Ken Clark - Prison doesn't work
Discussion
The real key must lay with turning around bad behaviour at an early age. Time and time again we read of youngsters turning up before the courts with records as long as your arm. It seems to me that we do these young pople a sustancial disservice by not coming down harder on young offenders. They become so immune to being nicked that by the time they are adult they know nothing else. By then their lives are ruined and society as a whole has to pay the price both in prison costs and in petty and violent crime.
The illegal drugs issue also needs to be looked at maturely.
Sort out this problem and you sort out the prison overcrowding problem and cut crime dramatically.
It's time we looked at legalising some of the class B and C drugs and downgrading things like ecstasy.
Abolish jail sentences for possession and add resources to tackling the dealers.
Sort out this problem and you sort out the prison overcrowding problem and cut crime dramatically.
It's time we looked at legalising some of the class B and C drugs and downgrading things like ecstasy.
Abolish jail sentences for possession and add resources to tackling the dealers.
Yes what he said.fbrs said:
legalise drugs. job done
In the US the state of California is broke and is all of suddenly looking at legalizing drugs. Couldn't be down to the need for another revenue stream could it???(Reuters) - A California voter initiative that would legalize possession and sale of marijuana has qualified for the November ballot, state election officials said on Wednesday, in what supporters called a "watershed moment" for their cause.
Passage of the measure, by no means certain, would make California the first U.S. state to legalize marijuana. Backers believe the state could be at the vanguard of a national movement toward decriminalizing the drug.
"This is a watershed moment in the decades-long struggle to end marijuana prohibition in this country," said Stephen Gutwillig, California director of the Drug Policy Alliance, which has spearheaded the ballot initiative.
"Banning marijuana outright has been a disaster, fueling a massive, increasingly brutal underground economy, wasting billions in scarce law enforcement resources and making criminals out of countless law-abiding citizens," he said.
California Secretary of State Debra Bowen said in a written statement that her office had certified the measure for the November 2 general election ballot after backers submitted the required number of signatures on petitions.
Bowen said that proponents, who needed 433,971 valid signatures to qualify for the ballot, had submitted 694,248 that were verified through a random sampling.
Legalizing marijuana appears to have broad support in the state, with some 56 percent of Californians surveyed in an April, 2009 Field Poll saying they favored making it legal for social use and taxing the sales proceeds.
In October, Gallup found 44 percent of Americans favored legalization.
Activists have suggested that taxing marijuana sales could help bail out the cash-strapped state, but plenty of Californians still oppose marijuana.
I am failing to see a sea-change in attitude between the previous element of our useless political classes that was in charge and the current bunch apart from a slightly p1ss-yellow shade of blue instead of a s
t-brown shade of red. These politicians just don't get it - they're in hock to the liberal trendy chattering classes and the legions of lawyers and judges with too many points to prove and a huge fee to charge. If the rehabilitation side of prison doesn't work, MAKE IT WORK, because the other elements of prison DO work to a degree - there is an element of punishment (though feeble by the standards of any generally law-abiding citizen who doesn;t have a human-rights lawyer AND criminal barrister on speed-dial) and more importantly it stops them making more of us victims of crime while they're banged up... (they can and do reoffend within prison as well but that can be dealt with in due course).
As for saving money - false economy as these other non-custodial methods of punishment and rehabilitation will largely involve people pretending - both the criminals and the people supervising. Then we'll get even more reoffending plus a load of other bills in the post. Just make prisons cheaper and get the beggars doing something to earn their keep - and also there is an urgent need for IED-clearance in Afghanistan - offenders won't need expensive equipment and training, just transportation.
t-brown shade of red. These politicians just don't get it - they're in hock to the liberal trendy chattering classes and the legions of lawyers and judges with too many points to prove and a huge fee to charge. If the rehabilitation side of prison doesn't work, MAKE IT WORK, because the other elements of prison DO work to a degree - there is an element of punishment (though feeble by the standards of any generally law-abiding citizen who doesn;t have a human-rights lawyer AND criminal barrister on speed-dial) and more importantly it stops them making more of us victims of crime while they're banged up... (they can and do reoffend within prison as well but that can be dealt with in due course). As for saving money - false economy as these other non-custodial methods of punishment and rehabilitation will largely involve people pretending - both the criminals and the people supervising. Then we'll get even more reoffending plus a load of other bills in the post. Just make prisons cheaper and get the beggars doing something to earn their keep - and also there is an urgent need for IED-clearance in Afghanistan - offenders won't need expensive equipment and training, just transportation.
