Planning for a Corbyn Government
Discussion
wisbech said:
Very true. It is a big wide world full of opportunities. However, those opportunities are also there for tens, if not hundreds of millions of skilled people who don’t have the right passport to easily get a job in the EU or UK. So the competition is tough, and salaries not what you may think. Most immigrants to NZ are Chinese or Indian because meritocratic points system
Which is fine. The idea that we should be ahead of other people in the queue because we are British makes no sense.As I said above, there’s plenty of opportunities if you have marketable skills, and it’s not right to force yourself on a nation of you’ve not got what they want.
I needed a skilled worker visa when I worked in the US, so I got one. It’s a decent system.
Fittster said:
Do the people dreading a Corbyn Government think things have been going swimmingly for the last 20 years?
Overall they’ve been going very well, yes. Life expectancy is up, poverty is down, we’ve improved social mobility, and, of course, we have cars, computers, and lifestyles that our parents generation coukdn’t have dreamed of.Of course, globalisation means that the unskilled are competing with billions of people that they were once insulated from, but that’s to be expected.
It means that you need to keep improving, keep getting better.
Fittster said:
Do the people dreading a Corbyn Government think things have been going swimmingly for the last 20 years?
No. Problem is, Labour governments always crash the economy through incompetence and dogma, then a Conservative government has to come along and drag it out of the s
t, which takes a very long time.Corbyn s
t would be on a level of st never before seen. Deep, very, very deep st....HTH.
James_B said:
Fittster said:
Do the people dreading a Corbyn Government think things have been going swimmingly for the last 20 years?
Overall they’ve been going very well, yes. Life expectancy is up, poverty is down, we’ve improved social mobility, and, of course, we have cars, computers, and lifestyles that our parents generation coukdn’t have dreamed of.Of course, globalisation means that the unskilled are competing with billions of people that they were once insulated from, but that’s to be expected.
It means that you need to keep improving, keep getting better.
Life expectancy has stopped improving (https://www.lrb.co.uk/v39/n22/danny-dorling/short-cuts)
Poverty by what measure is down? https://fullfact.org/economy/poverty-uk-guide-fact...
"Britain has a deep social mobility problem which is getting worse for an entire generation of young people, the Social Mobility Commission’s State of the Nation 2016 report warns today." https://www.gov.uk/government/news/state-of-the-na...
This would be the generation who didn't have iphones, but had cheap housing, job security and far better pensions than we have today?
mybrainhurts said:
Fittster said:
Do the people dreading a Corbyn Government think things have been going swimmingly for the last 20 years?
No. Problem is, Labour governments always crash the economy through incompetence and dogma, then a Conservative government has to come along and drag it out of the st, which takes a very long time.Corbyn s
t would be on a level of st never before seen. Deep, very, very deep st....HTH.
It’s not that wages did badly. Bank of England data show that they rose 22.7% between 1970 and 1979 after adjusting for RPI inflation. That’s substantially better than in the last ten years.
If it's the 1970s you're afraid of:
Wage rose 22.7% between 1970 and 1979 after adjusting for RPI inflation. That’s substantially better than in the last ten years.
Tax was high in the 1970s but it was also high under the beloved Maggie in the 1980s. Corbyn is calling for a lower top tax rate than existed for most of the 1980s.
GDP per head since 1979 has risen by only 1.6% per year, between 1955 and 1979 it grow at 2.6% per year.
The most leftie thing about Corbyn is a desire to nationalize railways and utilites, which are often in public hands in Western Europe.
Edited by Fittster on Sunday 26th November 00:47
Fittster said:
Life expectancy has stopped improving (https://www.lrb.co.uk/v39/n22/danny-dorling/short-cuts)
Poverty by what measure is down? https://fullfact.org/economy/poverty-uk-guide-fact...
"Britain has a deep social mobility problem which is getting worse for an entire generation of young people, the Social Mobility Commission’s State of the Nation 2016 report warns today." https://www.gov.uk/government/news/state-of-the-na...
This would be the generation who didn't have iphones, but had cheap housing, job security and far better pensions than we have today?
Why?
James_B said:
Fittster said:
Life expectancy has stopped improving (https://www.lrb.co.uk/v39/n22/danny-dorling/short-cuts)
Poverty by what measure is down? https://fullfact.org/economy/poverty-uk-guide-fact...
"Britain has a deep social mobility problem which is getting worse for an entire generation of young people, the Social Mobility Commission’s State of the Nation 2016 report warns today." https://www.gov.uk/government/news/state-of-the-na...
This would be the generation who didn't have iphones, but had cheap housing, job security and far better pensions than we have today?
Why?
So I quite why people are happy for things to continue as they are but will flee offshore if Corbyn nationalize the railways I don't understand.
What's the argument for carrying on as we are, while having a huge falling out with our trading partners?
Edited by Fittster on Sunday 26th November 01:07
Fittster said:
Life expectancy has stopped improving since we've had a Tory government. It's not as if the policies of the government are making us richer if not healthier but wages are lower than they were ten years ago and aren't predicted to improve for a long while yet due to terrible productivity growth.
So I quite why people are happy for things to continue as they are but will flee offshore if Corbyn nationalize the railways I don't understand.
What's the argument for carrying on as we are, while having a huge falling out with our trading partners?
Increases in life expectancy are slowing down, life expectancies for the majority are not reducing.So I quite why people are happy for things to continue as they are but will flee offshore if Corbyn nationalize the railways I don't understand.
What's the argument for carrying on as we are, while having a huge falling out with our trading partners?
Try this for a starter:
https://www.hymans.co.uk/media/uploads/PLSA_Longev...
Wages, GDP etc were artificially increased in the run up to the 2008 crash, so that’s a poor starting point for the comparison.
Edited by sidicks on Sunday 26th November 12:38
I'm not sure what re-nationalisation would achieve. Just give the regulator more powers, add tax or investment ratios, impose massive fines for late \ crowded trains.
Personally, I'm dreading a Corbyn government. Whilst I agree with some of the socialist ideals they just don't work in the real world. Being self-employed (me and the Mrs) we have discussed an exit plan and would probably emigrate.
Personally, I'm dreading a Corbyn government. Whilst I agree with some of the socialist ideals they just don't work in the real world. Being self-employed (me and the Mrs) we have discussed an exit plan and would probably emigrate.
Fittster said:
Life expectancy has stopped improving ...
You are probably right. I am not surprised.
Have you noticed how some people no longer walk normally, but have to waddle along from side to side ?
My health nurse told me that some patients weigh more, than their scales can measure.
They then have to stand the person on two scales, and add the two weight measurements together.
This outbreak of obesity must be someone's fault. Everything now is someone else's fault.
Which political party should we blame ?
By a long term measure of debt to gdp ratio Thatcher and Blair/Brown were both good for the managing the economy, Wilson, Heath etc pretty neutral and Major pretty disastrous. Cameron and the current lot have pulled off a unique feat of making everyone believe we’re in times of Austerity AND running up more long term debt. Difficult to see how Corbyn with some judicious renationalizations of essential infrastructure and some sensible rebalancing of the economy can do any worse.
Edited by spyker138 on Sunday 26th November 16:54
spyker138 said:
TBy a long term measure of debt to gdp ratio Thatcher and Blair/Brown were both good for the managing the economy, Wilson, Heath etc pretty neutral and Major pretty disastrous.
Only if you don't really understand the economy and the lag between government activity and the impact.Also if you ignore the debt that Blair/Brown hid off balance sheet, and the way credit was used to artificially boost the economy.
spyker138 said:
Cameron and the current lot have pulled off a unique feat of making everyone believe we’re in times of Austerity AND running up more long term debt. Difficult to see how Corbyn with some judicious renationalizations of essential infrastructure and some sensible rebalancing of the economy can do any worse.
Should we assume you have no idea what a deficit is?
Edited by sidicks on Sunday 26th November 17:42
sidicks said:
Should we assume you have no idea what a deficit is?
Edited by sidicks on Sunday 26th November 17:42
sidicks said:
Only party related?!
Err yes, obviously! The gdp part of the ratio isn’t directly driven by deficit. But you’ll now tell me I don’t understand things and roll about laughing. History will show that this Tory government missed a huge opportunity the recover the economy post 2008 and squandered it with a ‘we’re all in it together ‘ austerity followed by a huge own goal on Brexit.Lets have more cool brittania please!
spyker138 said:
Err yes, obviously! The gdp part of the ratio isn’t directly driven by deficit. But you’ll now tell me I don’t understand things and roll about laughing. History will show that this Tory government missed a huge opportunity the recover the economy post 2008 and squandered it with a ‘we’re all in it together ‘ austerity followed by a huge own goal on Brexit.
So the Coalition (not Tory) government inherited a £160bn deficit (which has since been reduced to £50bn) all the while many people were complaining that not enough was being spent on public services (despite spending increasing each and every year) and that education and the NHS were 'in crisis'.But I'm sure the debt that was (inevitably) incurred was their fault, and not due to the reckless spending of the previous government (who incurred massive debt on and off balance sheet despite record tax receipts and a credit-fuelled boom) and who were running a massive structural deficit at the peak of the economic cycle...
mybrainhurts said:
Fittster said:
Do the people dreading a Corbyn Government think things have been going swimmingly for the last 20 years?
No. Problem is, Labour governments always crash the economy through incompetence and dogma, then a Conservative government has to come along and drag it out of the st, which takes a very long time.Corbyn s
t would be on a level of st never before seen. Deep, very, very deep st....HTH.
ive traded through shed loads of market crashes and interest rate hikes into double figs overseen by conservative govts. they were renowned for dropping a ball or two or three or four or five
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