Now that everyone is renting their music and cars
Discussion
Most definitely not due to the insecurity of not knowing whether your landlord is selling or taking it back for their own use. My longest and best rental were 5 and 7 years even then it was difficult as they initially didn't want to rent to me. Only got it when their preferred tenant fell through and the other was too picky (lucky for me as I got it much cheaper than advertised even though I had to put in a guarantor). Years of moving meant my sentimental belongings are still in their boxes yet to see the daylight from all the moving. It's also not helped by the high admin charges, 3 or 4 times a year home visit inspection, passport inspection, arrogant estate agents keeping viewers waiting and not passing on repair works that needs to be done. The only down side to owning your own home is the repair/upkeep costs. My first home isn't imy preferred location but I'm learning to adapt and slowly loving it with good public transport and amenities. Otherwise I wouldn't be able to get on the housing ladder as the rental costs have increase from £550 to £750-£1000 which will end up depleting my savings while reaching for the dream location.
Edited by barleyskillet on Saturday 17th February 23:59
227bhp said:
Awww, there there, stroke his hair 
It's precisely that attitude from your generation that has brought them up to be the way they are now, that's why they don't get it.
It's nothing to do with luck, I decided to work hard for it - you must have missed my point where I said I'm not advising how he spends his money, just don't complain when you decide to go motor racing and can't afford to buy a £400k house.
It's a relatively pointless argument anyhow unless he submits a spreadsheet listing all his incoming and outgoing, and that's not going to happen (neither would I).
Would you afford me some sympathy if I posted up I can't afford to race because i've got a mortgage to pay? I do doubt it.
Don’t blame my parents, they’re the best. It's precisely that attitude from your generation that has brought them up to be the way they are now, that's why they don't get it.
It's nothing to do with luck, I decided to work hard for it - you must have missed my point where I said I'm not advising how he spends his money, just don't complain when you decide to go motor racing and can't afford to buy a £400k house.
It's a relatively pointless argument anyhow unless he submits a spreadsheet listing all his incoming and outgoing, and that's not going to happen (neither would I).
Would you afford me some sympathy if I posted up I can't afford to race because i've got a mortgage to pay? I do doubt it.
I don’t know where the idea that I don’t work hard came from, or that I expect a ‘£400k house’... in fact you’ve been casting all kinds of aspersions about me throughout the thread.
HustleRussell said:
Don’t blame my parents, they’re the best.
I don’t know where the idea that I don’t work hard came from, or that I expect a ‘£400k house’... in fact you’ve been casting all kinds of aspersions about me throughout the thread.
I think the various facts that have Emirates from this thread are:I don’t know where the idea that I don’t work hard came from, or that I expect a ‘£400k house’... in fact you’ve been casting all kinds of aspersions about me throughout the thread.
1: You have absolutely no problem whatsoever when it comes to buying your first home.
2: Your mother is a very good cook.
3: Your father has too large a workshop.
4: You know what side your bread is buttered.
And 5: You cannot claim that youngsters can’t get on the housing ladder because you know from your own personal experience that that is complete b
ks. Edited by DonkeyApple on Sunday 18th February 01:25
Well as I have said already, this isn’t the HustleRussell ‘woe is me’ thread, I am just observing that even in my situation which is a good situation, savings, salary etc having worked for so long I am still borderline at best on affordability and it remains a fact that I am the only one close to doing among my peers, the ones who are ‘homeowners’ have had big help from Mum and Dad.
HustleRussell said:
...I am still borderline at best on affordability...
And that's the point. No, you aren't. Also - you're looking at a single income in a dual-income world. People have been buying on dual incomes for the last four or five decades, since women were freed from being tied to the cooker all day.HustleRussell said:
and it remains a fact that I am the only one close to doing among my peers, the ones who are ‘homeowners’ have had big help from Mum and Dad.
...and we get back to the expenditure priorities, don't we?If we're talking about a £35k income, then we're talking about only a relatively small jump above the national average full-time income, yet you can still afford to buy in one of the most expensive parts of the country.
HustleRussell said:
Well as I have said already, this isn’t the HustleRussell ‘woe is me’ thread, I am just observing that even in my situation which is a good situation, savings, salary etc having worked for so long I am still borderline at best on affordability and it remains a fact that I am the only one close to doing among my peers, the ones who are ‘homeowners’ have had big help from Mum and Dad.
Yes but all of that is totally irrelevant because as you’ve explained you have more than enough funds and income to purchase a perfectly good home in a perfectly good area should you wish. You just don’t wish to do so because there is no need to fly the nest yet. And unless your peers are earning significantly less than you then the reason they have utilised the bank of mum and dad is either because they’ve been over spending and not saving or want a bigger gaff in a nicer area than their salary permits. Ergo it’s 100% down to them and nothing to do with the property market. It’s is in fact somewhat insulting for all those who are genuinely grafting to secure their first home. Like when someone not remotely humble keeps saying something is humbling.
HustleRussell said:
Again with the suggestion that somehow I’m not ‘genuinely grafting’?
£35k/year is the average full-time income for the SE, and £10k less than the average FT income for London - and you're competing in the local market with dual-income London commuters.https://statswales.gov.wales/Catalogue/Business-Ec...
HustleRussell said:
DonkeyApple said:
It’s is in fact somewhat insulting for all those who are genuinely grafting to secure their first home. Like when someone not remotely humble keeps saying something is humbling.
Again with the suggestion that somehow I’m not ‘genuinely grafting’? You’re very much on the other side of the property debate and really should recognise that. ‘Grafting’ is not just the work aspect but the sacrifices. Living at home in a lovely house, enjoying owning race cars, having the luxury of time and wealth to play with them and having a workshop while also having an easy work commute to a good job and all while saving over £60k to eventually go towards a property whenever you wish simply does not put you in a position whatsoever to complain about the state of the property market.
You have a luxurious existence with nothing to complain about.
And it’s also beginning to look like you won’t even have house price inflation to struggle with at the most crucial period for moving up through the ladder as your career and family progresses.
HustleRussell said:
How many times, I’m not in here for sympathy, I observe that none of my friends 27-30 have been able to buy property without help. It’s hard to do it. I happen to be the closest to doing it by virtue of not fking about, getting a job and keeping at it for my entire adult life.
You're being baited. Don't take it.king about, getting a job and keeping at it for my entire adult life. Vincefox said:
You're being baited. Don't take it.
To give people the benefit of the doubt, I’d say that my intention has been misconstrued. TooMany2cvs said:
HustleRussell said:
I happen to be the closest to doing it by virtue of not fking about, getting a job and keeping at it for my entire adult life.
Umm, yes. That's always been a bit of a given.king about, getting a job and keeping at it for my entire adult life. HustleRussell said:
How many times, I’m not in here for sympathy, I observe that none of my friends 27-30 have been able to buy property without help. It’s hard to do it. I happen to be the closest to doing it by virtue of not fking about, getting a job and keeping at it for my entire adult life.
Russell, you close to doing it because you have not had to pay rent, not had to pay bills, not had to pay for food, not had to pay a huge commuting bill, not had to pay for car storage, not had to pay for a workshop. All that cash in your bank account is not there because you are a hero but because of your parents. king about, getting a job and keeping at it for my entire adult life. . There is absolutely nothing wrong in that and anyone who has that enormous advantage and does not make use of it is a plank but please let’s continue to try and link this to the real issues that normal young men have with regards to getting onto the property ladder. It is actually rather offensive. You do not own a home because you have no need to yet and have chosen not to take that step. There is nothing about the property market that is holding you back.
What you observe about yourself and your peers is the curse of the City working, middle class suburban boy. And it is nothing new. We’ve always existed but some of us recognised the monumental gift of our good fortune and used it to enormous advantage to prosper, others went to mum and dad for benefits handouts to subsidise their over extravagant lifestyles and unentitled first property expectations.
among my age peer group the very same people are spending thousands a month on dining, tens of thousands on holidays and having tapped their parents for a lifestyle subsidy in their 20s in the guise of a ‘flat deposit’ they are now tapping up for their lifestyle subsidy via having the children’s school fees paid for by the grandparents.
Your scenario is nothing new and it’s nothing to do with the state of the property market or the cost of living. Your peers probably haven’t worked that out. I suspect you do understand this and that is probably why when you’re my age (45) and you take another look at yourself and your peers they will still be living on benefits and claiming it’s the cost of property that means their parents need to pay the kids school fees while they enjoy fine dining and extravagant holidays, whereas you will have met and married someone more normal, have a normal life and be living in a nice normal home, in a normal area and not a scrounger living off benefits.
DonkeyApple said:
That is not strictly speaking true. While there is no doubt that residential property prices have been inflated beyond fair value by deliberately relaxed lending it is not the case that you cannot purchase a home if you’re earning less than 3x national average salary.
And let’s separate the action of building up a deposit from the future lending aspect of any purchase as they are two highly distinct phases and while there are obvious relationships between the two acts they are both fealty with very differently.
First of all you need to strip down the group of people who are complaining they cannot buy a property into those for whom it has never been feasible and those for whom it should be. Ie removed the unrealistic from the scenario.
Second, with the group who are left who should be your traditional workers with a serious intent to own their family home we need to them look at why they are struggling to build up a deposit. Of course we must recognise that during the period of lax lending and the deliberate inflation of property values the deposit requirements were artificially deflated and that today they are back at more prudent and appropriate levels but what is it that is stopping those in their 20s who fit the traditional home buying demographic from building a deposit? If you’re of this correct demographic then what is it that after paying your rent, utilities and pension contributions that is meaning there is no money left to allocate to a deposit?
In the past it used to be that those who were in the socio economic group where owning a property was feasible would save for a deposit by not renting a flat but renting just a room, by going without meals out except for special occasions, not going shopping as a past time but focusing solely on building up that deposit and increasing their salary.
