Crypto Currency Thread
Discussion
NRS said:
Why does that need Bitcoin?
There are some insurance related smart contracts already live like AXA fizzy. The big selling point is that the insurer cannot cancel the deal so it needs to be visibly immutable, private automation doesn't achieve that. Not sure Fizzy does either as I have a feeling it's on a private chain! Insurers will go where the income is, if one started offering a smart contract and it took off then the others would follow. There are some live flight insurance contracts on the Ethereum chain, although none are holding much money: https://etherscan.io/contractsVerified?cn=flight
Contrary to my earlier position I'm not really sold on smart contracts, although things like open zeppelin are interesting ways to resolve the coding errors/issues. I'm not sure I see value in a smart contract that needs an external Oracle (like insurance ones), seems like it's just centralising at a different point so you've got all the constraints of blockchain but still a massive vulnerability in the middle. Probably limits usefulness of SC to functions directly relating to the blockchain itself like multi-sig wallets.
p1stonhead said:
Is anyone here who holds crypto actively spending it in various ways? Or is it still being hoarded for value gains only?
Bitmain only offered their miners for sale using BCH for a long period. So I had to pay using BCH to buy those.I've also paid/received BCH/BTC/Eth from friends for fiat money owed.
SCAN - a brilliant online computer parts shop offers payment in BTC, I've paid them that way a few times.
Other than that. I'm hodling.
The problem for BTC is you have on one hand it will be used for micropayments on the lightening network, so they only real way on utilising it would be for funded channels to always be open, other ways just won't work. This then means it becomes centralised something that BTC is not supposed to be.
Then you have the limited supply issue along with borders that means BTC in actual circulation is very small and therefore extremely prone to hyper inflation. Without centrilastion BTC will always struggle for mass adoption.
Then you have the limited supply issue along with borders that means BTC in actual circulation is very small and therefore extremely prone to hyper inflation. Without centrilastion BTC will always struggle for mass adoption.
p1stonhead said:
Is anyone here who holds crypto actively spending it in various ways? Or is it still being hoarded for value gains only?
I've spent enough over the years to have some excellent Bitcoin pizza-style regrets. Merchant adoption is contracting though so it's harder to spend than it was. That's mainly down to Coinbase's payment processing system changing to make their merchants handle their own private keys and very few can be bothered with that, and Bitpay, the other main player, doing their very best to make Bitcoin unattractive to spend with unnecessary fees and scaremongering and the insistence on using only certain wallets.
Retail is a sideshow and I expect it dwindle further. It just doesn't add up unless you're already in crypto and looking to spend your free money.
Thesprucegoose said:
The problem for BTC is you have on one hand it will be used for micropayments on the lightening network, so they only real way on utilising it would be for funded channels to always be open, other ways just won't work. This then means it becomes centralised something that BTC is not supposed to be.
Then you have the limited supply issue along with borders that means BTC in actual circulation is very small and therefore extremely prone to hyper inflation. Without centrilastion BTC will always struggle for mass adoption.
One connection to blockchain to get the funds, then billions of lightning transactions on the back of that. We could be talking about people being able to make free and instant transactions smaller than millisatoshis! All in a peer to peer network that doesn't clog up the blockchain.Then you have the limited supply issue along with borders that means BTC in actual circulation is very small and therefore extremely prone to hyper inflation. Without centrilastion BTC will always struggle for mass adoption.
What is centralised about that? What are you talking about?
Lightning network certainly has its issues to overcome, but I struggle to understand what problems you are highlighting and how you conclude that without centrilastion (sic) btc will struggle for mass adoption? What do you mean?
Thesprucegoose said:
The problem for BTC is you have on one hand it will be used for micropayments on the lightening network, so they only real way on utilising it would be for funded channels to always be open, other ways just won't work. This then means it becomes centralised something that BTC is not supposed to be.
Layers on Bitcoin can be far more centralised without negative impact on Bitcoin's underlying qualities in a similar way to the internet protocol being decentralised but many websites owned by companies & served from single locations. As it happens, if you look at a node map, Lightning is proving to be well decentralised anyway. There is no problem with funding channels on LN being always open.Thesprucegoose said:
Then you have the limited supply issue along with borders that means BTC in actual circulation is very small and therefore extremely prone to hyper inflation.
This is complete nonsense. It is over supply of a currency that creates hyper inflation, not limited supply. Hyperinflation starts when money is printed to pay for spending. As the money supply increases, prices rise.Bluedot said:
Mousem40 said:
SCAN - a brilliant online computer parts shop offers payment in BTC, I've paid them that way a few times.
.
Blimey, I'd forgotten all about SCAN, they've been around years and years, good to see they're still going..
Anyway, apologies for going O/T, as you were.
They are the best company I've ever dealt with! From start to finish their service excels and their prices are fantastic. I guess that's why they've been around so long and have a Royal Warrant.
I've just set up my first master nodes in the past week, pure speculation of course but they look promising.
I've got 2, one is Motion (XMN) and the other Moondex (MDEX). Motion is going well and I've earnt back around 10% of my stake already, and MDEX isn't listed anywhere yet so is a lot riskier, but the project looks to have potential.
Check out https://masternodes.pro if you might be interested.
As always DYOR as there are a lot of s
tcoins based around master nodes which don't appear to have any value and are just riding the hype train, HTRC for example looks completely hyped up with no useful product, even though the returns have been ridiculously high.
I've got 2, one is Motion (XMN) and the other Moondex (MDEX). Motion is going well and I've earnt back around 10% of my stake already, and MDEX isn't listed anywhere yet so is a lot riskier, but the project looks to have potential.
Check out https://masternodes.pro if you might be interested.
As always DYOR as there are a lot of s
tcoins based around master nodes which don't appear to have any value and are just riding the hype train, HTRC for example looks completely hyped up with no useful product, even though the returns have been ridiculously high.bloomen said:
I've spent enough over the years to have some excellent Bitcoin pizza-style regrets. Merchant adoption is contracting though so it's harder to spend than it was.
That's mainly down to Coinbase's payment processing system changing to make their merchants handle their own private keys and very few can be bothered with that, and Bitpay, the other main player, doing their very best to make Bitcoin unattractive to spend with unnecessary fees and scaremongering and the insistence on using only certain wallets.
Retail is a sideshow and I expect it dwindle further. It just doesn't add up unless you're already in crypto and looking to spend your free money.
So if it has no value as a spending mechanism, what do you see it being used for?! That's mainly down to Coinbase's payment processing system changing to make their merchants handle their own private keys and very few can be bothered with that, and Bitpay, the other main player, doing their very best to make Bitcoin unattractive to spend with unnecessary fees and scaremongering and the insistence on using only certain wallets.
Retail is a sideshow and I expect it dwindle further. It just doesn't add up unless you're already in crypto and looking to spend your free money.
dimots said:
Condi said:
How about we do a swop? Say today's price is $6700, in 6 months time whatever the price is we'll pay the difference. If it goes up, I'll pay you the extra, if it goes down, you pay me the difference?
Sure we can do that. See you in six months.or is it just a wild bet with a very crap risk to reward ratio?.. (you may want to put a stop loss on that bet.. either that or i hope you have a lambo to sell !)
crazy mofo.
dimots said:
I’m just trying to illuminate a simple example. Obviously the true micropayment grail is thing to thing electricity micro payments. Payments so small they cannot be managed by human systems. Bitcoin can handle that. Imagine the possibilities if you can.
Do you have Tourette’s, or did you actually mean to type the word “electricity”in there?Come on, this is not coherent English, let alone a coherent argument.
Behemoth said:
I know more than I care to about EOS, since a good friend is a Larimer belieber. Dan Larimer once got spurned by Satoshi in a forum. He then set about being better than Bitcoin & created Bitshares (then ran away), created Steem (then ran away). EOS is his latest idealistic & overcomplex project that seems to depend too much on good intentions.
By holding a token you get to vote for a validating node (called Block Producers), of which there are 21 to run the show. Problem is most token holders are speculators and couldn't care less who runs the nodes. And most of the rest are so up their own backsides with idealistically doing the right thing that they'll take forever and a day to decide who to vote for. Many candidates have appeared from nowhere and are difficult to scrutinise.
They solicited money for their ICO and will surely be in direct sight of the SEC. tl;dnr: too complex & idealistic to stand a chance of success. But they have raised $4bln
Good luck!
Cheers, Behemoth, for the advice - I only have $350 of them but they do seem pretty much doomed!By holding a token you get to vote for a validating node (called Block Producers), of which there are 21 to run the show. Problem is most token holders are speculators and couldn't care less who runs the nodes. And most of the rest are so up their own backsides with idealistically doing the right thing that they'll take forever and a day to decide who to vote for. Many candidates have appeared from nowhere and are difficult to scrutinise.
They solicited money for their ICO and will surely be in direct sight of the SEC. tl;dnr: too complex & idealistic to stand a chance of success. But they have raised $4bln
Good luck!the only thing i hate about Crypto is the 5 day wait for my SEPA transfer to go through from my bank to the exchange so i can buy it...
saw this earlier, overstock.com
"
We pay a processing fee for credit cards, and we employ about 40 people in our fraud department. That’s a cost of doing business with credit cards.
..
When we take cryptocurrency, we have a very small transaction fee with Coinbase, much smaller than our credit card processing fee, and we have no fraud prevention department. It’s like a cash transaction. For us, that is a much cheaper way of doing business.
"
http://bitcoinist.com/ex-overstock-chairman-prefer...
also saw the SEC announced BTC and ETH are not classed as securities
"The SEC Director says that while Bitcoin and Ethereum may have once been offered as securities, they behave and should be treated more like commodities similar to gold, corn, livestock, or oil."
saw this earlier, overstock.com
"
We pay a processing fee for credit cards, and we employ about 40 people in our fraud department. That’s a cost of doing business with credit cards.
..
When we take cryptocurrency, we have a very small transaction fee with Coinbase, much smaller than our credit card processing fee, and we have no fraud prevention department. It’s like a cash transaction. For us, that is a much cheaper way of doing business.
"
http://bitcoinist.com/ex-overstock-chairman-prefer...
also saw the SEC announced BTC and ETH are not classed as securities
"The SEC Director says that while Bitcoin and Ethereum may have once been offered as securities, they behave and should be treated more like commodities similar to gold, corn, livestock, or oil."
CryptoSuperDave said:
dimots said:
Condi said:
How about we do a swop? Say today's price is $6700, in 6 months time whatever the price is we'll pay the difference. If it goes up, I'll pay you the extra, if it goes down, you pay me the difference?
Sure we can do that. See you in six months.or is it just a wild bet with a very crap risk to reward ratio?.. (you may want to put a stop loss on that bet.. either that or i hope you have a lambo to sell !)
crazy mofo.
My logic is simply I believe it has no value, and that it is a bubble, hence I'd rather short than long. As for why I think that, too many reasons to list, but can be generally summed up by years of experience professionally watching and trading markets.
coyft said:
My logic so far, is that no one has given me a sound reason why anyone would use Bitcoin.
I'm actively searching for that reason, I'd like to take a punt, but I need to know it has some utility.
If you take the anti-thesis side of every one of these use cases, then you're half way to staying well clear. The other half will be in Part Two of this great summary: https://medium.com/@pierre_rochard/bitcoin-investm...I'm actively searching for that reason, I'd like to take a punt, but I need to know it has some utility.
It isn't important what Bitcoin is used for now. It's only relevant to consider what it might be used for in the future. That future is still being built & is most likely at least 10 years away, not 1 year away.
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