Discussion
dmsims said:
Enut said:
dmsims said:
Can't read that 
which is why I quoted the figures in my reply
but I want to read the labels, surely not beyond the wit of mand to post a readable diagram?
Enut said:
They are meant to be bringing another battery back to replace the faulty one, so hopefully will get them to check then.
At 5.15 the figures are now....
current yield 1.37 kW, Battery charging at 0.556kW, exporting to grid 0.046 kW and consumption now only 0.776 kW
Just been into the loft and the inverter is quite hot, it that normal?
On the plus side I haven't paid for it yet!
You can just check consumption at the meter or smart meter if you have it?At 5.15 the figures are now....
current yield 1.37 kW, Battery charging at 0.556kW, exporting to grid 0.046 kW and consumption now only 0.776 kW
Just been into the loft and the inverter is quite hot, it that normal?
On the plus side I haven't paid for it yet!
Where are inverters normally installed domestically? On our commercial install, it's in the kitchen. When our inverter hits 85%+ of capacity, it does kick the fan in to cool things down, but I understand that's normal. I would be concerned about having these inverters in a loft, where summer temperatures could be very high before you consider what the inverter is doing.
OutInTheShed said:
Enut said:
They are meant to be bringing another battery back to replace the faulty one, so hopefully will get them to check then.
At 5.15 the figures are now....
current yield 1.37 kW, Battery charging at 0.556kW, exporting to grid 0.046 kW and consumption now only 0.776 kW
Just been into the loft and the inverter is quite hot, it that normal?
On the plus side I haven't paid for it yet!
'Quite hot' means different things to different people at different times, but the system is running at about 1/4 capacity, it should be barely warm.At 5.15 the figures are now....
current yield 1.37 kW, Battery charging at 0.556kW, exporting to grid 0.046 kW and consumption now only 0.776 kW
Just been into the loft and the inverter is quite hot, it that normal?
On the plus side I haven't paid for it yet!
The batteries are currently fully charged (discharging @0.2), the panels producing 3.5 KW of which only 1.0 KW is being exported, 2.7 is 'consumption', my normal consumption is in the region of 0.7, when it's dark or the batteries are being charged for example. It looks like the inverter is using the extra 2 KW!
I'm now keeping a track on actual consumption at the meter
edit 4.40 pm sun gone behind clouds, panels now only generating 0.823 KW, batteries discharging 0.161, Consumption now only 0.868 and exporting 0.116 to the grid. It looks like the inverter is using an awful lot of the power generated when it tries to export to the grid, I thought these things were meant to be efficient?
Edited by Enut on Sunday 9th October 16:44
2kW is a lot to get rid of with just a few heatsink fins.
You'd need a lot of fins and good passive airflow.
Efficiency below about 90% seems quite unlikely to me unless something is badly wrong.
I would imagine the system is measuring at least one of the powers wrong and hence calculating some others wrong.
The fact that the numbers seemed to add up exactly is suspicious for a start.
Sometimes you can get the wrong answers measuring volts and amps to get power, AC has phase and harmonics to think about, what's supposed to be DC has AC components added, and v/v.
I could speculate about stuff to measure, but googling for other people with similar issues might be more constructive.
Wild guesses might include a calibration factor being set wrong in the software.
If I was the installer I might be doing some RTFM this evening.
Power conversion systems are somewhere between 'interesting' and 'dark art'. My own relatively minor involvement with this branch of electronics has had its moments....
You'd need a lot of fins and good passive airflow.
Efficiency below about 90% seems quite unlikely to me unless something is badly wrong.
I would imagine the system is measuring at least one of the powers wrong and hence calculating some others wrong.
The fact that the numbers seemed to add up exactly is suspicious for a start.
Sometimes you can get the wrong answers measuring volts and amps to get power, AC has phase and harmonics to think about, what's supposed to be DC has AC components added, and v/v.
I could speculate about stuff to measure, but googling for other people with similar issues might be more constructive.
Wild guesses might include a calibration factor being set wrong in the software.
If I was the installer I might be doing some RTFM this evening.
Power conversion systems are somewhere between 'interesting' and 'dark art'. My own relatively minor involvement with this branch of electronics has had its moments....
OutInTheShed said:
2kW is a lot to get rid of with just a few heatsink fins.
You'd need a lot of fins and good passive airflow.
Efficiency below about 90% seems quite unlikely to me unless something is badly wrong.
I would imagine the system is measuring at least one of the powers wrong and hence calculating some others wrong.
The fact that the numbers seemed to add up exactly is suspicious for a start.
Sometimes you can get the wrong answers measuring volts and amps to get power, AC has phase and harmonics to think about, what's supposed to be DC has AC components added, and v/v.
I could speculate about stuff to measure, but googling for other people with similar issues might be more constructive.
Wild guesses might include a calibration factor being set wrong in the software.
If I was the installer I might be doing some RTFM this evening.
Power conversion systems are somewhere between 'interesting' and 'dark art'. My own relatively minor involvement with this branch of electronics has had its moments....
Thanks for your help and comments, I am to electronics what The Queen was to weightlifting so it's a steep learning curve!You'd need a lot of fins and good passive airflow.
Efficiency below about 90% seems quite unlikely to me unless something is badly wrong.
I would imagine the system is measuring at least one of the powers wrong and hence calculating some others wrong.
The fact that the numbers seemed to add up exactly is suspicious for a start.
Sometimes you can get the wrong answers measuring volts and amps to get power, AC has phase and harmonics to think about, what's supposed to be DC has AC components added, and v/v.
I could speculate about stuff to measure, but googling for other people with similar issues might be more constructive.
Wild guesses might include a calibration factor being set wrong in the software.
If I was the installer I might be doing some RTFM this evening.
Power conversion systems are somewhere between 'interesting' and 'dark art'. My own relatively minor involvement with this branch of electronics has had its moments....
markiii said:
BREMBOV6 said:
Sorry slight change of topic. We have purchased a house which has solar panels. Missives still to be concluded so expect some input from the solicitor. Does anyone have any advise on anything we can or should do?
It's a 70s building and the owner had them installed quite sometime ago. I expect she owns them out right so no outstanding payments /contract. Apart from that we aren't clued up on them. Hoping it's a positive to have them but any help or advice would be much appreciated.
find out whether they are getting FIT payments and whether these are being transferred to you?It's a 70s building and the owner had them installed quite sometime ago. I expect she owns them out right so no outstanding payments /contract. Apart from that we aren't clued up on them. Hoping it's a positive to have them but any help or advice would be much appreciated.
AW10 said:
MaxFromage said:
I would be concerned about having these inverters in a loft, where summer temperatures could be very high before you consider what the inverter is doing.
Although the loft is often a fair bit cooler after the panels are installed because they shade the roof.Thanks to the previous help on solar panels. Currently in the process of buying a house with them. I have found out the following information -
Fitted in 2011
Certified - Phono Solar Technology
Estimated Annual kWh Generation - 1339.00
Declared Net Capacity kW - 1.56
Not shown everything but this on the installer certificate. This is our opportunity to go back to the solicitor to ask any questions before missives. Somebody kindly mentioned FIT payments. Any other advice would be great!?
Fitted in 2011
Certified - Phono Solar Technology
Estimated Annual kWh Generation - 1339.00
Declared Net Capacity kW - 1.56
Not shown everything but this on the installer certificate. This is our opportunity to go back to the solicitor to ask any questions before missives. Somebody kindly mentioned FIT payments. Any other advice would be great!?
OutInTheShed said:
2kW is a lot to get rid of with just a few heatsink fins.
You'd need a lot of fins and good passive airflow.
Efficiency below about 90% seems quite unlikely to me unless something is badly wrong.
I would imagine the system is measuring at least one of the powers wrong and hence calculating some others wrong.
The fact that the numbers seemed to add up exactly is suspicious for a start.
Sometimes you can get the wrong answers measuring volts and amps to get power, AC has phase and harmonics to think about, what's supposed to be DC has AC components added, and v/v.
I could speculate about stuff to measure, but googling for other people with similar issues might be more constructive.
Wild guesses might include a calibration factor being set wrong in the software.
If I was the installer I might be doing some RTFM this evening.
Power conversion systems are somewhere between 'interesting' and 'dark art'. My own relatively minor involvement with this branch of electronics has had its moments....
We had a smart meter fitted after the solar install - long story short, the smart meter guy connected the solar panel clamp on the incoming feed incorrectly and everything was displaying incorrectly (our 4.8kW system was somehow producing over 7kW, the house that was using around 300W before he touched anything was suddenly drawing about 4kW etc). He was adamant that it was correct and I would need to speak to the installer. You'd need a lot of fins and good passive airflow.
Efficiency below about 90% seems quite unlikely to me unless something is badly wrong.
I would imagine the system is measuring at least one of the powers wrong and hence calculating some others wrong.
The fact that the numbers seemed to add up exactly is suspicious for a start.
Sometimes you can get the wrong answers measuring volts and amps to get power, AC has phase and harmonics to think about, what's supposed to be DC has AC components added, and v/v.
I could speculate about stuff to measure, but googling for other people with similar issues might be more constructive.
Wild guesses might include a calibration factor being set wrong in the software.
If I was the installer I might be doing some RTFM this evening.
Power conversion systems are somewhere between 'interesting' and 'dark art'. My own relatively minor involvement with this branch of electronics has had its moments....
Fortunately I had taken pics before and was able to point out that the cables were not in the same places - which he remedied and everything was good again.
So - it sounds like something is not wired up correctly for you.
Edited by TriumphStag3.0V8 on Thursday 20th October 22:36
Arnold Cunningham said:
Does anyone have any positive news on givenergy timelines for gen 2 inverters? Everywhere I'm looking seems to be saying no more stock until the new year?
We've been told mid Feb for installation of a system with GivEnergy inverters and batteries. Partly this is installation but also having to wait for the hardware to be delivered BREMBOV6 said:
Thanks to the previous help on solar panels. Currently in the process of buying a house with them. I have found out the following information -
Fitted in 2011
Certified - Phono Solar Technology
Estimated Annual kWh Generation - 1339.00
Declared Net Capacity kW - 1.56
Not shown everything but this on the installer certificate. This is our opportunity to go back to the solicitor to ask any questions before missives. Somebody kindly mentioned FIT payments. Any other advice would be great!?
You definitely want to ensure the FIT payments are transferred.... assuming this is a registered install. My panels were installed 2011 and I think are now being paid 64p per kW - with a > 10% rise due next year. Fitted in 2011
Certified - Phono Solar Technology
Estimated Annual kWh Generation - 1339.00
Declared Net Capacity kW - 1.56
Not shown everything but this on the installer certificate. This is our opportunity to go back to the solicitor to ask any questions before missives. Somebody kindly mentioned FIT payments. Any other advice would be great!?
The previous owners handled the process of the transfer
We had shading issues with our install - we've managed to increase our yield closer to installer prediction due to a neighbor removing a large tree and us fitting optimisers to the panels
Tobermory said:
Arnold Cunningham said:
Does anyone have any positive news on givenergy timelines for gen 2 inverters? Everywhere I'm looking seems to be saying no more stock until the new year?
We've been told mid Feb for installation of a system with GivEnergy inverters and batteries. Partly this is installation but also having to wait for the hardware to be delivered Chris Type R said:
BREMBOV6 said:
Thanks to the previous help on solar panels. Currently in the process of buying a house with them. I have found out the following information -
Fitted in 2011
Certified - Phono Solar Technology
Estimated Annual kWh Generation - 1339.00
Declared Net Capacity kW - 1.56
Not shown everything but this on the installer certificate. This is our opportunity to go back to the solicitor to ask any questions before missives. Somebody kindly mentioned FIT payments. Any other advice would be great!?
You definitely want to ensure the FIT payments are transferred.... assuming this is a registered install. My panels were installed 2011 and I think are now being paid 64p per kW - with a > 10% rise due next year. Fitted in 2011
Certified - Phono Solar Technology
Estimated Annual kWh Generation - 1339.00
Declared Net Capacity kW - 1.56
Not shown everything but this on the installer certificate. This is our opportunity to go back to the solicitor to ask any questions before missives. Somebody kindly mentioned FIT payments. Any other advice would be great!?
The previous owners handled the process of the transfer
We had shading issues with our install - we've managed to increase our yield closer to installer prediction due to a neighbor removing a large tree and us fitting optimisers to the panels
markiii said:
tell me more about these optimisers?
Optimisers basically allow each panel to operate at peak function, regardless of the performance of the surrounding panels.When panels are instead installed with strings (often 2, top row, bottom row) the performance of the best panel is limited by the performance of the worst panel in that string. So shading on panel 1 will limit the performance of panel 4. Optimisers remove this limitation, but add cost and complexity.
Evanivitch said:
Optimisers basically allow each panel to operate at peak function, regardless of the performance of the surrounding panels.
When panels are instead installed with strings (often 2, top row, bottom row) the performance of the best panel is limited by the performance of the worst panel in that string. So shading on panel 1 will limit the performance of panel 4. Optimisers remove this limitation, but add cost and complexity.
Not trueWhen panels are instead installed with strings (often 2, top row, bottom row) the performance of the best panel is limited by the performance of the worst panel in that string. So shading on panel 1 will limit the performance of panel 4. Optimisers remove this limitation, but add cost and complexity.
They can give a (marginal) improvemnet in certain situations
They cannot help if the bypass diode(s) are active - which is built into the panels
Those diodes already ensure that that a non shaded panel does not affect an unshaded panel
Be very interested to see actual payback figures for these (and did the salesmen offer to tarmac the drive at the same time ?)
markiii said:
tell me more about these optimisers?
The previous and elderly owners of our house must have sat down with a good and amoral salesman who was able to relieve them of £14.5k for a 2kWp installation in a compromised location. This in a house with totally inadequate loft insulation. The panels are located facing south on a single story part of the house which is shaded from the east in the morning by the double story part of the house. There was also a large Silverbirch tree in the neighbours garden, about 6 metres away SW of the panels.
I installed Tigo (TS4-A-Oex) optimisers to each of the panels to try and improve matters - https://www.tigoenergy.com/product/ts4-a-o .As our install is on a single story part of the house it was possible to reasonably safely DIY this.
We still receive partial shading in the morning and late afternoon. It's hard to know how effective these have been in monetary terms as they were fitted after the tree was removed. What they have added is monitoring, allowing me to work out which panels are underperforming and to move these to the slots with less sun i.e. to maximise the yield from the better performing panels.
The combination of tree removal, fitting optimisers, and rearranging the panels has seen output in 2022 projected to be 1940kW vs 1240kW in 2021.
I think I could improve output even further by moving 3 or 4 of the panels to the south facing part of the double story part of the house, but that's not something I'd want to undertake myself.
These are the gains using Tigo's own algorithm for much of this year to date - on the face of it not much of a gain for the capital.
Per the image, I we have bad shading in the morning, in as much as it's diagonal. We also had shading from a soil pipe. Moving the array two tiles higher helped eliminate that issue - which is where the per panel monitoring was useful to help identify this.
Edited by Chris Type R on Thursday 20th October 09:49
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