Crypto Currency Thread

Crypto Currency Thread

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Mousem40

1,667 posts

218 months

Wednesday 2nd January 2019
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wisbech said:
coyft said:
The US managed to pump almost $2 trillion into the economy without causing inflation.
Considerable asset inflation though.
And spread over 10 years, and that's the US, a much bigger country with much higher GDP and that was to avoid a global financial meltdown (read - massively deflationary pressures)

Condi

17,219 posts

172 months

Wednesday 2nd January 2019
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coyft said:
The US managed to pump almost $2 trillion into the economy without causing inflation.
Really?

So the massive increase in the US stock market and low yield of US treasury bonds has nothing to do with QE?

Of course it does. The fact that the consumer hasnt seen inflation is that wages have been depressed and the very shaky bedrock of the recovery post 2008 has not lead to increased consumer prices. Now, as a result of various policies, inflation is starting to rise. One of the very ironies about QE is that all the money being pumped into the economy has done little for the average Joe, but has vastly increased the wealth of those who already owned assets, and who arguably needed the support the least. (And yes, I know it was done to support the economy rather than the individual, but it has still led to a greater division of wealth which in the long run is not healthy).

bloomen

6,918 posts

160 months

Thursday 3rd January 2019
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Today is the 10th anniversary of Bitcoin's birth.

https://twitter.com/BitMEXResearch/status/10805904...

For a bit of software released to utter indifference by a no one from nowhere it's done rather well overall.

200Plus Club

10,773 posts

279 months

Thursday 3rd January 2019
quotequote all
bloomen said:
Today is the 10th anniversary of Bitcoin's birth.

https://twitter.com/BitMEXResearch/status/10805904...

For a bit of software released to utter indifference by a no one from nowhere it's done rather well overall.
In terms of what exactly?

Mousem40

1,667 posts

218 months

Thursday 3rd January 2019
quotequote all
coyft said:
Condi said:
Really?

So the massive increase in the US stock market and low yield of US treasury bonds has nothing to do with QE?

Of course it does. The fact that the consumer hasnt seen inflation is that wages have been depressed and the very shaky bedrock of the recovery post 2008 has not lead to increased consumer prices. Now, as a result of various policies, inflation is starting to rise. One of the very ironies about QE is that all the money being pumped into the economy has done little for the average Joe, but has vastly increased the wealth of those who already owned assets, and who arguably needed the support the least. (And yes, I know it was done to support the economy rather than the individual, but it has still led to a greater division of wealth which in the long run is not healthy).
The real irony is that Government’s could have issued it debt free.
Do you really think owning a money printing press and keeping it running ad infinitum has no negative repercussions? Have you single handedly solved the world's debt problems? If so, send me the link to the Nobel prize nominations for 2019 and I'll put in a good word for you.

dimots

3,093 posts

91 months

Thursday 3rd January 2019
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coyft said:
Money is purely a man made concept, it doesn’t cost anything to create, isn’t backed by anything, and is in limitless supply.

All money is issued as debt, so it can never be repaid anyway. Inflation is the mechanism which makes the debt sustainable. It can only be reset through default/bankruptcy. I’m suggesting there is an alternative which is to issue debt free money.
You are on the money here (see what I did there?) but in a capitalist state of continual growth the system works.

It is interesting to note also that the developed world's birth rate is falling, which brings into question how long capitalism is sustainable in its existing form and what our post or new capitalism might look like. Saifedean Ammous talks about this in some detail.

Thanks for being there when we most need you bitcoin biggrin

Edited by dimots on Thursday 3rd January 10:09

anonymous-user

55 months

Thursday 3rd January 2019
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coyft said:
Money is purely a man made concept
So is religion. Religion has been around for a very long time and there's no sign it's going to go out of fashion any time soon.

On the other hand crazy sects come and go on a regular basis, despite the advocacy of their most fervent evangelists.

bloomen

6,918 posts

160 months

Thursday 3rd January 2019
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200Plus Club said:
In terms of what exactly?
Getting people to froth at the mouth.

200Plus Club

10,773 posts

279 months

Thursday 3rd January 2019
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bloomen said:
Getting people to froth at the mouth.
That I agree with! Never has so much money been wasted by so many on so little lol

Condi

17,219 posts

172 months

Thursday 3rd January 2019
quotequote all
bloomen said:
Today is the 10th anniversary of Bitcoin's birth.

https://twitter.com/BitMEXResearch/status/10805904...

For a bit of software released to utter indifference by a no one from nowhere it's done rather well overall.
Its done very well.


In 20 or 30 years time academic papers will be written about how human psychology meant so many people bought into something they didnt have a hope of understanding. Were people desperate, or simply greedy? Was it an example of how weak humans are, that 'hope' rather than rational thought prevailed? Did people really take out debt in Sterling to buy, what exactly? What were they buying? A piece of computer code? Some made up numbers on a screen? Something someone literally just created for free, and sold for millions of dollars?


The psychology of trading, gambling and investing is a fascinating subject.

Some Gump

12,705 posts

187 months

Thursday 3rd January 2019
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Condi said:
The psychology of trading, gambling and investing is a fascinating subject.
Also game theory. Many a post referred to watching how it plays out.

