Now that everyone is renting their music and cars
Discussion
drainbrain said:
Here Russell. I've found one for you in Surrey. £60k deposit. £35k salary with 4x multiplier to mortgage the balance.
http://www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/prope...
Send my £1k sourcing fee to the account I'll pm you.
(by the way, that took less than 30 secs to find)
Ps: I'd like a link to that mongolian goat farm 'opportunity' if you have it.
£200K for three rooms in a converted house. That's just depressing!http://www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/prope...
Send my £1k sourcing fee to the account I'll pm you.
(by the way, that took less than 30 secs to find)
Ps: I'd like a link to that mongolian goat farm 'opportunity' if you have it.
Edited by drainbrain on Saturday 17th February 16:20
HustleRussell said:
I have learned something about mortgages in this thread. 3x salary is quoted as a rule of thumb everywhere (I have done a lot of homework on moneysavingexpert) with that I have zero options without moving much further out. 4x is closer, any more than that and it’s basically doable.
Forgive me, but have you actually sat down with a mortgage advisor and found out what you actually could borrow?If you’re going to be on here saying how unaffordable it is and all you want to do is buy a house then finding out what your position actually is (rather than guessing from MSE or similar) would be the way forward?
I am sympathetic - I raced cars for a couple of seasons but then gave that up to buy my first house...
I rent. I to own,but a divorce messed that up. Luckily I got out by 'only' losing the house and manageable debt. I kept everything else.
I quite like renting, I was in my first place for 18 months and moved because it was only ever going to be a quick bolt hole. I'm on notice where I am now, because my landlord has run out of money and needs to sell. Bit of a pain, but I get the pick of where I want to live, with little outlay. Plus of course, no maintenance costs. I think it largely depends on what area you are renting in, and what monthly outlay you are happy with.
Sounds morbid, but my dad owns his house outright, and when he goes it will be mine. Which at the moment, I think I might rent out. I'm also looking at taking my pension annuity in future and buying another house to rent.
Nothing wrong with renting, provided you find the right place, and have a plan to pay the rent forever. The downside is of course, you may be served notice, and that you never own your home. But I don't necessarily see the latter as a problem.
I quite like renting, I was in my first place for 18 months and moved because it was only ever going to be a quick bolt hole. I'm on notice where I am now, because my landlord has run out of money and needs to sell. Bit of a pain, but I get the pick of where I want to live, with little outlay. Plus of course, no maintenance costs. I think it largely depends on what area you are renting in, and what monthly outlay you are happy with.
Sounds morbid, but my dad owns his house outright, and when he goes it will be mine. Which at the moment, I think I might rent out. I'm also looking at taking my pension annuity in future and buying another house to rent.
Nothing wrong with renting, provided you find the right place, and have a plan to pay the rent forever. The downside is of course, you may be served notice, and that you never own your home. But I don't necessarily see the latter as a problem.
HustleRussell said:
Epsom, working in Leatherhead but likely to work in London. Looking at Sutton, you don’t get anything for less than about 280 and I’m talking one bed middle floor flat in 1960s prefab block.
I’m sure you really do get why people *might* refer to you as “generation snowflake”. After all, you’re kinda whinging that you can’t buy a big house in an expensive part of the U.K. whilst also indulging in a £20k+ a year hobby.Your £60k deposit would provide a healthy 20% deposit on the Sutton (nice area) flat, leaving a modest £1000 pm mortgage, mostly offset by the property’s capital appreciation. If you halted racing until, say, 40 years old the extra money stuffed into overpayments could see you mortgage free before your 45. Then you can go GT racing.
I really fail to see what you real problem is. That is unless you want it all, and you want it now.
HustleRussell said:
DonkeyApple said:
Russell, you close to doing it because you have not had to pay rent, not had to pay bills, not had to pay for food, not had to pay a huge commuting bill, not had to pay for car storage, not had to pay for a workshop.
You are not being unfair on the whole but you do make a whole heap of assumptions here, a few of which are incorrect. 
I was no different from you. And after Uni I opted to stay at my parents in order to build up my deposit. I had the luxury of parents who lived in Town and had a workshop and space for my cars. My personal issue was that at that throughout my time the property market was racing away so each time I took a step on the ladder the jump to the next step up was only about £100-£200k but by the time I’d built up another deposit and moved my career up the jump was £500k and debt was 5-6% and career steps further apart.
What benefited me during my 20s and building up my deposit was that I used that deposit combined with recognising Inwas in a totally risk free part of my life to invest and use my CGT alliance to build an even larger deposit. During your entire 20s you’ve had the total gift of out of control asset inflation to the point that investment in almost any traditional asset class will have yeilded absolutely enormous growth.
If I look back to my father, he had to give up flying, motorsport, shooting and yachting to purchase the family home he wanted.
I’m now 45 and to get back the workshop facilities I want and the space and time to take back up a bit of motor sport and shooting I have traded a home at £1250/sqft for one at £330/sqft two hours from central London.
But none of that would have been possible if I had not recognised that if I want a home commensurate with my expectations I mustn’t chuck money away on a lifestyle remotely similar to my parents who were at a very different stage of their lives and even then I was never going to have the sort of property they had in the sort of location they were in. When I finally moved into NW3 that type of property was £10m+
MrOrange said:
I’m sure you really do get why people *might* refer to you as “generation snowflake”. After all, you’re kinda whinging that you can’t buy a big house in an expensive part of the U.K. whilst also indulging in a £20k+ a year hobby.
Your £60k deposit would provide a healthy 20% deposit on the Sutton (nice area) flat, leaving a modest £1000 pm mortgage, mostly offset by the property’s capital appreciation. If you halted racing until, say, 40 years old the extra money stuffed into overpayments could see you mortgage free before your 45. Then you can go GT racing.
I really fail to see what you real problem is. That is unless you want it all, and you want it now.
I think we should avoid this ‘generation snowflake’ term though. It’s really not nice or accurate. You only need to look around at all the whinging pensioners who have had a lifetime to save for their old age and get prepared or all the Gen X living off parental benefits to subsidise a lifestyle beyond their means to appreciate that ‘snowflakes’ are abundant in every generation and that in amongst them are all the completely normal people just doing what has always been done and living within their means and making a good go of it and not whinging about the price of shiny things they don’t need. Your £60k deposit would provide a healthy 20% deposit on the Sutton (nice area) flat, leaving a modest £1000 pm mortgage, mostly offset by the property’s capital appreciation. If you halted racing until, say, 40 years old the extra money stuffed into overpayments could see you mortgage free before your 45. Then you can go GT racing.
I really fail to see what you real problem is. That is unless you want it all, and you want it now.
DoubleD said:
227bhp said:
DoubleD said:
covmutley said:
All just part of the entitlement snowflake cultIt's where kids grow up being told that they have rights, no winners or losers everything is society's fault and the government needs to solve their problems
This paragraph is such a commonly written thing on PH. Its rather tedious to be honest.Edited by covmutley on Saturday 17th February 18:16
But if you're referring to the other post then no I don't, everybody views things differently. Generations have gone through different times of good and bad, austerity and indulgence. It would be interesting to look at a log of peoples perceptions over the years.
The rot truly set in under Tony Blair. He told everyone that things would be better, they were worth more than this and utopia for all was around the corner.
He started what I call the L'Oreal generation (Because I'm worth it). A nation of entitled want it now, it's not my fault spineless workshy drains on society.
He started what I call the L'Oreal generation (Because I'm worth it). A nation of entitled want it now, it's not my fault spineless workshy drains on society.
HustleRussell said:
227bhp said:
Awww, there there, stroke his hair 
It's precisely that attitude from your generation that has brought them up to be the way they are now, that's why they don't get it.
It's nothing to do with luck, I decided to work hard for it - you must have missed my point where I said I'm not advising how he spends his money, just don't complain when you decide to go motor racing and can't afford to buy a £400k house.
It's a relatively pointless argument anyhow unless he submits a spreadsheet listing all his incoming and outgoing, and that's not going to happen (neither would I).
Would you afford me some sympathy if I posted up I can't afford to race because i've got a mortgage to pay? I do doubt it.
Don’t blame my parents, they’re the best. It's precisely that attitude from your generation that has brought them up to be the way they are now, that's why they don't get it.
It's nothing to do with luck, I decided to work hard for it - you must have missed my point where I said I'm not advising how he spends his money, just don't complain when you decide to go motor racing and can't afford to buy a £400k house.
It's a relatively pointless argument anyhow unless he submits a spreadsheet listing all his incoming and outgoing, and that's not going to happen (neither would I).
Would you afford me some sympathy if I posted up I can't afford to race because i've got a mortgage to pay? I do doubt it.
I don’t know where the idea that I don’t work hard came from, or that I expect a ‘£400k house’... in fact you’ve been casting all kinds of aspersions about me throughout the thread.
I never claimed you didn't work hard either, I can't. You're just picking bits out of what i've written and ignoring the rest.
I've quite clearly said that you've decided to live your life the way you have and so have I.
It's just that I don't blame anything or anyone for my situation, I can't - I was in charge of it.
Tyre Smoke said:
The rot truly set in under Tony Blair. He told everyone that things would be better, they were worth more than this and utopia for all was around the corner.
He started what I call the L'Oreal generation (Because I'm worth it). A nation of entitled want it now, it's not my fault spineless workshy drains on society.
Apart from the minor detail that it's now 11 years since his 10yr stint as PM finished, does that mean this is unique to the UK...?He started what I call the L'Oreal generation (Because I'm worth it). A nation of entitled want it now, it's not my fault spineless workshy drains on society.
DonkeyApple said:
I think we should avoid this ‘generation snowflake’ term though. It’s really not nice or accurate. You only need to look around at all the whinging pensioners who have had a lifetime to save for their old age and get prepared or all the Gen X living off parental benefits to subsidise a lifestyle beyond their means to appreciate that ‘snowflakes’ are abundant in every generation and that in amongst them are all the completely normal people just doing what has always been done and living within their means and making a good go of it and not whinging about the price of shiny things they don’t need.
Yes I agree, but that perception comes from < THIS > ^ where we are now; the internet society. You only have to read this forum to be drawn to conclude that people can't wipe their own arses without having to ask someone how to do it. Once you get out into the real world and away from this you start to realise it isn't all like that in real life.nickfrog said:
227bhp said:
nickfrog said:
HustleRussell said:
Classic PH, I point out that modest property around me is out of reach even though I have worked full time since I was 18, saved up a significant deposit and have a job which pays a moderate wage and PH deduces that I’m socially inept, work shy and ‘can’t be arsed’ to do anything.
Yes I saw the comment and it was very condescending, particularly in light of your contributions to PH who are very eloquent and useful.You don't exactly come across as a thick slacker and I sympathise with you as my kids are only slightly younger than you, very successful too professionally but simply won't buy a home for a while, however clever/creative they are.
You and them belong to the first generation who didn't surf the affordable property wave because there isn't one and it's very easy for older people to be condescending when the only thing they had was luck on their side, almost however thick/uneducated they were.
It's precisely that attitude from your generation that has brought them up to be the way they are now, that's why they don't get it.
It's nothing to do with luck, I decided to work hard for it - you must have missed my point where I said I'm not advising how he spends his money, just don't complain when you decide to go motor racing and can't afford to buy a £400k house.
It's a relatively pointless argument anyhow unless he submits a spreadsheet listing all his incoming and outgoing, and that's not going to happen (neither would I).
Would you afford me some sympathy if I posted up I can't afford to race because i've got a mortgage to pay? I do doubt it.
If you even glance at the evolution of house prices vs income over the past 20 years, you might realise that being on the market at the right time through luck is a massive factor, however hard you work at your luck. The data is simply compelling.
I don't believe in sweeping statements so no it's not always or not just because of lack of luck. Conversely, I don't believe EVERYONE in my generation have brought kids up with a particular attitude (actually humans don't change that quickly, it's very slow and gradual) nor that "they" are ALL like you say, it's just a minority, probably a noisy one though, hence the misguided perception.
We are also discussing someone who neither of us know (I certainly don't) which is never going to get us far and is a bit unfair really.
When I refered to snowflakes I said culture, I didn't mean individuals. There are a lot of hard working and decent young people. Most of them probably.
But my concern is how society is setting up the narrative. It must make it harder for young people!
Take the recent reporting in the news about millenials having far less money than old people. And I am supposed to be not only surprised by this, but also see some lack of fairness or equality in that situation?
This is what I am talking about, not the young people themselves but the victim mentality and other snowflakr agendas that are seeming to take over mainstream media they will have to cut through to succeed in life
But my concern is how society is setting up the narrative. It must make it harder for young people!
Take the recent reporting in the news about millenials having far less money than old people. And I am supposed to be not only surprised by this, but also see some lack of fairness or equality in that situation?
This is what I am talking about, not the young people themselves but the victim mentality and other snowflakr agendas that are seeming to take over mainstream media they will have to cut through to succeed in life
Whilst not specifically referring to Hustle, there's been a few mentions of 'generation snowflake' that seem aimed at the population general, and these are misplaced.
I'd suggest that these people take a look at the numbers - which are simply mind boggling. A chap in this thread mentioned that his house increased £10k in value every year - that's actually about the average.
In the UK, the median house price is about £225k. Last year it was £215k.
That means that every 2.5 years, the average house price in the UK increases an amount equal to the average salary in the UK.
So every 2.5 years we are adding on another multiplier to the house price/income ratio.
Insane.
In 1996 average house prices were 3.6 times average combined income.
In 2016 average house prices are 7.6 times average combined income.
I wonder how some of you would have coped if in 1996 your house purchase was literally double the price in relation to your salary?
I'd suggest that these people take a look at the numbers - which are simply mind boggling. A chap in this thread mentioned that his house increased £10k in value every year - that's actually about the average.
In the UK, the median house price is about £225k. Last year it was £215k.
That means that every 2.5 years, the average house price in the UK increases an amount equal to the average salary in the UK.
So every 2.5 years we are adding on another multiplier to the house price/income ratio.
Insane.
In 1996 average house prices were 3.6 times average combined income.
In 2016 average house prices are 7.6 times average combined income.
I wonder how some of you would have coped if in 1996 your house purchase was literally double the price in relation to your salary?
Edited by anonymous-user on Sunday 18th February 13:26
covmutley said:
This is what I am talking about, not the young people themselves but the victim mentality and other snowflakr agendas that are seeming to take over mainstream media they will have to cut through to succeed in life
It's not victim mentality and it's not a snowflake agenda. You realize that factual records are kept of incomes and house prices right? This stuff isn't made up?If you did know that (you surely couldn't) then you'd know that house prices have massively increased whilst incomes haven't.
It is empirically obvious that it is much more difficult to 'succeed' in these respects.
I dont disagree, our housing market is broken.
But you also need to look at things wider. Practically everything else in life has got cheaper!
If you don't think that these type of messages out there then fair enough. I will be teaching my kids that hard work pays off, that they should but a house, that they should find a way to buy a house, that they can have a pension if they save from an early age and are smart with their money, etc.
Maybe it is just me, but I don't hear any of this in the media. I mainly hear it is the government s fault.
But you also need to look at things wider. Practically everything else in life has got cheaper!
If you don't think that these type of messages out there then fair enough. I will be teaching my kids that hard work pays off, that they should but a house, that they should find a way to buy a house, that they can have a pension if they save from an early age and are smart with their money, etc.
Maybe it is just me, but I don't hear any of this in the media. I mainly hear it is the government s fault.
Edited by covmutley on Sunday 18th February 13:34
covmutley said:
I dont disagree, our housing market is broken.
But you also need to look at things wider. Practically everything else in life has got cheaper!
No it hasn't, it's actually the opposite. Income growth as compared to CPI/RPI has been negative for a long time.But you also need to look at things wider. Practically everything else in life has got cheaper!
Put simply, things are getting more expensive in relation to income.
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