The what does a kitchen cost thread!?

[BaldOldMan]

RichB said:

Why is this?

Solid wood is not rigid or stable enough really.

Bespoke cabinets would more usually be ply of some description - maybe with oak facing.

[singlecoil]

jason61c said:

How busy are you mr singlecoil? Can you drop me some example of previous?

I'll sort something out and send a PM. I don't normally do framed kitchens, was going to stop offering them altogether until I recently had the opportunity to study a top name big bucks kitchen made in Wiltshire and realised that I could match that at substantially less cost. Big firms like that carry massive overhead costs.

number2 said:

RichB said:

Wozy68 said:

Just to be clear ....... Using solid wood for cabinet carcasses is not a sign of quality .... in fact in a bizarre way it’s the opposite of a quality made product.

Why is this?

Yes, it would be good to know! Stability in the environment? Thanks!

Solid wood expands and contracts across its grain, not along it. If you think about how a kitchen cabinet is constructed you can see that the back will be working against the sides. Which is why the make of cabinets referred to has veneered mdf backs. So much for solid wood!

Also, they don't do custom sizes, and the cabinets are drilled for all possible combinations of possible doors and drawers so when you open one you'll see a lot of extra holes.

[Crumpet]

My brother has that Devol kitchen and with a similar number of units it cost him £50k fitted, presumably with a few other bits and bobs.

It’s nice, but it’s not £50k nice. He also had some custom cabinets made by Devol to house a washer and dryer in the utility. They’re actually bordering on st and the quality is poor.

[DavidY]

I'm doing a "DIY Kitchens" Kitchen at the moment, and my costs are split as follows:-

Carcasses/doors/end panels/etc (DIY Kitchens) 35%
Quartz Worktop/Glass Splashback 20%
Appliances inc Sink/Tap 27%
Electrics and Lighting 8%
Flooring/Skirting/etc 5%
External Trades - Plasterer/Gas 5%

And thats with me doing most of the work, currently up to about 23 days (including removal of old kitchen.lifting floor, prep etc)

So 10K from DIY kitchens to the original OP, is likely to be only a fraction of the cost (about a third if you are doing the work yourself), and if you are getting trades in to do all the work and buying an AGA, you could easily be looking at 45K+

[Wozy68]

number2 said:

RichB said:

Wozy68 said:

Just to be clear ....... Using solid wood for cabinet carcasses is not a sign of quality .... in fact in a bizarre way it’s the opposite of a quality made product.

Why is this?

Yes, it would be good to know! Stability in the environment? Thanks!

The biggest problem with timber is making sure it’s as stable as possible, hence why modern timbers for interior use these days are kiln rather than air dried..... modern living in new or old houses are so much drier now (because of CH) than they were years ago.

Kiln dried timber has a moisture content of around 10%, seasoned generally no less than around 15%

But even with kiln dried ..... in a room like a kitchen wheres there’s a mixture of heat and moisture timber can struggle to acclimatise.

Not such an issue with a kitchen door or drawer front (as the frame rails are made out of one piece of timber) but a solid wood carcass is basically thin strips of timber glued together. These are called timber blanks and are quite cheap to buy.

Because they are strips .... you have timber that basically can be of slightly different moisture and can in a room like a kitchen absorb moisture at different rates which can cause twist..... The thinner the timber the worse it can be ..... hence why it’s not normally an issue on something like a kitchen worktop.

The likes of drawers etc needing a flat parallel cabinet running on metal runners need a flat surface to be fixed to to operate properly, if not over time they can start to stick......

Quite often on old furniture you’ll notice drawers can stick ..... that’s movement in the cabinet over the years that’s caused that, not that they stuck from when it was first made.

Basically I’d never make something like a kitchen with solid wood carcass, yes doors frames and drawers ... but not cabinets.

Sold as a sign of quality, you couldn’t get much further (in a way) from the truth really.

If man made materials were available 300 years ago, then furniture would have been made with these and veneered.

We for example do not use MFC (Chipboard) as we just don’t like the way it can quickly blow if water gets in to it or near a heat source. We use cabinet making quality MDF veneered with real wood ..... So you get the finish/feel of real wood and the stability of a man made material. So the best of both worlds.....

Some use (Smallbone I believe for example) use veneered plywood...... We don’t use veneered ply but that’s a trade secret why we don’t

Edited by Wozy68 on Saturday 26th October 17:55

[jason61c]

DavidY said:

I'm doing a "DIY Kitchens" Kitchen at the moment, and my costs are split as follows:-

Carcasses/doors/end panels/etc (DIY Kitchens) 35%
Quartz Worktop/Glass Splashback 20%
Appliances inc Sink/Tap 27%
Electrics and Lighting 8%
Flooring/Skirting/etc 5%
External Trades - Plasterer/Gas 5%

And thats with me doing most of the work, currently up to about 23 days (including removal of old kitchen.lifting floor, prep etc)

So 10K from DIY kitchens to the original OP, is likely to be only a fraction of the cost (about a third if you are doing the work yourself), and if you are getting trades in to do all the work and buying an AGA, you could easily be looking at 45K+

Floor is all done, i'll run all services and first fix of electircs.
I've already got an aga type thing
House is going through a full renovation so the extra kitchen costs are 'just' the cost of the kitchen,worktops etc.

[RichB]

Wozy68 said:

number2 said:

RichB said:

Wozy68 said:

Just to be clear ....... Using solid wood for cabinet carcasses is not a sign of quality .... in fact in a bizarre way it’s the opposite of a quality made product.

Why is this?

Yes, it would be good to know! Stability in the environment? Thanks!

The biggest problem with timber is making sure it’s as stable as possible, <clip> We use cabinet making quality MDF veneered with real wood ...

Thanks Wozy...

[mart 63]

jason61c said:

DavidY said:

I'm doing a "DIY Kitchens" Kitchen at the moment, and my costs are split as follows:-

Carcasses/doors/end panels/etc (DIY Kitchens) 35%
Quartz Worktop/Glass Splashback 20%
Appliances inc Sink/Tap 27%
Electrics and Lighting 8%
Flooring/Skirting/etc 5%
External Trades - Plasterer/Gas 5%

And thats with me doing most of the work, currently up to about 23 days (including removal of old kitchen.lifting floor, prep etc)

So 10K from DIY kitchens to the original OP, is likely to be only a fraction of the cost (about a third if you are doing the work yourself), and if you are getting trades in to do all the work and buying an AGA, you could easily be looking at 45K+

Floor is all done, i'll run all services and first fix of electircs.
I've already got an aga type thing
House is going through a full renovation so the extra kitchen costs are 'just' the cost of the kitchen,worktops etc.

We paid £45k for our kitchen. Our units were from DIY Kitchens. But for the £45k we had a 7.5m x 5.5m extension built in the price. Which included, 12ft bifolds, 2 2.5m x 1.5m sky pods, electrics and appliances . I love these theads.

[troika]

Just installed a DIY kitchen. The fitter we used (sourced by my builder) was outstanding. He usually fits the really pricey stuff and had not fitted a DIY before. He said the quality was very good and we could have easily paid 2 or 3 times the amount for essentially the same thing. He had to do a few tweaks to get it spot on for the space and has done a brilliant job. In summary, go for DIY but get a really good joiner to fit it.

[singlecoil]

troika said:

He had to do a few tweaks to get it spot on for the space and has done a brilliant job. In summary, go for DIY but get a really good joiner to fit it.

No disrespect intended to DIY Kitchens, they are very good at what they do, but I gathered the OP was looking for something bespoke and although that word appears on their website they don't actually do any bespoke. Also he wants dovetailed drawers and they don't do those either.

[jamiem555]

In our experience, it was how much is your budget and then the big names matched it! We ended up with a local guy and a Howden’s kitchen. Whole lot came to £27k including a bifold door and new window. Room is 5m x 5m.

[troika]

singlecoil said:

troika said:

He had to do a few tweaks to get it spot on for the space and has done a brilliant job. In summary, go for DIY but get a really good joiner to fit it.

No disrespect intended to DIY Kitchens, they are very good at what they do, but I gathered the OP was looking for something bespoke and although that word appears on their website they don't actually do any bespoke. Also he wants dovetailed drawers and they don't do those either.

Fair enough, you pay your money and take your choice. When we did the house about 10 years ago, we got a local joiner to build us a bespoke solid wood kitchen and kitchen furniture (with dovetailed joints etc). It still looks like new and didn’t cost the earth. You’ve just got to find the right person to do it. Some of the margins in this stuff must be astronomical.

[jason61c]

Its true the smaller companies can surpass the quality of larger ones where the same thing costs 4x as much.

I used this company to do a door and frame for me.

http://www.exeterbenchjoiners.co.uk/ They might do the kitchen.

I'm not against a DIY kitchens one, however i'm not planning on moving and i'd love to see dovetail joints etc, plus the details on the larder units.

[RichB]

singlecoil said:

...he wants dovetailed drawers and they don't do those...

Being a child of the '60s and a huge Beatles fan I've always been fascinated by dovetail joints - they are a 'must have' in my new kitchen

[V8RX7]

jason61c said:

Who's harry? I think DIY kitchens are good, its just the little bits I want that i'm not sure they could do.

Harry Flashman

[wombleh]

Noddy question but is it worth doing that bespoke? Other than the units around the aga they all look fairly standard

[singlecoil]

RichB said:

singlecoil said:

...he wants dovetailed drawers and they don't do those...

Being a child of the '60s and a huge Beatles fan I've always been fascinated by dovetail joints - they are a 'must have' in my new kitchen

The walrus was Paul.

wombleh said:

Noddy question but is it worth doing that bespoke? Other than the units around the aga they all look fairly standard

The units in the opening post are indeed standard units, as is the construction method (MFC = melamine faced chipboard). My guess is they are making the cabinets but buying in the doors, hence the standard sizes.

Custom sized units will usually, but not always, result in a more balanced design and better space utilisation. For instance, if there was say 165 cm available for wall units then a bespoke maker would do that as three 55 cm units, somebody using standard sizes wouldn't be able to use all the space.

[jason61c]

wombleh said:

Noddy question but is it worth doing that bespoke? Other than the units around the aga they all look fairly standard

Thats because its a generic kitchen drawing, just used to show the layout, how I want it to feel, so people can see clearer whats in my mind.

the renders/layout are based on a diykitchens kitchen.

[mikees]

Harry and I and others have used solidwoodkitchencabinets

Very good quality and finish. Understand views on mdf and mbc

I’ve fitted 2 recently but also highly rate singlecoils units

Pm me if you want pics etc

M

[The Moose]

Please center the Aga!