Policing of pro Palestinian marches
Discussion
Slowboathome said:
The CAA claim that GOSH gave that as one of the reasons for declining their bid. GOSH deny this. CAA are going to submit a FOI request with the aim of disclosing factors that influenced GOSH's decision-making process.
exactlynow, who would I believe in this situation. A world class institution who are very well run or CAA who send their staff to inflame tensions at a march? hmmm
LM240 said:
When I read that I see it as, warn him that he may get assaulted / intimidated if he goes through the march/protest.
Not give a warning in terms of let off an offence.
Seems quite obvious reading it.
We're discussing within the context of someone being threatened with arrest, being 'let off with a warning and being sent on your way'.Not give a warning in terms of let off an offence.
Seems quite obvious reading it.
I think most people would interpret that as a police warning.
IMO.
swisstoni said:
Just because the situation was manufactured, doesn’t change the situation.
yes, agreedthe situation is CAA are a bunch of morons trying their best to inflame tensions. I hope the training they provide is dropped by every single public and private sector body in favour of a sensible organisation who can raise awareness of anti semetism in a sensible way. Not like this bunch of clowns.
Edited by MrJuice on Monday 22 April 11:11
MrJuice said:
swisstoni said:
Just because the situation was manufactured, doesn’t change the situation.
yes, agreedthe situation is CAA are a bunch of morons trying their best to inflame tensions. I hope the training they provide is dropped by every single public and private sector body in favour of a sensible organisation who can raise awareness of anti semetism in a sensible way. Not like this bunch of clowns.
Edited by MrJuice on Monday 22 April 11:11
MrJuice said:
Slowboathome said:
The CAA claim that GOSH gave that as one of the reasons for declining their bid. GOSH deny this. CAA are going to submit a FOI request with the aim of disclosing factors that influenced GOSH's decision-making process.
exactlynow, who would I believe in this situation. A world class institution who are very well run or CAA who send their staff to inflame tensions at a march? hmmm
Were you at the Trust during any of these episodes?
Great Ormond Street Hospital was involved in a scandal regarding the removal of live tissue and organs from children during surgery and onward sale to pharmaceutical companies without the knowledge of parents in 2001.[49]
In January 2014, it was revealed that as a result of an accidental injection of glue into her brain, Maisha Najeeb brought a claim for compensation against the Great Ormond Street Hospital leading to a payment of up to £24million.[50][51]
The hospital's charity faced an investigation by the Information Commissioner's Office over potential breaches of data protection law in February 2017.[52] The Great Ormond Street Hospital Charity was fined "£11,000 for sharing 910,283 records with other charities, sending on average 795,000 records per month to a wealth screening company and using email and birthdays to find out extra information about more than 311,000 supporters".[53][54]
In April 2018, it was revealed children were put at risk by being given potentially dangerous drugs.[55]
In April 2019, following an inquiry into the death of Amy Allan, the coroner criticised the hospital for not providing a proper plan for the teenager's recovery after surgery.[56]
In 2019 the Great Ormond Street mortuary manager made the senior leadership aware of staffing issues. "Since April 2019 GOSH mortuary has been very short staffed but somehow we have managed to keep our standards up, get through a HTA inspection and still give 100% care to our patients whilst having 50% staff. Patient first and always".[57]
The former Health Secretary, Jeremy Hunt, urged Great Ormond Street Hospital to examine a possible fundamental cultural problem amid claims it prioritizes reputation over patient care in March 2020.[58]
In March 2020, the BBC conducted an investigation into the death of a child and revealed that at least six children had died of invasive aspergillosis at Great Ormond Street since 2016.[59]
Several leaked emails from the head of Great Ormond Street Hospital, released in November 2020, suggested that the hospital had become accustomed to some "bad behaviours" and that more needed to be done to ensure staff feel safe.[60]
In June 2021, the mother of a baby questioned why action was not taken sooner for her son who died at Great Ormond Street Hospital.[61]
Great Ormond Street Hospital entered into an agreement with Sensyne, an AI company, in September 2021. The hospital received 1,428,571 shares in the company in exchange for patient data. Sensyne has since been delisted from the London Stock Exchange leading to a loss to the hospital of around £2 million.[62][63]
Following a lawsuit against Great Ormond Street Hospital for Children NHS Foundation Trust, a family received up to £7 million after the boy was left disabled, in July 2022.[64][65][66]
In February 2023, the mother of a sick child with cancer was shocked after hearing Great Ormond Street hospital workers making jokes about his likely death.[67][68][69][70]
In March 2023, it was revealed trainee dentist doctors at Great Ormond Street Hospital NHS Foundation Trust were going unsupervised.[71]
In May 2023, newspapers highlighted the case of Ryan, left unattended in a lift by a Great Ormond Street hospital worker. His mother Catherine suffered a stress-induced seizure as she fell down the stairs and broke several bones after learning what happened to her son. Ryan was found again after someone needed to use the trolley he was in, around 11 hours later. A spokesperson from the hospital said that there was a situation on the day of Ryan’s arrival and that they had half the number of staff that were due to be on duty.[72][73]
Hospital cleaners have made allegations of institutional racism at Great Ormond Street Hospital in March 2023. Hospital cleaners from minority ethnic groups say they were denied NHS contracts and paid less than white NHS employees. A court hearing was concluded in 2023. Each cleaner could receive between £80,000 and £190,000 if the claims are successful.[74]
In August 2023 it was revealed a child began to experience lung complications with an invasive aspergillosis infection which led to his death.[75]
In February 2024, the hospital's orthopedic unit faced scrutiny following the discovery of the use of outdated limb lengthening devices from the Soviet era by one of its surgeons. Soviet-era limb lengthening devices are outdated and potentially unsafe compared to modern medical equipment. The use of such devices in 2017-2022 would raise concerns about patient safety, medical ethics, and the standards of care provided by the surgeon. The revelation came about after parents raised concerns.[76][77]
LM240 said:
Dagnir said:
Mojooo said:
I was being a bit facetious... the guy wanted a punch in the face to further his cause. Shame he didnt get one. As far as the police go they should have just given him a warning and then let him be on his way - he seems to have 3 people with him - 2 of them looked 'openly Jewish' as wel lso he wasn't on his own.
A warning for what?How on earth can people still this blindly biased?
How utterly bizzare...
Not give a warning in terms of let off an offence.
Seems quite obvious reading it.
As mentioned he had 3 or 4 other people with him as well.
Edited by Mojooo on Monday 22 April 11:30
Slowboathome said:
Are you claiming to be impartial? You've already disclosed that you used to work there.
Were you at the Trust during any of these episodes?
Great Ormond Street Hospital was involved in a scandal regarding the removal of live tissue and organs from children during surgery and onward sale to pharmaceutical companies without the knowledge of parents in 2001.[49]
In January 2014, it was revealed that as a result of an accidental injection of glue into her brain, Maisha Najeeb brought a claim for compensation against the Great Ormond Street Hospital leading to a payment of up to £24million.[50][51]
The hospital's charity faced an investigation by the Information Commissioner's Office over potential breaches of data protection law in February 2017.[52] The Great Ormond Street Hospital Charity was fined "£11,000 for sharing 910,283 records with other charities, sending on average 795,000 records per month to a wealth screening company and using email and birthdays to find out extra information about more than 311,000 supporters".[53][54]
In April 2018, it was revealed children were put at risk by being given potentially dangerous drugs.[55]
In April 2019, following an inquiry into the death of Amy Allan, the coroner criticised the hospital for not providing a proper plan for the teenager's recovery after surgery.[56]
In 2019 the Great Ormond Street mortuary manager made the senior leadership aware of staffing issues. "Since April 2019 GOSH mortuary has been very short staffed but somehow we have managed to keep our standards up, get through a HTA inspection and still give 100% care to our patients whilst having 50% staff. Patient first and always".[57]
The former Health Secretary, Jeremy Hunt, urged Great Ormond Street Hospital to examine a possible fundamental cultural problem amid claims it prioritizes reputation over patient care in March 2020.[58]
In March 2020, the BBC conducted an investigation into the death of a child and revealed that at least six children had died of invasive aspergillosis at Great Ormond Street since 2016.[59]
