Cost of living squeeze in 2022
Discussion
princeperch said:
I am however absolutely stupified by the number of 30 to 40k cars here. Everyone has a new German car, or a discovery, or a new Kia.
Taking into account inflation; a brand new ford mondeo in 2005 was 22.5k which would sit it within the 30k to 40k in todays money depending on options and trim level. Back then, no one would criticise people or think they were reckless for owning a ford mondeo.Throttlebody said:
Welshbeef said:
Throttlebody said:
The unsustainable UK property dream bubble is now starting to deflate. Another transition to a greater good.
Where do you see this evidence?Only yesterday/day before I posted up the link that house prices were up even more 12.4%.
When you post something up (without evidence to back it up) it’s always right and damnation and gloom and doom will follow.
Are you only and always right? Is that how you operate in real life
princeperch said:
The middle are getting squeezed.
Due to having an expensive year buying and doing up a new house, I decided our early summer break for a few days on the coast would be on a shoestring. The kids are only very young anyway and all they want is to go in the sea and eat ice cream. So we've ended up at a parkdean static caravan type place on the coast for a few days, in Suffolk.
For me it's perfectly adequate, comfortable, almost new accomodation, right next to the sea, 15 mins from Southwold where we will spend most of our leisure time. Cost pennies to come here and its absolutely fine.
I am however absolutely stupified by the number of 30 to 40k cars here. Everyone has a new German car, or a discovery, or a new Kia.
Either they are all cheapskates like me after having a cripplingly expensive few months, or the middle are seriously downshifting their leisure activities.
Static caravan sites have been full of 'tasty' cars for some years now. When the caravan itself is £50k+, and site fees often approaching a grand a month - it's hardly a surprise that owners can afford a Land Rover/etc. Due to having an expensive year buying and doing up a new house, I decided our early summer break for a few days on the coast would be on a shoestring. The kids are only very young anyway and all they want is to go in the sea and eat ice cream. So we've ended up at a parkdean static caravan type place on the coast for a few days, in Suffolk.
For me it's perfectly adequate, comfortable, almost new accomodation, right next to the sea, 15 mins from Southwold where we will spend most of our leisure time. Cost pennies to come here and its absolutely fine.
I am however absolutely stupified by the number of 30 to 40k cars here. Everyone has a new German car, or a discovery, or a new Kia.
Either they are all cheapskates like me after having a cripplingly expensive few months, or the middle are seriously downshifting their leisure activities.
speedy_thrills said:
Smiler. said:
Which begs the questions, is it likely to & if not, why not?
I'm a believer in technology. The printing press, machine tools, production lines, fertilizers, pesticides etc. all substantially increased per capita productivity and improved the material wellbeing of humanity.Unfortunately IT hasn't delivered similar gains and that's where most technology investment has been targeted. It looks like we've just not invested in the right technologies over recent decades perhaps?
Tlandcruiser said:
princeperch said:
I am however absolutely stupified by the number of 30 to 40k cars here. Everyone has a new German car, or a discovery, or a new Kia.
Taking into account inflation; a brand new ford mondeo in 2005 was 22.5k which would sit it within the 30k to 40k in todays money depending on options and trim level. Back then, no one would criticise people or think they were reckless for owning a ford mondeo.Today full time cleaner national minimum wage is £19.7k with income tax starting at £12.7k
I think people really have over looked the rate that totally unskilled Labour now earn
Welshbeef said:
Throttlebody said:
Welshbeef said:
Throttlebody said:
The unsustainable UK property dream bubble is now starting to deflate. Another transition to a greater good.
Where do you see this evidence?Only yesterday/day before I posted up the link that house prices were up even more 12.4%.
When you post something up (without evidence to back it up) it’s always right and damnation and gloom and doom will follow.
Are you only and always right? Is that how you operate in real life
Welshbeef said:
So to clarify when someone posts up a view or point (with evidence) that is opposite to you views & counters your thoughts you state the data is flawed & imply you are right.
When you post something up (without evidence to back it up) it’s always right and damnation and gloom and doom will follow.
Are you only and always right? Is that how you operate in real life
And yet he has historically been proven over many threads where he predicted doom and damnation for the middle classes that he ends up being woefully and embarrassingly wrong.When you post something up (without evidence to back it up) it’s always right and damnation and gloom and doom will follow.
Are you only and always right? Is that how you operate in real life
Time and time again. Never right once.
Throttlebody said:
You had the replies to show that ONS house price data is flawed. In the Mar they recorded a 1.5% drop in prices. Unreliable and volatile. You asked for analysis on the data, you just didn’t like the replies.
But your data and your own skewed view rarely stands up to any scrutiny at all?Deep Thought said:
Welshbeef said:
So to clarify when someone posts up a view or point (with evidence) that is opposite to you views & counters your thoughts you state the data is flawed & imply you are right.
When you post something up (without evidence to back it up) it’s always right and damnation and gloom and doom will follow.
Are you only and always right? Is that how you operate in real life
And yet he has historically been proven over many threads where he predicted doom and damnation for the middle classes that he ends up being woefully and embarrassingly wrong.When you post something up (without evidence to back it up) it’s always right and damnation and gloom and doom will follow.
Are you only and always right? Is that how you operate in real life
Time and time again. Never right once.
Your head is so full of exaggerated interpretations. Throttlebody said:
You had the replies to show that ONS house price data is flawed. In the Mar they recorded a 1.5% drop in prices. Unreliable and volatile. You asked for analysis on the data, you just didn’t like the replies.
You do know that the House price inflation is a rolling 12 months don’t you So the Mar22 number was Apr21 to Mar22
The Apr22 is May21 to Apr22
As such what you point out could have been something in the Apr21 month which is no longer in the calculation and of course the Apr22 month isn’t included in the HPI 12 months rolling to Mar22.
Sway said:
princeperch said:
The middle are getting squeezed.
Due to having an expensive year buying and doing up a new house, I decided our early summer break for a few days on the coast would be on a shoestring. The kids are only very young anyway and all they want is to go in the sea and eat ice cream. So we've ended up at a parkdean static caravan type place on the coast for a few days, in Suffolk.
For me it's perfectly adequate, comfortable, almost new accomodation, right next to the sea, 15 mins from Southwold where we will spend most of our leisure time. Cost pennies to come here and its absolutely fine.
I am however absolutely stupified by the number of 30 to 40k cars here. Everyone has a new German car, or a discovery, or a new Kia.
Either they are all cheapskates like me after having a cripplingly expensive few months, or the middle are seriously downshifting their leisure activities.
Static caravan sites have been full of 'tasty' cars for some years now. When the caravan itself is £50k+, and site fees often approaching a grand a month - it's hardly a surprise that owners can afford a Land Rover/etc. Due to having an expensive year buying and doing up a new house, I decided our early summer break for a few days on the coast would be on a shoestring. The kids are only very young anyway and all they want is to go in the sea and eat ice cream. So we've ended up at a parkdean static caravan type place on the coast for a few days, in Suffolk.
For me it's perfectly adequate, comfortable, almost new accomodation, right next to the sea, 15 mins from Southwold where we will spend most of our leisure time. Cost pennies to come here and its absolutely fine.
I am however absolutely stupified by the number of 30 to 40k cars here. Everyone has a new German car, or a discovery, or a new Kia.
Either they are all cheapskates like me after having a cripplingly expensive few months, or the middle are seriously downshifting their leisure activities.
Plenty of expensive mobile caravans being pulled around by expensive PCP cars in the UK. It’s not my bag, but do mobile caravans and motor homes get flogged on PCPs? That would explain much.
.
Throttlebody said:
Much depends on who is renting the static compared to who owns.
Plenty of expensive mobile caravans being pulled around by expensive PCP cars in the UK. It’s not my bag, but do mobile caravans and motor homes get flogged on PCPs? That would explain much.
.
No they don’t - sorry to counter that point of view. Plenty of expensive mobile caravans being pulled around by expensive PCP cars in the UK. It’s not my bag, but do mobile caravans and motor homes get flogged on PCPs? That would explain much.
.
It’s a cash buy / you cannot get a mortgage for a static caravan.
Personal loan would be another option but clearly that does mean they could afford it.
Also you’d have to factory specify toe hitch on a vehicle - not after market as that wouldn’t work with PCPs
It's cost me £89.00 for 4 nights. it's a brand new static caravan, free parking, kitchen, two bathrooms.
As I said I just wanted somewhere cheap for the kids to come and enjoy the beach for a few days but youd have to have had half your brain removed to spend tens of thousands buying one of these things when you can rent them for next to nothing.
AMG estate just drove past btw! The cars are getting better as the day goes on.
As I said I just wanted somewhere cheap for the kids to come and enjoy the beach for a few days but youd have to have had half your brain removed to spend tens of thousands buying one of these things when you can rent them for next to nothing.
AMG estate just drove past btw! The cars are getting better as the day goes on.
Throttlebody said:
Plenty of expensive mobile caravans being pulled around by expensive PCP cars in the UK. It’s not my bag, but do mobile caravans and motor homes get flogged on PCPs? That would explain much.
.
No as caravan and motor home ownership tends to be a long term thing not something too many would replace or need to replace every three years..
Also there is great longevity with each. Its not unusual for caravans to last 30 years. Motorhomes 20 to 39 years.
BIL bought a relatively new huge motorhome for £55k or so 3 odd years ago. They'd likely get that back for it now with the way prices have jumped.
Deep Thought said:
No as caravan and motor home ownership tends to be a long term thing not something too many would replace or need to replace every three years.
Also there is great longevity with each. Its not unusual for caravans to last 30 years. Motorhomes 20 to 39 years.
BIL bought a relatively new huge motorhome for £55k or so 3 odd years ago. They'd likely get that back for it now with the way prices have jumped.
You can get a PCP on a motorhome or mobile caravan. The finance industries reach is wide.Also there is great longevity with each. Its not unusual for caravans to last 30 years. Motorhomes 20 to 39 years.
BIL bought a relatively new huge motorhome for £55k or so 3 odd years ago. They'd likely get that back for it now with the way prices have jumped.
speedy_thrills said:
brickwall said:
This is only true for the Western World. In developing economies there is still a glut of young people all looking for a job. Take South Africa for example…60% of the population are under 34, vs. 9% over 50.
The UK delayed/temporarily solved its working demographic pressures through the 2000s with large scale immigration of young workers (from Eastern Europe and elsewhere).
That tap is now drying up, in part linked to Brexit, but also because the home countries have developed massively in the last 20 years and so the relative appeal of moving thousands of miles for a job/life is less.
I'm not sure there is another China out there in the undeveloped world to replace the one that is now substantially industrialised and rapidly aging. China had always been an advanced civilisation until the Opium Wars, their development was likely expedited because it was a return as a global power.The UK delayed/temporarily solved its working demographic pressures through the 2000s with large scale immigration of young workers (from Eastern Europe and elsewhere).
That tap is now drying up, in part linked to Brexit, but also because the home countries have developed massively in the last 20 years and so the relative appeal of moving thousands of miles for a job/life is less.
Eastern European countries have some of the steepest population declines. There won't be a resumption of that pipeline of workers because they just don't have the working age people (nor, as you mention, the overwhelming economic incentive). Indian fertility is now at just the population replacement rate and on a downwards trajectory. Pakistan is probably a decade or two behind India on that trend. Either way it would only temporarily delay the inevitable.
The other thing that may not be immediately apparent is just how much of a role women have likely played in the economic boom we've seen. I seem to recall that after the second world war about a quarter of women worked, by the 70s that was about half and today that's three quarters in most industrialised countries which is substantially comparable to men. Along side population age demographics that's likely to be a one-off, never to be repeated, upswing that helped suppress wage growth and inflation.
We where just really lucky to live at a time when there was so much labour coming into the workforce making goods and services progressively cheaper and driving returns on assets. It's a brave new world for companies and consumers.
Sway said:
princeperch said:
The middle are getting squeezed.
Due to having an expensive year buying and doing up a new house, I decided our early summer break for a few days on the coast would be on a shoestring. The kids are only very young anyway and all they want is to go in the sea and eat ice cream. So we've ended up at a parkdean static caravan type place on the coast for a few days, in Suffolk.
For me it's perfectly adequate, comfortable, almost new accomodation, right next to the sea, 15 mins from Southwold where we will spend most of our leisure time. Cost pennies to come here and its absolutely fine.
I am however absolutely stupified by the number of 30 to 40k cars here. Everyone has a new German car, or a discovery, or a new Kia.
Either they are all cheapskates like me after having a that's expensive few months, or the middle are seriously downshifting their leisure activities.
Static caravan sites have been full of 'tasty' cars for some years now. When the caravan itself is £50k+, and site fees often approaching a grand a month - it's hardly a surprise that owners can afford a Land Rover/etc. Due to having an expensive year buying and doing up a new house, I decided our early summer break for a few days on the coast would be on a shoestring. The kids are only very young anyway and all they want is to go in the sea and eat ice cream. So we've ended up at a parkdean static caravan type place on the coast for a few days, in Suffolk.
For me it's perfectly adequate, comfortable, almost new accomodation, right next to the sea, 15 mins from Southwold where we will spend most of our leisure time. Cost pennies to come here and its absolutely fine.
I am however absolutely stupified by the number of 30 to 40k cars here. Everyone has a new German car, or a discovery, or a new Kia.
Either they are all cheapskates like me after having a that's expensive few months, or the middle are seriously downshifting their leisure activities.
Now this aunt lived in a very well to do part of Rickmansworth, still is well to do frankly, husband a director of Distillers Ltd. Clearly she thought we were poor relations, living in Yorkshire and ugh a caravan, and tbh compared to them we were poor relations.
She'd been on site about an hour and comments flowed like "Goodness me, a Bentley!" and "Monty 3 doors from us has one of those Astons" To be fair there were also some bangers in addition to the legions of ordinary cars.
Hopefully I'll be joining the ranks of those spending 30 on a new car, when the buggers decide to build it.
Throttlebody said:
You can get a PCP on a motorhome or mobile caravan. The finance industries reach is wide.
You can finance sofas and even clothes of course you can finance caravans.Motorhomes are very expensive new, I would imagine most are financed. But at DT says above people tend to keep for them for a very long time and they don’t depreciate like cars even during normal times.
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