The EU v UK vaccine tussle

[barryrs]

DeltonaS said:

Isn't the usual PH response; well it's The Guardian.

Or is that invalid in this case ?

Seems Englands vaccination programm is the new Falklands.

By the way it seems that the much hailed CEO of AZ Soriot, wasn't really honest:

Soriot: "When we took over the Oxford vaccine, we inherited a number of contracts. The British government had invested in production in the UK, but also with our partner in the Netherlands." In the first instance, Halix from Leiden would even be fully used to produce for the United Kingdom. That is no longer the case.

In an earlier interview, Soriot said that vaccines manufactured in the British production chain cannot simply be used to compensate for setbacks for the EU. Now he admits that the British production chain can also be located on the European mainland, in this case in the Netherlands.

The big question now is whether AstraZeneca has violated the terms of the EU contract. The contract states that AstraZeneca has not signed any other contracts that impede delivery to the EU. Apparently those contracts were there after all.
https://nos.nl/artikel/2370277-farmaceut-astrazene...

bitter much.

[NextSlidePlease]

loafer123 said:

Blib said:

Four in five Oxford Covid jabs delivered to EU not yet used.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/feb/25/acce...

Mutti said:

Asked whether she would volunteer to be administered with the vaccine, Merkel added: “I am 66 years old and I do not belong to the recommended group for AstraZeneca.”

Well that's not going to exactly help, is it?!

The answer should have been "of course, now that we have real world data from Scotland showing excellent results in terms of reduction in the risk of hospitalisation I can assure everyone that the AZ vaccine is safe and effective, and I urge those people offered the vaccine to come forward to receive it"

Macron does the same and voila, the vaccine program gains traction.

[Blib]

NextSlidePlease said:

The answer should have been "of course, now that we have real world data from Scotland showing excellent results in terms of reduction in the risk of hospitalisation I can assure everyone that the AZ vaccine is safe and effective, and I urge those people offered the vaccine to come forward to receive it"

Macron does the same and voila, the vaccine program gains traction.

That would validate the way that the UK has gone about things.

[CraigyMc]

thepeoplespal said:

France is just peed off the Sanofi vaccine didn't make the cut

France had one from the Pasteur Institute (with US-based Merck) that was unsuccessful. That's been canned.

Sanofi has two candidates, one recombinant protein-based with GSK (entering Phase II trials, expect results April) and another RNA-based one with Translate Bio.
The GSK one was delayed because of crap results in December from the previous phase II (because they under-dosed), but is still in development.

I've not read how the RNA-based one is getting on for a while but it was expected to be entering trials in Q2'21.

[amusingduck]

EU says UK, U.S. have vaccine export bans, EU allows exports of Pfizer, Moderna shots
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavi...

[DeltonaS]

loafer123 said:

I don’t see how any of that is relevant...if anything you guys should be thankful we invested early in production in your country which you are now benefitting from.

Ungrateful bd.

Well thats actually the problem; we don't.

[NextSlidePlease]

NextSlidePlease said:

loafer123 said:

Blib said:

Four in five Oxford Covid jabs delivered to EU not yet used.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/feb/25/acce...

Mutti said:

Asked whether she would volunteer to be administered with the vaccine, Merkel added: “I am 66 years old and I do not belong to the recommended group for AstraZeneca.”

Well that's not going to exactly help, is it?!

The answer should have been "of course, now that we have real world data from Scotland showing excellent results in terms of reduction in the risk of hospitalisation I can assure everyone that the AZ vaccine is safe and effective, and I urge those people offered the vaccine to come forward to receive it"

Macron does the same and voila, the vaccine program gains traction.

Ah fk, 5 minutes after typing this i am told my grandmother who is 85 and lives in the ROI, has contracted covid whilst in hospital. She went in with a knee injury.

She hasn't had her vaccine yet. Ireland arent giving the AZ vaccine to the over 65's.

[andy_s]

thepeoplespal said:

Don't know if people have watching Dr John Campbell daily analysis...

All the time; very good commentator this past year.

[Andy Zarse]

DeltonaS said:

MiniMan64 said:

Andy 308GTB said:

loafer123 said:

Blib said:

Four in five Oxford Covid jabs delivered to EU not yet used.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/feb/25/acce...

Mutti said:

Asked whether she would volunteer to be administered with the vaccine, Merkel added: “I am 66 years old and I do not belong to the recommended group for AstraZeneca.”

Well that's not going to exactly help, is it?!

Surely the stupidity of what is going on in Europe is not lost on the populations of the member states?

One would hope. I’m sort of amazed the French haven’t been out burning things yet. It’s insane that they’ve supposedly got all that supply that there, after demands extra from the UK a month ago but they’re not using it!

Isn't the usual PH response; well it's The Guardian.

Or is that invalid in this case ?

Seems Englands vaccination programm is the new Falklands.

By the way it seems that the much hailed CEO of AZ Soriot, wasn't really honest:

Soriot: "When we took over the Oxford vaccine, we inherited a number of contracts. The British government had invested in production in the UK, but also with our partner in the Netherlands." In the first instance, Halix from Leiden would even be fully used to produce for the United Kingdom. That is no longer the case.

In an earlier interview, Soriot said that vaccines manufactured in the British production chain cannot simply be used to compensate for setbacks for the EU. Now he admits that the British production chain can also be located on the European mainland, in this case in the Netherlands.

The big question now is whether AstraZeneca has violated the terms of the EU contract. The contract states that AstraZeneca has not signed any other contracts that impede delivery to the EU. Apparently those contracts were there after all.
https://nos.nl/artikel/2370277-farmaceut-astrazene...

I don’t understand the point you’re making. Are you asking a question (and looking for an explanation of the contract terms which were explored in depth on here some weeks back)?

Or are you making a legal statement (and if so I’d be really grateful if you’d explain why you think the contract terms state this)?

For context, my wife is Dutch, her 93yo mother has still not been vaccinated and we are frantic as a family, desperate to see the EU vaccination program succeed.

[anonymous-user]

DeltonaS said:

loafer123 said:

I don’t see how any of that is relevant...if anything you guys should be thankful we invested early in production in your country which you are now benefitting from.

Ungrateful bd.

Well thats actually the problem; we don't.

That's the UK's fault?

[i4got]

catweasle said:

DeltonaS said:

loafer123 said:

I don’t see how any of that is relevant...if anything you guys should be thankful we invested early in production in your country which you are now benefitting from.

Ungrateful bd.

Well thats actually the problem; we don't.

That's the UK's fault?

You're not paying attention. Everything is the UK's fault.

[anonymous-user]

i4got said:

catweasle said:

DeltonaS said:

loafer123 said:

I don’t see how any of that is relevant...if anything you guys should be thankful we invested early in production in your country which you are now benefitting from.

Ungrateful bd.

Well thats actually the problem; we don't.

That's the UK's fault?

You're not paying attention. Everything is the UK's fault.

Unfortunately the UK doesn't have the power and influence we once did so it's a lot harder to sort out the mess the Germans and the French make this time around...{Deltona War Mode off }

[CraigyMc]

anonymous said:

[redacted]

Bild is a bit like the Sun. It's popular, but do not take too seriously.

[DeltonaS]

i4got said:

catweasle said:

DeltonaS said:

loafer123 said:

I don’t see how any of that is relevant...if anything you guys should be thankful we invested early in production in your country which you are now benefitting from.

Ungrateful bd.

Well thats actually the problem; we don't.

That's the UK's fault?

You're not paying attention. Everything is the UK's fault.

And to some on here everything is the EU's fault (or similar).

The reality is maybe AZ shouldn't sign contracts it can't uphold and should be frank about the contracts it already had with the Oxford/the UK.

Edited by DeltonaS on Thursday 25th February 21:43

[CraigyMc]

DeltonaS said:

i4got said:

catweasle said:

DeltonaS said:

loafer123 said:

I don’t see how any of that is relevant...if anything you guys should be thankful we invested early in production in your country which you are now benefitting from.

Ungrateful bd.

Well thats actually the problem; we don't.

That's the UK's fault?

You're not paying attention. Everything is the UK's fault.

And to some on here everything is the EU's fault (or similar).

The reality is maybe AZ shouldn't sign contracts it can't uphold and should be frank about the contracts it already had with Oxford.

DeltonaS, you've read the contract. I know this because we've posted about it before.

What part of "Reasonable effort" is confusing?

[CraigyMc]

anonymous said:

[redacted]

There are jugs?

I've been reading the fking Zeit all this time, hoping for jugs. They never come*.


*yes, that pun was intentional. You're welcome.

[anonymous-user]

DeltonaS said:

i4got said:

catweasle said:

DeltonaS said:

loafer123 said:

I don’t see how any of that is relevant...if anything you guys should be thankful we invested early in production in your country which you are now benefitting from.

Ungrateful bd.

Well thats actually the problem; we don't.

That's the UK's fault?

You're not paying attention. Everything is the UK's fault.

And to some on here everything is the EU's fault (or similar).

The reality is maybe AZ shouldn't sign contracts it can't uphold and should be frank about the contracts it already had with Oxford.

Well the EU will sue them if they are in breach of contract surely..........Are Fish & Pharma the new Coal & Steel?

[loafer123]

DeltonaS said:

loafer123 said:

I don’t see how any of that is relevant...if anything you guys should be thankful we invested early in production in your country which you are now benefitting from.

Ungrateful bd.

Well thats actually the problem; we don't.

You don’t what? Benefit?