Mousem40

1,667 posts

218 months

Thursday 3rd January 2019
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Condi said:
Its done very well.


In 20 or 30 years time academic papers will be written about how human psychology meant so many people bought into something they didnt have a hope of understanding. Were people desperate, or simply greedy? Was it an example of how weak humans are, that 'hope' rather than rational thought prevailed? Did people really take out debt in Sterling to buy, what exactly? What were they buying? A piece of computer code? Some made up numbers on a screen? Something someone literally just created for free, and sold for millions of dollars?


The psychology of trading, gambling and investing is a fascinating subject.
So people should only buy things if they understand how they work? Do people understand how most of the things they own or use work?

People create domain names for nothing, they are pixels on a screen, yet some go for millions. All those virtual assets on Entropia (the VR game) combined are worth $442 million - and they literally do not exist, only as pixels.


I can give you many such examples of frivolous and expensive nonsense, its a crazy mixed up world, yet Bitcoin, I'd suggest, may have much more uses

Mousem40

1,667 posts

218 months

Wednesday 9th January 2019
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51% Attack and reorg on Ethereum Classic, lots of double spending and money stolen. Oh dear. Is only BTC safe from this?

DonkeyApple

55,402 posts

170 months

Thursday 10th January 2019
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Mousem40 said:
51% Attack and reorg on Ethereum Classic, lots of double spending and money stolen. Oh dear. Is only BTC safe from this?
This is worth a read: https://www.theverge.com/2019/1/9/18174407/ethereu...

It briefly discusses the hacking of wallets but mostly the disruption of blockchain.

Given an earlier subject heavily discussed on here which was the geographic location of mining operations and that where electricity tends to be cheapest and laws laxest are typically utterly corrupt nations then its worth considering why that would add to the security.

Guvernator

13,164 posts

166 months

Thursday 10th January 2019
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I also see that the slow recovery of BTC and ETH that had been occurring has slammed into full reverse again after this news.

Mousem40

1,667 posts

218 months

Thursday 10th January 2019
quotequote all
DonkeyApple said:
Mousem40 said:
51% Attack and reorg on Ethereum Classic, lots of double spending and money stolen. Oh dear. Is only BTC safe from this?
This is worth a read: https://www.theverge.com/2019/1/9/18174407/ethereu...

It briefly discusses the hacking of wallets but mostly the disruption of blockchain.

Given an earlier subject heavily discussed on here which was the geographic location of mining operations and that where electricity tends to be cheapest and laws laxest are typically utterly corrupt nations then its worth considering why that would add to the security.
I did mention this risk when the BCH fork took place and I stated that IMO it was a watershed moment, only to be told it was BCH specific and just a fascinating sideshow rolleyes


Behemoth said:
Mousem40 said:
Forget about cheap phones in Africa for the moment.

There is a post fork hash war going on at BCH at the moment, costing both sides a reported $200k a day in electricity costs to try and win the battle
It's an existential risk to the currency, with the possibility of the resulting fork BCHSV being run by 'bad agents'

If this can happen to a currency with one of the largest hashrates in all of crypto, then what hope do any of the rest of CryptoCurrencies have in being utilised for anything serious, let alone an actual currency? None of them can be trusted. This marks a watershed moment IMO - people are waking up to the reality.

Then you have the whole Bitfinex/Tether issue. If that implodes, then the whole space will crater.
BCH hash has always been extremely centralised, hence the high likelihood of a 51% attack coming up in this fork. It's a sideshow, albeit a fascinating one for those understanding the game theory being played out.

Behemoth

2,105 posts

132 months

Thursday 10th January 2019
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Mousem40 said:
I did mention this risk when the BCH fork took place and I stated that IMO it was a watershed moment, only to be told it was BCH specific and just a fascinating sideshow rolleyes
The sideshow comment refers to the BCH hashwar, not 51% attacks.

51% attacks are a feature of PoW chains. It's pure survival of the fittest. I look forwards to a bunch more of these happening in 2019.

On the other comment concerning mining, Bitcoin is amoral & will go to wherever electricity is cheapest, whether that's due to corruption or innovative use of stranded energy that would otherwise be dumped. Most Bitcoin energy use is now renewable (because it's cheap and Bitcoin mining is highly mobile). There's also clear evidence it's because of curtailment, not corruption. I linked to a research doc about this a while back.

m3sye

26,231 posts

202 months

Thursday 10th January 2019
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I did run a search for 'IOTA' but nothing came back

Does anyone have any money in them? anyone any thoughts on longterm ?

g4ry13

17,006 posts

256 months

Thursday 10th January 2019
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Guvernator said:
I also see that the slow recovery of BTC and ETH that had been occurring has slammed into full reverse again after this news.
I certainly wouldn't attribute the fall to this.

NickCQ

5,392 posts

97 months

Thursday 10th January 2019
quotequote all
Behemoth said:
Most Bitcoin energy use is now renewable (because it's cheap and Bitcoin mining is highly mobile). I linked to a research doc about this a while back.
Could you re-link?

Cheers

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