Reform UK - A symptom of all that is wrong?

[abzmike]

Inerview on TV this morning....

Julia Hartley Brewer, "You would leave asylum seekers to drown in the channel?"

Ben Habib, "Absolutely"

JHB, "That is not a policy that a civilised country should endorse"

BH, "Why is that uncivilised?"

JHB, "Because we don't leave people to drown.. I don't want these people here, but I wouldn't leave them to drown.. I don't think anyone in the border force or Royal Navy that would do that"

BH, "I'm afraid border force means using force at the border"

So, Reform endorses letting people drown in the channel. How can anyone vote for them, unless they also want migrants to drown.

[cheesejunkie]

bad company said:

Couldn’t agree more. Labour wanted us to elect Corbyn and Diane Abbott, both utterly useless imo.

Trouble is the current Conservative government don’t seem much better, I speak as a lifelong Tory voter and former party member. BoJo was a disaster imo.

Tories have had two unelected PMs in recent years. Their party membership are not very attached to reality and they’re suffering as a result.

I agree labour messed up with Corbyn. They’ve sorted that mess, the tories have yet to.

[swisstoni]

cheesejunkie said:

bad company said:

Couldn’t agree more. Labour wanted us to elect Corbyn and Diane Abbott, both utterly useless imo.

Trouble is the current Conservative government don’t seem much better, I speak as a lifelong Tory voter and former party member. BoJo was a disaster imo.

Tories have had two unelected PMs in recent years. Their party membership are not very attached to reality and they’re suffering as a result.

I agree labour messed up with Corbyn. They’ve sorted that mess, the tories have yet to.

I think time will tell whether Labour have 'sorted that mess'. They have generally done an excellent job of keeping a lid on any issues in opposition. Even the Gaza crisis hasn't blown up like it could have.

The real test will be in the daily glare of government.

But few could argue that they don't deserve a shot at it. The Tories look like an MOT failure that needs to come off the road for a nut and bolt resto.

[smn159]

crankedup5 said:

What is the point of voting for Labour, their track record indicates uselessness in every direction over the past 50 years. Vote Labour when they op tell the Country not to expect any change of a positive direction. Starmer continues to ‘flip flop’ unable to make up his mind, terrified of his own decisions

'But Labour...' again

This thread is excellent - the comedy value of thinking that a bunch of illiterate Facebook racists will somehow be a 'breath of fresh air' and lead the country to the sunlit uplands and / or force the Tories to become more racist is great

[Mr Penguin]

Reform won't be forming the government so voting for them is more of a statement of wanting a tougher approach rather than quibbling over the details.

[President Merkin]

bad company said:

I said ‘ The Conservative Party has traditionally been low tax’.

Obviously any government spends taxpayers money, the debates are about how much to tax and spend.

The factual nonsense is your post.

Edited by bad company on Wednesday 24th April 10:34

Not obvious in the slightest going by your very own words though eh, And none of this touches the sides of Reforms fantasynomics. Still, I expect you guys will just slide on over to oh well, it's just a protest vote. You boys are puddle deep in your thihking.

bad company said:

From what I’ve seen so far intelligence doesn’t seem to figure highly among Labour voters. Busy finding ways of spending other people’s money. Politics of envy imo.

[Killboy]

Pan Pan Pan said:

You have views many of which I disagree with. That is the nature of having choice in the UK. Your use of the word scum however shows that you are a bigot.

Is scum better or worse than "fkwit"?

[Killboy]

So, let me get this right.

People voting for Labour are "fkwits", because while Labour has at least some substance in their manifesto they have a poor track record from ages ago.

But people voting for a party with meaningless manifestos that do not need to hold up scrutiny should not be considered just a little bit dim - because if they got in they'd somehow figure it out?

[The Selfish Gene]

abzmike said:

Inerview on TV this morning....

Julia Hartley Brewer, "You would leave asylum seekers to drown in the channel?"

Ben Habib, "Absolutely"

JHB, "That is not a policy that a civilised country should endorse"

BH, "Why is that uncivilised?"

JHB, "Because we don't leave people to drown.. I don't want these people here, but I wouldn't leave them to drown.. I don't think anyone in the border force or Royal Navy that would do that"

BH, "I'm afraid border force means using force at the border"

So, Reform endorses letting people drown in the channel. How can anyone vote for them, unless they also want migrants to drown.

understand your logic there, really do. However, you could use that argument for a lot of things.

Where do you draw the line?

A burglar breaks into your house, and is hurting your child, do you stop him with an axe, or turn a blind eye etc (extreme example).

I believe the interviewee is essentially saying if you stop them with force, they will stop coming - I kind of agree regardless of politics, that would work as a tactic.

[smn159]

abzmike said:

Inerview on TV this morning....

Julia Hartley Brewer, "You would leave asylum seekers to drown in the channel?"

Ben Habib, "Absolutely"

JHB, "That is not a policy that a civilised country should endorse"

BH, "Why is that uncivilised?"

JHB, "Because we don't leave people to drown.. I don't want these people here, but I wouldn't leave them to drown.. I don't think anyone in the border force or Royal Navy that would do that"

BH, "I'm afraid border force means using force at the border"

So, Reform endorses letting people drown in the channel. How can anyone vote for them, unless they also want migrants to drown.