Somewhatfoolish said:
The vast majority of crimes are committed by young men and essentially there is nothing you can do about it, other than kill them (hence low crime rates after wars).
You can kill them. Simply stop incentivising young, poor women to breed. Remove the welfare state and you'll see far less single mothers about.
Fittster said:
Somewhatfoolish said:
The vast majority of crimes are committed by young men and essentially there is nothing you can do about it, other than kill them (hence low crime rates after wars).
You can kill them. Simply stop incentivising young, poor women to breed. Remove the welfare state and you'll see far less single mothers about.
Some people on here are trully confused , tell me how many people you heard of that have been jailed for a small quantity of heroin , cocaine or canabis ?
Tell me please , how many people get robbed for a ten-bag each day ? You lot who say drugs should be legalised are trully messed in the hair !
Now it seems this gov is worse than the previous , it seems they have no plan for anything ( besides cutting money and jobs ) that is
Tell me please , how many people get robbed for a ten-bag each day ? You lot who say drugs should be legalised are trully messed in the hair !
Now it seems this gov is worse than the previous , it seems they have no plan for anything ( besides cutting money and jobs ) that is
frosted said:
Some people on here are trully confused , tell me how many people you heard of that have been jailed for a small quantity of heroin , cocaine or canabis ?
Tell me please , how many people get robbed for a ten-bag each day ? You lot who say drugs should be legalised are trully messed in the hair !
Now it seems this gov is worse than the previous , it seems they have no plan for anything ( besides cutting money and jobs ) that is
I'd refer to this thread which is definitely a robbing little sTell me please , how many people get robbed for a ten-bag each day ? You lot who say drugs should be legalised are trully messed in the hair !
Now it seems this gov is worse than the previous , it seems they have no plan for anything ( besides cutting money and jobs ) that is
t in search of cash for a daily fix. A well known offender, all "petty" crimes, and someone definitely in need of "rehabilitation".dandarez said:
Some of his comments were sound.
But the problem is not that prisons don't work, it's also that our prisons are no longer 'prisons', they are more like 'hotels'!
Take the multiple Essex boys killer who was awarded over 40 grand cos he suffered toothache during his stretch. 40k! That's a pools win to many.
No, it's 'us' on the outside, who in reality, are in prison!
We do all the graft and get little reward.
I have posted this in other threads. the problem is like someone else said money. Pure and simple. But the problem is not that prisons don't work, it's also that our prisons are no longer 'prisons', they are more like 'hotels'!
Take the multiple Essex boys killer who was awarded over 40 grand cos he suffered toothache during his stretch. 40k! That's a pools win to many.
No, it's 'us' on the outside, who in reality, are in prison!
We do all the graft and get little reward.
Edited by dandarez on Wednesday 30th June 10:25
There are lots of plans in place to reduce the prison service bill.
I can tell you that almost every prison apparently pays a fine very year for breach of health and safety or was it eu law?? regarding a certain item within prisons.
There are fewer and fewer prison officers much like with the police.Only way to keep the prisons functioning is to keep the inmates happy so they cooperate and not kick off.
You cant stop people from commiting criminal acts but you can try correct their behaviour which prison staff admirably attempt to do but with very limited resources.
Personally was very dissapointed at the lack of support for the prison service from the new government
frosted said:
Tell me please , how many people get robbed for a ten-bag each day ? You lot who say drugs should be legalised are trully messed in the hair !
thats the point exactly. drugs are expensive because they are illegal. the fact that they are illegal deters no one from using them or many from selling them. so make them legal. price drops, quality goes up and junkies dont have to rob everyone to pay for it, st just give it to them.I'm not convinced it will do anything to stop the types who end up in prison, as let's face it's very easy to have a smack/coke habit and not be a degenerate junkie. The latter is a lifestyle choice that is unlikely to end with drug legalisation.
The reason drugs should be legalised is that one should have the right to put what one wants in ones body. Simple as that.
The reason drugs should be legalised is that one should have the right to put what one wants in ones body. Simple as that.
The real Apache said:
Somewhatfoolish said:
The reason drugs should be legalised is that one should have the right to put what one wants in ones body. Simple as that.
you could legalise prostetution on that principle.....2 birds with 1 stone!But yes, I agree that brothels etc should be legal. Of course they should, common bloody sense frankly. Feminists' fault it isn't I think.
The real Apache said:
Somewhatfoolish said:
The reason drugs should be legalised is that one should have the right to put what one wants in ones body. Simple as that.
you could legalise prostetution on that principle.....2 birds with 1 stone!
Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff