45th President of the United States, Donald Trump (Vol. 12)

[Byker28i]

anonymous said:

[redacted]

Slightly off topic discussing what next, but actually the one good thing trump did was to encourage a lot of young democrats to stand in opposition to him, not just 'the squad' as he called Reps. Ilhan Omar of Minnesota, Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez of New York, Rashida Tlaib of Michigan and Ayanna Pressley of Massachusetts.

I think we had the discussion before and many had alternatives to Biden, although agreed that Biden was seen as the proper antidote to trump, very experienced, honest, a safe pair of hands.

I can see Biden doing one term. Harris as VP is an obvious choice, but I liked Pete Buttigieg and his approach. It would be nice to see the younger members coming through. I can't currently see the GOP getting back into power through normal democracy and voting... I think they've burnt the bridges with trump and the current leadership, the splits trump has caused within the party. McConnell looks lost to control it, and McCarthy is still sucking up to trump.

Lyndsey grahams quote about trump destroying the party springs to mind
https://twitter.com/lindseygrahamsc/status/7276045...

Edited by Byker28i on Wednesday 15th September 12:12

[andymadmak]

Byker28i said:

anonymous said:

[redacted]

Slightly off topic discussing what next, but actually the one good thing trump did was to encourage a lot of young democrats to stand in opposition to him, not just 'the squad' as he called Reps. Ilhan Omar of Minnesota, Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez of New York, Rashida Tlaib of Michigan and Ayanna Pressley of Massachusetts.

I think we had the discussion before and many had alternatives to Biden, although agreed that Biden was seen as the proper antidote to trump, very experienced, honest, a safe pair of hands.

I can see Biden doing one term. Harris as VP is an obvious choice, but I liked Pete Buttigieg and his approach. It would be nice to see the younger members coming through. I can't currently see the GOP getting back into power through normal democracy and voting... I think they've burnt the bridges with trump and the current leadership, the splits trump has caused within the party. McConnell looks lost to control it, and McCarthy is still sucking up to trump.

Lyndsey grahams quote about trump destroying the party springs to mind
https://twitter.com/lindseygrahamsc/status/7276045...

Edited by Byker28i on Wednesday 15th September 12:12

I agree with just about all of this, especially the bit about Buttigieg.
However I think the die is already cast, so unless Harris proves to be a total failure as VP or makes a huge mistake then I think she will be the next President - most likely in 2024
I also think the Republicans are going to spend the next 10 years in the political wilderness unless they can reunite behind a sensible, younger candidate that can put serious distance between the GOP and the awful memory of Trump. But as to the identity of that candidate I simply don't have a clue!

[Byker28i]

andymadmak said:

I agree with just about all of this, especially the bit about Buttigieg.
However I think the die is already cast, so unless Harris proves to be a total failure as VP or makes a huge mistake then I think she will be the next President - most likely in 2024
I also think the Republicans are going to spend the next 10 years in the political wilderness unless they can reunite behind a sensible, younger candidate that can put serious distance between the GOP and the awful memory of Trump. But as to the identity of that candidate I simply don't have a clue!

There's no chance for anyone trying to distance from trump at the moment in the GOP, so I think most are keeping their heads down. Look at what happened to Liz Cheney and Adam Kinzinger

[HM-2]

anonymous said:

[redacted]

You do, however, have to be an expert to offer a meaningful rebuttal to actual subject matter experts who have been clear in stating that the "evidence" being used to spin the yarn of Biden having dementia aren't actually diagnostic indicators of it

Nobody is arguing that Biden is as sharp and together as he was decades ago. The contentions are, and always have been, statements that Biden is suffering from some condition above and beyond normal age related mental decline, and/or that his mental state makes him unfit to be president.


Anyway, not really for this topic. As pointed out above, the issue is that the only people who've really been motivated to offer a decent range of alternative candidates are the Democrats; the GOP has basically be one a Trump personality cult with more moderate and coherent figures ostracised.

Edited by HM-2 on Wednesday 15th September 13:01

[zbc]

Byker28i said:

andymadmak said:

I agree with just about all of this, especially the bit about Buttigieg.
However I think the die is already cast, so unless Harris proves to be a total failure as VP or makes a huge mistake then I think she will be the next President - most likely in 2024
I also think the Republicans are going to spend the next 10 years in the political wilderness unless they can reunite behind a sensible, younger candidate that can put serious distance between the GOP and the awful memory of Trump. But as to the identity of that candidate I simply don't have a clue!

There's no chance for anyone trying to distance from trump at the moment in the GOP, so I think most are keeping their heads down. Look at what happened to Liz Cheney and Adam Kinzinger

Best chance for a renewed GOP now is surely for Trump to stand again in 2024 and get absolutely thrashed by Harris. If Trump puts himself forward as a candidate I can't see anyone opposing him at this time but a complete failure would surely lead to some changes.

