Discussion
Blue62 said:
It was reported fairly widely yesterday in the quality press that there’s now evidence that it reduces transmission, I’d be interested if you have a link to your point about the pharma companies.
Assuming you think the BBC is quality (God help you), what they seem to be reporting is Matt quality Hancock saying what his expert interpretation of the data shows himhttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-56145392
Hospitalisation rates are falling and a professor said the data 'looks really good' - which I imagine is the sort of thing John Ioannidis meant when he coined the term 'evidence based hear-say.'
I'm sure you great minds who seek out solid evidence for your opinions, and weed out those who make bold claims with your critical thinking prowess must have something more substantial to go on?
g4ry13 said:
You just said it yourself 
The press aren't going to pull up such claims from thin air without Pfizer, Astrazeneca etc. giving them some basis to print such a claim.
Apologies, I misread the second part of your post based on your opening line which stated that ‘they don’t really know if it reduces transmission at all’. The press aren't going to pull up such claims from thin air without Pfizer, Astrazeneca etc. giving them some basis to print such a claim.
The data that has been coming out of Israel for a week or more would challenge your statement, but based on your following posts you think that’s a falsehood?
JuanCarlosFandango said:
Assuming you think the BBC is quality (God help you), what they seem to be reporting is Matt quality Hancock saying what his expert interpretation of the data shows him
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-56145392
Hospitalisation rates are falling and a professor said the data 'looks really good' - which I imagine is the sort of thing John Ioannidis meant when he coined the term 'evidence based hear-say.'
I'm sure you great minds who seek out solid evidence for your opinions, and weed out those who make bold claims with your critical thinking prowess must have something more substantial to go on?
Not at all, that was why I was asking for a link, comprehension must be in short supply when you’ve got all that foam to deal with. The reports I saw were in the Times and Indy, I’ve read previously about the results coming out of Israel and the data is obviously new. HTHhttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-56145392
Hospitalisation rates are falling and a professor said the data 'looks really good' - which I imagine is the sort of thing John Ioannidis meant when he coined the term 'evidence based hear-say.'
I'm sure you great minds who seek out solid evidence for your opinions, and weed out those who make bold claims with your critical thinking prowess must have something more substantial to go on?
Blue62 said:
g4ry13 said:
You just said it yourself
The press aren't going to pull up such claims from thin air without Pfizer, Astrazeneca etc. giving them some basis to print such a claim.
Apologies, I misread the second part of your post based on your opening line which stated that ‘they don’t really know if it reduces transmission at all’. The press aren't going to pull up such claims from thin air without Pfizer, Astrazeneca etc. giving them some basis to print such a claim.
The data that has been coming out of Israel for a week or more would challenge your statement, but based on your following posts you think that’s a falsehood?
It's a bit of a mixed message because vaccinations took place and infection numbers went up.
"Paediatricians in Israel, which has surged ahead in vaccinating its adult population, reported a sharp rise in covid-19 infections among young people, with more than 50 000 children and teens testing positive in January—more than Israel saw in any month during the first and second waves."
Source: https://www.bmj.com/content/372/bmj.n383#:~:text=P...
For balance, an article a few weeks later which now claims infections dropping:
https://www.bmj.com/content/372/bmj.n338
rxe said:
Why do we care about transmission if a vaccine has been offered to everyone , which it looks like will be the case by June? If you’re concerned by COVID, get a vaccine and the worst that will happen is you might get a cold. If you’re worried about the vaccine, then the worst that can happen is that you might get COVID.
This. I just cannot see the argument that those who opt not to be vaccinated are a threat. Well, they are, but only to themselves. If you're worried about covid, get vaccinated. Then you can stop worrying about transmission. Brave Fart said:
This. I just cannot see the argument that those who opt not to be vaccinated are a threat. Well, they are, but only to themselves. If you're worried about covid, get vaccinated. Then you can stop worrying about transmission.
It's another thing where they're wildly inconsisted, isn't it?When the vaccine is only so effective and appears to reduce transmission, masks might do some good, lockdowns appear to work, we're all meant to get behind it with enthusiasm because even a bit of harm reduction is better than doing nothing.
Now they have their vaccine and it's busy reducing harm and transmission for millions of vulnerable people with every indication that many more in all age groups will happily take it and reduce harm further, they still have to get their knickers in a know because a few people would rather not take it for whatever reason. They start sneering about how ignorant and stupid we must be, talking about how we must have been duped by mischief making charlatans and are deficient in our abilities to see the truth and the light.
It is, in every sense a new religion and the vaccine is the baptism.
Brave Fart said:
rxe said:
Why do we care about transmission if a vaccine has been offered to everyone , which it looks like will be the case by June? If you’re concerned by COVID, get a vaccine and the worst that will happen is you might get a cold. If you’re worried about the vaccine, then the worst that can happen is that you might get COVID.
This. I just cannot see the argument that those who opt not to be vaccinated are a threat. Well, they are, but only to themselves. If you're worried about covid, get vaccinated. Then you can stop worrying about transmission. [/quote
As I understand it the vaccines don't stop anyone from getting Covid 19, or from spreading it, but they do reduce the chance of people getting seriously ill from it, to the extent, they can avoid hospitalization, and possibly death
In a care home setting I would expect it to be necessary for both the staff and residents to be vaccinated as a minimum precaution.
In the same way I would expect the crew of an airliner I was boarding, to have all the necessary health and professional qualifications to do their job properly and safely.
I could just imagine passengers reactions if the crew announced before taxiing out, that the pilots (although they are feeling just fine) did not have a valid instrument rating, or AME certification.
Edited by Pan Pan Pan on Tuesday 23 February 11:26
Pan Pan Pan said:
<edit for brevity>
As I understand it the vaccines don't stop anyone from getting Covid 19, or from spreading it, but they do reduce the chance of people getting seriously ill from it, to the extent, they can avoid hospitalization, and possibly death.
Well, either the vaccines reduce transmission, or they don't. If they don't, there's no point in vaccine passports because there will always be some folk who can't have the vaccine. If they do reduce transmission, there's no point in vaccine passports because if you're vaccinated then you're safe. Of course we'll never get a 100% safe situation whatever we do.As I understand it the vaccines don't stop anyone from getting Covid 19, or from spreading it, but they do reduce the chance of people getting seriously ill from it, to the extent, they can avoid hospitalization, and possibly death.
Bottom line: if a person is worried, get jabbed (and don't try to impose your choice on others) . Otherwise, do whatever you like.
Brave Fart said:
Well, either the vaccines reduce transmission, or they don't. If they don't, there's no point in vaccine passports because there will always be some folk who can't have the vaccine. If they do reduce transmission, there's no point in vaccine passports because if you're vaccinated then you're safe. Of course we'll never get a 100% safe situation whatever we do.
Bottom line: if a person is worried, get jabbed (and don't try to impose your choice on others) . Otherwise, do whatever you like.
That would defeat the whole purpose of inventing this crisis in the first place.Bottom line: if a person is worried, get jabbed (and don't try to impose your choice on others) . Otherwise, do whatever you like.
Brave Fart said:
Pan Pan Pan said:
<edit for brevity>
As I understand it the vaccines don't stop anyone from getting Covid 19, or from spreading it, but they do reduce the chance of people getting seriously ill from it, to the extent, they can avoid hospitalization, and possibly death.
Well, either the vaccines reduce transmission, or they don't. If they don't, there's no point in vaccine passports because there will always be some folk who can't have the vaccine. If they do reduce transmission, there's no point in vaccine passports because if you're vaccinated then you're safe. Of course we'll never get a 100% safe situation whatever we do.As I understand it the vaccines don't stop anyone from getting Covid 19, or from spreading it, but they do reduce the chance of people getting seriously ill from it, to the extent, they can avoid hospitalization, and possibly death.
Bottom line: if a person is worried, get jabbed (and don't try to impose your choice on others) . Otherwise, do whatever you like.
JuanCarlosFandango said:
otolith said:
JuanCarlosFandango said:
That would defeat the whole purpose of inventing this crisis in the first place.
Which is? Pan Pan Pan said:
This. I just cannot see the argument that those who opt not to be vaccinated are a threat. Well, they are, but only to themselves. If you're worried about covid, get vaccinated. Then you can stop worrying about transmission.
[/quote
As I understand it the vaccines don't stop anyone from getting Covid 19, or from spreading it, but they do reduce the chance of people getting seriously ill from it, to the extent, they can avoid hospitalization, and possibly death
In a care home setting I would expect it to be necessary for both the staff and residents to be vaccinated as a minimum precaution.
In the same way I would expect the crew of an airliner I was boarding, to have all the necessary health and professional qualifications to do their job properly and safely.
I could just imagine passengers reactions if the crew announced before taxiing out, that the pilots (although they are feeling just fine) did not have a valid instrument rating, or AME certification.
Why would you care whether the person sitting next to you on a plane was vaccinated? If you’re vaccinated, you’re worrying about nothing. [/quote
As I understand it the vaccines don't stop anyone from getting Covid 19, or from spreading it, but they do reduce the chance of people getting seriously ill from it, to the extent, they can avoid hospitalization, and possibly death
In a care home setting I would expect it to be necessary for both the staff and residents to be vaccinated as a minimum precaution.
In the same way I would expect the crew of an airliner I was boarding, to have all the necessary health and professional qualifications to do their job properly and safely.
I could just imagine passengers reactions if the crew announced before taxiing out, that the pilots (although they are feeling just fine) did not have a valid instrument rating, or AME certification.
Edited by Pan Pan Pan on Tuesday 23 February 11:26
If I happened to be sticking my mum in a care home, my only concern would be that she had been vaccinated.
JuanCarlosFandango said:
otolith said:
JuanCarlosFandango said:
That would defeat the whole purpose of inventing this crisis in the first place.
Which is? CraigyMc said:
For the record, this theory you have that there's a conspiracy, what would it take for you to stop believing in it?
Won’t happen, which is why any rational discussion around this and many other topics is a complete waste of time. To some extent they get away with it on the internet, in the real world you would just move to another seat on the bus. Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff