Dodgy Toyota accelerator death
Discussion
no one else think this whole story sounds a bit fishy? all due respect to the dead/innocent but an advanced driver (CHP) can't slow a runaway car but they do manage to call 911 and get a recording of the ordeal? modern brakes can slow any FWD/4WD car to a halt on the brakes (dont try it you'll trash the torque converter). very weird or incredibly unlucky series of mechanical problems.
fbrs said:
no one else think this whole story sounds a bit fishy? all due respect to the dead/innocent but an advanced driver (CHP) can't slow a runaway car but they do manage to call 911 and get a recording of the ordeal? modern brakes can slow any FWD/4WD car to a halt on the brakes (dont try it you'll trash the torque converter). very weird or incredibly unlucky series of mechanical problems.
Yeah, you are right, because a guy really did want to die and kill his family in the process so a keyboard warrior could start thinking up some sort of conspiracy.Cmon, Real World is out there. Step away from the keyboard. Engage with reality.
tinman0 said:
fbrs said:
no one else think this whole story sounds a bit fishy? all due respect to the dead/innocent but an advanced driver (CHP) can't slow a runaway car but they do manage to call 911 and get a recording of the ordeal? modern brakes can slow any FWD/4WD car to a halt on the brakes (dont try it you'll trash the torque converter). very weird or incredibly unlucky series of mechanical problems.
Yeah, you are right, because a guy really did want to die and kill his family in the process so a keyboard warrior could start thinking up some sort of conspiracy.Cmon, Real World is out there. Step away from the keyboard. Engage with reality.
there are a lot of people who really dont give a **** about their family's safety. You just have to watch police programmes to see them
ctallchris said:
would you intentionally crash your car at 50 mph for £1,000,000?
there are a lot of people who really dont give a **** about their family's safety. You just have to watch police programmes to see them
Would you intentionally crash a car at over 125? I wouldn't.there are a lot of people who really dont give a **** about their family's safety. You just have to watch police programmes to see them
And you can watch all the Police programmes you want where people put the lives of their family in danger, and they mostly conform to a single definition: pikey
This was a middle aged suburban couple, Mr and Mrs Average. Not Mr "I could get a million buck if I crash this car at 125mph with my family in it" Average.
fbrs said:
no one else think this whole story sounds a bit fishy? all due respect to the dead/innocent but an advanced driver (CHP) can't slow a runaway car but they do manage to call 911 and get a recording of the ordeal? modern brakes can slow any FWD/4WD car to a halt on the brakes (dont try it you'll trash the torque converter). very weird or incredibly unlucky series of mechanical problems.
As I've already explained, when it happens for real (when you're behind the wheel, not the keyboard) they can't.tinman0 said:
fbrs said:
no one else think this whole story sounds a bit fishy? all due respect to the dead/innocent but an advanced driver (CHP) can't slow a runaway car but they do manage to call 911 and get a recording of the ordeal? modern brakes can slow any FWD/4WD car to a halt on the brakes (dont try it you'll trash the torque converter). very weird or incredibly unlucky series of mechanical problems.
Yeah, you are right, because a guy really did want to die and kill his family in the process so a keyboard warrior could start thinking up some sort of conspiracy.Cmon, Real World is out there. Step away from the keyboard. Engage with reality.
try reading my post and disengaging the emotion for a second. what do you actually disagree with? firstly i know you can slow a WOT auto on the brakes ive done it and chrysler has the destroyed torque converters to prove it. secondly i said "or incredibly unlucky series of mechanical problems"; i take it you think this is what happened? jammed throttle AND faulty brakes? on a 2009 lexus? quite what my post has with anyone dying is beyond me. the tragic result was not the cause or even relevant! personally i'd like to know the cause. did you cry when diana died ?
attempted scam gone horribly wrong as suggested above, possibly, here's another scenario; jammed throttle, push button start/no key so can't turn off ignition, electromechanical lock keeps drive engaged at speed (never heard of this but maybe), ABS/TC/ESP gets confused and releases the brakes (maybe). i havent seen this as a theory but its more worrying than anything else ive read. (this guy was vetran CHP, i can't think of a person more qualified to deal with a stressful driving situation, he's not gonna ride the brakes till he loses them like your average muppet might)
its a sad tale for sure but calm down with your keyboard warrior/"won't someone think of the children" drivel.