Now my business does a lot of analysis of consumer spending habits as we need to understand which groups have the wealth levels that will enable them to become customers and the big shift that we have seen among the under 35s of today who fit the income and work profile of logically being home owners is that they are not being frugal but are being profligate. Highly profligate. They have the monthly spending characteristics of the traditional bottom end renter, spending all net income on leisure. They aren’t acting as potential future home owners. When we look at the data we see people spending huge amounts on renting entire properties and with numerous monthly contracts for non essential goods and services and almost daily cars expenses on buying lunch and eating and drinking out.
People in their 20s are buying homes without being given their deposit. They’re out there in abundance but they are doing so by having the appropriate career path and by not consuming non essential goods so as to create the required deposit themselves.
If someone genuinely wants to buy a home they need to understand that lenders need to see evidence that the customer is a grown up who understands life priorities and not someone living the life of the 70s disco diva.
I haven't yet read the rest of the thread but this post is bang on.And let’s separate the action of building up a deposit from the future lending aspect of any purchase as they are two highly distinct phases and while there are obvious relationships between the two acts they are both fealty with very differently.
First of all you need to strip down the group of people who are complaining they cannot buy a property into those for whom it has never been feasible and those for whom it should be. Ie removed the unrealistic from the scenario.
Second, with the group who are left who should be your traditional workers with a serious intent to own their family home we need to them look at why they are struggling to build up a deposit. Of course we must recognise that during the period of lax lending and the deliberate inflation of property values the deposit requirements were artificially deflated and that today they are back at more prudent and appropriate levels but what is it that is stopping those in their 20s who fit the traditional home buying demographic from building a deposit? If you’re of this correct demographic then what is it that after paying your rent, utilities and pension contributions that is meaning there is no money left to allocate to a deposit?
In the past it used to be that those who were in the socio economic group where owning a property was feasible would save for a deposit by not renting a flat but renting just a room, by going without meals out except for special occasions, not going shopping as a past time but focusing solely on building up that deposit and increasing their salary.
Now my business does a lot of analysis of consumer spending habits as we need to understand which groups have the wealth levels that will enable them to become customers and the big shift that we have seen among the under 35s of today who fit the income and work profile of logically being home owners is that they are not being frugal but are being profligate. Highly profligate. They have the monthly spending characteristics of the traditional bottom end renter, spending all net income on leisure. They aren’t acting as potential future home owners. When we look at the data we see people spending huge amounts on renting entire properties and with numerous monthly contracts for non essential goods and services and almost daily cars expenses on buying lunch and eating and drinking out.
People in their 20s are buying homes without being given their deposit. They’re out there in abundance but they are doing so by having the appropriate career path and by not consuming non essential goods so as to create the required deposit themselves.
If someone genuinely wants to buy a home they need to understand that lenders need to see evidence that the customer is a grown up who understands life priorities and not someone living the life of the 70s disco diva.
I'm 'lucky' I have a well paid job now after a few years of hard work and learning but buying a house at 25 (2 years ago) wasn't the huge deal that it's made out to be.
I rented a room with all bills included for £400 a month and enjoyed little to no luxuries for nearly 2 years to scrape the deposit I needed whilst friends were out partying and living an extravagant lifestyle.
2 years on and I can easily afford my mortgage payments and now have extra money to spend on the more extravagant luxuries that I missed out on and yet all I hear my friends do is moan about how hard it is to buy a house and they'll never be able to do it.
I'm certainly not alone in this case either and must admit to being a bit jealous of a coworker who managed to climb into the same career as me and life the same way to buy his first house at 22.
I'm making the next move now to climb the ladder with my girlfriend now who will match my deposit thanks to the bank of mum and dad, lucky for her but then I don't feel she will appreciate it as much as I do coming from nothing and working my way into this position.
HustleRussell said:
Vincefox said:
You're being baited. Don't take it.
To give people the benefit of the doubt, I’d say that my intention has been misconstrued. HustleRussell said:
TooMany2cvs said:
HustleRussell said:
I happen to be the closest to doing it by virtue of not fking about, getting a job and keeping at it for my entire adult life.
Umm, yes. That's always been a bit of a given.king about, getting a job and keeping at it for my entire adult life. king about", rather than "not taking the opportunities available to you". Being relatively uneducated is not laudable, y'know. That, at a time when damn near 50% of under 30s are either in higher education or have completed it, is also probably holding your career - and income - progression back. Sure, you're not in student debt - but the increased income would soon sort that.DonkeyApple said:
Russell, you close to doing it because you have not had to pay rent, not had to pay bills, not had to pay for food, not had to pay a huge commuting bill, not had to pay for car storage, not had to pay for a workshop.
You are not being unfair on the whole but you do make a whole heap of assumptions here, a few of which are incorrect. Gassing Station | Homes, Gardens and DIY | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff