House buying - Seller states No to flooding
Discussion
When dealing with a deceased estate sale, the person completing the PIF can only really do so to the best of their knowledge, which is often quite limited. Proving that the daughter knew that the property had in fact suffered from flooding previously will likely be impossible.
I wouldn't waste my time, energy or money pursuing this if it were me. Nearly every property I've purchased has been an estate sale and in my experience the PIF is therefore worthless, so you have to proceed with caution. Your solicitor should know this.
I wouldn't waste my time, energy or money pursuing this if it were me. Nearly every property I've purchased has been an estate sale and in my experience the PIF is therefore worthless, so you have to proceed with caution. Your solicitor should know this.
yellowtang said:
When dealing with a deceased estate sale, the person completing the PIF can only really do so to the best of their knowledge, which is often quite limited. Proving that the daughter knew that the property had in fact suffered from flooding previously will likely be impossible.
Not necessarily. A neighbour might say "Oh yes, she came round to help her mother when it happened".IANAL but if I recall correctly you are not allowed to let a nuisance (ie water) affect your neighbour
So surely it's either the owner of the fields / hills or the Highway Authorities problem.
I suggest threatening a solicitor with legal action isn't much of a threat and it isn't an obvious enough case for a no win no fee solicitor to be interested in.
So surely it's either the owner of the fields / hills or the Highway Authorities problem.
I suggest threatening a solicitor with legal action isn't much of a threat and it isn't an obvious enough case for a no win no fee solicitor to be interested in.
I'm don't know a lot about this but having recently bought a house with a (hopefully very low!) risk of flooding from a river I did notice in the surveyors and legal docs there were categories for river/sea flooding and a separate category for surface flooding.
What did your surveyor and searches come up with on surface flooding? I presume if there had ever been an insurance claim based on surface flooding then that might show as a risk with the Environment Agency?
What did your surveyor and searches come up with on surface flooding? I presume if there had ever been an insurance claim based on surface flooding then that might show as a risk with the Environment Agency?
Can you post more photos I can't see to the left or right of the image below but raising the height with a speed bump, or hump type apron where the red is shown and then diverting the water in the blue which will pool as a result off the hump area into large drain / soakaway would be better. A sump might be ideal if the water is coming faster that the original drains can carry it.
I'm having similar issues but we are on a hill and the water runs in huge volume with the camber of a b road into our drive, in our case the council are helping as that shouldn't really happen in our aspect / road setup.
If you can get more image up I'm sure everyone can chip in a few ideas. As its not rising water ie a river etc I think this should be fixable. I would guess you won't be far off your guesstimate of £10k but lets see..............
I'm having similar issues but we are on a hill and the water runs in huge volume with the camber of a b road into our drive, in our case the council are helping as that shouldn't really happen in our aspect / road setup.
If you can get more image up I'm sure everyone can chip in a few ideas. As its not rising water ie a river etc I think this should be fixable. I would guess you won't be far off your guesstimate of £10k but lets see..............
I have a similar problem, though by the look of it nowhere near as severe.
The complication seems to be that run off is not considered 'flooding' even though water is coming into your house. The flood maps seem to only concentrate on areas at risk of flooding from rivers. This is good and bad in that you can get home insurance and this should cover damage (at least I could).
Part of the problem is that we're on an unadopted road which has had various piecemeal repairs over the years and then been allowed to fall to ruin again, so water collects in puddles but can't drain away, and there's no overall drainage off the road. Another part of the problem is that a fairly new development up the hill reduced the land available for the water to soak into and now it runs down to my house.
A few years before I bought the house the waterboard had put in bigger drains up the hill to cope with the run off from the new development, which apparently massively reduced the problem, though it does still happen. I believe the waterboard (they still exist, they're just seperate from water companies) have a responsibility to do this, but councils aren't usually interested, so get onto them if this applies in your situation.
If the water is running down your drains into the public drains you might be able to get some help with the cost of diverting it in a more orderly way!
Ask your insurance company if they can help with this as they are sure to have come across similar situations before and would surely rather get the council or water board to help rather than keep paying out or not be able to offer insurance.
The other thing I did was dig a ditch along the front of my property and filled it with rubble. This absorbs a lot of water and diverts run off away from the house. Obviously you don't want to just tip it on your next door neighbours, but if you can divert it to somewhere that won't flood your house. A foot deep and a foot wide trench full of rubble can hold and absorb a lot of water.
You might have to check with the council first. One of the benefits of living on an unadopted road is that I can do stuff like that, but if it's next to a public road it might not be so easy.
The complication seems to be that run off is not considered 'flooding' even though water is coming into your house. The flood maps seem to only concentrate on areas at risk of flooding from rivers. This is good and bad in that you can get home insurance and this should cover damage (at least I could).
Part of the problem is that we're on an unadopted road which has had various piecemeal repairs over the years and then been allowed to fall to ruin again, so water collects in puddles but can't drain away, and there's no overall drainage off the road. Another part of the problem is that a fairly new development up the hill reduced the land available for the water to soak into and now it runs down to my house.
A few years before I bought the house the waterboard had put in bigger drains up the hill to cope with the run off from the new development, which apparently massively reduced the problem, though it does still happen. I believe the waterboard (they still exist, they're just seperate from water companies) have a responsibility to do this, but councils aren't usually interested, so get onto them if this applies in your situation.
If the water is running down your drains into the public drains you might be able to get some help with the cost of diverting it in a more orderly way!
Ask your insurance company if they can help with this as they are sure to have come across similar situations before and would surely rather get the council or water board to help rather than keep paying out or not be able to offer insurance.
The other thing I did was dig a ditch along the front of my property and filled it with rubble. This absorbs a lot of water and diverts run off away from the house. Obviously you don't want to just tip it on your next door neighbours, but if you can divert it to somewhere that won't flood your house. A foot deep and a foot wide trench full of rubble can hold and absorb a lot of water.
You might have to check with the council first. One of the benefits of living on an unadopted road is that I can do stuff like that, but if it's next to a public road it might not be so easy.
Edited by JuanCarlosFandango on Wednesday 14th November 17:03
Mr Pointy said:
yellowtang said:
When dealing with a deceased estate sale, the person completing the PIF can only really do so to the best of their knowledge, which is often quite limited. Proving that the daughter knew that the property had in fact suffered from flooding previously will likely be impossible.
Not necessarily. A neighbour might say "Oh yes, she came round to help her mother when it happened".Litigation is best left to rich people or poor people with absolutely no alternative. Those inbetween should avoid!
Edited by yellowtang on Wednesday 14th November 17:00
just to add.... digging up the tarmac road to the corner and adding a grate style drain across (in blue) connecting to a sump may be the way forward this would let you the build a suitable apron (in purple) between where your drive and the tarmac is.
It seems to be bottle necking at that fence post, also I can't see the camber / gradient so its a bit hard to say.
It seems to be bottle necking at that fence post, also I can't see the camber / gradient so its a bit hard to say.
You lift an inspection cover to get the flood water away.
Is that on the surface water or foul. Or is the house old and on a combined system
If it's foul you are potentially overloading the water authority pumping station or sewage works. Not good.
If it's surface water then why not just put a yard gully in, connected to the inspection chamber.
If it's water from outside your property then discuss with the owner of the land causing the flooding and ask/demand they give it attention. They should be able to provide a kerb or other upstand to direct water down the road. Assuming it's an adopted highway then the LA. Or of course as some other poster has quite rightly commented, it might just be a blocked gully upstream, it's autumn and leaves fall from trees (should be a law against trees) and block drainage systems regularly.
Is that on the surface water or foul. Or is the house old and on a combined system
If it's foul you are potentially overloading the water authority pumping station or sewage works. Not good.
If it's surface water then why not just put a yard gully in, connected to the inspection chamber.
If it's water from outside your property then discuss with the owner of the land causing the flooding and ask/demand they give it attention. They should be able to provide a kerb or other upstand to direct water down the road. Assuming it's an adopted highway then the LA. Or of course as some other poster has quite rightly commented, it might just be a blocked gully upstream, it's autumn and leaves fall from trees (should be a law against trees) and block drainage systems regularly.
Hi All,
Thanks for your replies and especially those who are considering drainage solutions.
Attached is a photo showing:
from the left that the highways road slopes to our property,
the field opposite (which doesn't affect our property),
the hill in the distance where the water runs down a footpath to the left of the field and down our road,
our driveway slopes to our house
Ideas:
As some have written, a gully is possible if it went under the green opposite but must all happen on our land - we can't change the road
We have had some tarmac lifted and turfed as the soil is sand with good drainage but won't handle excess water
I don't think a soak away is strong enough
On the drains - the gutters are into foul water and the driveway drains are into grey water. Yes I shouldn't have lifted the foul water but Thames Water and the Council etc are all fully aware I have this situation and the alternative is water comes into the house
On the wording of the sellers form, its a straight question - has the property ever flooded. A straight answer - No. There is no 'to the best of my knowledge' type vagueness
Cheers
Thanks for your replies and especially those who are considering drainage solutions.
Attached is a photo showing:
from the left that the highways road slopes to our property,
the field opposite (which doesn't affect our property),
the hill in the distance where the water runs down a footpath to the left of the field and down our road,
our driveway slopes to our house
Ideas:
As some have written, a gully is possible if it went under the green opposite but must all happen on our land - we can't change the road
We have had some tarmac lifted and turfed as the soil is sand with good drainage but won't handle excess water
I don't think a soak away is strong enough
On the drains - the gutters are into foul water and the driveway drains are into grey water. Yes I shouldn't have lifted the foul water but Thames Water and the Council etc are all fully aware I have this situation and the alternative is water comes into the house
On the wording of the sellers form, its a straight question - has the property ever flooded. A straight answer - No. There is no 'to the best of my knowledge' type vagueness
Cheers
That puts a different spin on it.
Combined with the very first picture you posted it looks as though the water is all running down the road leading to your gate?
If that is a public road (?) then surely the council are responsible for ensuring it doesn't drain onto your property. Is there any ditch or drainage down the side of that road? I'd also go and have a nose further up that road and see if other properties are ditching their water onto the public highway, or if there are any other blockages in drains further up which will be causing water to run down the road.
Combined with the very first picture you posted it looks as though the water is all running down the road leading to your gate?
If that is a public road (?) then surely the council are responsible for ensuring it doesn't drain onto your property. Is there any ditch or drainage down the side of that road? I'd also go and have a nose further up that road and see if other properties are ditching their water onto the public highway, or if there are any other blockages in drains further up which will be causing water to run down the road.
fastgerman said:
Hi All,
On the wording of the sellers form, its a straight question - has the property ever flooded. A straight answer - No. There is no 'to the best of my knowledge' type vagueness
Cheers
That is thing though in relation to the PIF all questions are based on this - "As it says in those instructions you should respondOn the wording of the sellers form, its a straight question - has the property ever flooded. A straight answer - No. There is no 'to the best of my knowledge' type vagueness
Cheers
to the questions from your own knowledge. You are not expected to have expert knowledge
of legal or technical matters, or matters that occurred prior to your ownership of the property. "
https://www.lawsociety.org.uk/support-services/doc...
But as said by others even if she has knowledge (which due to the exact nature of the sale might be difficult), providing it is a completely different ball game.
It's that the only place the flow is coming from? ie down the road and through the entrance?
What works have you had done?
How deep is it when it flows through the entrance?
Looks like there's not enough capacity and/or gullies on the road to catch all the surface water before it enters your driveway.
Have you thought about a raised hump across your driveway to divert the water into the verge to the right of your entrance?
Forgive me if this has been suggested and discounted.
What works have you had done?
How deep is it when it flows through the entrance?
Looks like there's not enough capacity and/or gullies on the road to catch all the surface water before it enters your driveway.
Have you thought about a raised hump across your driveway to divert the water into the verge to the right of your entrance?
Forgive me if this has been suggested and discounted.
On the plus side, looks a nice house and lovely view
Id be tempted by one of these: https://stormmeister.com/flood-gates.php and then flood proof barriers linked to it
It wont fix the root cause and it might flood you in but it will help stop it coming to your house
Id be going hard after the council/highways/land owner to fix the issue
Could be worth writing a letter to past owner, asking why she said no!
Its not fair on you to fix someone elses drainage issue , what a ballache....good luck
Id be tempted by one of these: https://stormmeister.com/flood-gates.php and then flood proof barriers linked to it
It wont fix the root cause and it might flood you in but it will help stop it coming to your house
Id be going hard after the council/highways/land owner to fix the issue
Could be worth writing a letter to past owner, asking why she said no!
Its not fair on you to fix someone elses drainage issue , what a ballache....good luck
Edited by TwistingMyMelon on Thursday 15th November 12:39
Lemming Train said:
fastgerman said:
Road is public with parking areas.
So presumably that deluge of water pouring off the road into your garden is flowing straight over the top of the gullies along the side of the public road? The solution is to ring the council's highways department and get them to send out their gully tanker to empty and clear them so that the water coming off the hills goes down them as it should not arrive in your front garden.As an adhoc gully tanker driver, make sure you get your neighbours to park their vehicles elsewhere or at least clear of the gullies as the boom arm only has approximately a car's width reach at 90 degrees to the gully. If they can't get close then the crew will simply turn around and go home and mark it as inaccessible. Also, after sucking out all the crap they should reverse the pump on the tank and fill up the gully with water to ensure it's clear and drains away properly before moving on to the next one.
(I'm a roads engineer, if the road ifs flooding your house then the Council/highway authority are obliged to address it.)
herewego said:
Is that concrete or gravel outside your gates? Can you dig a shallow french drain from the tarmac to the area behind your bins?
This.... A bodge could be done for a few hundred quid until you can get the council/highways to sort out the issue for good.
A handful of these in the gravel and then a soakaway/trench at the far end?
https://www.drainagesuperstore.co.uk/product/chann...
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