Edited by fbrs on Friday 5th February 21:45
fbrs said:
tinman0 said:
fbrs said:
no one else think this whole story sounds a bit fishy? all due respect to the dead/innocent but an advanced driver (CHP) can't slow a runaway car but they do manage to call 911 and get a recording of the ordeal? modern brakes can slow any FWD/4WD car to a halt on the brakes (dont try it you'll trash the torque converter). very weird or incredibly unlucky series of mechanical problems.
Yeah, you are right, because a guy really did want to die and kill his family in the process so a keyboard warrior could start thinking up some sort of conspiracy.Cmon, Real World is out there. Step away from the keyboard. Engage with reality.
try reading my post and disengaging the emotion for a second. what do you actually disagree with? firstly i know you can slow a WOT auto on the brakes ive done it and chrysler has the destroyed torque converters to prove it. secondly i said "or incredibly unlucky series of mechanical problems"; i take it you think this is what happened? jammed throttle AND faulty brakes? on a 2009 lexus? quite what my post has with anyone dying is beyond me. the end result was not the cause! personally i'd like to know the cause. did you cry when diana died ?
attempted scam gone horribly wrong as suggested above, possibly, here's another scenario; jammed throttle, push button start/no key so can't turn off ignition, electromechanical lock keeps drive engaged at speed (never heard of this but maybe), ABS/TC/ESP gets confused and releases the brakes (maybe). i havent seen this as a theory but its more worrying than anything else ive read. (this guy was vetran CHP, i can't think of a person more qualified to deal with the situation, he's not gonna ride the brakes till he loses them like your average muppet might)
its a sad tale for sure but calm down with your keyboard warrior/won't someone think of the children drivel.
The moment you scrub any speed off the car - what is the autobox going to do? It's going to kick down. Everytime you slow the car, it will kick down more gears. I have no doubt that if i was in that situation, my 300bhp on my Toyota engine is going to win the argument with the brakes.
This isn't about "thinking of the children" either. Someone died and all that some posters on PH can do is post from their armchairs of all the possible options available to them, which is distasteful at its best.
And as for Diana - lets remember that the person wearing the seatbelt lived. Couldn't care less that she died frankly as I never knew her. But her, Dodi and the drunk driver are testament to seatbelts saving lives. Maybe if she had a seatbelt, her aorta wouldn't have been ripped from her heart during the accident.
tinman0 said:
fbrs said:
tinman0 said:
fbrs said:
no one else think this whole story sounds a bit fishy? all due respect to the dead/innocent but an advanced driver (CHP) can't slow a runaway car but they do manage to call 911 and get a recording of the ordeal? modern brakes can slow any FWD/4WD car to a halt on the brakes (dont try it you'll trash the torque converter). very weird or incredibly unlucky series of mechanical problems.
Yeah, you are right, because a guy really did want to die and kill his family in the process so a keyboard warrior could start thinking up some sort of conspiracy.Cmon, Real World is out there. Step away from the keyboard. Engage with reality.
try reading my post and disengaging the emotion for a second. what do you actually disagree with? firstly i know you can slow a WOT auto on the brakes ive done it and chrysler has the destroyed torque converters to prove it. secondly i said "or incredibly unlucky series of mechanical problems"; i take it you think this is what happened? jammed throttle AND faulty brakes? on a 2009 lexus? quite what my post has with anyone dying is beyond me. the end result was not the cause! personally i'd like to know the cause. did you cry when diana died ?
attempted scam gone horribly wrong as suggested above, possibly, here's another scenario; jammed throttle, push button start/no key so can't turn off ignition, electromechanical lock keeps drive engaged at speed (never heard of this but maybe), ABS/TC/ESP gets confused and releases the brakes (maybe). i havent seen this as a theory but its more worrying than anything else ive read. (this guy was vetran CHP, i can't think of a person more qualified to deal with the situation, he's not gonna ride the brakes till he loses them like your average muppet might)
its a sad tale for sure but calm down with your keyboard warrior/won't someone think of the children drivel.
