Will the plan work to turn generation rent into buy?
Discussion
Bacon Is Proof said:
stitched said:
Step duly taken.
I have thought quite a bit about my privileged life.
You actually worked behind the bar, or served or cooked food for those 84 hours?
And I agree actually, running a pub or bar can be exacting work, I hope you can get back to it soon.
Don't cheers me immediately after still having the audacity to question whether or not I have worked those hours.I have thought quite a bit about my privileged life.
You actually worked behind the bar, or served or cooked food for those 84 hours?
And I agree actually, running a pub or bar can be exacting work, I hope you can get back to it soon.
TBH, I wish I was still in the pub then I would simply pour your drink down the drain and drag you off the premises, backwards, in line with our customer behaviour policy.
FWIW, no I was not behind the bar or cooking food for all of those hours, some of them were spent vacuuming the garden, scrubbing toilets clean, getting stock in and out of the cellar, cashing up and filling out financial reports, or doing any other of the myriad of tasks it takes to successfully run a pub that the average feckless pleb wouldn't think about.
With your attitude you would have no chance of evicting me from the premises.
I'd already have left.
Cock
Bacon Is Proof said:
stitched said:
The idea that someone is capable of working for 120 hours a week is simply risible.
That I take the stance that working involves performing tasks for money, or in your case to better your business.
So to the 120 hours a week claim, don't tell me, show me.
Because at best it is misleading, at worst an outright lie.
Look down.That I take the stance that working involves performing tasks for money, or in your case to better your business.
So to the 120 hours a week claim, don't tell me, show me.
Because at best it is misleading, at worst an outright lie.
Is there velcro where your shoelaces should be?
Just because you have neither the experience of, nor the imagination to consider vastly different sectors to your own does not mean that anyone is lying.
It's like me saying that I have had 300,000 volts flowing through me. To a layperson that didn't study basic science that sounds unbelievably high, but as an insulation tape monkey you will know that it is quite, quite possible.
Also, considering that you can put your screwdriver down at any time without consequence for a breather, I find it particularly distasteful you question how much someone is working in a sector where one can't take five whenever they feel like it.
You can't stop for a minute whilst bathing Mavis, because she'll drown.
It's one of the reasons why people working in care work much harder than you do, despite being rewarded less.
I know it's a new concept for you and others but the relationship is not linear.
That's why some people work really hard for upto, but not exceeding, 84 hours a week to be able to get help from a mortgage lender, whereas a lazy albeit naturally gifted pisshead like myself can own his own home with zero debts whilst typically working only two days a week, as a favour, at the age of 43.
Cheers
I've run cocktail bars from corfu to brindisi.
I hold a qualification to do so, actually hard to earn.
But because I'm also a qualified spark you think I know nothing of your industry.
The main reason I removed myself from the hospitality industry on returning to this country is because those who are good at it are unrecognised and unrewarded.
Hint, in corfu I was paid £45 per hour in several bars.
I agree regards care workers, however not those working a 120 hour week.
stitched said:
I'll pass on the beer,
I've run cocktail bars from corfu to brindisi.
I hold a qualification to do so, actually hard to earn.
But because I'm also a qualified spark you think I know nothing of your industry.
The main reason I removed myself from the hospitality industry on returning to this country is because those who are good at it are unrecognised and unrewarded.
Hint, in corfu I was paid £45 per hour in several bars.
I agree regards care workers, however not those working a 120 hour week.
You keep ignoring what was said. No one said 120hrs. YOU said anyone working more than 84 hours is bullsI've run cocktail bars from corfu to brindisi.
I hold a qualification to do so, actually hard to earn.
But because I'm also a qualified spark you think I know nothing of your industry.
The main reason I removed myself from the hospitality industry on returning to this country is because those who are good at it are unrecognised and unrewarded.
Hint, in corfu I was paid £45 per hour in several bars.
I agree regards care workers, however not those working a 120 hour week.
tting then claimed it was lies when you got numerous examples of it happening and told people they're making it up.egor110 said:
A500leroy said:
If we REALLY want it levelling out, we need to introduce a national wage no matter what job your doing, ie doctor £16p/h,Nurse £16p/h, shelf stacker £16 p/h, That way everyone has the same income, everyone has roughly the same outgoings for necessities and we become this great level nation the g/ment want us to be.
Come on you don't believe that .People who've put the time in to train as doctors , vets etc should be paid more , however shelf stackers , posties etc should earn a decent wage that allows them to buy a modest house , pay into a pension etc rather than live paycheck to paycheck.
