CV19 - Cure Worse Than The Disease? (Vol 18)
Discussion
Grumps. said:
bodhi said:
I wouldn't be the least bit surprised to hear that all of the anecdotal evidence for this centres around tyres with "Bridgestone" written on the side.....
They do seem to be quite bad with it.
Cold said:
Grumps. said:
Cold said:
An interesting (and PH themed) sidebar to all the CV19 nonsense is that Autocar magazine have observed numerous reports of car tyres failing MOTs and inspections due to the sidewalls or tread area cracking because of lack of use during lockdowns.
Although this spike in incidents is mainly anecdotal at the moment, it is repeated by many in the supply and inspection industry and appears to be directly attributable to extended periods of inactivity leading to the various UV resistant waxes and chemicals not migrating to the tyre's surface.
April 1st is still a few days away! Although this spike in incidents is mainly anecdotal at the moment, it is repeated by many in the supply and inspection industry and appears to be directly attributable to extended periods of inactivity leading to the various UV resistant waxes and chemicals not migrating to the tyre's surface.
There just cannot be any reason why this can be attributed to lockdowns imo.
Any link to this observation by autocar as I have just done a quick Google and haven’t found anything.
Edited by Grumps. on Monday 27th March 13:25
Evans cites readers' experiences, a Kwik Fit spokesperson and the RAC's analysis of MOT test results.
Cold said:
Grumps. said:
bodhi said:
I wouldn't be the least bit surprised to hear that all of the anecdotal evidence for this centres around tyres with "Bridgestone" written on the side.....
They do seem to be quite bad with it.
rodericb said:
Cold said:
Grumps. said:
bodhi said:
I wouldn't be the least bit surprised to hear that all of the anecdotal evidence for this centres around tyres with "Bridgestone" written on the side.....
They do seem to be quite bad with it.
Cold said:
rodericb said:
Cold said:
Grumps. said:
bodhi said:
I wouldn't be the least bit surprised to hear that all of the anecdotal evidence for this centres around tyres with "Bridgestone" written on the side.....
They do seem to be quite bad with it.
Hants PHer said:
I have a less charitable view than yours, I'm afraid. I am still a little angry with good friends of mine who bought into the guidance without question. I stress those last two words: without question. That was perhaps understandable in the first couple of weeks, but I was literally the only person in my social circle looking at the published data and questioning the utter nonsense that was being inflicted on us.
Everyone else that I know simply did as they were told by those in authority, despite having said for years that those same authorities were incompetent fools who could not be trusted. And yet, suddenly, when the council put hazard tape all round the kiddies' play park, my friends all said "Well, I'm sure it's necessary."
It's that schizophrenic "The authorities are idiots / I will obey 100%" mindset that I couldn't, and still don't, understand.
Lots of people on here who sound and are probably sensible were posting about how they were quarantining the food deliveries to their homes and treating them like possible threats in the early days, three years ago. I was visiting people who were either snuffing it quickly in care homes en masse or were struggling to cope with even the management of fever at home. Everyone else that I know simply did as they were told by those in authority, despite having said for years that those same authorities were incompetent fools who could not be trusted. And yet, suddenly, when the council put hazard tape all round the kiddies' play park, my friends all said "Well, I'm sure it's necessary."
It's that schizophrenic "The authorities are idiots / I will obey 100%" mindset that I couldn't, and still don't, understand.
No one could get Paracetamol. We were having to deliver it to people because it had sold out.
Hypoxic non palliative Patients were being advised to stay at home, until they couldn't tolerate it anymore (the distress) the ambulance service was not conveying seriously unwell Patients, I had many of them that I had to CONVINCE them to take.
The NHS and certainly primary care, where I work has still not returned to anything like normality, and it's to the determent of you lot. More remote assessments etc. Lot's of damage has been done to what was already a failing service.
pneumothorax said:
Lots of people on here who sound and are probably sensible were posting about how they were quarantining the food deliveries to their homes and treating them like possible threats in the early days, three years ago. I was visiting people who were either snuffing it quickly in care homes en masse or were struggling to cope with even the management of fever at home.
No one could get Paracetamol. We were having to deliver it to people because it had sold out.
Hypoxic non palliative Patients were being advised to stay at home, until they couldn't tolerate it anymore (the distress) the ambulance service was not conveying seriously unwell Patients, I had many of them that I had to CONVINCE them to take.
The NHS and certainly primary care, where I work has still not returned to anything like normality, and it's to the determent of you lot. More remote assessments etc. Lot's of damage has been done to what was already a failing service.
More interesting observations, thanks. There are some on here that would rather we just forgot about it all, and pretend it never happened. They usually post snarky one-liners attempting to pour scorn on those of use who wish to discuss the madness (such as you describe above).No one could get Paracetamol. We were having to deliver it to people because it had sold out.
Hypoxic non palliative Patients were being advised to stay at home, until they couldn't tolerate it anymore (the distress) the ambulance service was not conveying seriously unwell Patients, I had many of them that I had to CONVINCE them to take.
The NHS and certainly primary care, where I work has still not returned to anything like normality, and it's to the determent of you lot. More remote assessments etc. Lot's of damage has been done to what was already a failing service.
What these sneering posters miss, of course, is the ongoing impacts of what happened. I cannot get a NHS dentist appointment, and it is nigh on impossible to see my GP. I get scolded by stroppy nurses ("You must wear a mask!") at my local hospital, and hear tales of elderly folk still too scared to socialise.
And we have added massively to the national debt; and for what? A huge stack of our money spent on largely useless business, school and healthcare closures (and dodgy PPE, and silly NHS tracing, and.......) that achieved nothing much. We must never repeat the folly of wholesale lockdowns again, and should ignore those who urge us to just "get over it."
Hants Pher.
You are near the mark here "That was perhaps understandable in the first couple of weeks" in my opinion.
I think that at around this time three years ago, things were going turbo in the community where I work, half term holidaymakers from the alps were arriving back and spreading it all around south west London.
Then the media hyped it up, everyone had chest pain and breathing problems, mainly 2ndry to anxiety, truly ill people were lost in all of the noise. They were obscured.
I was specifically advised NOT to treat my Patients with oral steroids at this time when it was exactly what my training had suggested that I should be prescribing given what I was hearing when I listened to these Patient's chests.
Dexamethasone ( a steroid) was then announced as a solution in hospitalized Patients by Hancock. I am not a particularly clever Doctor but even I called it at this time 3 yrs ago, I was finding an excuse to prescribe it for my Patients..
After the first month, we should have be been treating this for what it was, a serious and often fatal illness in the susceptible (who were increasingly unpredictable in March 2021)
What happened subsequently was nuts.
IMO
You are near the mark here "That was perhaps understandable in the first couple of weeks" in my opinion.
I think that at around this time three years ago, things were going turbo in the community where I work, half term holidaymakers from the alps were arriving back and spreading it all around south west London.
Then the media hyped it up, everyone had chest pain and breathing problems, mainly 2ndry to anxiety, truly ill people were lost in all of the noise. They were obscured.
I was specifically advised NOT to treat my Patients with oral steroids at this time when it was exactly what my training had suggested that I should be prescribing given what I was hearing when I listened to these Patient's chests.
Dexamethasone ( a steroid) was then announced as a solution in hospitalized Patients by Hancock. I am not a particularly clever Doctor but even I called it at this time 3 yrs ago, I was finding an excuse to prescribe it for my Patients..
After the first month, we should have be been treating this for what it was, a serious and often fatal illness in the susceptible (who were increasingly unpredictable in March 2021)
What happened subsequently was nuts.
IMO
Hants PHer said:
isaldiri said:
Bonkers it certainly was. however I wonder if you perhaps are being a little too hard on the compliance that was shown. Society is quite conditioned to being guilted into 'doing the right thing' and human nature has always been quite easily exploited. The line that was very strongly signalled by the authorities and repeated by the media was that we had to do the right thing back in March2020. I think it's hard to fault those (at least the general members of the public) who whether from fear or feelings of personal sacrifice did what they did even with close friends/family at the time being directly affected.
I have a less charitable view than yours, I'm afraid. I am still a little angry with good friends of mine who bought into the guidance without question. I stress those last two words: without question. That was perhaps understandable in the first couple of weeks, but I was literally the only person in my social circle looking at the published data and questioning the utter nonsense that was being inflicted on us.Everyone else that I know simply did as they were told by those in authority, despite having said for years that those same authorities were incompetent fools who could not be trusted. And yet, suddenly, when the council put hazard tape all round the kiddies' play park, my friends all said "Well, I'm sure it's necessary."
It's that schizophrenic "The authorities are idiots / I will obey 100%" mindset that I couldn't, and still don't, understand.
Perhaps I am indeed part of the 'forget what happened' group as you noted but I do particularly question what the continued anger and incredulity at the general population's willingness to fall in line is actually going or meant to achieve. It certainly isn't going to get more people onside as compared to those already firmly convinced one way or another and human nature isn't going to change for the better anytime soon.....
isaldiri said:
Don't know if 'charitable' is the word I'd personally use to describe my view but I guess what I'm trying to say is that human nature is what it is - fear of disease is very embedded into people such that they are always going to be very susceptible to the kind of messaging as used by the authorities. Human nature I might add also ensures that said authorities will always try to exploit that fear to 'encourage' compliance.
Perhaps I am indeed part of the 'forget what happened' group as you noted but I do particularly question what the continued anger and incredulity at the general population's willingness to fall in line is actually going or meant to achieve. It certainly isn't going to get more people onside as compared to those already firmly convinced one way or another and human nature isn't going to change for the better anytime soon.....
It isn’t ‘meant to achieve’ anything. This isn’t a negotiation or a campaign group. It’s not about winning hearts and minds. Perhaps I am indeed part of the 'forget what happened' group as you noted but I do particularly question what the continued anger and incredulity at the general population's willingness to fall in line is actually going or meant to achieve. It certainly isn't going to get more people onside as compared to those already firmly convinced one way or another and human nature isn't going to change for the better anytime soon.....
This is just discussion between people who find it helpful to know that they were not alone in their struggle to understand why people acted as they did.
Digging into the ‘why’ is interesting and important.
isaldiri said:
Don't know if 'charitable' is the word I'd personally use to describe my view but I guess what I'm trying to say is that human nature is what it is - fear of disease is very embedded into people such that they are always going to be very susceptible to the kind of messaging as used by the authorities. Human nature I might add also ensures that said authorities will always try to exploit that fear to 'encourage' compliance.
Perhaps I am indeed part of the 'forget what happened' group as you noted but I do particularly question what the continued anger and incredulity at the general population's willingness to fall in line is actually going or meant to achieve. It certainly isn't going to get more people onside as compared to those already firmly convinced one way or another and human nature isn't going to change for the better anytime soon.....
I don't think fear if disease came into it. SARS 1, swine flu, monkeypox etc have never gained any traction. C19 did because they made dramatic laws about it and people like drama and obedience and covid gave it to them in spades.Perhaps I am indeed part of the 'forget what happened' group as you noted but I do particularly question what the continued anger and incredulity at the general population's willingness to fall in line is actually going or meant to achieve. It certainly isn't going to get more people onside as compared to those already firmly convinced one way or another and human nature isn't going to change for the better anytime soon.....
JuanCarlosFandango said:
I don't think fear if disease came into it. SARS 1, swine flu, monkeypox etc have never gained any traction. C19 did because they made dramatic laws about it and people like drama and obedience and covid gave it to them in spades.
Not sure if serious. Sars1 - how many in the UK got infected.....? Did not spread easily in any case. And perhaps you might take a look at HK/Singapore as to what 'fear of disease' was like in 2003.
Monkeypox - again, relatively few numbers infected, in particular mainly spread amongst a specific group of the population. Overall, not many infected died either.
Swine flu - now perhaps there's a bit more of a point... up until the point where swine flu had no visible impact on overall hospital/ICU/death rates. So just a little different from covid.
isaldiri said:
Not sure if serious.
Sars1 - how many in the UK got infected.....? Did not spread easily in any case. And perhaps you might take a look at HK/Singapore as to what 'fear of disease' was like in 2003.
Monkeypox - again, relatively few numbers infected, in particular mainly spread amongst a specific group of the population. Overall, not many infected died either.
Swine flu - now perhaps there's a bit more of a point... up until the point where swine flu had no visible impact on overall hospital/ICU/death rates. So just a little different from covid.
Who knows how many were infected? Since we didn't test everything that moves.Sars1 - how many in the UK got infected.....? Did not spread easily in any case. And perhaps you might take a look at HK/Singapore as to what 'fear of disease' was like in 2003.
Monkeypox - again, relatively few numbers infected, in particular mainly spread amongst a specific group of the population. Overall, not many infected died either.
Swine flu - now perhaps there's a bit more of a point... up until the point where swine flu had no visible impact on overall hospital/ICU/death rates. So just a little different from covid.
There was no discernible spike in total deaths until well after the first lockdown started.
Point is people were far more into the drama and obedience than the actual disease.
JuanCarlosFandango said:
Who knows how many were infected? Since we didn't test everything that moves.
There was no discernible spike in total deaths until well after the first lockdown started.
Point is people were far more into the drama and obedience than the actual disease.
Well, with a 7-10% infection fatality rate with rather severe symtoms manifesting itself, I don't think it is a reasonable suggestion that there were potentially many sars1 infections here in the UK (or Europe or indeed anywhere else) that weren't noticed because 'we didn't test everything that moves'.There was no discernible spike in total deaths until well after the first lockdown started.
Point is people were far more into the drama and obedience than the actual disease.
It tends to take a while for people to drop dead after infection so it's not exactly a shock that death rates only increased post lockdown1. Also given the rather clear rise in excess deaths well... anywhere one might want to look in the world corresponding to covid spread in 2020, I rather doubt the 2 were unrelated at all.
Point is that you might want to pick slightly better examples rather than sars1/monkeypox/swine flu to be compared in terms of population impact than covid..
isaldiri said:
Well, with a 7-10% infection fatality rate with rather severe symtoms manifesting itself, I don't think it is a reasonable suggestion that there were potentially many sars1 infections here in the UK (or Europe or indeed anywhere else) that weren't noticed because 'we didn't test everything that moves'.
It tends to take a while for people to drop dead after infection so it's not exactly a shock that death rates only increased post lockdown1. Also given the rather clear rise in excess deaths well... anywhere one might want to look in the world corresponding to covid spread in 2020, I rather doubt the 2 were unrelated at all.
Point is that you might want to pick slightly better examples rather than sars1/monkeypox/swine flu to be compared in terms of population impact than covid..
They were dropping dead in the street in Wuhan and Lombardy.It tends to take a while for people to drop dead after infection so it's not exactly a shock that death rates only increased post lockdown1. Also given the rather clear rise in excess deaths well... anywhere one might want to look in the world corresponding to covid spread in 2020, I rather doubt the 2 were unrelated at all.
Point is that you might want to pick slightly better examples rather than sars1/monkeypox/swine flu to be compared in terms of population impact than covid..
The big spike in excess deaths in April and May 2020 corresponds a lot more closely with midazolam prescriptions than it does with covid tests.
The fact is covid was a common cold and the response was an exercise in psychology and manipulation, for which fear of a disease was a respectable cover.
JuanCarlosFandango said:
They were dropping dead in the street in Wuhan and Lombardy.
The big spike in excess deaths in April and May 2020 corresponds a lot more closely with midazolam prescriptions than it does with covid tests.
The fact is covid was a common cold and the response was an exercise in psychology and manipulation, for which fear of a disease was a respectable cover.
Ok according to you, midazolam was heavily prescribed all over the world just coincidentally a few weeks after big rises of covid infections were expected that was the main cause of excess deaths. Oh and covid as per spring 2020 was 'a common cold'.The big spike in excess deaths in April and May 2020 corresponds a lot more closely with midazolam prescriptions than it does with covid tests.
The fact is covid was a common cold and the response was an exercise in psychology and manipulation, for which fear of a disease was a respectable cover.
Suit yourself.
vaud said:
Hants PHer said:
I get scolded by stroppy nurses ("You must wear a mask!") at my local hospital, and hear tales of elderly folk still too scared to socialise.
My MIL still hardly goes out and she isn't immunosuppressed. Not been out for lunch inside for 3 years...THAT is the legacy of fear that society has created, and, yes, it makes me angry. Not least because my mother is very, very lonely and now she can't even touch her best friends. Isaldiri thinks my anger won't achieve anything, and he may be right. But I can't simply ignore the massive damage that the fools who govern us have inflicted. And you know the worst thing? I think if there was Covid-23 tomorrow, we'd make the same damn mistakes all over again.
Hants PHer said:
And you know the worst thing? I think if there was Covid-23 tomorrow, we'd make the same damn mistakes all over again.
Yep I'm sorry to have to agree with this - It sounds wrong but the population needs to see a lot more consequences linked to the actions over CV-19 but the "blame" will be placed on "other factors" - there won't be any admittance of mistakes made.Energy crisis is down to the war in Ukraine
Inflation - clearly down to the energy crisis which is down to the war in Ukraine
It will always be something else..........
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