2022 Lawn Thread
Discussion
Condi said:
CubanPete said:
The moss at the front hasn't grown much...
Lucky you. My grass is 70% moss in winter, it never really dries out and the moss just loves it. Managed to cut it the other day, looks a lot better now. Would agree with removing clippings at this time of year, it's too cold for them to break down. Edited by Condi on Saturday 29th January 23:46
Dr Mike Oxgreen said:
I personally don’t mulch or leave clippings on during the winter - I use the mower’s collection bag.
Two reasons:
Firstly it’s probably too cold for bacterial and/or fungal action to break the clippings down.
Secondly the additional leaf material on the surface will attract earthworms to the surface to feed on the organic matter,, thus increasing casts. This doesn’t seem to be a problem in the warmer months; worms only really cast in autumn and winter.
During summer I nearly always mow with the mulching plug in. I’m sure the lawn benefits.
Oops...Two reasons:
Firstly it’s probably too cold for bacterial and/or fungal action to break the clippings down.
Secondly the additional leaf material on the surface will attract earthworms to the surface to feed on the organic matter,, thus increasing casts. This doesn’t seem to be a problem in the warmer months; worms only really cast in autumn and winter.
During summer I nearly always mow with the mulching plug in. I’m sure the lawn benefits.
It has been continuously growing (N Hampshire) and lawn looking a bit meh so sent the robot out this week. Otherwise it would become too much for him. He has only been on holiday for a couple of months!
Looks much better but now you got me worried! No leaves though...
Any tips on how or when to try and start eliminating moss? My front garden even in the summer only gets sunlight in the evening and as I have only been in this house 1 summer I need to start tacking the problem of moss on my front lawn.
The back garden was relaid in early 2021 and really grows so this year I am turning my attention to front.
The back garden was relaid in early 2021 and really grows so this year I am turning my attention to front.
Chuffedmonkey said:
Any tips on how or when to try and start eliminating moss? My front garden even in the summer only gets sunlight in the evening and as I have only been in this house 1 summer I need to start tacking the problem of moss on my front lawn.
The back garden was relaid in early 2021 and really grows so this year I am turning my attention to front.
I have a general view regarding lawns. Grasses are weeds. They will start growing three minutes after the apocalypse. They are ancient, tough as old boots and will grow anywhere it is possible for them to grow. The back garden was relaid in early 2021 and really grows so this year I am turning my attention to front.
There are two things that define the utter arrogance of man. One, that every generation is adamant that the end of the world will occur on their watch and the second is that we can and must make grass grow where it is repeatedly saying it's not going to.
My view is that if you can't remedy the reason why moss is the superior plant to grass on that bit of land then you have two choices, retain your sanity and not try and grow grass where other plants are superior or, get the largest English passport that you can, join a gold club, start writing to the Telegraph or Daily Mail and commit to an unwinable war that will take every penny you earn and will always fail.
Moss v Grass is potentially your Vietnam.
DonkeyApple said:
I have a general view regarding lawns. Grasses are weeds. They will start growing three minutes after the apocalypse. They are ancient, tough as old boots and will grow anywhere it is possible for them to grow.
There are two things that define the utter arrogance of man. One, that every generation is adamant that the end of the world will occur on their watch and the second is that we can and must make grass grow where it is repeatedly saying it's not going to.
My view is that if you can't remedy the reason why moss is the superior plant to grass on that bit of land then you have two choices, retain your sanity and not try and grow grass where other plants are superior or, get the largest English passport that you can, join a gold club, start writing to the Telegraph or Daily Mail and commit to an unwinable war that will take every penny you earn and will always fail.
Moss v Grass is potentially your Vietnam.
Great reply..... I think. There are two things that define the utter arrogance of man. One, that every generation is adamant that the end of the world will occur on their watch and the second is that we can and must make grass grow where it is repeatedly saying it's not going to.
My view is that if you can't remedy the reason why moss is the superior plant to grass on that bit of land then you have two choices, retain your sanity and not try and grow grass where other plants are superior or, get the largest English passport that you can, join a gold club, start writing to the Telegraph or Daily Mail and commit to an unwinable war that will take every penny you earn and will always fail.
Moss v Grass is potentially your Vietnam.
So basically rip it up, relay and have a nice garden for a couple of years then expect the battle of the moss to win long term? I was hoping some sort of magic fertilizer would help.
The garden does not look bad from a far but the grass/moss never seems to grow due not gettng any sun. Its that bad all my small trees and bushes are all pointing west, trying to grow with any sun they can get. Not a straight tree or bush in my garden at all.
The back garden by contrast thrives, sun all day during Spring/Summer.
Chuffedmonkey said:
Great reply..... I think.
So basically rip it up, relay and have a nice garden for a couple of years then expect the battle of the moss to win long term? I was hoping some sort of magic fertilizer would help.
The garden does not look bad from a far but the grass/moss never seems to grow due not gettng any sun. Its that bad all my small trees and bushes are all pointing west, trying to grow with any sun they can get. Not a straight tree or bush in my garden at all.
The back garden by contrast thrives, sun all day during Spring/Summer.
If that bit of land is genuinely in shade almost all the time then trying to pour enough chemicals on it to get grass to grow is going to drive you mad. Logic dictates running with nature rather than entering a war you can never win. If it's as bad as you allude then maybe going a bit Mediterranean with gravels and strategic planting rather than lawn?So basically rip it up, relay and have a nice garden for a couple of years then expect the battle of the moss to win long term? I was hoping some sort of magic fertilizer would help.
The garden does not look bad from a far but the grass/moss never seems to grow due not gettng any sun. Its that bad all my small trees and bushes are all pointing west, trying to grow with any sun they can get. Not a straight tree or bush in my garden at all.
The back garden by contrast thrives, sun all day during Spring/Summer.
DonkeyApple said:
Chuffedmonkey said:
Any tips on how or when to try and start eliminating moss? My front garden even in the summer only gets sunlight in the evening and as I have only been in this house 1 summer I need to start tacking the problem of moss on my front lawn.
The back garden was relaid in early 2021 and really grows so this year I am turning my attention to front.
I have a general view regarding lawns. Grasses are weeds. They will start growing three minutes after the apocalypse. They are ancient, tough as old boots and will grow anywhere it is possible for them to grow. The back garden was relaid in early 2021 and really grows so this year I am turning my attention to front.
There are two things that define the utter arrogance of man. One, that every generation is adamant that the end of the world will occur on their watch and the second is that we can and must make grass grow where it is repeatedly saying it's not going to.
My view is that if you can't remedy the reason why moss is the superior plant to grass on that bit of land then you have two choices, retain your sanity and not try and grow grass where other plants are superior or, get the largest English passport that you can, join a gold club, start writing to the Telegraph or Daily Mail and commit to an unwinable war that will take every penny you earn and will always fail.
Moss v Grass is potentially your Vietnam.
Chuffedmonkey said:
So basically rip it up, relay ....
...with anything but lawn! Because grass grows almost everywhere, and isn't growing there! Was I believe the point being made. If it is borderline, then some soluble iron or lawn sand and gentle raking etc can tip the balance. But if it really doesn't get almost any sun at all then as suggested, it will be an uphill and unfair battle you can't win.
This is our lawn, slightly neglected, but still fine bar where I left too many leaves in too long. While it can green up fairly even now I have overseeded the main lawn two years on the trott, you can still clearly see the section which is new lawn again, seeded over what was likely once nice gardening soil and clearly has a lot more depth and green matter than the 5inchs of low grade topsoil on sandstone bed rock elsewhere.
Bit late, but I've just bought a bag of Lawnsmith "Winter Green High Iron" which is 5-0-8 + 9% iron so I think I'll put that in at minimum dose, in the hope it helps while also not creating too much dog urine burn!
Give it a couple of months with that, will it's warm enough for some Natur Spring 18-3-8 I guess.
Don't really know what the best plan is for building up the soil. Maybe some mulching when the weather is right? I don't have a plug or mulch blade but can do a few close twice weekly cuts without the collection box?
Is it worth getting in a ton or two of well rotted manure or equivalent?
I did top-dress and level with about 10mm (several tons) of soil from the garden area when that was leveled down to seed it, as part of the overseeded process, which sorted the thatch as well as giving the new seed something to germinate in. But otherwise the whole plot is on a sandstone ridge. Even new builds don't need foundations here!
Daniel
Edited by dhutch on Friday 11th February 12:09
dhutch said:
...with anything but lawn! Because grass grows almost everywhere, and isn't growing there! Was I believe the point being made.
If it is borderline, then some soluble iron or lawn sand and gentle raking etc can tip the balance. But if it really doesn't get almost any sun at all then as suggested, it will be an uphill and unfair battle you can't win.
That is my thinking. If a bit of simple, low cost tlc reverses the situation so that grass pit competes then fine but otherwise I'd personally chose sanity and try to grow something else or nothing else on that space. If it is borderline, then some soluble iron or lawn sand and gentle raking etc can tip the balance. But if it really doesn't get almost any sun at all then as suggested, it will be an uphill and unfair battle you can't win.
We had a first mow last weekend, it's not looking good at the moment.
The lawn is sparse and there is a lot of clover in the lawn. There is also a patch that seems to get a bit waterlogged where nothing grows. Oh yes.... The whole area around here has a leather jacket problem too.
Anyway, as it happens, the local lawn care people popped round a few days ago to follow up on an appointment I had last year. They suggested a blanket kill of the grass, aeration, scarification and reseeding with sports pitch grass. Unfortunately they can only do so much with the leather jackets since the ban on that particular insecticide.
My wife will not let me spend £200 on someone to fix the lawn. So what are the suggestions? I can get an electric lawn raker off marketplace for not much money, will this do the job of a scarifier?
The lawn is sparse and there is a lot of clover in the lawn. There is also a patch that seems to get a bit waterlogged where nothing grows. Oh yes.... The whole area around here has a leather jacket problem too.
Anyway, as it happens, the local lawn care people popped round a few days ago to follow up on an appointment I had last year. They suggested a blanket kill of the grass, aeration, scarification and reseeding with sports pitch grass. Unfortunately they can only do so much with the leather jackets since the ban on that particular insecticide.
My wife will not let me spend £200 on someone to fix the lawn. So what are the suggestions? I can get an electric lawn raker off marketplace for not much money, will this do the job of a scarifier?
BigGingerBob said:
My wife will not let me spend £200 on someone to fix the lawn. So what are the suggestions? I can get an electric lawn raker off marketplace for not much money, will this do the job of a scarifier?
You're not going to get much done for £200...! Welcome to the hobby.Can you get some good overall and close up photos? Hand for scale on the latter.
Scarification is good for thatch if you have it, less so if you don't! Some clover isn't a bad thing.
Hollow tube aeration is almost always good. Hire a machine and makes sure is a Camon (red) type crank based vertical stabbing type machine rather than a rotary Bannerman (green) type. Unless you want to rotovate it!
Then overseed, ideally with some top dressing of topsoil.
All of which needs to wait till it's a little warmer for germination.
Managed to pick up a new to me mower for less than the price of the service kit and blade i replaced on it. It's not got the proper basket so will need to make do with the temporary one for the time being. Anyone know where to lay hands on one???
A full service done its running very nice ready for use later in the year.
I haven't got a aerator so spent three hours yesterday forking the back garden.
The grass is looking really poor with quite a layer of tatch so roll on the warmer weather and I'll get started.
A full service done its running very nice ready for use later in the year.
I haven't got a aerator so spent three hours yesterday forking the back garden.
The grass is looking really poor with quite a layer of tatch so roll on the warmer weather and I'll get started.
Rockape said:
Managed to pick up a new to me mower for less than the price of the service kit and blade I replaced on it. It's not got the proper basket so will need to make do with the temporary one for the time being. Anyone know where to lay hands on one???
A full service done its running very nice ready for use later in the year.
I haven't got a aerator so spent three hours yesterday forking the back garden.
The grass is looking really poor with quite a layer of tatch so roll on the warmer weather and I'll get started.
Nice. Honda HRX 476 Roller? Snap. Nice mowers and hard to find for a sensible price used, people seem to keep hold of them or pay too much! Grass bags appear to wear out fairly prematurely, and are not too bad at £50, but with no used ones on ebay, the frame is another £50 on top it seems! Maybe message a few ebay based repairer/refurbishes and you might get lucky and find a used one?A full service done its running very nice ready for use later in the year.
I haven't got a aerator so spent three hours yesterday forking the back garden.
The grass is looking really poor with quite a layer of tatch so roll on the warmer weather and I'll get started.
Depending on the size, deffo hire a Camon LA20 / LA25 for a day. Doesnt go a deep as a fork, but if you apply gentle backwards pressure you get the full 3" insert of a hollow tine, and a bit of top-dressing for free.
Dr Mike Oxgreen said:
The plug is simply a piece of plastic that wedges into the rear outflow, blocking it and trapping the clippings so they’re forced to stay under the deck slightly longer.
For mulching to work, you also need a special mulching blade. These are a more complex shape - they bend up and down along the length of the blade, unlike a normal blade which is generally straight. The bends in the blade change the aerodynamics under the deck and help with the mulching process.
For some mowers it’s possible to buy a mulching kit. This would consist of a plug plus a mulching blade. Not sure if the Spirit 41 can be converted - mine is an Osprey 46, which is a mulching mower by design (and in fact I don’t think there’s a normal blade that fits it).
How do you find the Osprey? For mulching to work, you also need a special mulching blade. These are a more complex shape - they bend up and down along the length of the blade, unlike a normal blade which is generally straight. The bends in the blade change the aerodynamics under the deck and help with the mulching process.
For some mowers it’s possible to buy a mulching kit. This would consist of a plug plus a mulching blade. Not sure if the Spirit 41 can be converted - mine is an Osprey 46, which is a mulching mower by design (and in fact I don’t think there’s a normal blade that fits it).
I have a 30year old Honda HR194 that I bought as a non runner for £100 many years ago and have enjoyed tinkering with to keep it maintained. Great mower but it is rapidly developing multiple holes in the aluminium deck, decks are practically impossible to source given the age.
Mrs Buzz has suggested I treat myself and get something decent and reliable so we can keep a nice cut lawn so our 1yr and 3yr boys can enjoy the garden (still have a old ride on mower to satisfy the need to tinker)
Honda Izy's are out of my price range but I have been looking around and keep coming back to the Osprey 46 or 53. looked last year and nowhere seemed to stock them. now there is stock and spring is coming it might be time for a purchase
BigGingerBob said:
[url]
|https://thumbsnap.com/eMfL5mPa[/url][url]
|https://thumbsnap.com/Vez6caFz[/url]This is the part of the garden that I assume gets waterlogged behind the shed
The lawn as a whole
I am not a leather jacket expert having so far avoided that game, however certainly doesn't look awful to me, thin but otherwise nice grasses and no real thatch to speak of. Is it a youngish lawn? Does what grass you have grow reasonably well come growing season?
If it where me I would hold fire till spring. Then aerate, either with a hollow tine machine (fast, but £50 to hire) or with a fork (time consuming, but free and a deeper lift), and overseed with a lawn seed of your choice (am a using Lawnsmith Stay green as it suits our sandy location, but you can do a lot worse than generic BnQ spec 'family lawn seed' an then top-dress with either some top-soil or compost. You can get either bagged from the diy/garden outlets and or loose, more the better, broadly.
Lawnsmiths have good guides on their site, plus plenty of others elsewhere, but basically to overseed you just want to scratch up the surface a bit (light scarification, machine if you really want, but i would just use a spring tine rake) spread the seed down (hand cast it in two passes, even is good but perfect is not required) and then re-rake it to get the seed as covered as it can be (trying not to get the seed in clumps, but this is why its not a perfect science) top dress if you have anything to add on top. Then compact it down, either with a roller if you have one or its a huge lawn, but in practice I usually just tread it down with overlaying foot prints because for small-mid size areas its as fast anyway. Cover with polythene sheet if you can, which can again be an imperfect collection of saved/scavenged packaging. If well covered, and or nice and wet before you should be fine as is. else gently water to ensure its kept moist for the next 2-3 weeks, for once in lawn watering, you want light frequent watering, to avoid any pools and floating seed. If pre-watering, this wants to be one deep water, as you would do in a dry spell normally.
Something like that! Should thicken nicely.
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