[fatbutt]

I'd love to see Harris as president in 2024 but I'm very fearful for where the GOP narrative is heading. I seriously think the only direction for them now is physical violence. I was always surprised that no-one took a shot at Obama and things are 10 times worse now.

After they've pursued all the law suits and loopholes and find that they will only get 'stupid' so far. What is left to them but to exercise that right to bear arms? How many Texas republicans would try to argue that a Democrat is making them fear for their lives so they have the right to defend themselves, and by defend themselves I mean sit on a roof with a high powered rifle and gun a representative down from half a mile away?

[Electro1980]

zbc said:

Byker28i said:

andymadmak said:

I agree with just about all of this, especially the bit about Buttigieg.
However I think the die is already cast, so unless Harris proves to be a total failure as VP or makes a huge mistake then I think she will be the next President - most likely in 2024
I also think the Republicans are going to spend the next 10 years in the political wilderness unless they can reunite behind a sensible, younger candidate that can put serious distance between the GOP and the awful memory of Trump. But as to the identity of that candidate I simply don't have a clue!

There's no chance for anyone trying to distance from trump at the moment in the GOP, so I think most are keeping their heads down. Look at what happened to Liz Cheney and Adam Kinzinger

Best chance for a renewed GOP now is surely for Trump to stand again in 2024 and get absolutely thrashed by Harris. If Trump puts himself forward as a candidate I can't see anyone opposing him at this time but a complete failure would surely lead to some changes.

To do anything else would require a sea change in the party, which would mean possibly dropping lots of their more traditional voters. I can’t see how they can change and not change some fundamental issues around gun control and religion. Those two points seem so linked to the party at the moment.

[Byker28i]

zbc said:

Best chance for a renewed GOP now is surely for Trump to stand again in 2024 and get absolutely thrashed by Harris. If Trump puts himself forward as a candidate I can't see anyone opposing him at this time but a complete failure would surely lead to some changes.

It's what happened in 2020 - seen it happening now? Not going to happen whilst trump refuses to fade away, whilst others are looking at a run and trying to appeal to his base (DeSantis and Cruz spring to mind).

Instead they are still pushing his Big Lie, because he can't accept he was a loser...

In Bob Woodwards new book Peril, Pelosi made the point that if they couldn't even stop him from an assault on the Capitol, who even knows what else he may do and they were all busy kissing his fat butt at the WH.
https://www.waaytv.com/content/news/575311662.html

Edit: And lets face it, in California voting, Newsom beating the recall significantly is a straight rejection of trumpism.

Edited by Byker28i on Wednesday 15th September 13:57

[zbc]

Byker28i said:

zbc said:

Best chance for a renewed GOP now is surely for Trump to stand again in 2024 and get absolutely thrashed by Harris. If Trump puts himself forward as a candidate I can't see anyone opposing him at this time but a complete failure would surely lead to some changes.

It's what happened in 2020 - seen it happening now? Not going to happen whilst trump refuses to fade away, whilst others are looking at a run and trying to appeal to his base (DeSantis and Cruz spring to mind).

Instead they are still pushing his Big Lie, because he can't accept he was a loser...

In Bob Woodwards new book Peril, Pelosi made the point that if they couldn't even stop him from an assault on the Capitol, who even knows what else he may do and they were all busy kissing his fat butt at the WH.
https://www.waaytv.com/content/news/575311662.html

Edit: And lets face it, in California voting, Newsom beating the recall significantly is a straight rejection of trumpism.

Edited by Byker28i on Wednesday 15th September 13:57

It's why he needs to be thrashed and not just slightly beaten. If that happens in 2024 then it will be clear that he won't stand again (surely it would be clear he would be too old then, 82 in 2028) and there will be some sort of a clear out between those who want to continue his legacy, such as it is, and those who see a different path for the GOP. Whatever comes out of it Trumpism will be gone if they want to get elected.

[The Hypno-Toad]

Personally, I think Trump never had the real launch codes since the first weeks in his office. There is no way they would have let the Orange Idiot start launching big white ones without approval from a lot of far more qualified people first.

They never told him the truth about Roswell either but that is most definitely for another thread….

[5 In a Row]

It'd be nice to think of Trump standing against Harris in 2024 and getting his orange arse tanned but I can't see it. I really don't think the US is ready for Harris as President and it might easily be a rerun of 2016.

Would love to be proved wrong though. I'm sure the midterms will give a decent indication of how things are playing out both for a GOP still in thrall to the buffoon and for the Dems.

Of course the midterms may also be a clear indicator of how much the Republican states election engineering is working.
Assuming all the suppression of undesirable (in their eyes) voters works is there any fairly easy way of telling how things will go in 2024 given the Electoral College setup?

[Byker28i]

zbc said:

It's why he needs to be thrashed and not just slightly beaten.

He was beaten 306 electoral votes to 232
Lost the popular vote 74m to 81m

He was thrashed...

[Byker28i]

5 In a Row said:

It'd be nice to think of Trump standing against Harris in 2024 and getting his orange arse tanned but I can't see it. I really don't think the US is ready for Harris as President and it might easily be a rerun of 2016.

Would love to be proved wrong though. I'm sure the midterms will give a decent indication of how things are playing out both for a GOP still in thrall to the buffoon and for the Dems.

Of course the midterms may also be a clear indicator of how much the Republican states election engineering is working.
Assuming all the suppression of undesirable (in their eyes) voters works is there any fairly easy way of telling how things will go in 2024 given the Electoral College setup?

This should read some of the US isn't ready for a woman president... and yes the biggest threat is the GOP gerrymandering, the voting restrictions and of course continued pushing of the Big Lie. Maybe that will all stop when the court cases start...

[silentbrown]

Byker28i said:

I can see Biden doing one term. Harris as VP is an obvious choice, but I liked Pete Buttigieg and his approach.

I'd agree with all that. Bernie Sanders will be 83 so I don't see him throwing a hat in the ring.

[zbc]

Byker28i said:

zbc said:

It's why he needs to be thrashed and not just slightly beaten.

He was beaten 306 electoral votes to 232
Lost the popular vote 74m to 81m

He was thrashed...

Not by US standards. With the exception of George W. Bush elections he got more electoral college votes than any loser than Ford in 76. The popular vote was wider but still by no means a thrashing, Bill Clinton won the election with a smaller proportion of popular votes (thanks to Ross Perot of course - how different the world would have been if he hadn't stood). I'm looking for a result more like Reagan's second term 525-13 electoral college and nearly 59% of the popular vote. It's the relative narrowness of his defeat that allows him to keep going on with his Big Lie. And of course is narcissism and many other character flaws. And his need for the cash. And the various law suits that he'd like to dodge

[Byker28i]

I was using trumps own words, he won 306 electoral votes to Clinton's 232 and called it one of the greatest defeats in the history of politics in the US and a massive landslide victory...
https://www.npr.org/2016/12/11/505182622/fact-chec...

[Byker28i]

The MiamiHerald is reporting that three of the six officers investigated and reported for disciplinary action posed with the insurrectionists,

A special agent in the department’s Protective Services Bureau faces disciplinary action because he allegedly revealed information about the secure location he helped evacuate lawmakers to during the insurrection attempt. His friend of 40 years testified he fully believed trumps Big Lie and had fallen into the cult...

https://www.miamiherald.com/news/politics-governme...

[Byker28i]

Byker28i said:

Two more insurrectionists arrested yesterday from Pennsylvania. Marshall Neefe, 25, of Newville, faces 10 charges, Charles Bradford Smith, also known as Brad Smith, 25, of Shippensburg faces 7 charges including four felonies.

In messages Smith sent on Facebook before the insurrection attempt they discussed violent assault, in messages after the breachhe bragged about their participation.
https://www.justice.gov/usao-dc/pr/pennsylvania-me...

Two more blaming trump, saying trumps instruction to be there, will be wild as an instruction.
Facebook entries before hand show smith telling others that trump was calling people to teh Capitol as a show of force...
https://lawandcrime.com/u-s-capitol-breach/call-to...

[anonymous-user]

Byker28i said:

Laura Ingraham downplaying January 6th and accusing Milley of being part of an insurrection
https://twitter.com/i/status/1437962812932775937

Hannity calling Milley treasonous and should be fired
https://twitter.com/i/status/1437945603837739008

I think Tucker Carlson is also rowing that particular boat.

Even for them it is bizarre thesis: a US general acted treasonously by warning a nuclear superpower that the US was not on the verge of loosing a barrage of nukes at them, despite the spittle flecked rhetoric of DJT who might very well have been looking to go out with a bang.

[Byker28i]

BlackWidow13 said:

Byker28i said:

Laura Ingraham downplaying January 6th and accusing Milley of being part of an insurrection
https://twitter.com/i/status/1437962812932775937

Hannity calling Milley treasonous and should be fired
https://twitter.com/i/status/1437945603837739008

I think Tucker Carlson is also rowing that particular boat.

Even for them it is bizarre thesis: a US general acted treasonously by warning a nuclear superpower that the US was not on the verge of loosing a barrage of nukes at them, despite the spittle flecked rhetoric of DJT who might very well have been looking to go out with a bang.

trying to make out Milley called China on his own...
There were 15 people on the video teleconference calls, including a representative of the State Dept and the read out and notes from Milley’s two calls with his Chinese counterpart were shared with the IC and the Interagency and Milley was responding to China believing their own intelligence that trump was about to attack
https://www.axios.com/mark-milley-woodward-trump-c...