"Try to be less white" - what?!?
Discussion
sgtBerbatov said:
Kessler said:
sgtBerbatov said:
Kessler said:
sgtBerbatov said:
Do you see the irony of what you've written with what's on the slide?
That it's racist? No, I don't consider that ironicEdited by Kessler on Wednesday 24th February 12:27
You have demonstrated arrogance, irgnorance, certainty, defensiveness, nearly the whole list of things you've got a problem with because you think it's wrong.
What has gone wrong in your life for you to be offended by that list?
2xChevrons said:
Kessler said:
sgtBerbatov said:
Kessler said:
sgtBerbatov said:
Do you see the irony of what you've written with what's on the slide?
That it's racist? No, I don't consider that ironicLeaving aside the (probably deliberately) provocative context to the slide, you reacted to a slide suggesting that white people can be overly defensive, certain, arrogant, apathetic and unwilling to listen to or consider structural racial issues in society...in a way that hit all those points.
One slide from a presentation, out of context, tells us very little. It was probably intended for a certain amount of shock value to make the audience confront their subconscious biases - I've seen similar slides tackling different issues the same way. Or it's just a bad, overly-ambitious and self-flagellating attempt to make a point that is worth approaching.
As I said in the thread about unconscious bias, a big problem is that when there's a push to introduce this sort of training to organisations (or, worse, be seen to introduce it) it leads to a lot of low-quality information which does the actual matter that should be at hand a huge disservice.
Edited by Kessler on Wednesday 24th February 12:55
Kessler said:
No. Ascribing negative traits to a skin colour is racist - plain and simple, no further context needed. Yes, I reacted negatively to that because I'm not on board with racism - as would a black person being ascribed negative traits based on their skin colour - and you conclude my reaction is "arrogant and defensive"...wow
Perhaps a less controversial instruction would be "try to be less defined by your race"?
Kessler said:
No. Ascribing negative traits to a skin colour is racist - plain and simple, no further context needed. Yes, I reacted negatively to that because I'm not on board with racism - as would a black person being ascribed negative traits based on their skin colour - and you conclude my reaction is "arrogant and defensive"...wow
I'm with Kessler. You can't create a slideshow that incorporates things negatively stereotypical of a certain race, and then present it to them by saying "be less like this". Edited by Kessler on Wednesday 24th February 12:55
I can't imagine a similar slideshow saying "try to be less black" would go down particularly well.
2xChevrons said:
Kessler said:
sgtBerbatov said:
Kessler said:
sgtBerbatov said:
Do you see the irony of what you've written with what's on the slide?
That it's racist? No, I don't consider that ironicLeaving aside the (probably deliberately) provocative context to the slide, you reacted to a slide suggesting that white people can be overly defensive, certain, arrogant, apathetic and unwilling to listen to or consider structural racial issues in society...in a way that hit all those points.
One slide from a presentation, out of context, tells us very little. It was probably intended for a certain amount of shock value to make the audience confront their subconscious biases - I've seen similar slides tackling different issues the same way. Or it's just a bad, overly-ambitious and self-flagellating attempt to make a point that is worth approaching.
As I said in the thread about unconscious bias, a big problem is that when there's a push to introduce this sort of training to organisations (or, worse, be seen to introduce it) it leads to a lot of low-quality information which does the actual matter that should be at hand a huge disservice.
To be fair to Cola...they probably got a third party in to reprogram their employees and didn't bother reviewing their nonsense. We had a similar thing a couple of years ago, when a complete numpty was teaching us how to be nicer to everyone. It was like being at primary school. An amusing waste of company time and money though.
purplepenguin said:
bigandclever said:
So, Coca Cola have distanced themselves from it saying ‘not our curriculum, gov, we didn’t create it’. And the (supposed) author, Robin DiAngelo, has also distanced herself from it saying ‘not me, guv, I’m not the creator or the facilitator of it’. Now what?
Don’t drink coca-cola - it’s just s
t2xChevrons said:
Kessler said:
No. Ascribing negative traits to a skin colour is racist - plain and simple, no further context needed. Yes, I reacted negatively to that because I'm not on board with racism - as would a black person being ascribed negative traits based on their skin colour - and you conclude my reaction is "arrogant and defensive"...wow
Or healthy self-critique and reflection by a person of that race aimed at other people of that race? Edited by Kessler on Wednesday 24th February 12:55
It's one thing for people of one race to make sweeping generalisations - especially negative - about people of another. It's quite another for people of the same race to consider what aspects of their culture might cause issues when it comes to trying to eliminate lingering systemic issues about race.
Edited by Kessler on Wednesday 24th February 13:29
sgtBerbatov said:
2xChevrons said:
Kessler said:
sgtBerbatov said:
Kessler said:
sgtBerbatov said:
Do you see the irony of what you've written with what's on the slide?
That it's racist? No, I don't consider that ironicLeaving aside the (probably deliberately) provocative context to the slide, you reacted to a slide suggesting that white people can be overly defensive, certain, arrogant, apathetic and unwilling to listen to or consider structural racial issues in society...in a way that hit all those points.
