Renovating an old farmhouse and living on the Pennines

[Mark Benson]

skwdenyer said:

CrutyRammers said:

Mark Benson said:

Wacky Racer said:

Evoluzione said:

It reminds me of a lovely old Lady called Hannah Hauxwell. Many years ago now someone discovered her living on her own, completely off grid (no electric, no running water) and self sufficient somewhere remote in N. Yorks. They made a few programs about her life there before taking her on a round the World trip and filming that too of course. It's on YT now.

I met Hannah whilst walking The Pennine Way in 1974, which went right by her farmyard, I recognised her from the TV programme the year before. We had a brief chat for five minutes.

Well worth watching right through.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lC5WeuLHUdU&t=...

Hannah Hauxwell's farm, taken in July last year - it's now connected to mains electricity and water and the meadows around are a nature reserve.
Hannah used to go down to the reservior you can just seen in front of the house with buckets to fetch water for her animals and herself....

It's a pleasant spot for a wander round if you find yourself in the north pennines. There are still a few of these old farmhouses coming up for sale where old folk have been living seemingly unchanged since the 1940s, it's quite incredible to see what people were living in sometimes. An ever diminishing stock of course, and only for the very brave with considerable means, as the work involved to make them habitable to modern standards is huge. We tried for a couple but fell through, and realistically I suspect we would have ended up in financial purgatory for years. Some have come back onto the market repeatedly, presumably as people find out what's involved and back out again.

Don't forget to post links to any you can remember I've looked at a couple of properties like this; the problem is, last year at least, the market was so hot that people were paying very silly amounts (comparable to finished properties) for these opportunities (or, put another way, in effect valuing land at £30-70k / acre). One in Garsdale was guided at auction at about £300k and went for way more than double that. Another we bid on went for £420k against a "realistic" price of more like £300k.

That's the problem in a gold rush - there's always another triumph of hope over reality buyer around the corner.

We bid on a place near to where I took the above picture - was 'Offers Over £325k" we bid £450k based on a full renovation of the house and some put aside for outbuildings. We also took into account the fact that the 15 acres it came with were completely neglected - full of thistles, nettles and rush clumps. We found out we were the third highest bidders, with the winner bidding £650k.
A few months later, the agent called us as the £650k bidder had dropped out, we reiterated the £450k but the other bidder bid £500k. We think, through the grapevine that this bidder has also now dropped out, but the place hasn't been re-marketed.

[Evoluzione]

Mark Benson said:

We bid on a place near to where I took the above picture - was 'Offers Over £325k" we bid £450k based on a full renovation of the house and some put aside for outbuildings. We also took into account the fact that the 15 acres it came with were completely neglected - full of thistles, nettles and rush clumps. We found out we were the third highest bidders, with the winner bidding £650k.
A few months later, the agent called us as the £650k bidder had dropped out, we reiterated the £450k but the other bidder bid £500k. We think, through the grapevine that this bidder has also now dropped out, but the place hasn't been re-marketed.

You don't fancy knocking on the door and speaking to them? That's what I did with this place.

[CrutyRammers]

The above few posts exactly matched our experience, down to losing bidding wars and the properties later coming back onto the market. In the end we got in first, offered slightly over the odds, on the condition that they took it off the market immediately, which they did. Turned out they were desperate to move so it worked out. A bit less land than we really wanted, but not a wreck, so swings and roundabouts...

[Mark Benson]

Evoluzione said:

Mark Benson said:

We bid on a place near to where I took the above picture - was 'Offers Over £325k" we bid £450k based on a full renovation of the house and some put aside for outbuildings. We also took into account the fact that the 15 acres it came with were completely neglected - full of thistles, nettles and rush clumps. We found out we were the third highest bidders, with the winner bidding £650k.
A few months later, the agent called us as the £650k bidder had dropped out, we reiterated the £450k but the other bidder bid £500k. We think, through the grapevine that this bidder has also now dropped out, but the place hasn't been re-marketed.

You don't fancy knocking on the door and speaking to them? That's what I did with this place.

It was considered, but we've been in the process for about a year with several offers rejected then finally, when we found somewhere our chain collapsed around us - wife especially has had enough so we've knocked the idea of moving on the head for now.

I can live vicariously through you instead

[monkfish1]

Mark Benson said:

skwdenyer said:

CrutyRammers said:

Mark Benson said:

Wacky Racer said:

Evoluzione said:

It reminds me of a lovely old Lady called Hannah Hauxwell. Many years ago now someone discovered her living on her own, completely off grid (no electric, no running water) and self sufficient somewhere remote in N. Yorks. They made a few programs about her life there before taking her on a round the World trip and filming that too of course. It's on YT now.

I met Hannah whilst walking The Pennine Way in 1974, which went right by her farmyard, I recognised her from the TV programme the year before. We had a brief chat for five minutes.

Well worth watching right through.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lC5WeuLHUdU&t=...

Hannah Hauxwell's farm, taken in July last year - it's now connected to mains electricity and water and the meadows around are a nature reserve.
Hannah used to go down to the reservior you can just seen in front of the house with buckets to fetch water for her animals and herself....

It's a pleasant spot for a wander round if you find yourself in the north pennines. There are still a few of these old farmhouses coming up for sale where old folk have been living seemingly unchanged since the 1940s, it's quite incredible to see what people were living in sometimes. An ever diminishing stock of course, and only for the very brave with considerable means, as the work involved to make them habitable to modern standards is huge. We tried for a couple but fell through, and realistically I suspect we would have ended up in financial purgatory for years. Some have come back onto the market repeatedly, presumably as people find out what's involved and back out again.

Don't forget to post links to any you can remember I've looked at a couple of properties like this; the problem is, last year at least, the market was so hot that people were paying very silly amounts (comparable to finished properties) for these opportunities (or, put another way, in effect valuing land at £30-70k / acre). One in Garsdale was guided at auction at about £300k and went for way more than double that. Another we bid on went for £420k against a "realistic" price of more like £300k.

That's the problem in a gold rush - there's always another triumph of hope over reality buyer around the corner.

We bid on a place near to where I took the above picture - was 'Offers Over £325k" we bid £450k based on a full renovation of the house and some put aside for outbuildings. We also took into account the fact that the 15 acres it came with were completely neglected - full of thistles, nettles and rush clumps. We found out we were the third highest bidders, with the winner bidding £650k.
A few months later, the agent called us as the £650k bidder had dropped out, we reiterated the £450k but the other bidder bid £500k. We think, through the grapevine that this bidder has also now dropped out, but the place hasn't been re-marketed.

Thats nuts.

We tried to look at one in cumbria near the border, but missed the last viewing slot. It was advertised at £375k. Love to know what it actually went for. Needed pretty much everything, though had 30 odd acres. Fantastic location. Given it was in the middlke of covid, and with stories like yours, makes you wonder? Still not updated on land registry.

Some proper kite flying going on too. Still. Like this one. Absolutely nuts pricing. I cant see more than £400k in this given its location. Rhandirmwyn and the valley its in is truly beautiful, but even so? Minimal land, totally off grid, dont own the access. https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/129337850#/...

[number2]

monkfish1 said:

Thats nuts.

We tried to look at one in cumbria near the border, but missed the last viewing slot. It was advertised at £375k. Love to know what it actually went for. Needed pretty much everything, though had 30 odd acres. Fantastic location. Given it was in the middlke of covid, and with stories like yours, makes you wonder? Still not updated on land registry.

Some proper kite flying going on too. Still. Like this one. Absolutely nuts pricing. I cant see more than £400k in this given its location. Rhandirmwyn and the valley its in is truly beautiful, but even so? Minimal land, totally off grid, dont own the access. https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/129337850#/...

All that space and for 600k you'd only own 0.2 acres.... a small garden... I think the diesel generator would be running most days too .

[monkfish1]

number2 said:

monkfish1 said:

Thats nuts.

We tried to look at one in cumbria near the border, but missed the last viewing slot. It was advertised at £375k. Love to know what it actually went for. Needed pretty much everything, though had 30 odd acres. Fantastic location. Given it was in the middlke of covid, and with stories like yours, makes you wonder? Still not updated on land registry.

Some proper kite flying going on too. Still. Like this one. Absolutely nuts pricing. I cant see more than £400k in this given its location. Rhandirmwyn and the valley its in is truly beautiful, but even so? Minimal land, totally off grid, dont own the access. https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/129337850#/...

All that space and for 600k you'd only own 0.2 acres.... a small garden... I think the diesel generator would be running most days too .

Quite! I think the wall defines the boundary. An easygrid installation to sort out electricity properly will set you back at least £30k. Plus stamp duty (higher in wales), that takes you the wrong side of £650. And look at that gap under the front door!!!! Strangely, its not sold.

Mind you, there was one down in the valley, fantastic property, but needed everything. Was up for £500. Sold in a week or so. I still think it will be back up for sale. Again, made no sense, but it did have land, albeit mostly steep woodland.

[skwdenyer]

monkfish1 said:

Quite! I think the wall defines the boundary. An easygrid installation to sort out electricity properly will set you back at least £30k. Plus stamp duty (higher in wales), that takes you the wrong side of £650. And look at that gap under the front door!!!! Strangely, its not sold.

Mind you, there was one down in the valley, fantastic property, but needed everything. Was up for £500. Sold in a week or so. I still think it will be back up for sale. Again, made no sense, but it did have land, albeit mostly steep woodland.

Agents talking about timber from the wood, except you don’t own the wood.

Heaven knows what the access agreements are like; getting the farmer to maintain the track could be fun.

In terms of timing, only been on the market since end November - far too early to gauge demand.

Suspect the ideal buyer would be a city-dweller with a Range Rover who doesn’t mind a F rated EPC. Inability to warm it before arrival makes it a pain as a 2nd home, mind.

[monkfish1]

skwdenyer said:

monkfish1 said:

Quite! I think the wall defines the boundary. An easygrid installation to sort out electricity properly will set you back at least £30k. Plus stamp duty (higher in wales), that takes you the wrong side of £650. And look at that gap under the front door!!!! Strangely, its not sold.

Mind you, there was one down in the valley, fantastic property, but needed everything. Was up for £500. Sold in a week or so. I still think it will be back up for sale. Again, made no sense, but it did have land, albeit mostly steep woodland.

Agents talking about timber from the wood, except you don’t own the wood.

Heaven knows what the access agreements are like; getting the farmer to maintain the track could be fun.

In terms of timing, only been on the market since end November - far too early to gauge demand.

Suspect the ideal buyer would be a city-dweller with a Range Rover who doesn’t mind a F rated EPC. Inability to warm it before arrival makes it a pain as a 2nd home, mind.

2nd home can be up to triple council tax in wales now, so tack that cost on too.

I confidently predict it will sell for much less.

[skwdenyer]

In terms of start-again opportunities, we quite liked this one near Sedbergh:



https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/85502367

Guided at £180k, IIRC at auction it made over double that.

[craigthecoupe]

taking price and practicality out of it, the wales house is exquisite! A moody wintry walking long weekend with friends there really is the stuff of dreams.

[monkfish1]

craigthecoupe said:

taking price and practicality out of it, the wales house is exquisite! A moody wintry walking long weekend with friends there really is the stuff of dreams.

Replace moody with windy!

Plenty of stuff like that in wales. How about this one, just over the hill, but rather less money, and more land. Back on after it obviously fell through. https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/123733964#/...

Did seriously consider this one. Access was via several miles of forestry track was a bit of a concern. Again, needed an easy grid or similar installation rather them the hotpotch that it had. Domestic hostility to that level of isolation knocked that idea on the head. I did point out it had a neighbour. One. Sort of. Was a step to far https://www.onthemarket.com/details/11441951/

[monkfish1]

skwdenyer said:

In terms of start-again opportunities, we quite liked this one near Sedbergh:



https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/85502367

Guided at £180k, IIRC at auction it made over double that.

That looks lovely. Northeast facing though, which i couldnt do. And listed. Looks like the porch is making a bid for freedom down the hill!

[monkfish1]

I think we may have hijacked the thread. Whoops.

[craigthecoupe]

monkfish1 said:

craigthecoupe said:

taking price and practicality out of it, the wales house is exquisite! A moody wintry walking long weekend with friends there really is the stuff of dreams.

Replace moody with windy!

Plenty of stuff like that in wales. How about this one, just over the hill, but rather less money, and more land. Back on after it obviously fell through. https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/123733964#/...

Did seriously consider this one. Access was via several miles of forestry track was a bit of a concern. Again, needed an easy grid or similar installation rather them the hotpotch that it had. Domestic hostility to that level of isolation knocked that idea on the head. I did point out it had a neighbour. One. Sort of. Was a step to far https://www.onthemarket.com/details/11441951/

Thanks, i'm looking at airbnbs in Wales now I've just started reading 'our wild farming life' about two women who buy a croft in Scotland, despite having a good adventure of our own, I find myself envious.

Indeed, sorry for the thread hijack, and thanks OP for the detailed updates, a very enjoyable corner of pistonheads this....

[gareth h]

monkfish1 said:

Quite! I think the wall defines the boundary. An easygrid installation to sort out electricity properly will set you back at least £30k. Plus stamp duty (higher in wales), that takes you the wrong side of £650. And look at that gap under the front door!!!! Strangely, its not sold.

Mind you, there was one down in the valley, fantastic property, but needed everything. Was up for £500. Sold in a week or so. I still think it will be back up for sale. Again, made no sense, but it did have land, albeit mostly steep woodland.

An interesting fact about stamp duty in Wales is if the property has 2 dwellings or an annex you get the allowances twice, I got a (surprising and unexpected) £20k refund when we bought our place 12 months ago.

[PasttenseofFall]

monkfish1 said:

skwdenyer said:

In terms of start-again opportunities, we quite liked this one near Sedbergh:



https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/85502367

Guided at £180k, IIRC at auction it made over double that.

That looks lovely. Northeast facing though, which i couldnt do. And listed. Looks like the porch is making a bid for freedom down the hill!

My best friend at primary school’s parents owned the barn next to this. I grew up playing here and in the forestry nearby. I remember the old farmer who lived here - went everywhere on his very old bicycle. Fairly sure the house didn’t have electricity and water came from a spring. Beautiful spot - but don’t underestimate just how tough and resourceful you have to be to live in a location like this. This particular house isn’t far from a road, but in winter it’s pretty tough weather in Dent. Sedbergh/Dent/Garsdale - don’t kid yourself on how much it rains - must be 2 in every 3 days, which can get a little depressing.

[Muppet007]

Evoluzione said:

The list of damp inputs, possible or otherwise is long, but is getting slowly shorter and they'll all need ticking off.
Not the most entertaining of pictures i'm afraid, but in a brief mild/dry spell I managed to dig a trench along the base of the Easterly gable end wall right down to the foundations, which are solid rock. It seems like they've dug down until they got to a huge flatish slab of stone and built on that.
Removing the wet soil from against the wall means it isn't wicking damp up, the trench will be lined (bottom and soil side only) with a water permeable membrane (to stop the soil from coming back) and filled with gravel to allow water to run through, known as a 'French drain'.

Can I ask what membrane you used here? I have a similar problem (damp old stone wall). I have the will to fix it, just not the knowledge of materials.
Thanks.

[Evoluzione]

Muppet007 said:

Can I ask what membrane you used here? I have a similar problem (damp old stone wall). I have the will to fix it, just not the knowledge of materials.
Thanks.

I can search it out somehow and find out the exact one if needed, but it's nothing special. It's just a general landscaping membrane, used for putting on the ground to stop weeds from coming through.
There is another way of doing the job and that is to line the outside of your trench with slabs. You then fill the trench with gravel and the slabs stop the soil from mixing with it.

[Evoluzione]

The sun has a way to go before it sets a long way from there, but the daylight hours are increasing noticeably now, was able to play out in the recent decent weather until about 5.30 recently. I feel guilty for wishing my life away, but roll on March 31st.



Pic courtesy of ace photographer Steve Bradley.

Not much new has been happening, hence me not posting.
I've just had Op No.2 done so am having a few hrs off while the anaesthetic wears thin and the pain starts.
As you may have seen I started a fruit and veg growing thread, it is to separate that side of things from this one and appeal to normal gardeners. Anything which is a bit more er, industrial i'll keep here.

As with the rest of the UK, we've been treated to some lovely Winter sunsets.






Get down Benford you tart

Took advantage of the frozen fields to get about, plant the tree there in Benford and stake the others as the wind was doing them no good.

The good weather has seen me outside more than in just recently and it was time to tackle this dumping ground by the entrance:



I'd previously had a prod around and surprisingly found the whole stretch to the left paved, but buried under a foot of pretty decent soil:



As you can see in the foreground we already have one layer of mill flags laid over another, but they can stay as they are until I find a use for them

We found new homes for all the stuff on top then I went in with the rusty duo to dig up a few tons of hidden stone, then found a temporary home for that too



The soil surface was already a bit low, it was going to be even lower with the stone pulled out. So I tipped in a few tons of crap soil in the bottom before putting the decent stuff over the top.



Mmmm, tilth. Try saying that without smirking.



The South is to the right and I let last years strawberry plants go mad and throw out loads of runners which has resulted in about 80 new plants. Current thinking is to plant them to the right, sow wildflower seeds over the majority and then maybe some espalier apple trees against the wall, but we'll see, we have a few weeks to think about whilst the soil settles and the weather gets better.

As my hand gets better and presumably as the weather gets worse i'll carry on in the house to get some jobs finished in there.