Will the plan work to turn generation rent into buy?

[mikewilliams79]

GS salary average heavily skewed by the big shots !

[A.J.M]

Bacon Is Proof said:

A.J.M said:

Bacon Is Proof said:

It wasn't on offer; we're fully booked.

If you do Moretti on draft then I’ll have a pint..

But not for a while. Busy working and decorating a house you understand.

While laughing at the oracle of hard workings posts.

I'm just looking forward to the end of this brief silly season so I can get back to my typical 0-3 days a week when I will have the time to enjoy life and reflect gratefully on my ability to understand simple maths whilst checking the spelling of the word "farcical".
Amstel, Estrella, Staropramen and Pravha, btw. First one's on me.

A fine selection of beers that.

Completely off topic but I’m dying to go to a pub again and get a cold pint and some pub grub to enjoy.

The simple things to enjoy. Even better if the pubs dog friendly for Alfie the Labrador.

[okgo]

mikewilliams79 said:

GS salary average heavily skewed by the big shots !

They have an endless amount of MD's on half a mil, there's a lot of jobs paying a lot of money in London is my point.

[mikewilliams79]

okgo said:

They have an endless amount of MD's on half a mil, there's a lot of jobs paying a lot of money in London is my point.

I wasn’t disagreeing

[mikewilliams79]

stitched said:

I generally come on here for a chillax session after work, I've now been drawn into an argument I don't really want.
Anyone I have annoyed or offended with my genuine opinions, apologies.
I have been told all my life that the first rung of the housing ladder is impossible at this time, I don't believe it to be true.
My life has been made easier by investing in, and improving property and I advise anyone feeling this to be impossible to reconsider.
It is more complex now than it was when I first bought, planning regs require scheme members for a lot more, hetas for stoves, part p for electrics etc.
I still think it manageable in most areas.
Perhaps rig workers work longer hours than those with whom I am acquainted with, I neither know nor care, none of the personal actions I have described are inaccurate.
All those who are thinking of buying, go for it, carefully.
I'm out.

generally I agree your principle is good.

[NRS]

mclwanB said:

Don't include vets with doctors.. The number of vets leaving the profession because it tops out at 50-60k with a lot of debt is unfortunately huge. Not that most doctors are paid what they used to be.

The simple issue is that my engineer dad got paid 9k a year in 1980, bought a new build 4 bed house for 43k with a bit of help from parents.

The roughly equivalent job is now 30k (rather than the 36k inflation would make it) but rather than the house being 170k, the house is at least 450k (without a new build premium). It was a stretch for them then, it would be impossible now.

https://www.inflationtool.com/british-pound/1980-t...

Being in my 40s in a professional but not well paid job and with a wife not working due to kids and illness no way we'd own if it was not for parental help. And that's with 10 and 15 year old cars, no holidays for years and little additional expense.

Wage stagnation is a huge issue, as is the house price boom. Precovid and brexit but interesting read

https://www.forbes.com/sites/stevedenning/2018/07/...

But all you need to do is get a job in London, while commuting from Leeds as you're staying with your parents to save money on rent, having got a good job with a lot of hours but managed to avoid student debt, so you can buy a £20 000 house in Glasgow, which you fix up during every spare hour of the day. Sorted!

[NRS]

mikewilliams79 said:

stitched said:

I generally come on here for a chillax session after work, I've now been drawn into an argument I don't really want.
Anyone I have annoyed or offended with my genuine opinions, apologies.
I have been told all my life that the first rung of the housing ladder is impossible at this time, I don't believe it to be true.
My life has been made easier by investing in, and improving property and I advise anyone feeling this to be impossible to reconsider.
It is more complex now than it was when I first bought, planning regs require scheme members for a lot more, hetas for stoves, part p for electrics etc.
I still think it manageable in most areas.
Perhaps rig workers work longer hours than those with whom I am acquainted with, I neither know nor care, none of the personal actions I have described are inaccurate.
All those who are thinking of buying, go for it, carefully.
I'm out.

generally I agree your principle is good.

Me too, and I think it was a bit poor people making fun of the divorce. The issue for me was the selective ignoring of facts - for example despite being asked a lot of times you never did answer my question if things were harder now given your own wage and house price figures showing a 3x versus 6.5x increase I think it was. Some people do waste money of course and will never make it, but it is harder to buy that it used to be.

[austinsmirk]

okgo said:

austinsmirk said:

Not sure if you’re actually asking but I’ll bite - that house is a lot of cash, Hampton is quite expensive as it’s quite pleasant (although as a Comedian said to me in a pub in Hampton “lovely with a undercurrent” bang on).

In answer to what you do after that - You either move to somewhere horrible like Hanworth or you pay up. And it’s a million quid to live somewhere nice round the corner. Thanks for coming.

I’m being somewhat flippant but that’s the reality to be fair. Obviously nobody under 35 would ever move to Hampton unless their illness was terminal - as ever you must remember the salary thing, it’s warped for a lot of jobs. A girl I used to manage who must be 26 or so now (she graduated in 2015), who was medium good at flogging ad space to agencies by taking them out and getting them pissed - I heard just left a job for a promotion while being paid 50k base and probably most of that again if hitting target (I’m guessing she has got a pay rise to 65-70 and same again in bonus). It is that easy, she’ll easily make at least 100k from now on every year and she has at least two more easy promotions by just being in the game to take that base up to around 90-100k with same again bonus. It’s a shambles that you can out-earn a vet with no actual skills by the time you’re 24/25, but you can.

But you are correct in that the next thing is a huge jump. You need hundreds of thousands of pounds in cash and to be able to stomach setting fire to 50k of it in stamp.

And it’s that jump that requires you to have wealthy parents, or have done very well in your job and have picked a decent first flat that has gained some value. Preferably all 3. This is before we have even factored in having a wedding, children, holidays, a car, etc etc.

Thanks for this, an interesting observation. I guess the issue is, she and others might earn 100/150K........ but when yr house is so expensive, I bet disposable cash is just that of a person on £35k, living in the normal world. I suppose the point where you win is when you no longer need to be in London, you sell up and retire cash rich to the country somewhere else.

[okgo]

austinsmirk said:

Thanks for this, an interesting observation. I guess the issue is, she and others might earn 100/150K........ but when yr house is so expensive, I bet disposable cash is just that of a person on £35k, living in the normal world. I suppose the point where you win is when you no longer need to be in London, you sell up and retire cash rich to the country somewhere else.

I think even with a 3k mortgage which would soon be something you could cheapen in that example, if you're clearing 5400 each month (100k), you still have more than a the entirety of a 35k salary left after that. As you know banks generally apply blanket leveraging rules to people, so it's hard to borrow more than say 40% of your take-home whether that's 40% of 5k or 2.5k. I know what I'd rather be left with at the end of the day, because beyond property and beer, day to day life doesn't cost much more here than other places, and yes, the end goal you mention. And of course house price increase helps those with higher value assets (assuming everywhere raises equally, and that you do move somewhere cheaper eventually).

[kingston12]

austinsmirk said:

Thanks for this, an interesting observation. I guess the issue is, she and others might earn 100/150K........ but when yr house is so expensive, I bet disposable cash is just that of a person on £35k, living in the normal world. I suppose the point where you win is when you no longer need to be in London, you sell up and retire cash rich to the country somewhere else.

Yes. It's very much a two-speed economy in London. There are quite a few people earning very good money in industries that don't really exist to a great extent elsewhere. There are also a good number of support roles in these industries that pay well (you'll earn more in a back office role in Financial Services than a very similar role in most other areas). Then there is a a greater level of highly paid contracting.

Almost everyone else doesn't earn that much more than they would do elsewhere in the country. Where London weighting still exists, it doesn't really bridge the difference in house prices compared to other areas.

[stitched]

NRS said:

mikewilliams79 said:

stitched said:

I generally come on here for a chillax session after work, I've now been drawn into an argument I don't really want.
Anyone I have annoyed or offended with my genuine opinions, apologies.
I have been told all my life that the first rung of the housing ladder is impossible at this time, I don't believe it to be true.
My life has been made easier by investing in, and improving property and I advise anyone feeling this to be impossible to reconsider.
It is more complex now than it was when I first bought, planning regs require scheme members for a lot more, hetas for stoves, part p for electrics etc.
I still think it manageable in most areas.
Perhaps rig workers work longer hours than those with whom I am acquainted with, I neither know nor care, none of the personal actions I have described are inaccurate.
All those who are thinking of buying, go for it, carefully.
I'm out.

generally I agree your principle is good.

Me too, and I think it was a bit poor people making fun of the divorce. The issue for me was the selective ignoring of facts - for example despite being asked a lot of times you never did answer my question if things were harder now given your own wage and house price figures showing a 3x versus 6.5x increase I think it was. Some people do waste money of course and will never make it, but it is harder to buy that it used to be.

I am still out, didn't deliberately ignore the question though.
As such I will try and answer.
My first house, a mid terrace in need of much renovation, was a heartbreaker.
I had no skills and cocked things up more often than I got them right, I even tried to lay carpet, and learned not to.
The kitchen, a second hand one stripped out of another house, was fitted 4 times before it actually made sense, the worksurfaces.
Well the worksurfaces I rented a router and jig, and a biscuit cutter, to form an invisible right angle joint.
The jig came with a vhs video, I watched how to make an octagonal breakfast bar etc and fast forwarded to the bit about right angle joints, the only bit anyone had ever watched, the bit which descended into snowy chaos as it was worn out.
Throughout this entire debacle my wife, stepdaughter and son were staying with friends, just for a couple of weeks.
More like 6 months of heartbreaking stressful pain and sleeplessness.
That was a house which was less than twice my salary.
This time round the house was 3 times my salary and needed more work, it was an enjoyable project and took far less time.
Anyone considering this, look at what skills your friends and family can bring to the table.
Utilise those people, you can pay them back the favour.
Financially I didn't find it more difficult.
No more arguments from me, anyone who wants practical advice on renovating a property feel free to PM me, I'm no developer but have fallen in most of the holes to be avoided.