Home automation
Discussion
Agree with pilot-lite.
Re getting started with HASS I started from scratch and used a combo of the examples, documentation and when completely stuck the quite active forums are helpful.
The latest versions have built in checkers so you can change the code then run a test to check it is valid before you implement it which has saved a few boot fails.
I don't have much experience with the alternatives or professional solutions but get the impression HASS is in theory one of the most powerful solutions with the downside that it can be a nightmare to get to work with a steep learning curve. They seem very active in taking suggestions for new features / components. I think I read that people are working on a nice friendly GUI for it but not sure what the ETA is.
You can customise everything with enough perseverance so even the icons / interface issue (which doesn't bother me and passes the wife test!) can be sorted if you want. I have a floor plan of the house as a (work in progress) frontend for example which is all touch sensitive i.e. you can tap on the rooms and they change from blue to yellow as lights come on/off.
Re getting started with HASS I started from scratch and used a combo of the examples, documentation and when completely stuck the quite active forums are helpful.
The latest versions have built in checkers so you can change the code then run a test to check it is valid before you implement it which has saved a few boot fails.
I don't have much experience with the alternatives or professional solutions but get the impression HASS is in theory one of the most powerful solutions with the downside that it can be a nightmare to get to work with a steep learning curve. They seem very active in taking suggestions for new features / components. I think I read that people are working on a nice friendly GUI for it but not sure what the ETA is.
You can customise everything with enough perseverance so even the icons / interface issue (which doesn't bother me and passes the wife test!) can be sorted if you want. I have a floor plan of the house as a (work in progress) frontend for example which is all touch sensitive i.e. you can tap on the rooms and they change from blue to yellow as lights come on/off.
boxedin said:
This is the right direction:
http://atmoshome.tech
The compatibility list does not appear to include heating control systems such as heatmiser neo or any MVHR systems.http://atmoshome.tech
pilot-lite said:
Long time listener, first time caller etc...
Re homeassistant, the place to start is here, for the £20 cost of a raspberry pi you'll be up and running in less than an hour.
Expect a bit of a learning curve (the config files are written in YAML for instance), but you can build a solution more powerful and integrating many more components and services than anything Crestron, Control4 and the like can manage.
It is however not a competitor for the like of Crestron. It is now (and I suspect will always remain) a platform for the 'tinkerers'. I happen to enjoy the challenge (troubleshooting is fun!) - 99.99% of people probably wouldn't.
Someone above mentioned the 'mess of icons' - if you don't want to break out the text editor and make things look / work exactly as you like then this probably isn't the solution for you. But if, like me, you want your Sonos speaker to tell you that your journey to work is going to take 10 minutes longer than usual this morning when you get in the shower...
That is the route I'd been thinking of going, however it will be going into a new build so I may end up going for Control4 etc. so that when we come to sell the house there is a clear chain of support for a prospective purchaser.Re homeassistant, the place to start is here, for the £20 cost of a raspberry pi you'll be up and running in less than an hour.
Expect a bit of a learning curve (the config files are written in YAML for instance), but you can build a solution more powerful and integrating many more components and services than anything Crestron, Control4 and the like can manage.
It is however not a competitor for the like of Crestron. It is now (and I suspect will always remain) a platform for the 'tinkerers'. I happen to enjoy the challenge (troubleshooting is fun!) - 99.99% of people probably wouldn't.
Someone above mentioned the 'mess of icons' - if you don't want to break out the text editor and make things look / work exactly as you like then this probably isn't the solution for you. But if, like me, you want your Sonos speaker to tell you that your journey to work is going to take 10 minutes longer than usual this morning when you get in the shower...
VEX said:
lol, you should see the system in a ultra high end apartment I am just about to remove! (moving out and taking components with them)
12 Sky boxes, one per room, but if you hit the record button in the master bathroom, you have to go back to the master bathroom to watch it! Bonkers.
Surely SkyQ fixes that? (although is it still limited to 4(?) rooms?)12 Sky boxes, one per room, but if you hit the record button in the master bathroom, you have to go back to the master bathroom to watch it! Bonkers.
In the normal course of events I would never see the web front end. All my interactions are through perfectly normal light switches (with Fibaro dimmer modules behind), sensors (PIRs, presence detection, etc) and voice.
The goal is that the software should be an invisible presence in the background - always ready to help without ever being in the way - like some kind of 21st century man servant.
Guests shouldn't need a lesson on how to turn on a light - in fact they might not even notice anything is unusual at all (unless they get up for a pee in the middle of the night and the landing and bathroom lights gently dim up to 10% brightness as they step out of the guest bedroom - as they enter the bathroom the bathroom light brightens to 20% brightness, but the extractor fan remains off - unless they're in there for more than 5 minutes... pulling the cord on the light switch as they leave the bathroom the lights gently dim to off).
If I've been forgetful and left the bedside radio on, as I pull out of the drive to head for work, the house can pop up an alert on my iPhone with a button to press which switches the radio back off.
Should there be a leak in the boiler room the house will turn off the incoming water main stopcock and alert me to the fact. Smoke alarm goes off in the middle of the night? All the house lights come on and the front door unlocks (provided we're at home).
Ready for bed? Double click the switch by the bed and the house turns off all the lights and sets the alarm. Hear a noise outside? Triple click and the downstairs and outside lights come on.
My 3 year old does get a little confused when we visit his grandparents house and when he can't reach the light switch saying "Alexa, bedroom light on" doesn't work.
The goal is that the software should be an invisible presence in the background - always ready to help without ever being in the way - like some kind of 21st century man servant.
Guests shouldn't need a lesson on how to turn on a light - in fact they might not even notice anything is unusual at all (unless they get up for a pee in the middle of the night and the landing and bathroom lights gently dim up to 10% brightness as they step out of the guest bedroom - as they enter the bathroom the bathroom light brightens to 20% brightness, but the extractor fan remains off - unless they're in there for more than 5 minutes... pulling the cord on the light switch as they leave the bathroom the lights gently dim to off).
If I've been forgetful and left the bedside radio on, as I pull out of the drive to head for work, the house can pop up an alert on my iPhone with a button to press which switches the radio back off.
Should there be a leak in the boiler room the house will turn off the incoming water main stopcock and alert me to the fact. Smoke alarm goes off in the middle of the night? All the house lights come on and the front door unlocks (provided we're at home).
Ready for bed? Double click the switch by the bed and the house turns off all the lights and sets the alarm. Hear a noise outside? Triple click and the downstairs and outside lights come on.
My 3 year old does get a little confused when we visit his grandparents house and when he can't reach the light switch saying "Alexa, bedroom light on" doesn't work.
Toltec said:
That is the route I'd been thinking of going, however it will be going into a new build so I may end up going for Control4 etc. so that when we come to sell the house there is a clear chain of support for a prospective purchaser.
One of the drivers for using Fibaro Dimmer modules behind regular switches is that I can just remove the module and the switch is back to a normal 'dumb' switch. All communication is over Z-Wave and zigbee wireless so no additional wiring anywhere. Unless you're at the very top end of the market then home automation is I doubt something people would place at a premium. I suspect it might put off more buyers than it would attract.pilot-lite said:
Toltec said:
That is the route I'd been thinking of going, however it will be going into a new build so I may end up going for Control4 etc. so that when we come to sell the house there is a clear chain of support for a prospective purchaser.
One of the drivers for using Fibaro Dimmer modules behind regular switches is that I can just remove the module and the switch is back to a normal 'dumb' switch. All communication is over Z-Wave and zigbee wireless so no additional wiring anywhere. Unless you're at the very top end of the market then home automation is I doubt something people would place at a premium. I suspect it might put off more buyers than it would attract.The house will be in the one to two million region so in the mid range market really, wouldn't be looking to go for anything too whizzy, just add some occupancy detection and time of day to adjust room temperatures and lighting. I doubt I'd even bother with geofencing just keep it simple with an entry/exit switch and some remote monitoring for security.
mickmcpaddy said:
I've seen fibre for sky dish cabling, that looks useful, must be so much easier than running multiple co-ax's to the dish when its a long way from the multiswitch or splitter.
Yes, we did a big upgrade last year to an apartment block in central London, 8 dishes (8 different satellites) on the roof, 5 Risers and 199 Apartment. That was 32 thick coax cables in each riser. Upgraded to 1x 8 core fibre about 1cm in diameter. It was a lot of splicing, testing and cleaning though. monthefish said:
VEX said:
lol, you should see the system in a ultra high end apartment I am just about to remove! (moving out and taking components with them)
12 Sky boxes, one per room, but if you hit the record button in the master bathroom, you have to go back to the master bathroom to watch it! Bonkers.
Surely SkyQ fixes that? (although is it still limited to 4(?) rooms?)12 Sky boxes, one per room, but if you hit the record button in the master bathroom, you have to go back to the master bathroom to watch it! Bonkers.
How is control 4 wired up, I see they do wireless switches for lighting but these obviously still need power to work, are they wired in cat 5 or use the normal T&E for power.
Do they make wired switches as well if it was going in a new build or renovation, if so I take it they just sit on a network bus now and one switch can wire from the other or do they all need wiring back individually back to the dimmer packs like the lutron system. Someone was talking about it today and suggested they may fit it in their barn conversion when they do it.
Do they make wired switches as well if it was going in a new build or renovation, if so I take it they just sit on a network bus now and one switch can wire from the other or do they all need wiring back individually back to the dimmer packs like the lutron system. Someone was talking about it today and suggested they may fit it in their barn conversion when they do it.
chasingracecars said:
The Control4 wireless light switches use the light power, I am a Control4 dealer if you need any questions.
That's handy to know, it was mentioned at the site meeting today that it may be fitted .I'm not sure what he wants but its going to be a complete renovation so everything will be fully accessible. I found this which was quite helpful (PDF download)
http://www.genesis-tech.eu/images/dealers/Control4...
After a bit of reading the wireless switches are used in a retro fit application where the lights are already wired conventionally, a bit like the Lightwave stuff but in a new installation you would just daisy chain the switches with a single cable - what type of cable is this, cat5, two core or something else?
Is Control4 something that can be installed and set up by an electirican or is it more like Lutron where a bod in a shirt and tie comes round, spends a day with a laptop and walks off with many thousands of pounds after the electrician has done all the grunt work? I wouldn't mind having a go at it.
The setup he wants to do in his converted barn is 3 individual 2 bed houses and a communal games / bar area. He wants all the usual like smart lighting, ceiling speakers, CCTV, HDTV etc.
For me the first question on this one is ‘is it for personal use, resale or rental. IMO they all have slightly different needs and requirements.
Control4 is a dealer supply and fit, although most shouldn’t be anywhere near the cost of Lutron. We did an 8 house / factory conversion 2 years ago and the cost of Lutron Graphic Eye on the ground floor we did the whole house with Rako.
Chat to ChasingRacecars for C4 and I am happy to help if needed but not a C4 dealer.
Control4 is a dealer supply and fit, although most shouldn’t be anywhere near the cost of Lutron. We did an 8 house / factory conversion 2 years ago and the cost of Lutron Graphic Eye on the ground floor we did the whole house with Rako.
Chat to ChasingRacecars for C4 and I am happy to help if needed but not a C4 dealer.
Thanks Vex,
Yes in order to program Control4 you need to have access to the dealer portal as the software used checks this every time the software is started that it’s a live license.
There is a Control4 home software but it’s very limited.
Rako is good for lighting and all three main ones Lutron Rako and Control4 offer wireless systems, however if doing a base build I would consider the centralised lighting system. This is where all the dimmers and switches are located in a central place. All the keypads are wired but not directly to a light circuit.
Control4 and Lutron keypads are a bit more styish I would say than Rako. However a big trade show is on next week and most manufactures launch new stuff here.
I am hoping to head out for a day/night so will update.
Yes in order to program Control4 you need to have access to the dealer portal as the software used checks this every time the software is started that it’s a live license.
There is a Control4 home software but it’s very limited.
Rako is good for lighting and all three main ones Lutron Rako and Control4 offer wireless systems, however if doing a base build I would consider the centralised lighting system. This is where all the dimmers and switches are located in a central place. All the keypads are wired but not directly to a light circuit.
Control4 and Lutron keypads are a bit more styish I would say than Rako. However a big trade show is on next week and most manufactures launch new stuff here.
I am hoping to head out for a day/night so will update.
Has the removal of ‘works with nest’ been mentioned here?
I’ve logged into Nest today for the first time in a while and have been told to migrate my account to Google, as Nest will soon stop.
It appears they want all nest device to work with google smart home, which is crap as I have all Alexa hubs. I’ve just read the Alexa nest skill will no longer be available when I move over, so won’t be able to change my thermostat with Alexa.
I’ve logged into Nest today for the first time in a while and have been told to migrate my account to Google, as Nest will soon stop.
It appears they want all nest device to work with google smart home, which is crap as I have all Alexa hubs. I’ve just read the Alexa nest skill will no longer be available when I move over, so won’t be able to change my thermostat with Alexa.
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