Several leaked emails from the head of Great Ormond Street Hospital, released in November 2020, suggested that the hospital had become accustomed to some "bad behaviours" and that more needed to be done to ensure staff feel safe.[60]
In June 2021, the mother of a baby questioned why action was not taken sooner for her son who died at Great Ormond Street Hospital.[61]
Great Ormond Street Hospital entered into an agreement with Sensyne, an AI company, in September 2021. The hospital received 1,428,571 shares in the company in exchange for patient data. Sensyne has since been delisted from the London Stock Exchange leading to a loss to the hospital of around £2 million.[62][63]
Following a lawsuit against Great Ormond Street Hospital for Children NHS Foundation Trust, a family received up to £7 million after the boy was left disabled, in July 2022.[64][65][66]
In February 2023, the mother of a sick child with cancer was shocked after hearing Great Ormond Street hospital workers making jokes about his likely death.[67][68][69][70]
In March 2023, it was revealed trainee dentist doctors at Great Ormond Street Hospital NHS Foundation Trust were going unsupervised.[71]
In May 2023, newspapers highlighted the case of Ryan, left unattended in a lift by a Great Ormond Street hospital worker. His mother Catherine suffered a stress-induced seizure as she fell down the stairs and broke several bones after learning what happened to her son. Ryan was found again after someone needed to use the trolley he was in, around 11 hours later. A spokesperson from the hospital said that there was a situation on the day of Ryan’s arrival and that they had half the number of staff that were due to be on duty.[72][73]
Hospital cleaners have made allegations of institutional racism at Great Ormond Street Hospital in March 2023. Hospital cleaners from minority ethnic groups say they were denied NHS contracts and paid less than white NHS employees. A court hearing was concluded in 2023. Each cleaner could receive between £80,000 and £190,000 if the claims are successful.[74]
In August 2023 it was revealed a child began to experience lung complications with an invasive aspergillosis infection which led to his death.[75]
In February 2024, the hospital's orthopedic unit faced scrutiny following the discovery of the use of outdated limb lengthening devices from the Soviet era by one of its surgeons. Soviet-era limb lengthening devices are outdated and potentially unsafe compared to modern medical equipment. The use of such devices in 2017-2022 would raise concerns about patient safety, medical ethics, and the standards of care provided by the surgeon. The revelation came about after parents raised concerns.[76][77]
I am the type of guy who holds his hands up and apologises when I make a mistake. CAA are a bunch of clowns who keep digging because they think they are untouchable. They are not. They are idiots and I am very glad they keep on digging. And fwiw, they did not make any mistakes. They deliberately sent Gideon to stir and he's being exposed left, right and centre. Brilliant. Were you at the Trust during any of these episodes?
Great Ormond Street Hospital was involved in a scandal regarding the removal of live tissue and organs from children during surgery and onward sale to pharmaceutical companies without the knowledge of parents in 2001.[49]
In January 2014, it was revealed that as a result of an accidental injection of glue into her brain, Maisha Najeeb brought a claim for compensation against the Great Ormond Street Hospital leading to a payment of up to £24million.[50][51]
The hospital's charity faced an investigation by the Information Commissioner's Office over potential breaches of data protection law in February 2017.[52] The Great Ormond Street Hospital Charity was fined "£11,000 for sharing 910,283 records with other charities, sending on average 795,000 records per month to a wealth screening company and using email and birthdays to find out extra information about more than 311,000 supporters".[53][54]
In April 2018, it was revealed children were put at risk by being given potentially dangerous drugs.[55]
In April 2019, following an inquiry into the death of Amy Allan, the coroner criticised the hospital for not providing a proper plan for the teenager's recovery after surgery.[56]
In 2019 the Great Ormond Street mortuary manager made the senior leadership aware of staffing issues. "Since April 2019 GOSH mortuary has been very short staffed but somehow we have managed to keep our standards up, get through a HTA inspection and still give 100% care to our patients whilst having 50% staff. Patient first and always".[57]
The former Health Secretary, Jeremy Hunt, urged Great Ormond Street Hospital to examine a possible fundamental cultural problem amid claims it prioritizes reputation over patient care in March 2020.[58]
In March 2020, the BBC conducted an investigation into the death of a child and revealed that at least six children had died of invasive aspergillosis at Great Ormond Street since 2016.[59]
Several leaked emails from the head of Great Ormond Street Hospital, released in November 2020, suggested that the hospital had become accustomed to some "bad behaviours" and that more needed to be done to ensure staff feel safe.[60]
In June 2021, the mother of a baby questioned why action was not taken sooner for her son who died at Great Ormond Street Hospital.[61]
Great Ormond Street Hospital entered into an agreement with Sensyne, an AI company, in September 2021. The hospital received 1,428,571 shares in the company in exchange for patient data. Sensyne has since been delisted from the London Stock Exchange leading to a loss to the hospital of around £2 million.[62][63]
Following a lawsuit against Great Ormond Street Hospital for Children NHS Foundation Trust, a family received up to £7 million after the boy was left disabled, in July 2022.[64][65][66]
In February 2023, the mother of a sick child with cancer was shocked after hearing Great Ormond Street hospital workers making jokes about his likely death.[67][68][69][70]
In March 2023, it was revealed trainee dentist doctors at Great Ormond Street Hospital NHS Foundation Trust were going unsupervised.[71]
In May 2023, newspapers highlighted the case of Ryan, left unattended in a lift by a Great Ormond Street hospital worker. His mother Catherine suffered a stress-induced seizure as she fell down the stairs and broke several bones after learning what happened to her son. Ryan was found again after someone needed to use the trolley he was in, around 11 hours later. A spokesperson from the hospital said that there was a situation on the day of Ryan’s arrival and that they had half the number of staff that were due to be on duty.[72][73]
Hospital cleaners have made allegations of institutional racism at Great Ormond Street Hospital in March 2023. Hospital cleaners from minority ethnic groups say they were denied NHS contracts and paid less than white NHS employees. A court hearing was concluded in 2023. Each cleaner could receive between £80,000 and £190,000 if the claims are successful.[74]
In August 2023 it was revealed a child began to experience lung complications with an invasive aspergillosis infection which led to his death.[75]
In February 2024, the hospital's orthopedic unit faced scrutiny following the discovery of the use of outdated limb lengthening devices from the Soviet era by one of its surgeons. Soviet-era limb lengthening devices are outdated and potentially unsafe compared to modern medical equipment. The use of such devices in 2017-2022 would raise concerns about patient safety, medical ethics, and the standards of care provided by the surgeon. The revelation came about after parents raised concerns.[76][77]
Mojooo said:
LM240 said:
Dagnir said:
Mojooo said:
I was being a bit facetious... the guy wanted a punch in the face to further his cause. Shame he didnt get one. As far as the police go they should have just given him a warning and then let him be on his way - he seems to have 3 people with him - 2 of them looked 'openly Jewish' as wel lso he wasn't on his own.
A warning for what?How on earth can people still this blindly biased?
How utterly bizzare...
Not give a warning in terms of let off an offence.
Seems quite obvious reading it.
As mentioned he had 3 or 4 other people with him as well.
Edited by Mojooo on Monday 22 April 11:30
MrJuice said:
I am the type of guy who holds his hands up and apologises when I make a mistake. CAA are a bunch of clowns who keep digging because they think they are untouchable. They are not. They are idiots and I am very glad they keep on digging. And fwiw, they did not make any mistakes. They deliberately sent Gideon to stir and he's being exposed left, right and centre. Brilliant.
Earlier on you were asking for evidence. I've just given you some evidence that GOSH isn't always as well run as you claim. MrJuice said:
exactly
now, who would I believe in this situation. A world class institution who are very well run or CAA who send their staff to inflame tensions at a march? hmmm
Gideon isn't "their staff", he literally founded the organisation and is Chief Executive.now, who would I believe in this situation. A world class institution who are very well run or CAA who send their staff to inflame tensions at a march? hmmm
swisstoni said:
Just because the situation was manufactured, doesn’t change the situation.
Precisely.He's an activist, sure, and he actually has the chutzpah to go out there himself, rather than sending staff.
But the fact that he has some chutzpah doesn't detract from the point he was making.
How many Jews aren't even going near this bit of London when the marches are on? It's effectively excluding Jews from Central London every Saturday, unless you hide your Jewishness, or have a shibboleth that identifies you as the "right kind of Jew".
Boohoo he's filiming. I'm sure loads of people are filming... some support, some against.
Solocle said:
MrJuice said:
exactly
now, who would I believe in this situation. A world class institution who are very well run or CAA who send their staff to inflame tensions at a march? hmmm
Gideon isn't "their staff", he literally founded the organisation and is Chief Executive.now, who would I believe in this situation. A world class institution who are very well run or CAA who send their staff to inflame tensions at a march? hmmm
swisstoni said:
Just because the situation was manufactured, doesn’t change the situation.
Precisely.He's an activist, sure, and he actually has the chutzpah to go out there himself, rather than sending staff.
But the fact that he has some chutzpah doesn't detract from the point he was making.
How many Jews aren't even going near this bit of London when the marches are on? It's effectively excluding Jews from Central London every Saturday, unless you hide your Jewishness, or have a shibboleth that identifies you as the "right kind of Jew".
Boohoo he's filiming. I'm sure loads of people are filming... some support, some against.
I watched a clip sky put up this morning and to be fair it sounds like the sky crew happened to be there and weren't with him specifically.
Slowboathome said:
Earlier on you were asking for evidence. I've just given you some evidence that GOSH isn't always as well run as you claim.
I was asking for evidence of The Muslim Network at GOSH (that no one apart from CAA knows about) being responsible for CAA being dropped. You then go on to provide a series of mistakes or cover ups at GOSH over the years.
If my child had a serious issue, I'd want them treated at GOSH. If my current organisation wanted antisemitism training, I'd suggest management look for organisations other than CAA who are proven clowns.
White-Noise said:
Ps I had never heard the word chutzpah before. He definitely has that. I learnt something there.
Careful, Yiddish is an absolute rabbit hole of words that have sometimes made it into the English lexicon 
Although it's a bit more negative in Yiddish than I'd intend here. Maybe cojones?I'm generally not visibly Jewish, but it was nerve-wracking enough after doing a Channukah shop in Golder's Green and being just across from this guy on a train in Bournemouth... with some very visibly Israeli beers in tow.
Solocle said:
White-Noise said:
Ps I had never heard the word chutzpah before. He definitely has that. I learnt something there.
Careful, Yiddish is an absolute rabbit hole of words that have sometimes made it into the English lexicon Although it's a bit more negative in Yiddish than I'd intend here. Maybe cojones?I'm generally not visibly Jewish, but it was nerve-wracking enough after doing a Channukah shop in Golder's Green and being just across from this guy on a train in Bournemouth... with some very visibly Israeli beers in tow.
Solocle said:
MrJuice said:
exactly
now, who would I believe in this situation. A world class institution who are very well run or CAA who send their staff to inflame tensions at a march? hmmm
Gideon isn't "their staff", he literally founded the organisation and is Chief Executive.now, who would I believe in this situation. A world class institution who are very well run or CAA who send their staff to inflame tensions at a march? hmmm
swisstoni said:
Just because the situation was manufactured, doesn’t change the situation.
Precisely.He's an activist, sure, and he actually has the chutzpah to go out there himself, rather than sending staff.
But the fact that he has some chutzpah doesn't detract from the point he was making.
How many Jews aren't even going near this bit of London when the marches are on? It's effectively excluding Jews from Central London every Saturday, unless you hide your Jewishness, or have a shibboleth that identifies you as the "right kind of Jew".
Boohoo he's filiming. I'm sure loads of people are filming... some support, some against.
White-Noise said:
Presumably you are Jewish? Assuming you are I really like how you have made that quite obvious on here. Good man. When on PH I often wonder if there are folks who are reading a given topic and don't say anything but are from a group at the core of the topic. In this scenario police or Jewish etc for example.
Yes I am, although reform, so generally not identifiable as such in public - so I'm generally less affected by this than an orthodox Jew might be. E.g. I just bumped into this on Twitter:Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff