Crypto Currency Thread (Vol.2)

[g4ry13]

Condi said:

g4ry13 said:

Yeah....but you're investing in value.

You may have lost 70% of your money on Netflix but at least there's a product and you hold a small piece of the company

Bitcoin you lose 70% of your money and don't even have a product or a piece of the company!

-70% still looks the same when you look at the P&L!

[r3g]

g4ry13 said:

Yeah....but you're investing in value.

You may have lost 70% of your money on Netflix but at least there's a product and you hold a small piece of the company

above is sarcasm obviously

I knew a certain someone wouldn't be able to resist the temptation to chime in and castigate me/us for having the temerity to compare crypto price movements with stawks.

[Condi]

r3g said:

I knew a certain someone wouldn't be able to resist the temptation to chime in and castigate me/us for having the temerity to compare crypto price movements with stawks.

But it strikes to the heart of "what is Bitcoin for", for every argument that it's a store of value then the evidence is that it isnt a good store of value, for every comparison with gold which is generally counter cyclic, then Bitcoin isn't following gold, for every argument that Bitcoin is a currency, nobody is using it for transactions.

Comparing it with stocks shows a fundamental misunderstanding, both of what Bitcoin was designed to be, and also how stocks and currencies function, and by repeating the same erroneous comparison then it just shows you haven't learnt anything from 10 pages ago when you wrote the same stuff last time.

So, if Bitcoin isn't a good store of value, and it isn't a good currency, then, ummmm, what is it? 2 Volumes and 5 years later, I am still waiting for a good answer to this really very basic question.

[guyvert1]

Condi said:

So, if Bitcoin isn't a good store of value, and it isn't a good currency, then, ummmm, what is it? 2 Volumes and 5 years later, I am still waiting for a good answer to this really very basic question.

Its what used to get played with a pint, just these days you get a login

[Ouroboros]

A good way to make make money fast/ lose money fast. Delete as appropriate. Unless you bought 10 years ago, well you done good, the rest well , see how the wind blows.

[Blown2CV]

Recommendations of a good wallet I can use to get my crypto out of Coinbase?

[r3g]

Condi said:

But it strikes to the heart of "what is Bitcoin for", for every argument that it's a store of value then the evidence is that it isnt a good store of value, for every comparison with gold which is generally counter cyclic, then Bitcoin isn't following gold, for every argument that Bitcoin is a currency, nobody is using it for transactions.

Comparing it with stocks shows a fundamental misunderstanding, both of what Bitcoin was designed to be, and also how stocks and currencies function, and by repeating the same erroneous comparison then it just shows you haven't learnt anything from 10 pages ago when you wrote the same stuff last time.

So, if Bitcoin isn't a good store of value, and it isn't a good currency, then, ummmm, what is it? 2 Volumes and 5 years later, I am still waiting for a good answer to this really very basic question.

[Ari]

Condi said:

But it strikes to the heart of "what is Bitcoin for", for every argument that it's a store of value then the evidence is that it isnt a good store of value, for every comparison with gold which is generally counter cyclic, then Bitcoin isn't following gold, for every argument that Bitcoin is a currency, nobody is using it for transactions.

Comparing it with stocks shows a fundamental misunderstanding, both of what Bitcoin was designed to be, and also how stocks and currencies function, and by repeating the same erroneous comparison then it just shows you haven't learnt anything from 10 pages ago when you wrote the same stuff last time.

So, if Bitcoin isn't a good store of value, and it isn't a good currency, then, ummmm, what is it? 2 Volumes and 5 years later, I am still waiting for a good answer to this really very basic question.

You're right, but you're also wasting your time. Even in the face of what's happening right now, they still can't, or more precisely won't, see it.

If nothing else, it's a very interesting insight into human behaviour. Those women who send £10,000 to 'Jason Statham' believing that he really is in love with them via a Facebook fan page, or blokes sending out money to beautiful women who are definitely going to use it to buy a plane ticket to come and spend the rest of their lives with them - exactly the same mindset.

Tell people what they want to hear, and it's astonishing what they are prepared to to believe, and the facts that they are prepared to ignore.

It's a great shame that we're not allowed a thread to discuss it, because it is fascinating to observe.

Maybe the mods are crypto bros too...

[Mr Whippy]

Ouroboros said:

Mr Whippy said:

The loss isn’t real until it’s realised. It’s a notional loss.

How do you define your worth?

The majority of people will have bought BTC recently. Their BTC worth has gone done considerable, that is a loss, as everyone in finance understands, hell The Times Rich List is based on net worth.

Edited by Ouroboros on Saturday 18th June 15:16

To be a bit philosophical about it. My worth is defined by what I do about what I care about doing.

Not the fiat money value of everything I own if I sell it all tomorrow, which is utterly pointless for anything except willy waving as far as I can tell.


And no it’s not a loss. Just like mine wasn’t a gain until I took profits.

Notional worth is exactly that. Notional.

Ie, Elon Musk probably can’t realise even half his net worth as he’d tank the value trying to redeem it.

It’s just pretend numbers.

[Condi]

Why did you buy crypto, if not to make money, if you don't care about material wealth? Logically the only reason you bought was to sell at a profit, and thus at some fairly high level you must be motivated by money...

[tactical lizard]

Blown2CV said:

Recommendations of a good wallet I can use to get my crypto out of Coinbase?

https://shop.ledger.com/products/ledger-nano-x

[Mr Whippy]

Condi said:

Why did you buy crypto, if not to make money, if you don't care about material wealth? Logically the only reason you bought was to sell at a profit, and thus at some fairly high level you must be motivated by money...

I bought it because I wanted to learn about it and buy cryptostorm vpn tokens, so I could learn about that sort of stuff too.

The KYC at the time was a ball ache, so after buying £5 worth to ‘try out’ and all the faff, I just bought a load so I had plenty to go at for a few years of VPN tokens purchases etc.


Money is important to buy what I need abs/or want.

But ‘my worth’ at any given point is notional at best.

Have you ever tried to sell everything you own at “market prices”?
How long is a piece of string?
It’s all notional until it’s sold and the market tells you it’s value.

It’s also irrelevant. Sell your house and investment portfolio that makes you an income, your car.
Great, you now have a number that represents what?
What does that number tell you?
It’s a state you’ll never exist in because you need your car, investments and house… which is why you have them in the first place.

At best you use it for the ‘wealth effect’ feeling, or as a willy waving contest, or some spreadsheet antics… but it’s not really a truly tangible indicator of wealth.


Ie, when you want to liquidate some of your stuff because of hard times, there is a good chance those hard times are shared, and so now as we see, supply is high and demand is low and the net worth was a nonsensical value any way.
Stocks. Crypto. Soon to be houses.


So the ‘value’ of your wealth/money is in almost all cases pointless… unless you hit hard times in isolation for some random reason.
But then knowing your net notional worth didn’t stop you getting in financial trouble did it?
So again how useful is it?


I get your point. But crying over crypto losses is fking ridiculous.
It is 100% known to be highly speculative and unregulated.
It’s like buying magic beans and being upset you didn’t get a golden egg laying golden goose out of it

[Andy 308GTB]

Mr Whippy said:

Condi said:

Why did you buy crypto, if not to make money, if you don't care about material wealth? Logically the only reason you bought was to sell at a profit, and thus at some fairly high level you must be motivated by money...

I bought it because I wanted to learn about it and buy cryptostorm vpn tokens, so I could learn about that sort of stuff too.

The KYC at the time was a ball ache, so after buying £5 worth to ‘try out’ and all the faff, I just bought a load so I had plenty to go at for a few years of VPN tokens purchases etc.


Money is important to buy what I need abs/or want.

But ‘my worth’ at any given point is notional at best.

Have you ever tried to sell everything you own at “market prices”?
How long is a piece of string?
It’s all notional until it’s sold and the market tells you it’s value.

It’s also irrelevant. Sell your house and investment portfolio that makes you an income, your car.
Great, you now have a number that represents what?
What does that number tell you?
It’s a state you’ll never exist in because you need your car, investments and house… which is why you have them in the first place.

At best you use it for the ‘wealth effect’ feeling, or as a willy waving contest, or some spreadsheet antics… but it’s not really a truly tangible indicator of wealth.


Ie, when you want to liquidate some of your stuff because of hard times, there is a good chance those hard times are shared, and so now as we see, supply is high and demand is low and the net worth was a nonsensical value any way.
Stocks. Crypto. Soon to be houses.


So the ‘value’ of your wealth/money is in almost all cases pointless… unless you hit hard times in isolation for some random reason.
But then knowing your net notional worth didn’t stop you getting in financial trouble did it?
So again how useful is it?


I get your point. But crying over crypto losses is fking ridiculous.
It is 100% known to be highly speculative and unregulated.
It’s like buying magic beans and being upset you didn’t get a golden egg laying golden goose out of it

All very philosophical & admirable but I suspect you'd be happier sitting on a notional profit!

[jammy-git]

I'd be interested to run a vote and see which category most people on here fall into:

A) Bought crypto for its utility
B) Bought crypto to speculate
C) Only on here for sts and giggles

I suspect group A is quite small and groups B and C are relatively evenly split.


I'd also be interested to see who, out of all those who have held crypto, have decided not to buy any more (ever) or have even sold up completely?

I know I will definitely be buying some more in a year or two once I think we've hit bottom and it's steadily growing again.

[bitchstewie]

Bought a small amount as a small portion of my investments and I bought it as a gamble rather than in the way I think of those other investments.

It's money I can afford to lose and I take a very simple view which is I know the potential downside is it goes to zero but the upside is unlimited.

So B I guess.

[Mr Whippy]

Andy 308GTB said:

Mr Whippy said:

Condi said:

Why did you buy crypto, if not to make money, if you don't care about material wealth? Logically the only reason you bought was to sell at a profit, and thus at some fairly high level you must be motivated by money...

I bought it because I wanted to learn about it and buy cryptostorm vpn tokens, so I could learn about that sort of stuff too.

The KYC at the time was a ball ache, so after buying £5 worth to ‘try out’ and all the faff, I just bought a load so I had plenty to go at for a few years of VPN tokens purchases etc.


Money is important to buy what I need abs/or want.

But ‘my worth’ at any given point is notional at best.

Have you ever tried to sell everything you own at “market prices”?
How long is a piece of string?
It’s all notional until it’s sold and the market tells you it’s value.

It’s also irrelevant. Sell your house and investment portfolio that makes you an income, your car.
Great, you now have a number that represents what?
What does that number tell you?
It’s a state you’ll never exist in because you need your car, investments and house… which is why you have them in the first place.

At best you use it for the ‘wealth effect’ feeling, or as a willy waving contest, or some spreadsheet antics… but it’s not really a truly tangible indicator of wealth.


Ie, when you want to liquidate some of your stuff because of hard times, there is a good chance those hard times are shared, and so now as we see, supply is high and demand is low and the net worth was a nonsensical value any way.
Stocks. Crypto. Soon to be houses.


So the ‘value’ of your wealth/money is in almost all cases pointless… unless you hit hard times in isolation for some random reason.
But then knowing your net notional worth didn’t stop you getting in financial trouble did it?
So again how useful is it?


I get your point. But crying over crypto losses is fking ridiculous.
It is 100% known to be highly speculative and unregulated.
It’s like buying magic beans and being upset you didn’t get a golden egg laying golden goose out of it

All very philosophical & admirable but I suspect you'd be happier sitting on a notional profit!

I am sitting on a notional profit and an actual profit.

It can go to zero now and I’ve done ok.

I don’t think it ever went below my buy in price because I didn’t buy at an ATH. I bought in the doldrums.

[r3g]

jammy-git said:

I'd be interested to run a vote and see which category most people on here fall into:

A) Bought crypto for its utility
B) Bought crypto to speculate
C) Only on here for sts and giggles

I suspect group A is quite small and groups B and C are relatively evenly split.


I'd also be interested to see who, out of all those who have held crypto, have decided not to buy any more (ever) or have even sold up completely?

I know I will definitely be buying some more in a year or two once I think we've hit bottom and it's steadily growing again.

Don't care for utility, it's never going to happen beyond CBDCs which imo aren't true cryptos. Would love to see any of the low-fee de-centralised cryptos being accepted for day-to-day purchases. But I'm only in the 'space' to make money/gamble. I won't be buying any more CMC cryptos to speculate on because the market is too rigged now like the stock market and PMs. I only buy stuff like stables, BNB, TRON, AVAX, MATIC to exchange for tokens in the low cap ultra high risk miner and defi projects.

[Andy 308GTB]

Mr Whippy said:

I am sitting on a notional profit and an actual profit.

It can go to zero now and I’ve done ok.

I don’t think it ever went below my buy in price because I didn’t buy at an ATH. I bought in the doldrums.

Fair play.

[Hedgeman]

Mr Whippy said:

I am sitting on a notional profit and an actual profit.

It can go to zero now and I’ve done ok.

I don’t think it ever went below my buy in price because I didn’t buy at an ATH. I bought in the doldrums.

You still sound like a man who failed to crystallise a large unrealised PnL and is now trying to convince himself it doesn't matter

[Scootersp]

Hedgeman said:

You still sound like a man who failed to crystallise a large unrealised PnL and is now trying to convince himself it doesn't matter

Geez give the guy a break, unless you always sold at the top and bought at the bottom then we've all experienced this and the reverse to varying degrees.

This guy isn't Mr Crypto he dabbled and is well diversified from what I can gather from his other posts.