pointy stick.
From what I've read there are also gaps in the timeline of what has been provided, so what must those documents contain?
Odd, court order shows big Boris has misled Parliament over Covid contacts. Ruth and Carlaw will condemn and shout for his resignation any minute now I’m sure.
This is the point I made earlier. No one is going to listen to Conservatives calling for Sturgeon to resign because it reeks of hypocrisy and most people in Scotland won’t pay any attention to it. All they have done for the past 6 plus years is sling mud and so the latest mud slinging is essentially background noise.
There needs to be more visible opposition from the likes of Labour.
This is the point I made earlier. No one is going to listen to Conservatives calling for Sturgeon to resign because it reeks of hypocrisy and most people in Scotland won’t pay any attention to it. All they have done for the past 6 plus years is sling mud and so the latest mud slinging is essentially background noise.
There needs to be more visible opposition from the likes of Labour.
WackyWeaver said:
Odd, court order shows big Boris has misled Parliament over Covid contacts. Ruth and Carlaw will condemn and shout for his resignation any minute now I’m sure.
This is the point I made earlier. No one is going to listen to Conservatives calling for Sturgeon to resign because it reeks of hypocrisy and most people in Scotland won’t pay any attention to it. All they have done for the past 6 plus years is sling mud and so the latest mud slinging is essentially background noise.
There needs to be more visible opposition from the likes of Labour.
Will things be more honest and transparent in Holyrood after we leave the UK?This is the point I made earlier. No one is going to listen to Conservatives calling for Sturgeon to resign because it reeks of hypocrisy and most people in Scotland won’t pay any attention to it. All they have done for the past 6 plus years is sling mud and so the latest mud slinging is essentially background noise.
There needs to be more visible opposition from the likes of Labour.
Dr Jekyll said:
Roderick Spode said:
Good heavens. The seriousness of the implications of that article cannot be overstated. The Scottish Government knowingly withheld documentation from both their lawyers and a judicial review, to pursue a case that was ultimately unstatable. This was done in latter part, allegedly, with the full knowledge of the First Minister. Any bit of wonder they didn't want this little lot to be public knowledge prior to Wednesday past...
Let's see if any of the main media touch this with a pointy stick.
Plus we are presumably supposed to think it's an unfortunate coincidence that the document that implicates NS in the decision to carry on regardless just happened to be omitted from the information released before she was questioned by the committee.Let's see if any of the main media touch this with a pointy stick.
The fact this gets issued *2 days after* is pretty much a spit in the face of the process and is absolutely contemptible.
Absolutely f
king shocking.WackyWeaver said:
Odd, court order shows big Boris has misled Parliament over Covid contacts. Ruth and Carlaw will condemn and shout for his resignation any minute now I’m sure.
This is the point I made earlier. No one is going to listen to Conservatives calling for Sturgeon to resign because it reeks of hypocrisy and most people in Scotland won’t pay any attention to it. All they have done for the past 6 plus years is sling mud and so the latest mud slinging is essentially background noise.
There needs to be more visible opposition from the likes of Labour.
Translation: Our sacred leader, bless the ground she walks on and the air she breaths, can This is the point I made earlier. No one is going to listen to Conservatives calling for Sturgeon to resign because it reeks of hypocrisy and most people in Scotland won’t pay any attention to it. All they have done for the past 6 plus years is sling mud and so the latest mud slinging is essentially background noise.
There needs to be more visible opposition from the likes of Labour.
All because of that big horrible oaf in Westminster who eats BABIES for breakfast (just to be clear here and to avoid confusion I am not talking about Blackford).
Oh, and just in case you missed it, that f
king big squirrel over there is definitely a TOARY. Earthdweller said:
biggbn said:
How did the guy in the transit know you were English?
A bunch of English registered sports cars on the NC500 I think he made a fair guess
Leithen said:
Translation: Our sacred leader, bless the ground she walks on and the air she breaths, can do no wrong do as much wrong as she likes.
All because of that big horrible oaf in Westminster who eats BABIES for breakfast (just to be clear here and to avoid confusion I am not talking about Blackford).
Oh, and just in case you missed it, that fking big squirrel over there is definitely a TOARY.
I know it’s a hard concept for some to grasp so you’ll forever be left wondering why no one is listening to you.All because of that big horrible oaf in Westminster who eats BABIES for breakfast (just to be clear here and to avoid confusion I am not talking about Blackford).
Oh, and just in case you missed it, that f
king big squirrel over there is definitely a TOARY. News flash, the Tories are not popular in Scotland. Floating voters or current SNP voters will never be convinced by messages led by the Tories when they are laughably hypocritical. Boris has actually been found guilty as well whereas Sturgeon is still currently accused? Again, how on earth can anyone every take them seriously
Call it whataboutery if you want but that is the reality of the situation. SNP will only ever be defeated when Labour sort their act out which unfortunately still seems quite a way off
Edited by WackyWeaver on Friday 5th March 20:01
WackyWeaver said:
I know it’s a hard concept for some to grasp so you’ll forever be left wondering why no one is listening to you.
News flash, the Tories are not popular in Scotland. Floating voters or current SNP voters will never be convinced by messages led by the Tories when they are laughably hypocritical. Boris has actually been found guilty as well whereas Sturgeon is still currently accused? Again, how on earth can anyone every take them seriously
Call it whataboutery if you want but that is the reality of the situation. SNP will only ever be defeated when Labour sort their act out which unfortunately still seems quite a way off
YEPNews flash, the Tories are not popular in Scotland. Floating voters or current SNP voters will never be convinced by messages led by the Tories when they are laughably hypocritical. Boris has actually been found guilty as well whereas Sturgeon is still currently accused? Again, how on earth can anyone every take them seriously
Call it whataboutery if you want but that is the reality of the situation. SNP will only ever be defeated when Labour sort their act out which unfortunately still seems quite a way off
Edited by WackyWeaver on Friday 5th March 20:01
The SNP can do ANYTHING they want
As no matter how useless they are
the TRUE scots (not quislings like me) will always vote for them as they hate the tory party
And lets be honest
Tory voters are really scottish are they
biggbn said:
Shows how dim I can be, I didn't know you could tell where a car was from by its registration. I have never heard that before, unbelievable!!
Come on now man, a PH'er that doesn't know reg plates are regionally indentifiable, tut tut.https://www.newreg.co.uk/dvla-number-plate-identif...
I think he might have been talking about plates with the flag on them, SCO / ENG / GB / UK.
Roderick Spode said:
Greedydog said:
Wings does have an amusing turn of phrase at times:
https://wingsoverscotland.com/plough-on-regardless...
Good heavens. The seriousness of the implications of that article cannot be overstated. The Scottish Government knowingly withheld documentation from both their lawyers and a judicial review, to pursue a case that was ultimately unstatable. This was done in latter part, allegedly, with the full knowledge of the First Minister. Any bit of wonder they didn't want this little lot to be public knowledge prior to Wednesday past...https://wingsoverscotland.com/plough-on-regardless...
Let's see if any of the main media touch this with a pointy stick.
Donald Cameron said:
I've acted as counsel for the Scottish Government. At consultations, everyone takes notes. It is inconceivable these minutes don't exist.
WackyWeaver said:
I know it’s a hard concept for some to grasp so you’ll forever be left wondering why no one is listening to you.
News flash, the Tories are not popular in Scotland. Floating voters or current SNP voters will never be convinced by messages led by the Tories when they are laughably hypocritical. Boris has actually been found guilty as well whereas Sturgeon is still currently accused? Again, how on earth can anyone every take them seriously
Call it whataboutery if you want but that is the reality of the situation. SNP will only ever be defeated when Labour sort their act out which unfortunately still seems quite a way off
Look Nicola (WackyWeaver) you have been on Piston Heads for a month. I would have imagined that you have better things to do such as make Peter his tea, or give Judy Murray a back rub. You are obviously a troll or part of the SNP propaganda machine, it would probably be better for all of us if you just calmed down a little bit.News flash, the Tories are not popular in Scotland. Floating voters or current SNP voters will never be convinced by messages led by the Tories when they are laughably hypocritical. Boris has actually been found guilty as well whereas Sturgeon is still currently accused? Again, how on earth can anyone every take them seriously
Call it whataboutery if you want but that is the reality of the situation. SNP will only ever be defeated when Labour sort their act out which unfortunately still seems quite a way off
Edited by WackyWeaver on Friday 5th March 20:01
P.S. Alex sends his love. xxx
YorkshireWhisky said:
Look Nicola (WackyWeaver) you have been on Piston Heads for a month. I would have imagined that you have better things to do such as make Peter his tea, or give Judy Murray a back rub. You are obviously a troll or part of the SNP propaganda machine, it would probably be better for all of us if you just calmed down a little bit.
P.S. Alex sends his love. xxx
No offence Yorkshire, stick to Yorkshire related matters such as downing gravy and annoying people with your accents.P.S. Alex sends his love. xxx
Still to see someone actually provide a counter arguments to my points as opposed to weak ad hom attacks and sour grapes.
Anyone? Or this literally just a safe haven for Scottish Conservatives to vent their frustration like some sort of AA/anger management session?
WackyWeaver said:
No offence Yorkshire, stick to Yorkshire related matters such as downing gravy and annoying people with your accents.
Still to see someone actually provide a counter arguments to my points as opposed to weak ad hom attacks and sour grapes.
Anyone? Or this literally just a safe haven for Scottish Conservatives to vent their frustration like some sort of AA/anger management session?
Look you're rightStill to see someone actually provide a counter arguments to my points as opposed to weak ad hom attacks and sour grapes.
Anyone? Or this literally just a safe haven for Scottish Conservatives to vent their frustration like some sort of AA/anger management session?
we are just angry as you are going to win indyref2 in December
All i want to know is
What kind of scexit will we have hard or soft?
as you TRUE scots aren't like us thick tories who didn't know what kind of bret it would be
Quisling said:
Look you're right
we are just angry as you are going to win indyref2 in December
All i want to know is
What kind of scexit will we have hard or soft?
as you TRUE scots aren't like us thick tories who didn't know what kind of bret it would be
“You”? I’ll be voting no in any future referendum as I did the first time.we are just angry as you are going to win indyref2 in December
All i want to know is
What kind of scexit will we have hard or soft?
as you TRUE scots aren't like us thick tories who didn't know what kind of bret it would be
Interesting that you voted for Brexit though, very telling.
Pastor Of Muppets said:
biggbn said:
Shows how dim I can be, I didn't know you could tell where a car was from by its registration. I have never heard that before, unbelievable!!
Come on now man, a PH'er that doesn't know reg plates are regionally indentifiable, tut tut.https://www.newreg.co.uk/dvla-number-plate-identif...
I think he might have been talking about plates with the flag on them, SCO / ENG / GB / UK.
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