Orange Five - Any good?
Discussion
I've always liked the Orange Five, when I bought my current bike 12 years ago I wanted one, but it would have cost another £500 over the cost bike I was looking at (which was already £400 more than my actual budget). So I didn't get one and bought a Marin instead.
This appreciation of the '5' has stayed with me and over the years I've always looked wistfully at them. I've been hankering after a new full suspension bike for a while now and don't have a massive budget, around £1500. However for this I could have something new such as a Calibre Bossnut Triple B and some change or a second hand Five.
So my question is are they any good ? Or to put it another way, are there better bikes for an over weight middle aged man who likes to ride cross country (such as trails at Dalby & Grizedale Forests, Lake District etc) in comfort?
Is it daft for someone who lacks bike mechanicing skills to buy a second hand bike over a new one?
Any advice or opinions would be much appreciated.
TIA PH
This appreciation of the '5' has stayed with me and over the years I've always looked wistfully at them. I've been hankering after a new full suspension bike for a while now and don't have a massive budget, around £1500. However for this I could have something new such as a Calibre Bossnut Triple B and some change or a second hand Five.
So my question is are they any good ? Or to put it another way, are there better bikes for an over weight middle aged man who likes to ride cross country (such as trails at Dalby & Grizedale Forests, Lake District etc) in comfort?
Is it daft for someone who lacks bike mechanicing skills to buy a second hand bike over a new one?
Any advice or opinions would be much appreciated.
TIA PH
Well the design hasn't changed in 12 years whilst the rest of the biking world has moved on significantly. They are hard wearing and designed to survive everything the British weather can throw at them but if you are only going to be riding XC type trails then get a FS 29er. Something like the Norco Sight from Evans. Superb value. https://www.evanscycles.com/norco-sight-a3-29er-20...
The Five is a great bike! Although for the type of riding you mention I would suggest a Four would be more suitable. I'm also slight overweight etc and riding the same sort of trails and my Four is excellent!
The Oranges are pretty simple to maintain and there is lots of good advice available on the Orange Riders Facebook group.
The Oranges are pretty simple to maintain and there is lots of good advice available on the Orange Riders Facebook group.
moonigan said:
No you are right. Its completely different. Crazy geo on the 2006 apart (Its the first one I found on web) they are essentially the same.
Stop being so obtuse 
Do you understand bicycle geometry at all?
Comparing the 2009 Five (oldest Five Geometry they have on their website) to the 2019 Five in ten years they've got longer and slacker with a completely changed BB height....
Not to mention the photo of the 2018 "Five" is actually a Stage Five which again has a different geometry to the current Five...
Edited by AndrewEH1 on Wednesday 17th October 14:16
Craikeybaby said:
The Five is a great bike! Although for the type of riding you mention I would suggest a Four would be more suitable. I'm also slight overweight etc and riding the same sort of trails and my Four is excellent!
The Oranges are pretty simple to maintain and there is lots of good advice available on the Orange Riders Facebook group.
I've ridden a four and would agree it would be more that suited to whats getting asked of it, I nearly bought one but i prefer a hardtail. The lass who's four I had a shot of races one, she's won various uk events on it and loves the four, swears by it. The Oranges are pretty simple to maintain and there is lots of good advice available on the Orange Riders Facebook group.
Some will say this isn't true but if you are the sort that uses your rear brake alot or trails it you'll get brake-jack. Seriously decent riders (smooth) won't.
I used to have a Orange Alpine, loved it until one day I had a blast down a techy descent on a mates Santa Cruz and it blew my Orange our of the water without even trying and on a strange set up to what I'm used to.
Fives we're good ten years ago. They've been left back in history by modern bikes.
My Commencal AM V4.2 is essentially single pivot and it's light years ahead of the five.
I used to have a Orange Alpine, loved it until one day I had a blast down a techy descent on a mates Santa Cruz and it blew my Orange our of the water without even trying and on a strange set up to what I'm used to.
Fives we're good ten years ago. They've been left back in history by modern bikes.
My Commencal AM V4.2 is essentially single pivot and it's light years ahead of the five.
The Orange designs being old is an interesting one. I have a 6RS which I bought after liking it on a demo day and after riding my mates Alpine 160 and liking it. I hear a lot about how the design is old fashioned and outdated etc. Now, I do think that there is some terrain that it isn't great on. The ride is very 'busy' on quite land rover track type stuff. But when it gets interesting I think it's great.
My friend who has the Alpine 160 and I have ridden the same local trail on our bikes and then my mate (who is a much better rider than I am) did the same run on some demo bikes including a top of the range Santa Cruz. Each time we ran Strava. The day he had the Santa Cruz the trail conditions were absolutely perfect. I set PR after PR. Mate on the Santa Cruz was very impressed with it and how quick it had felt. Then looked at the Strava times and was slower on ever segment than his own bike. On some segments by a decent margin. Now obviously there is an advantage to knowing your bike but given the conditions were perfect and it was a bike costing triple his own and he tends to learn bikes quickly, it does suggest that that 'old design' Orange use might not be that bad....
My friend who has the Alpine 160 and I have ridden the same local trail on our bikes and then my mate (who is a much better rider than I am) did the same run on some demo bikes including a top of the range Santa Cruz. Each time we ran Strava. The day he had the Santa Cruz the trail conditions were absolutely perfect. I set PR after PR. Mate on the Santa Cruz was very impressed with it and how quick it had felt. Then looked at the Strava times and was slower on ever segment than his own bike. On some segments by a decent margin. Now obviously there is an advantage to knowing your bike but given the conditions were perfect and it was a bike costing triple his own and he tends to learn bikes quickly, it does suggest that that 'old design' Orange use might not be that bad....
I bought a second hand five after years away from mtb. Previously I'd had a 4x hardtail (nukeproof snap) and built a downhill bike from the frame up.
Both got sold and I wanted something to keep me entertained and boost my fitness when I wasn't riding motorbikes on track. I bought a five because they have a reputation as being durable and a versatile all rounder.
So far I've done uplift days at antur stiniog where it handled everything with ease, ridden local pump tracks with the kids where it was large and abit cumbersome but still plenty quick/fun enough.
Ive ridden it on local blue trails like lady Cannings plantation and also through the local woods. For me it's a versatile and sturdy bike, it doesn't need to be any lighter or stronger and I've passed people on hardtail xc bikes on climbs and I'm certainly below average fitness. I'm sure there are other bikes out there that will be quicker but as something I can sling in the van and not be precious over I'm very happy with it.
It's an all rounder and in my mind a very good one. I'd always buy second hand though, they're very expensive and not great value new at full price.
Both got sold and I wanted something to keep me entertained and boost my fitness when I wasn't riding motorbikes on track. I bought a five because they have a reputation as being durable and a versatile all rounder.
So far I've done uplift days at antur stiniog where it handled everything with ease, ridden local pump tracks with the kids where it was large and abit cumbersome but still plenty quick/fun enough.
Ive ridden it on local blue trails like lady Cannings plantation and also through the local woods. For me it's a versatile and sturdy bike, it doesn't need to be any lighter or stronger and I've passed people on hardtail xc bikes on climbs and I'm certainly below average fitness. I'm sure there are other bikes out there that will be quicker but as something I can sling in the van and not be precious over I'm very happy with it.
It's an all rounder and in my mind a very good one. I'd always buy second hand though, they're very expensive and not great value new at full price.
PH5121 said:
I've always liked the Orange Five, when I bought my current bike 12 years ago I wanted one
Pretty much sums them up...Okay, it's perhaps a bit mean to pick on them for being old fashioned- Geometry keeps them fairly contemporary, but not in every way of course, where as the rest of the world first moved to hydroformed Alu to save weight and 'tune' stiffness, Orange stayed the same, when others moved onto Carbon for their more expensive bikes to save more weight and add stiff ness, Orange stayed the same, when the rest of the world refined and refined their pick of the 3 or so linkage driven suspension systems Orange stayed single pivot (they actually tried a multi pivot design and it was, well, shall we say less then reliable).
It's really hard to really decide if they're any good without trying them for yourself, some riders LOVE them, although they also tend not to like ANY other bike so you might have to question their objectiveness, MBR has always loved them, but other reviewers are less smitten.
For the record I've ridden very few over the last 15 years or so and haven't liked any of them, I don't think they do anything particularity well, but I'm by no means a world lever rider, nor professional bike reviewer.
Things I think they do well:
They're tough.
They're made in the UK
They're designed to be ridden 12 months a year on this rainy muddy little island when most of the 'Cool' brands (Santa Cruz, Intense, Trek, Spesh etc etc) were designed in North America to be ridden either in Cali when it's sunny all year, or Canada when they put their bike away and grab their Snowboard for 6 months of the year.
For me though, the problem is that Bird do all of the above but manage to do so for about half the cost (so much for a 'Made in Britain' tax) and manage to pull off the 'made for UK winters' with a multi-link platform that wins enduro races on the regular and doesn't s
t bearings twice a year.Still... if you always wanted an Orange5 , buy an Orange 5 and enjoy it, pride of ownership is more important that a few tenths on Strava.
Many many manufacturers make bikes that are perfectly able to ride in our winter.
I've owned loads of Santa Cruz etc. I've not changed any bearings for years.
I read an interview with Orange where they stated how strong the BB area is to rock strikes. On the first ride on a five I dented the BB badly on cheeky rocks in the lakes.
I just found it well over priced for what they are. They don't have any import charges or distributor costs to factor in and their fabricators aren't on Stellar wages
I've owned loads of Santa Cruz etc. I've not changed any bearings for years.
I read an interview with Orange where they stated how strong the BB area is to rock strikes. On the first ride on a five I dented the BB badly on cheeky rocks in the lakes.
I just found it well over priced for what they are. They don't have any import charges or distributor costs to factor in and their fabricators aren't on Stellar wages
Edited by Sa Calobra on Friday 19th October 15:18
Craikeybaby said:
Do Bird manufacture in the UK now?
I thought I was only Orange that build mountain bikes at any scale in the UK.
Ah, seems I took too much faith in their tag-line of “Designed in Swinley, Built in the UK”.I thought I was only Orange that build mountain bikes at any scale in the UK.
The basic frames (front and rear triangles) are made in Taiwan and built up in the UK.
Second the bird option - I've just picked up a 145 at a year old for around 1/2 list price. It's immaculate and Birds service is superb (and they just one Bike radars Customer service of the year award) - they even have a fully transferable lifetime warranty on the frame so any issues and I'm covered.
Don't know where you are but they are more than happy to demo bikes and I wouldn't hesitate to recommend them!
Don't know where you are but they are more than happy to demo bikes and I wouldn't hesitate to recommend them!
P-Jay said:
Ah, seems I took too much faith in their tag-line of “Designed in Swinley, Built in the UK”.
The basic frames (front and rear triangles) are made in Taiwan and built up in the UK.
Lots like that, sport the union Jack on your designs like Montane 'designed in the UK'.The basic frames (front and rear triangles) are made in Taiwan and built up in the UK.
With bike companies I don't buy into reviews.
I think most mag ones are cohered or bent.
P-Jay said:
Craikeybaby said:
Do Bird manufacture in the UK now?
I thought I was only Orange that build mountain bikes at any scale in the UK.
Ah, seems I took too much faith in their tag-line of “Designed in Swinley, Built in the UK”.I thought I was only Orange that build mountain bikes at any scale in the UK.
The basic frames (front and rear triangles) are made in Taiwan and built up in the UK.
I ended up not buying one because they were between generations on the Zero. Only one of the three "bosses" was up for making my purchase work in time for a race I had coming up, and he wasn't there when I went back to try to work out an order. So I bought a Giant Anthem with £600 off, only for the "can do" guy to phone me back and say that he'd over-ruled the other two and we could have a deal. Sadly, though, I'd paid in full for my Anthem.
When they first started, Bird really went to town on customisation. You could choose from many, many options on all aspects of the early Zero. Then they moved to "package" builds with fewer variations available as options. Still great bikes though, and I'd love one if I had the cash (and space) for another bike to add to the garage. Income, and a wife who's on the warpath about bike numbers, combine to scupper that idea though...
P-Jay said:
some riders LOVE them, although they also tend not to like ANY other bike so you might have to question their objectiveness, MBR has always loved them, but other reviewers are less smitten.
Basis of this assertion? I currently have my Orange, a Whyte (which got rave reviews and I'd call, at best mediocre), a Felt and a Focus and have previously had a Giant and a Specialized. So not sure you can question my brand objectiveness too much when I've never owned more than one bike from any particular brand.Also, if you actually look at the geometries of some of the Orange models over the years you may notice they have changed more than you think.
The only sensible advice on bike choice is to try some and see what you like.
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