Breathable floors, limecrete or other optoins?
Discussion
I wouldn't worry overly - by all means dig into the wall somewhere to check but when I turned an existing window into a door everything was bone dry internally even down to near ground level.
If you think about it the path for any water to soak up through internal lime mortar around many layers of almost impermeable rock is pretty tortuous even once it gets up through the typically huge foundation stones. Add in the fact that the cement based mortar is still somewhat permeable (just less so than lime) and any trapped water should still be able to escape.
If you think about it the path for any water to soak up through internal lime mortar around many layers of almost impermeable rock is pretty tortuous even once it gets up through the typically huge foundation stones. Add in the fact that the cement based mortar is still somewhat permeable (just less so than lime) and any trapped water should still be able to escape.
monkfish1 said:
Magooagain said:
I agree with the cement pointing doing no harm to granite rock etc,but what method was used to build many granite and other hard stone buildings?
They won't have been laid in cement mortar
And there's a high chance the foundation stones are laid on soil and probably the rest of the stones are laid with a soil/chalk/lime mortar mix.
So that allows moisture to be sponged up from below the ground level where there is no cement pointing.
So where does that moisture go if it can't get out through lime pointing?
This is a question troubling me on my latest aquisition. Its been pointed in cement inside and out. The stone is harder than a hard thing. Utterley imperviois to moisture.They won't have been laid in cement mortar
And there's a high chance the foundation stones are laid on soil and probably the rest of the stones are laid with a soil/chalk/lime mortar mix.
So that allows moisture to be sponged up from below the ground level where there is no cement pointing.
So where does that moisture go if it can't get out through lime pointing?
Ive primed myself to remove it all and repoint in lime, but there no evidence of damp. Yet. But it is stone with rubble in-fill. As you say, by any measure of logic, the lime mortar that is "in" the wall may well be wet. If it stays that way, it will degrade long term.
What to do????
I'm in the middle of renovating a large granite house in France. The exterior has an old lime render but two very large areas have been repaired with sand and cement. The client is telling me just to leave it. But I think that's just a budget issue.
I've removed all the plaster to the two principal rooms on the ground floor. This stone house has been built on soil with huge granite stones as foundations and then granite stones with a mixed infill.
The walls are dry. We've had a very hot summer.
I've dug out the floors down to soil and then another 20cms.
Even when the new floors are installed the floor level will still be below the outside soil level. Not by much,maybe about 20cms.
All ground walls in the two rooms will be left exposed and lime pointed.
I don't I visage any problems.
Floor spec. 100mm type one,20 mm sand blinding,dpm,100mm rigid insulation,20mm perimeter insulation,vapeur barrier,120mm Concrete.
monkfish1 said:
This is a question troubling me on my latest aquisition. Its been pointed in cement inside and out. The stone is harder than a hard thing. Utterley imperviois to moisture.
Ive primed myself to remove it all and repoint in lime, but there no evidence of damp. Yet. But it is stone with rubble in-fill. As you say, by any measure of logic, the lime mortar that is "in" the wall may well be wet. If it stays that way, it will degrade long term.
What to do????
You have two potential issues with a damp wall, decorative spoiling and potential to rot timber (floors and skirting). If neither of those are an issue then the damp is under control.Ive primed myself to remove it all and repoint in lime, but there no evidence of damp. Yet. But it is stone with rubble in-fill. As you say, by any measure of logic, the lime mortar that is "in" the wall may well be wet. If it stays that way, it will degrade long term.
What to do????
If a wall is unplastered you're highly unlikely to see evidence of rising damp, it will be controlled by evaporation.
As always, attention to the height of external ground levels is often critical.
Evoluzione said:
The first question to answer is how long has it been like that?
If it's been years and looks ok then make a decision based on that.
Not long. It was repointed prior to being put on the market. Mainly because it looked pretty depressing having had no guttering for who knows how long. Fair bit of eroded mortar. Prioperly wet wall at the front.If it's been years and looks ok then make a decision based on that.
So pointed and painted. Proper crap job though.
Inside, its never been plastered since built, but they repointed that too. Then did dot and dab insulated plasterboard. However, its completely dry in the 2 places ive accessed behind the plaster board. Longer term, the plaster board will be going.
Would have been a whole lot better left well alone. Would have been less work.
C Lee Farquar said:
monkfish1 said:
This is a question troubling me on my latest aquisition. Its been pointed in cement inside and out. The stone is harder than a hard thing. Utterley imperviois to moisture.
Ive primed myself to remove it all and repoint in lime, but there no evidence of damp. Yet. But it is stone with rubble in-fill. As you say, by any measure of logic, the lime mortar that is "in" the wall may well be wet. If it stays that way, it will degrade long term.
What to do????
You have two potential issues with a damp wall, decorative spoiling and potential to rot timber (floors and skirting). If neither of those are an issue then the damp is under control.Ive primed myself to remove it all and repoint in lime, but there no evidence of damp. Yet. But it is stone with rubble in-fill. As you say, by any measure of logic, the lime mortar that is "in" the wall may well be wet. If it stays that way, it will degrade long term.
What to do????
If a wall is unplastered you're highly unlikely to see evidence of rising damp, it will be controlled by evaporation.
As always, attention to the height of external ground levels is often critical.
Ground levels significantly lower outside.
Snow and Rocks said:
I wouldn't worry overly - by all means dig into the wall somewhere to check but when I turned an existing window into a door everything was bone dry internally even down to near ground level.
If you think about it the path for any water to soak up through internal lime mortar around many layers of almost impermeable rock is pretty tortuous even once it gets up through the typically huge foundation stones. Add in the fact that the cement based mortar is still somewhat permeable (just less so than lime) and any trapped water should still be able to escape.
Yes, i thinking of drilling a couple of holes in the mortar lines and seeing what comes out.If you think about it the path for any water to soak up through internal lime mortar around many layers of almost impermeable rock is pretty tortuous even once it gets up through the typically huge foundation stones. Add in the fact that the cement based mortar is still somewhat permeable (just less so than lime) and any trapped water should still be able to escape.
If its dry dust, happy days.
If its like my current house, drilling holes just produced a damp slurry!
monkfish1 said:
Evoluzione said:
The first question to answer is how long has it been like that?
If it's been years and looks ok then make a decision based on that.
Not long. It was repointed prior to being put on the market. Mainly because it looked pretty depressing having had no guttering for who knows how long. Fair bit of eroded mortar. Prioperly wet wall at the front.If it's been years and looks ok then make a decision based on that.
So pointed and painted. Proper crap job though.
Inside, its never been plastered since built, but they repointed that too. Then did dot and dab insulated plasterboard. However, its completely dry in the 2 places ive accessed behind the plaster board. Longer term, the plaster board will be going.
Would have been a whole lot better left well alone. Would have been less work.
Evoluzione said:
monkfish1 said:
Evoluzione said:
The first question to answer is how long has it been like that?
If it's been years and looks ok then make a decision based on that.
Not long. It was repointed prior to being put on the market. Mainly because it looked pretty depressing having had no guttering for who knows how long. Fair bit of eroded mortar. Prioperly wet wall at the front.If it's been years and looks ok then make a decision based on that.
So pointed and painted. Proper crap job though.
Inside, its never been plastered since built, but they repointed that too. Then did dot and dab insulated plasterboard. However, its completely dry in the 2 places ive accessed behind the plaster board. Longer term, the plaster board will be going.
Would have been a whole lot better left well alone. Would have been less work.
monkfish1 said:
Evoluzione said:
monkfish1 said:
Evoluzione said:
The first question to answer is how long has it been like that?
If it's been years and looks ok then make a decision based on that.
Not long. It was repointed prior to being put on the market. Mainly because it looked pretty depressing having had no guttering for who knows how long. Fair bit of eroded mortar. Prioperly wet wall at the front.If it's been years and looks ok then make a decision based on that.
So pointed and painted. Proper crap job though.
Inside, its never been plastered since built, but they repointed that too. Then did dot and dab insulated plasterboard. However, its completely dry in the 2 places ive accessed behind the plaster board. Longer term, the plaster board will be going.
Would have been a whole lot better left well alone. Would have been less work.
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