The moment you scrub any speed off the car - what is the autobox going to do? It's going to kick down. Everytime you slow the car, it will kick down more gears. I have no doubt that if i was in that situation, my 300bhp on my Toyota engine is going to win the argument with the brakes.
This isn't about "thinking of the children" either. Someone died and all that some posters on PH can do is post from their armchairs of all the possible options available to them, which is distasteful at its best.
And as for Diana - lets remember that the person wearing the seatbelt lived. Couldn't care less that she died frankly as I never knew her. But her, Dodi and the drunk driver are testament to seatbelts saving lives. Maybe if she had a seatbelt, her aorta wouldn't have been ripped from her heart during the accident.
If you are driving an automatic and the throttle sticks, put it in neutral and use the brakes! Simples!
Edited by Poledriver on Friday 5th February 23:51
Poledriver said:
REVELATION! Dodi didn't die!
If you are driving an automatic and the throttle sticks, put it in neutral and use the brakes! Simples!
I've no idea what you mean by Dodi didn't die.If you are driving an automatic and the throttle sticks, put it in neutral and use the brakes! Simples!
As for the moving the vehicle into neutral, I have no idea why they didn't, and I'm not about to try it out on ours.
tinman0 said:
Poledriver said:
REVELATION! Dodi didn't die!
If you are driving an automatic and the throttle sticks, put it in neutral and use the brakes! Simples!
I've no idea what you mean by Dodi didn't die.If you are driving an automatic and the throttle sticks, put it in neutral and use the brakes! Simples!
As for the moving the vehicle into neutral, I have no idea why they didn't, and I'm not about to try it out on ours.
tinman0 said:
And as for Diana - lets remember that the person wearing the seatbelt lived. Couldn't care less that she died frankly as I never knew her. But her, Dodi and the drunk driver are testament to seatbelts saving lives. Maybe if she had a seatbelt, her aorta wouldn't have been ripped from her heart during the accident.
It looks like you're saying that Diana was the only one who died!tinman0 said:
hornetrider said:
On DBW cars the application of the brake overrides the input from the accelerator. Did in my old VAG disel anyway.
Doesn't on our Toyota. Nor my Fiat. Nor any of our Fords. Nor the Smart.Just wondering why Bosch/VAG stuff have a brake override but others don't - or is it controlled through some other mechanism?
Edited by fido on Saturday 6th February 00:15
fido said:
tinman0 said:
hornetrider said:
On DBW cars the application of the brake overrides the input from the accelerator. Did in my old VAG disel anyway.
Doesn't on our Toyota. Nor my Fiat. Nor any of our Fords. Nor the Smart.Just wondering why Bosch/VAG stuff have a brake override but others don't - or is it controlled through some other mechanism?
Edited by fido on Saturday 6th February 00:15
porsche 911 0-100 9.4 seconds
porsche 911 100-0 4.3 seconds
given a veyron thakes 5/7 seconds to do this sprint i think it's safe to say this shows brakes are more powerful than engine so as long as you apply the brakes hard you should come to a stop.
unless of course you drove down the road thinking hmm my accelerator seems to be sticking. I know i'll countract that by lightly holding the brake thus solving the problem once and for all.
Poledriver said:
tinman0 said:
And as for Diana - lets remember that the person wearing the seatbelt lived. Couldn't care less that she died frankly as I never knew her. But her, Dodi and the drunk driver are testament to seatbelts saving lives. Maybe if she had a seatbelt, her aorta wouldn't have been ripped from her heart during the accident.
It looks like you're saying that Diana was the only one who died!None of them were wearing seatbelts. They all died. The guy wearing his seatbelt (the body guard) who caught a concrete post in his face lived through it, albeit with horrible injuries.
Back to the 4 that died in the Lexus in the US, i have no wish to bring into question the intellect of the Driver or passengers of the Lexus!
Only that He was a Law enforcement officer (copper) of 20 yrs or more & had a very good mechanical apptitude (responsible for maintaining a variety of vehicles!) Does seem odd he had the presence of mind (or a passenger did) to phone the police to discuss his situation! there was a Policeman at the wheel!!!!
Worth noting that the Lexus was not his vehicle, it appears it was a rental vehicle or borrowed, so he may not of been familiar with the controls! Although there can't be many Americans who do not know the functions of an auto' box!
R.I.P
Only that He was a Law enforcement officer (copper) of 20 yrs or more & had a very good mechanical apptitude (responsible for maintaining a variety of vehicles!) Does seem odd he had the presence of mind (or a passenger did) to phone the police to discuss his situation! there was a Policeman at the wheel!!!!
Worth noting that the Lexus was not his vehicle, it appears it was a rental vehicle or borrowed, so he may not of been familiar with the controls! Although there can't be many Americans who do not know the functions of an auto' box!
R.I.P
hornetrider said:
jeff m said:
Switchng off the engine using the key is actually a very bad option...steering lock is applied...as a yooth I did this at parking speed and got a gouged rim courtesy of a kerb
Travelling at usual driving speeds would be pretty scary at best.
Brakes, nuetral, the engine will rev to it's limit but far safer.
Steering lock is only applied if the key is removed from the ignition - not if its simply switched off... I think?!Travelling at usual driving speeds would be pretty scary at best.
Brakes, nuetral, the engine will rev to it's limit but far safer.
Key position I- Run, engines runs and electrical accessories enabled, steering unlocked.
Key position O- Off, turns off engine and accessories, locks steering wheel in vehicles equiped.
Key position ACC- Accessory, allows most electrical accessories to be turned on, steering locked if equiped.
Edited by Trooper2 on Saturday 6th February 04:22
Trooper2 said:
hornetrider said:
jeff m said:
Switchng off the engine using the key is actually a very bad option...steering lock is applied...as a yooth I did this at parking speed and got a gouged rim courtesy of a kerb
Travelling at usual driving speeds would be pretty scary at best.
Brakes, nuetral, the engine will rev to it's limit but far safer.
Steering lock is only applied if the key is removed from the ignition - not if its simply switched off... I think?!Travelling at usual driving speeds would be pretty scary at best.
Brakes, nuetral, the engine will rev to it's limit but far safer.
Key position I- Run, engines runs and electrical accessories enabled, steering unlocked.
Key position O- Off, turns off engine and accessories, locks steering wheel in vehicles equiped.
Key position ACC- Accessory, allows most electrical accessories to be turned on, steering locked if equiped.
Edited by Trooper2 on Saturday 6th February 04:22
GavinPearson said:
Trooper2 said:
hornetrider said:
jeff m said:
Switchng off the engine using the key is actually a very bad option...steering lock is applied...as a yooth I did this at parking speed and got a gouged rim courtesy of a kerb
Travelling at usual driving speeds would be pretty scary at best.
Brakes, nuetral, the engine will rev to it's limit but far safer.
Steering lock is only applied if the key is removed from the ignition - not if its simply switched off... I think?!Travelling at usual driving speeds would be pretty scary at best.
Brakes, nuetral, the engine will rev to it's limit but far safer.
Key position I- Run, engines runs and electrical accessories enabled, steering unlocked.
Key position O- Off, turns off engine and accessories, locks steering wheel in vehicles equiped.
Key position ACC- Accessory, allows most electrical accessories to be turned on, steering locked if equiped.
Edited by Trooper2 on Saturday 6th February 04:22
All I've got to do are warranties, recalls and cars that helpline/field service engineers are clueless with, maybe if I could afford to eat, my responces to posts would be more to the point! ...
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