Our scientists invented the vaccine, ensured it was done at cost price, the U.K. government then invested early in production in your country, which is now producing vaccine that you are receiving, and you are unhappy?

[Earthdweller]

Left hand ... right hand comes to mind

https://www.rte.ie/news/europe/2021/0225/1199213-e...

EU leaders, including Taoiseach Micheál Martin, met virtually today under pressure to speed up Europe's coronavirus vaccine roll-out and facing demands from some capitals for a continent-wide vaccine passport.

Their video summit comes a year into the Covid-19 crisis, as most of the EU is experiencing a second wave of cases - or a third wave for some - that stubbornly won't diminish.

Brussels has warned six governments about unilateral border restrictions, while tourist-dependent countries are piling on pressure to lift travel barriers in time for summer vacations.

Ahead of the video conference, Austria's Chancellor Sebastian Kurz and Bulgarian Prime Minister Boyko Borissov called for "green passports" to be issued that contain vaccine and test results.

Mr Kurz tweeted "we... want an EU-wide Green Passport, with which people can travel freely, do business without restrictions and go on holiday, as well as finally enjoy gastronomy, culture, events and other things again".

But several EU officials and diplomats warn that, while they back a verifiable vaccination record, it is too early to look at using them to permit easier travel.

They said it was still unknown if vaccinated people can infect others, and worried that it could open a travel schism between a minority of vaccinated haves and a majority of unvaccinated have-nots.

Sea, vax and sun

Greece, however, has indicated it is ready to move faster than its EU peers. It has already struck a bilateral travel agreement with Israel, the world's vaccination champion.

And it is reportedly in similar talks with Britain, its second-biggest tourist market, which is contemplating lifting a ban on foreign leisure travel as early as mid-May.

One senior EU diplomat acknowledged that all European Union countries were eager to reopen travel for the June-to-September tourist season, but said "we have to move this forward together".

An EU official, also speaking on condition of anonymity, was blunter, saying the EU wants to avoid "a new death season".

While Mediterranean countries relying on tourism were pushing for vaccine-dependent travel, northern countries, including Ireland, were sceptical.


On top of examining options for developing a common certificate strategy, the EU leaders will look at how to speed the continent's sluggish vaccines rollout.

The European Commission's vaccine procurement strategy in the first quarter was too dependent on doses from British-Swedish giant AstraZeneca, which drastically under-delivered.

The EU now hopes supplies will be greatly boosted from April with more stocks from Pfizer/BioNTech and Moderna, and the possibility of new vaccines such as a single-dose one from Johnson & Johnson being authorised.

Despite ongoing concerns that several countries are underprepared to give out the millions of jabs in the pipeline, European Commission chief Ursula von der Leyen is sticking by her goal of having 70% of adults in the European Union fully vaccinated by mid-September.

So far just 4% of the bloc's 450 million people have received at least one jab, according to an AFP tally of official figures, and only two percent have been fully vaccinated with two jabs.


Worry over variants

Brussels is also concerned the emergence of worrying variants could require retooled booster shots, which would in turn mean vaccine certificates would have to be constantly updated.

A dispute is also stewing over severe border restrictions put in place by several EU countries to curb the virus variants, and which the European Commission sees as disproportionate.

It has written warning letters to Belgium, Denmark, Finland, Germany, Hungary and Sweden about their measures, giving them until late next week to respond.

An EU official said he expected "quite a lively discussion between the member states" on that issue during the summit.

The EU's internal market commissioner, Thierry Breton, tweeted that "the closure of borders by certain member states hurts the entire single market", calling for curbs to be lifted as soon as it is possible to do so.

There was a view in Brussels that while the first quarter has gone badly, there will be a much bigger flow of vaccines in the second quarter.

European Commission President Ursula von der Leyen told the German regional daily newspaper Augsburger Allgemeine that, despite the friction with AstraZeneca, "vaccine manufacturers are our partners in this pandemic".

[tertius]

DeltonaS said:

i4got said:

catweasle said:

DeltonaS said:

loafer123 said:

I don’t see how any of that is relevant...if anything you guys should be thankful we invested early in production in your country which you are now benefitting from.

Ungrateful bd.

Well thats actually the problem; we don't.

That's the UK's fault?

You're not paying attention. Everything is the UK's fault.

And to some on here everything is the EU's fault (or similar).

The reality is maybe AZ shouldn't sign contracts it can't uphold and should be frank about the contracts it already had with Oxford.

Hm, have you read the analysis of the contracts - e.g. from the Belgian lawyer (relevant given that the contract was made under Belgian law).

I can’t be bothered to find it (as I am just on my phone now) but this was discussed at length a few weeks ago and from memory the “no other contracts” bit referred to “completing its obligations as set out in the contract” and its obligations in the contract were all subject “best efforts” so not I think the smoking gun you imply.