Nazanin Zaghari-Ratcliffe has UK passport returned, MP says.
Discussion
irc said:
biggbn said:
How predictable, another PH thread that essentially says 'it was her own fault, she was asking for it'.
No. I am asking why as an Iranian citizen in Iran she expected the UK govt to help her? The rules are clear. A dual nationality citizen is not a UK citizen when in the other country she holds nationality for.There is presumably a good reason the UK has this rule.
The Iranian govt are the villains here. It was nothing to do with the UK govt and I don't think they should pay ransoms for foreign citizens which she was while in Iran.
biggbn said:
irc said:
biggbn said:
How predictable, another PH thread that essentially says 'it was her own fault, she was asking for it'.
No. I am asking why as an Iranian citizen in Iran she expected the UK govt to help her? The rules are clear. A dual nationality citizen is not a UK citizen when in the other country she holds nationality for.There is presumably a good reason the UK has this rule.
The Iranian govt are the villains here. It was nothing to do with the UK govt and I don't think they should pay ransoms for foreign citizens which she was while in Iran.
This is a difficult, sensitive case and I think it is much more nuanced than simply saying she has dual nationality so did not deserve the help of our country. Jeremy Hunt, amongst others, certainly seem to feel she deserved the help, and it shoukd have happened sooner.
andyA700 said:
biggbn said:
irc said:
biggbn said:
How predictable, another PH thread that essentially says 'it was her own fault, she was asking for it'.
No. I am asking why as an Iranian citizen in Iran she expected the UK govt to help her? The rules are clear. A dual nationality citizen is not a UK citizen when in the other country she holds nationality for.There is presumably a good reason the UK has this rule.
The Iranian govt are the villains here. It was nothing to do with the UK govt and I don't think they should pay ransoms for foreign citizens which she was while in Iran.
This is a difficult, sensitive case and I think it is much more nuanced than simply saying she has dual nationality so did not deserve the help of our country. Jeremy Hunt, amongst others, certainly seem to feel she deserved the help, and it shoukd have happened sooner.
biggbn said:
andyA700 said:
biggbn said:
irc said:
biggbn said:
How predictable, another PH thread that essentially says 'it was her own fault, she was asking for it'.
No. I am asking why as an Iranian citizen in Iran she expected the UK govt to help her? The rules are clear. A dual nationality citizen is not a UK citizen when in the other country she holds nationality for.There is presumably a good reason the UK has this rule.
The Iranian govt are the villains here. It was nothing to do with the UK govt and I don't think they should pay ransoms for foreign citizens which she was while in Iran.
This is a difficult, sensitive case and I think it is much more nuanced than simply saying she has dual nationality so did not deserve the help of our country. Jeremy Hunt, amongst others, certainly seem to feel she deserved the help, and it shoukd have happened sooner.
andyA700 said:
Murph7355 said:
andyA700 said:
Totally agree, the political infighting between various departments (civil service and military), which went on since 2017, was why the debt wasn't paid and that was why NR was held for so long......
Oh do behave.What about 1979 to 2017?
The debt, and the way the Iranian govt operated were known for decades. NR will have been more than fully aware of these things (more than), and yet chose to travel there as an Iranian citizen. But hey, it's all govt's fault from 2017....
Iran is a lovely place to visit, the people are great, the food wonderful, the historical sites awesome.
For anyone wishing to visit the country, a word to the wise. Make sure you don't have any baggage which will come back to haunt you. Make sure that you don't attend any demonstrations against the Iranian government in the UK, or worse still, give an interview to UK press saying less than pleasant things about the Iranian government.
The money owed was owed for much, much longer than 2017 - so if political infighting had prevented its repayment from 2017, what had caused it in the preceding 30+ years? Why single out 2017 to now?
FWIW I agree that we should not have been holding it, for a whole host of reasons. FWIW I believe the West's meddling in the Middle East has been a massive source of the issues in that region for well over 100yrs., and this country has played a large part in that, to our discredit.
Who cares how many people go back and forth to there every year. It doesn't matter. 3 people were being held on spurious charges. 3 people were released at the same time despite comments being made by a politician that "did not help" about just one of them. Pure logic dictates that the comments made bugger all difference to anything. Repaying the money owed did.
biggbn said:
Did she 'expect' to be rescued? Or merely expect that high ranking government official's thoughtless words should not negatively impact on her situation?
This is a difficult, sensitive case and I think it is much more nuanced than simply saying she has dual nationality so did not deserve the help of our country. Jeremy Hunt, amongst others, certainly seem to feel she deserved the help, and it shoukd have happened sooner.
The words didn't.This is a difficult, sensitive case and I think it is much more nuanced than simply saying she has dual nationality so did not deserve the help of our country. Jeremy Hunt, amongst others, certainly seem to feel she deserved the help, and it shoukd have happened sooner.
"Deserving" of help? The rules are clear. I'm cool with the govt trying to help. I'm definitely cool with the money being repaid. But you travel on the basis she travelled under, and you need to assume you're on your own. "Victim blaming"? Sometimes it's perfectly valid, and not the heinous crime some on here portray it as. "Personal accountability" is, perhaps, a slightly less emotional term. And might make people think harder before they do stuff.
For anyone interested. Nazanin is going to be interviewed on BBC Radio 4's Woman's Hour - Tuesday 24th May with Emma Barnett.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m0017khl
https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m0017khl
And she’s now complaining that the nasty Iranians made her sign a confession before getting on the ‘plane to leave, and the UK government official did nothing to stop it.
Let me see, would she prefer:
Option 1: sign the Iranian piece of toilet paper, get on the damn ‘plane and don’t come back
Option 2: don’t sign it, don’t get on the ‘plane, return to prison
Can’t win with some people.
Let me see, would she prefer:
Option 1: sign the Iranian piece of toilet paper, get on the damn ‘plane and don’t come back
Option 2: don’t sign it, don’t get on the ‘plane, return to prison
Can’t win with some people.
rxe said:
And she’s now complaining that the nasty Iranians made her sign a confession before getting on the ‘plane to leave, and the UK government official did nothing to stop it.
Let me see, would she prefer:
Option 1: sign the Iranian piece of toilet paper, get on the damn ‘plane and don’t come back
Option 2: don’t sign it, don’t get on the ‘plane, return to prison
Can’t win with some people.
She did Option 1 and is now telling us about it. Where's the problem?Let me see, would she prefer:
Option 1: sign the Iranian piece of toilet paper, get on the damn ‘plane and don’t come back
Option 2: don’t sign it, don’t get on the ‘plane, return to prison
Can’t win with some people.
rxe said:
Randy Winkman said:
She did Option 1 and is now telling us about it. Where's the problem?
She’s blaming the UK government representative ….What she thinks all this will achieve, other than attempting to embarrass the incumbent Govt, I can only imagine, and I have long suspected her motives are less than genuine and are designed to agitate for recognition of her political viewpoint, no more nor less.
Sadly the BBC are giving her more airtime, but I'm not surprised.
I saw this story in the BBC today.
It was written in a way that criticised the UK government for "allowing" it to happen.
It just showed complete naivety on the part of Nazanin, and on the BBC fort parroting this criticism of the representative with her.
Every grown up knows the Iranian govt are corrupt - not your Westminster bit of birthday cake and nominating a friend for a contract corrupt, but properly corrupt with no accountability, kidnapping, false imprisonment and torture.
But now, the BBC would much rather get a dig in at the Tories.
As I said, shows her either as naive, or deliberately stirring.
It was written in a way that criticised the UK government for "allowing" it to happen.
It just showed complete naivety on the part of Nazanin, and on the BBC fort parroting this criticism of the representative with her.
Every grown up knows the Iranian govt are corrupt - not your Westminster bit of birthday cake and nominating a friend for a contract corrupt, but properly corrupt with no accountability, kidnapping, false imprisonment and torture.
But now, the BBC would much rather get a dig in at the Tories.
As I said, shows her either as naive, or deliberately stirring.
Randy Winkman said:
rxe said:
And she’s now complaining that the nasty Iranians made her sign a confession before getting on the ‘plane to leave, and the UK government official did nothing to stop it.
Let me see, would she prefer:
Option 1: sign the Iranian piece of toilet paper, get on the damn ‘plane and don’t come back
Option 2: don’t sign it, don’t get on the ‘plane, return to prison
Can’t win with some people.
She did Option 1 and is now telling us about it. Where's the problem?Let me see, would she prefer:
Option 1: sign the Iranian piece of toilet paper, get on the damn ‘plane and don’t come back
Option 2: don’t sign it, don’t get on the ‘plane, return to prison
Can’t win with some people.
I have visited the US twice with my wife and will not be going back again, because of the way they treated her. You never hear about the dozens of Iranian citizens being detained in US prisons on trumped up charges. The last time we went to the US, we spent five hours in Atlanta (having flown from Los Angeles), waiting for a customs officer to verify that we were leaving the country - surely the fact that we had been forced to get off a plane that was bound for the UK, should have given them a clue that we were leaving the country?
rjfp1962 said:
How unlucky could Nazanin be in having the incompetent Johnson, first as Foreign Secretary, then Prime Minister during her incarceration?
I'm amazed she ever got home at all.........!
She could have been a damn sight luckier had she not travelled to Iran as an Iranian citizen and put herself in the situation in the first place.I'm amazed she ever got home at all.........!
Only one thing impacted her stay at the behest of the Iranian govt...payment of monies owed. Which PM sanctioned that (plenty to chose from - Thatcher? Major? Blair? Brown? Cameron? May? Johnson?).
What situation did she put herself in?
She had every right to go to Iran.
As far as she was aware, there was no reason not to. She had no beef with the regime and as far as she was aware, they had no beef with her. British people travel to and from Iran - it's not banned.
How was she to know that the UK government were reneging on a legally binding contract?
She had every right to go to Iran.
As far as she was aware, there was no reason not to. She had no beef with the regime and as far as she was aware, they had no beef with her. British people travel to and from Iran - it's not banned.
How was she to know that the UK government were reneging on a legally binding contract?
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