One slide from a presentation, out of context, tells us very little. It was probably intended for a certain amount of shock value to make the audience confront their subconscious biases - I've seen similar slides tackling different issues the same way. Or it's just a bad, overly-ambitious and self-flagellating attempt to make a point that is worth approaching.
As I said in the thread about unconscious bias, a big problem is that when there's a push to introduce this sort of training to organisations (or, worse, be seen to introduce it) it leads to a lot of low-quality information which does the actual matter that should be at hand a huge disservice.
End of
stitched said:
sgtBerbatov said:
2xChevrons said:
Kessler said:
sgtBerbatov said:
Kessler said:
sgtBerbatov said:
Do you see the irony of what you've written with what's on the slide?
That it's racist? No, I don't consider that ironicLeaving aside the (probably deliberately) provocative context to the slide, you reacted to a slide suggesting that white people can be overly defensive, certain, arrogant, apathetic and unwilling to listen to or consider structural racial issues in society...in a way that hit all those points.
One slide from a presentation, out of context, tells us very little. It was probably intended for a certain amount of shock value to make the audience confront their subconscious biases - I've seen similar slides tackling different issues the same way. Or it's just a bad, overly-ambitious and self-flagellating attempt to make a point that is worth approaching.
As I said in the thread about unconscious bias, a big problem is that when there's a push to introduce this sort of training to organisations (or, worse, be seen to introduce it) it leads to a lot of low-quality information which does the actual matter that should be at hand a huge disservice.
End of
a) It was racist
b) I wasn't white
I'm sorry you're hurt by a total stranger on the internet. End of.
stitched said:
sgtBerbatov said:
2xChevrons said:
Kessler said:
sgtBerbatov said:
Kessler said:
sgtBerbatov said:
Do you see the irony of what you've written with what's on the slide?
That it's racist? No, I don't consider that ironicLeaving aside the (probably deliberately) provocative context to the slide, you reacted to a slide suggesting that white people can be overly defensive, certain, arrogant, apathetic and unwilling to listen to or consider structural racial issues in society...in a way that hit all those points.
One slide from a presentation, out of context, tells us very little. It was probably intended for a certain amount of shock value to make the audience confront their subconscious biases - I've seen similar slides tackling different issues the same way. Or it's just a bad, overly-ambitious and self-flagellating attempt to make a point that is worth approaching.
As I said in the thread about unconscious bias, a big problem is that when there's a push to introduce this sort of training to organisations (or, worse, be seen to introduce it) it leads to a lot of low-quality information which does the actual matter that should be at hand a huge disservice.
End of
A simple test, substitute black for white, man for woman, jew for christian in any sentence. If its no longer acceptable it wasn't in the first place.
The notion that [insert physiological characteristic] equals [personality characteristic] is duff.
Aren't most of us taught that the colour of a person's skin has no bearing on their character?
Or is this more 'majority privilege' stuff?
The question of free speech that bhstewie raised - yes if someone like Robin DiAngelo wishes to pose this view then it's perfectly valid to choose to disagree with what she's saying or to challenge her to back up what she's saying with some data to support it.
But when it's a large employer like Coca-Cola having their employees take part in this kind of thing the question is do the employees have to agree with what they're being told and will this affect their employment?
Coca-Cola have distanced themselves from it, as have LinkedIn.
Does that demonstrate corporations that don't take care in ensuring the validity of the information they're disseminating? Socially careless.
Does it demonstrate companies that are naively and cynically following the 'woke' line until challenged to defend it? Socially shallow.
Does it represent companies promoting something they value until there's a backlash from someone, which might their revenue stream? Lacking integrity.
Personally I believe there are people at both ends of the horseshoe that are very different in their views but equally divisive and equally unpleasant.
Unity and harmony is not what they're looking to achieve.
Aren't most of us taught that the colour of a person's skin has no bearing on their character?
Or is this more 'majority privilege' stuff?
The question of free speech that b
hstewie raised - yes if someone like Robin DiAngelo wishes to pose this view then it's perfectly valid to choose to disagree with what she's saying or to challenge her to back up what she's saying with some data to support it. But when it's a large employer like Coca-Cola having their employees take part in this kind of thing the question is do the employees have to agree with what they're being told and will this affect their employment?
Coca-Cola have distanced themselves from it, as have LinkedIn.
Does that demonstrate corporations that don't take care in ensuring the validity of the information they're disseminating? Socially careless.
Does it demonstrate companies that are naively and cynically following the 'woke' line until challenged to defend it? Socially shallow.
Does it represent companies promoting something they value until there's a backlash from someone, which might their revenue stream? Lacking integrity.
Personally I believe there are people at both ends of the horseshoe that are very different in their views but equally divisive and equally unpleasant.
Unity and harmony is not what they're looking to achieve.
RonaldMcDonaldAteMyCat said:
Can't wait for the wokeness and virtue signalling age to be brown bread.
What's wrong with white bread ? Or "best of both" ?From this point onwards any references to bread must be made in a nondiscriminatory way, in the interests of inclusion and diversity.
Unless you think white bread is oppressive, obviously.
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