The simple issue is that my engineer dad got paid 9k a year in 1980, bought a new build 4 bed house for 43k with a bit of help from parents.
The roughly equivalent job is now 30k (rather than the 36k inflation would make it) but rather than the house being 170k, the house is at least 450k (without a new build premium). It was a stretch for them then, it would be impossible now.
https://www.inflationtool.com/british-pound/1980-t...
Being in my 40s in a professional but not well paid job and with a wife not working due to kids and illness no way we'd own if it was not for parental help. And that's with 10 and 15 year old cars, no holidays for years and little additional expense.
Wage stagnation is a huge issue, as is the house price boom. Precovid and brexit but interesting read
https://www.forbes.com/sites/stevedenning/2018/07/...
mikewilliams79 said:
stitched said:
I'll pass on the beer,
I've run cocktail bars from corfu to brindisi.
I hold a qualification to do so, actually hard to earn.
But because I'm also a qualified spark you think I know nothing of your industry.
The main reason I removed myself from the hospitality industry on returning to this country is because those who are good at it are unrecognised and unrewarded.
Hint, in corfu I was paid £45 per hour in several bars.
I agree regards care workers, however not those working a 120 hour week.
You keep ignoring what was said. No one said 120hrs. YOU said anyone working more than 84 hours is bullsI've run cocktail bars from corfu to brindisi.
I hold a qualification to do so, actually hard to earn.
But because I'm also a qualified spark you think I know nothing of your industry.
The main reason I removed myself from the hospitality industry on returning to this country is because those who are good at it are unrecognised and unrewarded.
Hint, in corfu I was paid £45 per hour in several bars.
I agree regards care workers, however not those working a 120 hour week.
tting then claimed it was lies when you got numerous examples of it happening and told people they're making it up.The claim of working a 120 hour week was made.
And yes having worked 84 hour weeks I doubt many do more, unless under exceptional pressure for a seriously short time.
Please enlighten us on what it is you do, and the hours you work, as you seem to be the adjudicator here?
Although entirely self imposed.
stitched said:
I have to ask, can you actually read?
The claim of working a 120 hour week was made.
And yes having worked 84 hour weeks I doubt many do more, unless under exceptional pressure for a seriously short time.
Please enlighten us on what it is you do, and the hours you work, as you seem to be the adjudicator here?
Although entirely self imposed.
Who made the claim?The claim of working a 120 hour week was made.
And yes having worked 84 hour weeks I doubt many do more, unless under exceptional pressure for a seriously short time.
Please enlighten us on what it is you do, and the hours you work, as you seem to be the adjudicator here?
Although entirely self imposed.
And short time, nope, 3 weeks +.
It's quite clear who the bulls
tter is here.Joey Deacon said:
Slim pickings near me, but lets assume a couple borrow the maximum allowed and go for something like this.
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/104484818#/
They need the £30K deposit so borrow £570K with Halifax at 3.73% over a 25 year repayment mortgage.
I make that £2924.35 a month........
That’s hilarious. A house so small that you can sit on the sofa on the l.room and kick the front door shut without getting up.
Joking aside you need a hell of a job to buy that. And it’s utterly utterly dreadful and miserable. Can you imagine the last 12 mths of lockdown living in that for what, nearly £3k a mth in mortgage.
But that’s the twist isn’t it. Bonkers wages required to live in a home the rest of the UK might put up with as a first time buyer home for a few years. Say you can afford it, what on earth do you do next when you want an average sized house ?
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/104484818#/
They need the £30K deposit so borrow £570K with Halifax at 3.73% over a 25 year repayment mortgage.
I make that £2924.35 a month........
That’s hilarious. A house so small that you can sit on the sofa on the l.room and kick the front door shut without getting up.
Joking aside you need a hell of a job to buy that. And it’s utterly utterly dreadful and miserable. Can you imagine the last 12 mths of lockdown living in that for what, nearly £3k a mth in mortgage.
But that’s the twist isn’t it. Bonkers wages required to live in a home the rest of the UK might put up with as a first time buyer home for a few years. Say you can afford it, what on earth do you do next when you want an average sized house ?
austinsmirk said:
Joey Deacon said:
Slim pickings near me, but lets assume a couple borrow the maximum allowed and go for something like this.
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/104484818#/
They need the £30K deposit so borrow £570K with Halifax at 3.73% over a 25 year repayment mortgage.
I make that £2924.35 a month........
That’s hilarious. A house so small that you can sit on the sofa on the l.room and kick the front door shut without getting up. https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/104484818#/
They need the £30K deposit so borrow £570K with Halifax at 3.73% over a 25 year repayment mortgage.
I make that £2924.35 a month........
Joking aside you need a hell of a job to buy that. And it’s utterly utterly dreadful and miserable. Can you imagine the last 12 mths of lockdown living in that for what, nearly £3k a mth in mortgage.
But that’s the twist isn’t it. Bonkers wages required to live in a home the rest of the UK might put up with as a first time buyer home for a few years. Say you can afford it, what on earth do you do next when you want an average sized house ?
A.J.M said:
Bacon Is Proof said:
It wasn't on offer; we're fully booked.
If you do Moretti on draft then I’ll have a pint.. 
But not for a while. Busy working and decorating a house you understand.
While laughing at the oracle of hard workings posts.
Amstel, Estrella, Staropramen and Pravha, btw. First one's on me.
austinsmirk said:
undercurrent” bang on). In answer to what you do after that - You either move to somewhere horrible like Hanworth or you pay up. And it’s a million quid to live somewhere nice round the corner. Thanks for coming.
I’m being somewhat flippant but that’s the reality to be fair. Obviously nobody under 35 would ever move to Hampton unless their illness was terminal - as ever you must remember the salary thing, it’s warped for a lot of jobs. A girl I used to manage who must be 26 or so now (she graduated in 2015), who was medium good at flogging ad space to agencies by taking them out and getting them pissed - I heard just left a job for a promotion while being paid 50k base and probably most of that again if hitting target (I’m guessing she has got a pay rise to 65-70 and same again in bonus). It is that easy, she’ll easily make at least 100k from now on every year and she has at least two more easy promotions by just being in the game to take that base up to around 90-100k with same again bonus. It’s a shambles that you can out-earn a vet with no actual skills by the time you’re 24/25, but you can.
But you are correct in that the next thing is a huge jump. You need hundreds of thousands of pounds in cash and to be able to stomach setting fire to 50k of it in stamp.
And it’s that jump that requires you to have wealthy parents, or have done very well in your job and have picked a decent first flat that has gained some value. Preferably all 3. This is before we have even factored in having a wedding, children, holidays, a car, etc etc.
The whole ‘average’ pay / affordability thing is interesting too. The ‘average pay’ is a median average. It’s not the more useful ( to my mind) modal average. I still think the housing affordability / mortgage affordability is actually top loaded ( certainly in the U.K. ). A lot of younger people ( particularly singles ) and people in less affluent areas, would still see the possibility of getting a suitable loan to be able to buy a suitable property ( one equivalent to the one they rent ) as a distant prospect. As for 95% LTV, well that’s just asking for another sub prime crisis.
Edited by Maximus_Meridius101 on Wednesday 21st April 08:06
I generally come on here for a chillax session after work, I've now been drawn into an argument I don't really want.
Anyone I have annoyed or offended with my genuine opinions, apologies.
I have been told all my life that the first rung of the housing ladder is impossible at this time, I don't believe it to be true.
My life has been made easier by investing in, and improving property and I advise anyone feeling this to be impossible to reconsider.
It is more complex now than it was when I first bought, planning regs require scheme members for a lot more, hetas for stoves, part p for electrics etc.
I still think it manageable in most areas.
Perhaps rig workers work longer hours than those with whom I am acquainted with, I neither know nor care, none of the personal actions I have described are inaccurate.
All those who are thinking of buying, go for it, carefully.
I'm out.
Anyone I have annoyed or offended with my genuine opinions, apologies.
I have been told all my life that the first rung of the housing ladder is impossible at this time, I don't believe it to be true.
My life has been made easier by investing in, and improving property and I advise anyone feeling this to be impossible to reconsider.
It is more complex now than it was when I first bought, planning regs require scheme members for a lot more, hetas for stoves, part p for electrics etc.
I still think it manageable in most areas.
Perhaps rig workers work longer hours than those with whom I am acquainted with, I neither know nor care, none of the personal actions I have described are inaccurate.
All those who are thinking of buying, go for it, carefully.
I'm out.
InitialDave said:
austinsmirk said:
Joey Deacon said:
Slim pickings near me, but lets assume a couple borrow the maximum allowed and go for something like this.
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/104484818#/
They need the £30K deposit so borrow £570K with Halifax at 3.73% over a 25 year repayment mortgage.
I make that £2924.35 a month........
That’s hilarious. A house so small that you can sit on the sofa on the l.room and kick the front door shut without getting up. https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/104484818#/
They need the £30K deposit so borrow £570K with Halifax at 3.73% over a 25 year repayment mortgage.
I make that £2924.35 a month........
Joking aside you need a hell of a job to buy that. And it’s utterly utterly dreadful and miserable. Can you imagine the last 12 mths of lockdown living in that for what, nearly £3k a mth in mortgage.
But that’s the twist isn’t it. Bonkers wages required to live in a home the rest of the UK might put up with as a first time buyer home for a few years. Say you can afford it, what on earth do you do next when you want an average sized house ?
To put that in perspective I bought a 3 bedroom detached house with garage and drive as a BTL four years ago in Hampshire for not much more than that. It's about a 45 minute drive outside of where we are now.
It is mental, I don't know how the majority of people afford it as £1 million doesn't even get you off street parking. Yet I see lots of couples in their 30s putting the children into the brand new Range Rover after having lunch in an expensive restaurant.
It is funny how things turn around.
In the early 90’s, when house prices collapsed and many people had negative equity in their homes, there were frequent tv documentaries telling us that the UK needed a much greater private rented sector like Germany and France.
Now we have that, but people are still not content.
You just have to make the most of what you have, and can afford. Life is difficult, and then you die.
In the early 90’s, when house prices collapsed and many people had negative equity in their homes, there were frequent tv documentaries telling us that the UK needed a much greater private rented sector like Germany and France.
Now we have that, but people are still not content.
You just have to make the most of what you have, and can afford. Life is difficult, and then you die.
Joey Deacon said:
This is the situation we are in, the next step up to go from a 2 bedroom to a 3 bedroom is probably the best part of £250/£300K. For that you are probably gaining a 10 by 12 foot room and maybe a bigger garden. It may even be a loft conversion which causes compromises with room sizes on the floor below.
To put that in perspective I bought a 3 bedroom detached house with garage and drive as a BTL four years ago in Hampshire for not much more than that. It's about a 45 minute drive outside of where we are now.
It is mental, I don't know how the majority of people afford it as £1 million doesn't even get you off street parking. Yet I see lots of couples in their 30s putting the children into the brand new Range Rover after having lunch in an expensive restaurant.
I know a 2 couples in that area in houses, most of them bought with proceed of flat sales (also in that area), two couples bought around 6 years ago at 500k/755k respectively, I'd imagine now worth 700/900k, and the single person I mentioned a few pages back who's buying at 750k bought a place near me in Clapham 10 years ago and made nearly 100% so they only need to borrow half of the 750k (as smart with cash and saved along the way as well as paying down half the mortgage).To put that in perspective I bought a 3 bedroom detached house with garage and drive as a BTL four years ago in Hampshire for not much more than that. It's about a 45 minute drive outside of where we are now.
It is mental, I don't know how the majority of people afford it as £1 million doesn't even get you off street parking. Yet I see lots of couples in their 30s putting the children into the brand new Range Rover after having lunch in an expensive restaurant.
I think in all but one case there was no help, and that help was likely a fairly modest sum to buy a 1 bed in KT5. All of these people are dual income (apart from the single one), I'd estimate all have HHI probably between 150-250k, none of them own range rovers though, but they do have kids, each kid in nursery is a range rover.
Again, those household incomes would allow you to borrow 750k-1m, and with a decent deposit from a previous property/saving you'd be looking at probably a lower payment that the hampton thing we were talking about in the first place. Of course there will be people living in Surbiton that are working in more highly paid areas.
I don't think it's too complex for around 1m price point, but what you say is exactly the same in Clapham/Putney/Barnes/Fulham etc, apart from the houses cost 1.5-3m, and the stamp is huge due to 10% levy, and there's no shortage of Range Rovers there, I can only assume that its just a simple situation of the HHI being far greater than what I mentioned. There's a lot of couples in such areas working in finance, law etc. I'd imagine by the time you're in your mid 30's in such industries you'd have to have messed up a bit not to each have a strong 6 figure salary, HHI of 4-500k I could imagine being quite common in said industrys, with the scope for it to be considerably more if you'd done well. I know of a few people in cycling who are perhaps early 40's and earning double those numbers on their own by being fairly senior in law/banking. There's 5000 people working at Goldman Sachs in London and their average salary is £365k it seems from an article I just read, there are a great many jobs in London paying good money.
Edited by okgo on Wednesday 21st April 09:20
Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff