Brexit - was it worth it? (Vol. 4)
Discussion
crankedup5 said:
mike9009 said:
Brexit is and was always a complete folly.
Looking forward to Reform selling pixie dust again.
Why was it that the ‘Remain campaign’ was unable to convince the majority of those who took an active interest in the issue that to leave the EU would be a negative outcome?Looking forward to Reform selling pixie dust again.
BTW I voted to leave the EU and remain content with my decision.
CivicDuties said:
crankedup5 said:
mike9009 said:
Brexit is and was always a complete folly.
Looking forward to Reform selling pixie dust again.
Why was it that the ‘Remain campaign’ was unable to convince the majority of those who took an active interest in the issue that to leave the EU would be a negative outcome?Looking forward to Reform selling pixie dust again.
BTW I voted to leave the EU and remain content with my decision.
The issue for the remain camp, and still is, that arrogance (as you amply demonstrate in your answer to me) overrode the sensible heads to be honest and open with the campaign. The idiot Osborne capped it all off by announcing that ‘an emergency budget’ would have to be called if we left the EU.
crankedup5 said:
I was listening for 30 years leading up to brexit, what I heard, read and watched convinced me from very early in the process that the EU was not the way forward. I remain convinced and content.
The issue for the remain camp, and still is, that arrogance (as you amply demonstrate in your answer to me) overrode the sensible heads to be honest and open with the campaign. The idiot Osborne capped it all off by announcing that ‘an emergency budget’ would have to be called if we left the EU.
Sure, that will convince the majority The issue for the remain camp, and still is, that arrogance (as you amply demonstrate in your answer to me) overrode the sensible heads to be honest and open with the campaign. The idiot Osborne capped it all off by announcing that ‘an emergency budget’ would have to be called if we left the EU.
it’s a complete & utter disaster
Thankfully
Edited by James6112 on Thursday 25th April 17:00
James6112 said:
crankedup5 said:
I was listening for 30 years leading up to brexit, what I heard, read and watched convinced me from very early in the process that the EU was not the way forward. I remain convinced and content.
The issue for the remain camp, and still is, that arrogance (as you amply demonstrate in your answer to me) overrode the sensible heads to be honest and open with the campaign. The idiot Osborne capped it all off by announcing that ‘an emergency budget’ would have to be called if we left the EU.
Sure, that will convince the majority The issue for the remain camp, and still is, that arrogance (as you amply demonstrate in your answer to me) overrode the sensible heads to be honest and open with the campaign. The idiot Osborne capped it all off by announcing that ‘an emergency budget’ would have to be called if we left the EU.
it’s a complete & utter disaster
Thankfully
Edited by James6112 on Thursday 25th April 17:00
crankedup5 said:
I was listening for 30 years leading up to brexit, what I heard, read and watched convinced me from very early in the process that the EU was not the way forward. I remain convinced and content.
The issue for the remain camp, and still is, that arrogance (as you amply demonstrate in your answer to me) overrode the sensible heads to be honest and open with the campaign. The idiot Osborne capped it all off by announcing that ‘an emergency budget’ would have to be called if we left the EU.
I had elderly relatives with dodgy opinions too. Some feeling very sour about losing the vote in the 70’s and feeling it was ding ding round two.The issue for the remain camp, and still is, that arrogance (as you amply demonstrate in your answer to me) overrode the sensible heads to be honest and open with the campaign. The idiot Osborne capped it all off by announcing that ‘an emergency budget’ would have to be called if we left the EU.
Some are idiots who haven’t realised how the world moved on and their opinions stayed the same.
Some are not idiots and can make a good argument.
If you were convinced very early the eu project was wrong there’s no convincing you. If your opinions were changed by events like Maastricht I’d have more sympathy although I wouldn’t agree. But straight out of the gate thinking it’s all wrong and sticking to those guns, no empathy. I may have been on the losing side but I wasn’t the loser.
crankedup5 said:
James6112 said:
crankedup5 said:
I was listening for 30 years leading up to brexit, what I heard, read and watched convinced me from very early in the process that the EU was not the way forward. I remain convinced and content.
The issue for the remain camp, and still is, that arrogance (as you amply demonstrate in your answer to me) overrode the sensible heads to be honest and open with the campaign. The idiot Osborne capped it all off by announcing that ‘an emergency budget’ would have to be called if we left the EU.
Sure, that will convince the majority The issue for the remain camp, and still is, that arrogance (as you amply demonstrate in your answer to me) overrode the sensible heads to be honest and open with the campaign. The idiot Osborne capped it all off by announcing that ‘an emergency budget’ would have to be called if we left the EU.
it’s a complete & utter disaster
Thankfully
Edited by James6112 on Thursday 25th April 17:00
crankedup5 said:
The idiot Osborne capped it all off by announcing that ‘an emergency budget’ would have to be called if we left the EU.
We never did have the emergency budget Osborne promised. Two months short of 8 years and still waiting for it.Or was it a lie to influence the gullible?
cheesejunkie said:
crankedup5 said:
I was listening for 30 years leading up to brexit, what I heard, read and watched convinced me from very early in the process that the EU was not the way forward. I remain convinced and content.
The issue for the remain camp, and still is, that arrogance (as you amply demonstrate in your answer to me) overrode the sensible heads to be honest and open with the campaign. The idiot Osborne capped it all off by announcing that ‘an emergency budget’ would have to be called if we left the EU.
I had elderly relatives with dodgy opinions too. Some feeling very sour about losing the vote in the 70’s and feeling it was ding ding round two.The issue for the remain camp, and still is, that arrogance (as you amply demonstrate in your answer to me) overrode the sensible heads to be honest and open with the campaign. The idiot Osborne capped it all off by announcing that ‘an emergency budget’ would have to be called if we left the EU.
Some are idiots who haven’t realised how the world moved on and their opinions stayed the same.
Some are not idiots and can make a good argument.
If you were convinced very early the eu project was wrong there’s no convincing you. If your opinions were changed by events like Maastricht I’d have more sympathy although I wouldn’t agree. But straight out of the gate thinking it’s all wrong and sticking to those guns, no empathy. I may have been on the losing side but I wasn’t the loser.
Have another go reading my post and then think about it.
Ashfordian said:
crankedup5 said:
The idiot Osborne capped it all off by announcing that ‘an emergency budget’ would have to be called if we left the EU.
We never did have the emergency budget Osborne promised. Two months short of 8 years and still waiting for it.Or was it a lie to influence the gullible?
James6112 said:
crankedup5 said:
James6112 said:
crankedup5 said:
I was listening for 30 years leading up to brexit, what I heard, read and watched convinced me from very early in the process that the EU was not the way forward. I remain convinced and content.
The issue for the remain camp, and still is, that arrogance (as you amply demonstrate in your answer to me) overrode the sensible heads to be honest and open with the campaign. The idiot Osborne capped it all off by announcing that ‘an emergency budget’ would have to be called if we left the EU.
Sure, that will convince the majority The issue for the remain camp, and still is, that arrogance (as you amply demonstrate in your answer to me) overrode the sensible heads to be honest and open with the campaign. The idiot Osborne capped it all off by announcing that ‘an emergency budget’ would have to be called if we left the EU.
it’s a complete & utter disaster
Thankfully
Edited by James6112 on Thursday 25th April 17:00
crankedup5 said:
You are a dork and you do post BS across many threads.
Have another go reading my post and then think about it.
Dork? lolHave another go reading my post and then think about it.
Have you been watching American movies?
Is that how you bypass the moderators. I must remember that.
I wouldn’t complain, I am a massive d
head at times and never one to go with the flow. But I think you beat me on that score. I’ve a low boredom threshold and post some crap as a result. I don’t do racism unlike your indigenous self.CivicDuties said:
An emeritus professor of clinical biochemistry who thinks curvy female students are a perk of his job pontificates on the economics of Brexit. I can see why you like him 
You really are scraping the very bottom of the barrel now.
cheesejunkie said:
crankedup5 said:
You are a dork and you do post BS across many threads.
Have another go reading my post and then think about it.
Dork? lolHave another go reading my post and then think about it.
Have you been watching American movies?
Is that how you bypass the moderators. I must remember that.
I wouldn’t complain, I am a massive d
head at times and never one to go with the flow. But I think you beat me on that score. I’ve a low boredom threshold and post some crap as a result. I don’t do racism unlike your indigenous self.Please post up lines that I have used that are racist, this concerns me as my family includes mixed race and skin colour. I’m old (hence term dork) and trying to keep up with terminology that is acceptable /. not acceptable can be a challenge. Your guidance would be appreciated and I will double check with my family.
Vanden Saab said:
An emeritus professor of clinical biochemistry who thinks curvy female students are a perk of his job pontificates on the economics of Brexit. I can see why you like him
You really are scraping the very bottom of the barrel now.
Accepting that the University of Buckingham has displaced the ‘F’ but I read it and don’t get the curvy females, which to be honest is why I read it. The comments are most revealing though, Conservative Home seems to be morphing into The New European, no wonder they’re losing voters. You really are scraping the very bottom of the barrel now.
Blue62 said:
Vanden Saab said:
An emeritus professor of clinical biochemistry who thinks curvy female students are a perk of his job pontificates on the economics of Brexit. I can see why you like him
You really are scraping the very bottom of the barrel now.
Accepting that the University of Buckingham has displaced the ‘F’ but I read it and don’t get the curvy females, which to be honest is why I read it. The comments are most revealing though, Conservative Home seems to be morphing into The New European, no wonder they’re losing voters. You really are scraping the very bottom of the barrel now.
His 'I am cleverer than you and it was a joke' excuse was a bit lame but would strike a chord with the critical thinkers among us.
Vanden Saab said:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/education/8270475.stm
His 'I am cleverer than you and it was a joke' excuse was a bit lame but would strike a chord with the critical thinkers among us.
A rather bizarre story, lame excuse or not I don’t see how it would strike a chord with ‘the critical thinkers’, whoever they are, an equally odd statement if I may say so. Anyway, those comments are worth a read, best part of the article and quite illuminating, as is often the case. Thanks for linking the story, it puts everything into perspective. His 'I am cleverer than you and it was a joke' excuse was a bit lame but would strike a chord with the critical thinkers among us.
crankedup5 said:
mike9009 said:
Brexit is and was always a complete folly.
Looking forward to Reform selling pixie dust again.
Why was it that the ‘Remain campaign’ was unable to convince the majority of those who took an active interest in the issue that to leave the EU would be a negative outcome?Looking forward to Reform selling pixie dust again.
BTW I voted to leave the EU and remain content with my decision.
As we now know, the propensity for leave rises with age. 73% of people between 18 and 24 voted to remain compared to 40% of people 60 and over. As people get old, their opinions become intrenched to a point where it can become impossible to alter them, even with presentation of irrefutable fact; hence the saying, as you age, your narrow waist and broad mind swap places.
For these people, their opinions of the EU were shaped by it evolving into something different to what they reluctantly signed up to. The press capitalised upon this growing distain by taking an editorial position against the EU which meant that headlines promoted negativity towards it, suppressing the good stuff. These editorial positions were and remain rarely challenged.
Added to this is that we never really promoted the EU when it was appropriate to do so. The good stuff rarely gained any visibility. I'll give you an example.
In the late 00s, I joined a Community Radio station, going on to become its Chairman. It was part of a wider Community Project that had been funded entirely by the EU and had been effective in preserving and building a number of key community assets. This was bang smack in the middle of austerity. Government money had stopped but the EU money continued. I only found out about this in 2014 when I was sorting through a cupboard and found a large metal sign that had the EU flag on it and the words; 'Funded by the European Union' written on it. Now, if you went to any similar project in Spain or France, or Germany, that sign would be the first thing you see when you enter a building. It's the first thing that gets erected. But here, they didn't even take it out of the bubble-wrap.
This was common which meant that the 'tangible' positives of EU membership was largely invisible despite being present.
So in summary, the reason the remain option didn't resonate is a combination of intrenched opinion being maintained by the extraneous suppression of counter argument and factual evidence, this having been a factor since the day we joined.
This is why I think there is so much animosity. It's not animosity aimed at those who voted leave or even the fact that we have left. It's because the opinions that led to us leaving were sometimes groundless, sometimes wrong and often without evidence and all this stoked by nefarious politicians who used the vote for their own political ambitions supported by a client press only too willing to support those ambitions.
There's some reason to level a similar critique to the remain side too. Project fear and all that. I don't think it comes close to what the leave promoters did but they are not entirely blameless.
crankedup5 said:
James6112 said:
crankedup5 said:
I was listening for 30 years leading up to brexit, what I heard, read and watched convinced me from very early in the process that the EU was not the way forward. I remain convinced and content.
The issue for the remain camp, and still is, that arrogance (as you amply demonstrate in your answer to me) overrode the sensible heads to be honest and open with the campaign. The idiot Osborne capped it all off by announcing that ‘an emergency budget’ would have to be called if we left the EU.
Sure, that will convince the majority The issue for the remain camp, and still is, that arrogance (as you amply demonstrate in your answer to me) overrode the sensible heads to be honest and open with the campaign. The idiot Osborne capped it all off by announcing that ‘an emergency budget’ would have to be called if we left the EU.
it’s a complete & utter disaster
Thankfully
Edited by James6112 on Thursday 25th April 17:00
StevieB thanks for taking the time to lay out your perspective of brexit, however you do seem to bypass the negatives of membership of the EU and blame any such things onto U.K. media.
My concerns of being in the EU were those that many remainers still refuse to accept as credible and true, not that it makes any difference now. I will not repeat those negatives as they are well known from me in too many posts in the past.
My hope now is that the U.K. government will learn from its mistakes and in future all major political and practical changes directly affecting its,people will be openly debated and agreed with the people whom they serve. When wanting to make major changes first make sure you take the people with you.
My concerns of being in the EU were those that many remainers still refuse to accept as credible and true, not that it makes any difference now. I will not repeat those negatives as they are well known from me in too many posts in the past.
My hope now is that the U.K. government will learn from its mistakes and in future all major political and practical changes directly affecting its,people will be openly debated and agreed with the people whom they serve. When wanting to make major changes first make sure you take the people with you.
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