Is anyone surprised by this? The type of people that Reform attract has been clear for a while now.

An immigrant himself, who has done very well from this country, now advocates letting other immigrants drown.

.

[TTwiggy]

I'm ex RN. Regardless of anything else (enemy combatants, or 'illegal' immigrants) you don't leave anyone to the 'mercy' of the wet stuff.

[Bill]

The Selfish Gene said:

understand your logic there, really do. However, you could use that argument for a lot of things.

Where do you draw the line?

A burglar breaks into your house, and is hurting your child, do you stop him with an axe, or turn a blind eye etc (extreme example).

I believe the interviewee is essentially saying if you stop them with force, they will stop coming - I kind of agree regardless of politics, that would work as a tactic.

Your burglar example is clearly self defence. Deliberately letting people drown is the act of a .

HTH.

[bad company]

abzmike said:

Inerview on TV this morning....

Julia Hartley Brewer, "You would leave asylum seekers to drown in the channel?"

Ben Habib, "Absolutely"

JHB, "That is not a policy that a civilised country should endorse"

BH, "Why is that uncivilised?"

JHB, "Because we don't leave people to drown.. I don't want these people here, but I wouldn't leave them to drown.. I don't think anyone in the border force or Royal Navy that would do that"

BH, "I'm afraid border force means using force at the border"

So, Reform endorses letting people drown in the channel. How can anyone vote for them, unless they also want migrants to drown.

I didn’t hear it but here’s BH’s response:-

I said that migrants who jumped overboard when challenged in the Channel could be rescued in any number of ways, one of which was to give them another boat. But, if they put themselves deliberately in harms way we cannot be held responsible.

[CraigyMc]

smn159 said:

abzmike said:

Inerview on TV this morning....

Julia Hartley Brewer, "You would leave asylum seekers to drown in the channel?"

Ben Habib, "Absolutely"

JHB, "That is not a policy that a civilised country should endorse"

BH, "Why is that uncivilised?"

JHB, "Because we don't leave people to drown.. I don't want these people here, but I wouldn't leave them to drown.. I don't think anyone in the border force or Royal Navy that would do that"

BH, "I'm afraid border force means using force at the border"

So, Reform endorses letting people drown in the channel. How can anyone vote for them, unless they also want migrants to drown.

Is anyone surprised by this? The type of people that Reform attract has been clear for a while now.

An immigrant himself, who has done very well from this country, now advocates letting other immigrants drown.

.

You may be surpised by how many immigrants are anti-immigration. I was.

In other news, Binface is now more electable than reform, simply by "campaigning" on a topic that has appeal across all the demographics and parties.

[Mrr T]

abzmike said:

Inerview on TV this morning....

Julia Hartley Brewer, "You would leave asylum seekers to drown in the channel?"

Ben Habib, "Absolutely"

JHB, "That is not a policy that a civilised country should endorse"

BH, "Why is that uncivilised?"

JHB, "Because we don't leave people to drown.. I don't want these people here, but I wouldn't leave them to drown.. I don't think anyone in the border force or Royal Navy that would do that"

BH, "I'm afraid border force means using force at the border"

So, Reform endorses letting people drown in the channel. How can anyone vote for them, unless they also want migrants to drown.

Reform seem to be unaware we have laws on murder and manslaughter.

[President Merkin]

Decent measure of how degraded politics has become when a senior political figure advocates letting people drown & some suggest it's a workable tactic. In any nornal country, that would be the end of Habib's career. Here though, barely an eyebrow raised.

[bad company]

President Merkin said:

Decent measure of how degraded politics has become when a senior political figure advocates letting people drown & some suggest it's a workable tactic. In any nornal country, that would be the end of Habib's career. Here though, barely an eyebrow raised.

Once again - HIS RESPONSE:-

I said that migrants who jumped overboard when challenged in the Channel could be rescued in any number of ways, one of which was to give them another boat. But, if they put themselves deliberately in harms way we cannot be held responsible.

Can we get a transcript of exactly what was said?

[Dave200]

Does anyone really care about UKIP/Reclaim/Reform/Brexit, or whatever they've rebranded themselves as this year? They are on track to win 20 or so seats at most, with a smaller share of vote than the unelectable Lib Dems. They are a laughing stock in mainstream political terms, and mostly a home for voters who don't think that a party who want to send immigrants to Rwanda are racist enough for them. I'm sure they'll disappear and rebrand after another embarrassing election campaign founded on a manifesto that looks like it was written as part of a secondary school project on WW2 Germany.

[CraigyMc]

Dave200 said:

Does anyone really care about UKIP/Reclaim/Reform/Brexit, or whatever they've rebranded themselves as this year?

Yes.

Why?

It's feasible that they become the next iteration of the Tory party.

[Dave200]

CraigyMc said:

Dave200 said:

Does anyone really care about UKIP/Reclaim/Reform/Brexit, or whatever they've rebranded themselves as this year?

Yes.

Why?

It's feasible that they become the next iteration of the Tory party.

Are they really though? They are on track for 12% of the vote, and could easily still end up with no seats. Given that we're witnessing a generational collapse in support for the Tories, I'd expect significantly better than this if theirs was really a tenable mainstream political position. They are an irrelevance whose only role will be to keep the Tories out of power for a long while as they try to recover the centrist votes they lost to Labour.