Smart meters - Avoid?
Discussion
Wombat3 said:
Some weird maths going on there!"
..........
I'd also eat my hat if the price comes down because of a smart meters
You're right, some very odd maths. Let me do those sums again. ..........
I'd also eat my hat if the price comes down because of a smart meters
As for the last point - prices won't come down overall, but will encourage people to use energy at cheaper times. Therefore individuals may/will save money. Eventually this may lead to lower prices across peak times and higher prices at off peak times, but encouraging consumers to respond to price signals is only the same as what happens in all walks of life - airline tickets are more in school holidays, theatre tickets are more expensive on a Friday night than a Tuesday night, Christmas cards are more expensive in December than January.
The end goal for the government will be to add duty to those charging their EV's at home, they will need to make up the £37 billion shortfall in tax from the switch from ICE to electric.
I was hoping the days of using noisy appliances at night would be over, it's very inconsiderate for neighbours to be woken up at 3am by a spin cycle thudding away just to save a couple of pence per load of washing.
There's also a sinister side to connected smart meters as mine nags (literally flashes up and sends alerts) every time the 18KW shower is used!
The smart meter can be used as a way to monitor other members in the household especially if linked to an app, if someone is in an abusive relationship will allow the abuser to keep tabs on them and the victim may face repercussions every time they consume excess electricity eg use the hair dryer or iron.
I was hoping the days of using noisy appliances at night would be over, it's very inconsiderate for neighbours to be woken up at 3am by a spin cycle thudding away just to save a couple of pence per load of washing.
There's also a sinister side to connected smart meters as mine nags (literally flashes up and sends alerts) every time the 18KW shower is used!
The smart meter can be used as a way to monitor other members in the household especially if linked to an app, if someone is in an abusive relationship will allow the abuser to keep tabs on them and the victim may face repercussions every time they consume excess electricity eg use the hair dryer or iron.
As another poster noted. This is about shifting infrastructure upgrades for peak load into spreading peak load instead.
It’s like roads designed for rush hour, but would be hugely overkill the rest of the day.
Though I don’t get why infrastructure doesn’t include more large scale energy storage facilities to spread load.
For now it’s behaviour optimisations which is less than ideal.
Or DIY your own energy storage (battery and solar).
Maybe in a utopia we’d see government invest in ‘potential energy’ storage facilities etc, and then just run really efficient main generation.
It’s like roads designed for rush hour, but would be hugely overkill the rest of the day.
Though I don’t get why infrastructure doesn’t include more large scale energy storage facilities to spread load.
For now it’s behaviour optimisations which is less than ideal.
Or DIY your own energy storage (battery and solar).
Maybe in a utopia we’d see government invest in ‘potential energy’ storage facilities etc, and then just run really efficient main generation.
Mr Whippy said:
As another poster noted. This is about shifting infrastructure upgrades for peak load into spreading peak load instead.
It’s like roads designed for rush hour, but would be hugely overkill the rest of the day.
Though I don’t get why infrastructure doesn’t include more large scale energy storage facilities to spread load.
For now it’s behaviour optimisations which is less than ideal.
Or DIY your own energy storage (battery and solar).
Maybe in a utopia we’d see government invest in ‘potential energy’ storage facilities etc, and then just run really efficient main generation.
I mentioned battery storage in another thread but apparently its not cost effective. I suggested that those that had signed up for a solar tariff at the beginning should charge a bank of batteries up on the normal rate and then shove the stored battery electric through the inverter pretending it had come from the solar cells. You would charge the batteries at much cheaper rate than you were getting paid for the "solar" electric.It’s like roads designed for rush hour, but would be hugely overkill the rest of the day.
Though I don’t get why infrastructure doesn’t include more large scale energy storage facilities to spread load.
For now it’s behaviour optimisations which is less than ideal.
Or DIY your own energy storage (battery and solar).
Maybe in a utopia we’d see government invest in ‘potential energy’ storage facilities etc, and then just run really efficient main generation.
It might look at bit dodgy though when everyone else in the area only managed to feed in 1kWhr because it was raining and you managed to feed in 100kWhr's though with a garage full of batteries.
However I don't see why you couldn't charge a bank of them up on the cheap overnight tariff and then use that stored electric in the day. I would imagine cost is the main thing though. I spend about £30 a month on electric and get about 230kWhr's for it. Looks like I would need about 10 batteries to cover that with some quick calculations, thats about £1000, plus an inverter and other stuff. it would still cost to charge the batteries up so I reckon it would be about a 5 year payback. Of course by then the batteries will most probably be knackered.
Cold said:
So if you only use electricity at 3AM while you're asleep it will save you money. Might make living a bit awkward, but think of the savings.
Not at all. Simply moving the dishwashing from 7pm to 9pm could mean you pay half as much. Or you could tell the dishwasher to have everything clean for 6am and it will chose the best time based on electricity prices. Equally maybe your fridge could turn off for half an hour over the most expensive period of the day. Technology will mean lots of changes and savings will be possible without needing to become nocturnal, and once people think about it they will make many changes just in response to the prices. At the moment there is no incentive to do so at all, so people don't.
jmn said:
Thanks for the info. Am I correct in assuming that the Smart Meter would be installed in the cupboard inside the house rather than the box outside?
It will replace your existing electric meter, wherever that is.Our old meter is high up behind a kitchen cupboard. If I tell the smart meter people this, they suddenly opt out of fitting one!
We spend quite a lot on electricity (£106 a month currently). We dont have a smart meter (still waiting, when we have one we can get a better tariff), but do provide monthly meter readings to Octopus. I find it has reduced the likelihood of a massive shocking bill as has happened in the past. I also have a usage monitor on my desk that tells me if someone may be left on.
It all helps improve our behaviour.
It all helps improve our behaviour.
To put this stuff into context, back in the late 80s and early 90s when I was a kid my Dad had us on Economy 7 with timers on the washing machine and dishwasher.
It seemed to pay off having it.
Optimising for off peak with batteries seems a sensible thing.
Plus you get a few hours of usage in a power cut.
And combined with solar a bit of free energy top up.
Yes many years to pay off, but why not if it does eventually pay off?
It seemed to pay off having it.
Optimising for off peak with batteries seems a sensible thing.
Plus you get a few hours of usage in a power cut.
And combined with solar a bit of free energy top up.
Yes many years to pay off, but why not if it does eventually pay off?
Peoples Energy went bust in Oct last year I think - that was when they last took a £100 a month payment from us
Just submitted my readings to my new supplier British Gas and its £500! So £200 more than I would have paid to People's Energy. I am guessing this might balance out over a year as usage is always high in winter?
I think thinking of getting a Smart Meter now because the real live info may actually be useful.
Just submitted my readings to my new supplier British Gas and its £500! So £200 more than I would have paid to People's Energy. I am guessing this might balance out over a year as usage is always high in winter?
I think thinking of getting a Smart Meter now because the real live info may actually be useful.
Mojooo said:
Peoples Energy went bust in Oct last year I think - that was when they last took a £100 a month payment from us
Just submitted my readings to my new supplier British Gas and its £500! So £200 more than I would have paid to People's Energy. I am guessing this might balance out over a year as usage is always high in winter?
I think thinking of getting a Smart Meter now because the real live info may actually be useful.
People's Energy (and plenty of other suppliers) went bust because they were offering energy too cheap. Unfortunately what you are paying now is the new norm... until it goes up again in April. I was with Avro and was transferred to Octopus. My bills are up 40%.Just submitted my readings to my new supplier British Gas and its £500! So £200 more than I would have paid to People's Energy. I am guessing this might balance out over a year as usage is always high in winter?
I think thinking of getting a Smart Meter now because the real live info may actually be useful.
djglover said:
The real benefit of smart meters, is in the transition to EV (an other things like ASHP to an extent) I cannot access the Octopus Go tariff, and therefore cheap overnight charging, without a smart meter.
Smart meters are a pre-requisite for smart charging.
How did economy 7 work all those years ago before Smart Meters where even invented?Smart meters are a pre-requisite for smart charging.
77th Brigade said:
Until everyone is charging an EV overnight and the tariff's are inflated/Govt duty added. There is nothing free in this world and smart meters are not offered for your convenience.
Why can they not benefit both sides? Consumers get to see what energy they're using and adjust their habits accordingly to save money and energy suppliers no longer need to rely on you for meter readings, or pay for someone to come around and read your meter and have access to much more reliable data for their ability to buy/sell at the best prices.AyBee said:
77th Brigade said:
Until everyone is charging an EV overnight and the tariff's are inflated/Govt duty added. There is nothing free in this world and smart meters are not offered for your convenience.
Why can they not benefit both sides? Consumers get to see what energy they're using and adjust their habits accordingly to save money and energy suppliers no longer need to rely on you for meter readings, or pay for someone to come around and read your meter and have access to much more reliable data for their ability to buy/sell at the best prices.Gassing Station | Homes, Gardens and DIY | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff