Reform UK - A symptom of all that is wrong?
Discussion
cheesejunkie said:
So people can be d
heads at any age, it's a fair country in that regard.
What are reform offering?
Who are they appealing to?
What does anyone voting for them expect to achieve?
It isn't those younger people with so called breathtaking arrogance voting for them.
Yes dheads at any age, it's a fair country in that regard.What are reform offering?
Who are they appealing to?
What does anyone voting for them expect to achieve?
It isn't those younger people with so called breathtaking arrogance voting for them.
heads at any age and some here on PH.I see Reform attracting votes from disaffected voters from both of the main parties. For my part I’m hoping that Reform will influence the Conservatives to return to conservative policies and values. Also I’m particularly dissatisfied with my conservative MP and will not vote for him.
If that whiffy poll VS put about is to be believed, practically no Lib Dems or Labour voters fancy giving Reform a squeeze. But whiffy is as whiffy does,
Out of curiosity, since we have seen all sorts of what the man on the Clapham omnibus would reasonably describe as fking appaling people ejected from Reform in recent weeks & generally only post facto too (Cheers HNH) and as recently as yesterday, Ben Habib confirming he's happy to let desperate people drown to protect the border exactly how much are you Reform boys holding your noses in the polling booth hoping to persuade your Tory friens to return to those generally undefined traditional values? Because from the outside, it does look quite a lot like the ends justifying the means.
Out of curiosity, since we have seen all sorts of what the man on the Clapham omnibus would reasonably describe as f
king appaling people ejected from Reform in recent weeks & generally only post facto too (Cheers HNH) and as recently as yesterday, Ben Habib confirming he's happy to let desperate people drown to protect the border exactly how much are you Reform boys holding your noses in the polling booth hoping to persuade your Tory friens to return to those generally undefined traditional values? Because from the outside, it does look quite a lot like the ends justifying the means.I've never understood how anyone could vote for Habib. I find him shallow and self centred.
I've heard him talk some nonsense (his twisty two facedness over the NI protocol, voting for it then complaining about it being enforced, is enough to show what a liar he is) but didn't realise until this thread that he'd come out admitting he'd let people drown.
I'm very glad I've never been tempted to vote reform.
I'd also love to know what traditional conservative values they're representing that the Conservative Party aren't. I'm guessing I know the answer but it's interesting to hear people state it.
I've heard him talk some nonsense (his twisty two facedness over the NI protocol, voting for it then complaining about it being enforced, is enough to show what a liar he is) but didn't realise until this thread that he'd come out admitting he'd let people drown.
I'm very glad I've never been tempted to vote reform.
I'd also love to know what traditional conservative values they're representing that the Conservative Party aren't. I'm guessing I know the answer but it's interesting to hear people state it.
Pan Pan Pan said:
Dave200 said:
Jordie Barretts sock said:
crankedup5 said:
A few posters 
you can coast from stats to stats offered from differing outlets, most will present entirely differing ‘facts and figures’.For example the students entering the U.K. mentioned earlier, no mention of family members accompany of students and wether that was included or not in the stats presented. We do know that family members are now restricted to overseas students.
Oh dear. This immigrant also knows how to spell 'whether'. you can coast from stats to stats offered from differing outlets, most will present entirely differing ‘facts and figures’.For example the students entering the U.K. mentioned earlier, no mention of family members accompany of students and wether that was included or not in the stats presented. We do know that family members are now restricted to overseas students. Another slip? I think not.
Never mind your argument your lack of basic English grammar is pointing to a limited education. Which explains quite a lot.
https://yougov.co.uk/politics/articles/48476-how-i...
cheesejunkie said:
I'd also love to know what traditional conservative values they're representing that the Conservative Party aren't. I'm guessing I know the answer but it's interesting to hear people state it.
You're going to find, if you find anything at all from our honest correspondents, that 'Traditional Conservative values' is a handily nebulous shape shifter of an entity deployed to service whatever the particular Reformite in question believes.One only has to look at the Brexit whirlygig to see this. Brexit in practical terms was so ill defined that it has served as a helpful slippery pass the parcel exercise ever since. The economy has tanked - well it was about sovereignty. You always had sovereignty, well it was about making our own decisions. We always did that anyway, well trade deals etc.etc. ad infinitum, since the glaring truth - that it was always a terrible idea can never, ever, under any circumstances be countenanced. And we're back to superannuated gimmers & their perma entrenchment.
bad company said:
cheesejunkie said:
So people can be dheads at any age, it's a fair country in that regard.
What are reform offering?
Who are they appealing to?
What does anyone voting for them expect to achieve?
It isn't those younger people with so called breathtaking arrogance voting for them.
Yes dheads at any age, it's a fair country in that regard.What are reform offering?
Who are they appealing to?
What does anyone voting for them expect to achieve?
It isn't those younger people with so called breathtaking arrogance voting for them.
heads at any age and some here on PH.I see Reform attracting votes from disaffected voters from both of the main parties. For my part I’m hoping that Reform will influence the Conservatives to return to conservative policies and values. Also I’m particularly dissatisfied with my conservative MP and will not vote for him.
President Merkin said:
cheesejunkie said:
I'd also love to know what traditional conservative values they're representing that the Conservative Party aren't. I'm guessing I know the answer but it's interesting to hear people state it.
You're going to find, if you find anything at all from our honest correspondents, that 'Traditional Conservative values' is a handily nebulous shape shifter of an entity deployed to service whatever the particular Reformite in question believes.One only has to look at the Brexit whirlygig to see this. Brexit in practical terms was so ill defined that it has served as a helpful slippery pass the parcel exercise ever since. The economy has tanked - well it was about sovereignty. You always had sovereignty, well it was about making our own decisions. We always did that anyway, well trade deals etc.etc. ad infinitum, since the glaring truth - that it was always a terrible idea can never, ever, under any circumstances be countenanced. And we're back to superannuated gimmers & their perma entrenchment.
Dave200 said:
But it's not disaffected voters from across the social spectrum. It's specifically disaffected voters from the over-50, and the over-60s and Leave voters is where it's really hurt the Tories. Making a mess of Brexit was the final straw for those older Leave voters, and it's cost the Tories a huge chunk of their base. Only around 1-in-10 under 40s would vote Reform, where they are behind the Greens and on par with the Lib Dems.
I agree that the Tories have failed to take advantage of Brexit which will inevitably cost them votes. To be honest I wouldn’t be surprised if less than 1-in-10 under 40s would vote Reform but that won’t stop me voting for them.The conservatives have made a mess of Brexit and the economy. The Labour Party have a track record of high tax, spending and pandering to the unions. I have nobody else to vote for so for me it’s Reform in the hope they’re influence may ‘reform’ the Conservative Party.
Dave200 said:
Tell it like it is. Immigration controls were the biggest reason for people voting Leave, and Reform know this hence their paper-thin policies to basically close our borders. https://ukandeu.ac.uk/wp-content/uploads/2018/07/C...
It's pretty much the same lot that promised undeliverable unicorns during the leave campaign are now promising the same for Reform.What's that line about those who continually vote for the same old stuff expecting things to be magically different?
bad company said:
Dave200 said:
But it's not disaffected voters from across the social spectrum. It's specifically disaffected voters from the over-50, and the over-60s and Leave voters is where it's really hurt the Tories. Making a mess of Brexit was the final straw for those older Leave voters, and it's cost the Tories a huge chunk of their base. Only around 1-in-10 under 40s would vote Reform, where they are behind the Greens and on par with the Lib Dems.
I agree that the Tories have failed to take advantage of Brexit which will inevitably cost them votes. To be honest I wouldn’t be surprised if less than 1-in-10 under 40s would vote Reform but that won’t stop me voting for them.The conservatives have made a mess of Brexit and the economy. The Labour Party have a track record of high tax, spending and pandering to the unions. I have nobody else to vote for so for me it’s Reform in the hope they’re influence may ‘reform’ the Conservative Party.
Dave200 said:
Does it not worry you to be so badly out of sync with what the majority of the country are voting for? Does it not make you question your motivations when the majority of under-50s would be more likely to vote for Labour than ANY of the other parties?
Not convinced they think they're out of touch I think they think it's everyone else.There's an interesting stat I saw that not only are Conservative voters getting older to the point they're literally a dying breed but they aren't being replaced because as people get older they simply don't seem to be getting more conservative.
bad company said:
Dave200 said:
But it's not disaffected voters from across the social spectrum. It's specifically disaffected voters from the over-50, and the over-60s and Leave voters is where it's really hurt the Tories. Making a mess of Brexit was the final straw for those older Leave voters, and it's cost the Tories a huge chunk of their base. Only around 1-in-10 under 40s would vote Reform, where they are behind the Greens and on par with the Lib Dems.
I agree that the Tories have failed to take advantage of Brexit which will inevitably cost them votes. To be honest I wouldn’t be surprised if less than 1-in-10 under 40s would vote Reform but that won’t stop me voting for them.The conservatives have made a mess of Brexit and the economy. The Labour Party have a track record of high tax, spending and pandering to the unions. I have nobody else to vote for so for me it’s Reform in the hope they’re influence may ‘reform’ the Conservative Party.
Dave200 said:
Does it not worry you to be so badly out of sync with what the majority of the country are voting for? Does it not make you question your motivations when the majority of under-50s would be more likely to vote for Labour than ANY of the other parties?
What worries me is the inevitability of Labour getting into power. A lot of those Labour voters aren’t old enough to remember the carnage from their previous periods in office.The simplest way to avoid Labour getting into power would have been quiet competent government.
Instead we had Brexit Johnson and Truss and criminality and utterly bent behaviour from a government who seem to take delight in punching down on every group of society imaginable, except oddly enough pensioners, can't think why that might be.
Funny thing is the people who cheered the loudest whilst they did all of that don't seem to have the self-awareness to realise why there would appear to be something close to an exorcism predicted come the General Election.
They think the problem is the Conservatives aren't far enough to the right.
Instead we had Brexit Johnson and Truss and criminality and utterly bent behaviour from a government who seem to take delight in punching down on every group of society imaginable, except oddly enough pensioners, can't think why that might be.
Funny thing is the people who cheered the loudest whilst they did all of that don't seem to have the self-awareness to realise why there would appear to be something close to an exorcism predicted come the General Election.
They think the problem is the Conservatives aren't far enough to the right.
bad company said:
What worries me is the inevitability of Labour getting into power. A lot of those Labour voters aren’t old enough to remember the carnage from their previous periods in office.
You need to look outside your bias bubble. Everything is worse now and we pay far more for it.bad company said:
Dave200 said:
Does it not worry you to be so badly out of sync with what the majority of the country are voting for? Does it not make you question your motivations when the majority of under-50s would be more likely to vote for Labour than ANY of the other parties?
What worries me is the inevitability of Labour getting into power. A lot of those Labour voters aren’t old enough to remember the carnage from their previous periods in office.chrispmartha said:
They’re old enough to have lived through the carnage of the last 14 years though aren’t they.
I wouldn’t say it’s been 14 years of carnage. For me the damage started when BoJo became PM, he was and is a disaster but he did at least get Brexit done.Not many will agree but I liked Liz Truss’s policies. She had the right idea but tried to do too much too quickly.
You see what I mean about the shapeshifting? According to this guy, Labour voters are sweet summer children, with mother's milk on their lips.
Yet, this guy says they're one foot in the grave never learn fools.
Another slip? I think not.
Never mind your argument your lack of basic English grammar is pointing to a limited education. Which explains quite a lot.It's exactly what I was saying a few pages ago, Reform appeals to older, less well-educated folks.What, You mean labour supporters?The boys in here are if nothing else, a microcosm of 2024 Tory, more splits than a pair of Primark jeggings.
bad company said:
Dave200 said:
Does it not worry you to be so badly out of sync with what the majority of the country are voting for? Does it not make you question your motivations when the majority of under-50s would be more likely to vote for Labour than ANY of the other parties?
What worries me is the inevitability of Labour getting into power. A lot of those Labour voters aren’t old enough to remember the carnage from their previous periods in office.Pan Pan Pan said:
Dave200 said:
Jordie Barretts sock said:
crankedup5 said:
A few posters you can coast from stats to stats offered from differing outlets, most will present entirely differing ‘facts and figures’.For example the students entering the U.K. mentioned earlier, no mention of family members accompany of students and wether that was included or not in the stats presented. We do know that family members are now restricted to overseas students.
Oh dear. This immigrant also knows how to spell 'whether'. you can coast from stats to stats offered from differing outlets, most will present entirely differing ‘facts and figures’.For example the students entering the U.K. mentioned earlier, no mention of family members accompany of students and wether that was included or not in the stats presented. We do know that family members are now restricted to overseas students. Another slip? I think not.
Never mind your argument your lack of basic English grammar is pointing to a limited education. Which explains quite a lot.
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