Smart meters. Wish you hadn't?

[TonyRPH]

monthou said:

turbobloke said:

The smart meters scandal is about to explode in our faces
Daily Telegraph, 27 March 2024

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/03/27/the-sm...

Could be a pearoast at 4 days old.

Snips from the link said:

It would not be much of a surprise if Ed Miliband, as energy minister, introduces some form of energy rationing.

The technology doesn’t work as planned. The numbers don’t add up. And ordinary people may have their lives ruined by a system that barely even recognises they exist. If ITV is looking for a follow-up to its hit drama about the Post Office scandal its producers and script writers do not have to look very far. It is playing out in real-time right now. In reality, the smart meter fiasco risks turning into the next Horizon scandal.

It gets 'better' after that, and while experiences will differ, unfortunately far too many won't.

nonsense_article said:

Your smart meter might then decide when you can and can’t boil the kettle

How's that going to work then?

Smart meters enable suppliers to switch the electricity off remotely (when they work) - I suspect that's how it'll work.

[monthou]

TonyRPH said:

Smart meters enable suppliers to switch the electricity off remotely (when they work) - I suspect that's how it'll work.

They(energy suppliers) can't just stop the kettle boiling, they could in theory disconnect the supply.
They can't just cut you off because they feel like it though - there are very limited circumstrances in which it can happen.
No politician will sign off on them being able to cut people off in the situation described.

It's pure tinfoil hattery.

[dickymint]

monthou said:

TonyRPH said:

Smart meters enable suppliers to switch the electricity off remotely (when they work) - I suspect that's how it'll work.

They(energy suppliers) can't just stop the kettle boiling, they could in theory disconnect the supply.
They can't just cut you off because they feel like it though - there are very limited circumstrances in which it can happen.
No politician will sign off on them being able to cut people off in the situation described.

It's pure tinfoil hattery.

Price Capping is effectively rationing (it's also called Price Rationing)...... it's already happening without extra legislation.

[monthou]

dickymint said:

monthou said:

TonyRPH said:

Smart meters enable suppliers to switch the electricity off remotely (when they work) - I suspect that's how it'll work.

They(energy suppliers) can't just stop the kettle boiling, they could in theory disconnect the supply.
They can't just cut you off because they feel like it though - there are very limited circumstrances in which it can happen.
No politician will sign off on them being able to cut people off in the situation described.

It's pure tinfoil hattery.

Price Capping is effectively rationing (it's also called Price Rationing)...... it's already happening without extra legislation.

Does it stop you boiling your kettle at 5pm?

[OutInTheShed]

monthou said:

They(energy suppliers) can't just stop the kettle boiling, they could in theory disconnect the supply.
They can't just cut you off because they feel like it though - there are very limited circumstrances in which it can happen.
No politician will sign off on them being able to cut people off in the situation described.

It's pure tinfoil hattery.

I suspect one othose 'circumstances' might be where the supplier says you owe them thousands of pounds, because their meter software is a pile of poo.

The problem is, we seem to have committed to asystem which has no chance of working in 100% of homes.
On top of the we have the UK software industry's endemic incompetence.

[monthou]

OutInTheShed said:

monthou said:

They(energy suppliers) can't just stop the kettle boiling, they could in theory disconnect the supply.
They can't just cut you off because they feel like it though - there are very limited circumstrances in which it can happen.
No politician will sign off on them being able to cut people off in the situation described.

It's pure tinfoil hattery.

I suspect one othose 'circumstances' might be where the supplier says you owe them thousands of pounds, because their meter software is a pile of poo.

The problem is, we seem to have committed to asystem which has no chance of working in 100% of homes.
On top of the we have the UK software industry's endemic incompetence.

Sure. Is that in any way related to the bullst claim in the article that Ed Milliband will be telling us when we can boil our kettles?

[Condi]

dickymint said:

Price Capping is effectively rationing (it's also called Price Rationing)...... it's already happening without extra legislation.

The only price cap is the one which the government imposes on suppliers to the benefit on consumers, the same price cap which was so far below the cost of buying the electricity it ended up being a £400m subsidy from suppliers to consumers and caused half the suppliers in the market to go bust!

[dickymint]

Condi said:

dickymint said:

Price Capping is effectively rationing (it's also called Price Rationing)...... it's already happening without extra legislation.

The only price cap is the one which the government imposes on suppliers to the benefit on consumers, the same price cap which was so far below the cost of buying the electricity it ended up being a £400m subsidy from suppliers to consumers and caused half the suppliers in the market to go bust!

I'm pretty sure you were OK with many of these suppliers going 'bust' as their pricing models were unsustainable - Bulb springs to mind.

Do you agree that Price Rationing is a well known economic method?

[monthou]

dickymint said:

Condi said:

dickymint said:

Price Capping is effectively rationing (it's also called Price Rationing)...... it's already happening without extra legislation.

The only price cap is the one which the government imposes on suppliers to the benefit on consumers, the same price cap which was so far below the cost of buying the electricity it ended up being a £400m subsidy from suppliers to consumers and caused half the suppliers in the market to go bust!

I'm pretty sure you were OK with many of these suppliers going 'bust' as their pricing models were unsustainable - Bulb springs to mind.

Do you agree that Price Rationing is a well known economic method?

Could you explain how this rationing is (supposedly) happening?
What limits are in place on kettle boiling?

[Condi]

dickymint said:

I'm pretty sure you were OK with many of these suppliers going 'bust' as their pricing models were unsustainable - Bulb springs to mind.

Do you agree that Price Rationing is a well known economic method?

I was okay with them going bust as their risk management was non existent for those who sold fixed price contracts and didnt cover their exposure, but I did also very much disagree with forcing suppliers to buy power and sell it to customers at a loss.

Price rationing/Time based pricing is very common, and I see no reason it shouldn't be applied to energy. Energy at peak times is distinctly more expensive than energy at low demand points, exposing consumers to some of that price spread has a lot of benefits and few drawbacks.

Nowhere will you be banned from boiling a kettle though.

[Mercdriver]

dickymint said:

I'm pretty sure you were OK with many of these suppliers going 'bust' as their pricing models were unsustainable - Bulb springs to mind.

Yes the companies that went bankrupt, their debts were added to everyone’s bill along with the cost of installing smart meters, wonder if they can think of any more ways of pushing power costs up?

[anonymoususer]

Mercdriver said:

dickymint said:

I'm pretty sure you were OK with many of these suppliers going 'bust' as their pricing models were unsustainable - Bulb springs to mind.

Yes the companies that went bankrupt, their debts were added to everyone’s bill along with the cost of installing smart meters, wonder if they can think of any more ways of pushing power costs up?

Some of those "energy suppliers" that went bust were little more than pyramid schemes towards the end of their days. Their customers bankrolled them by paying ever more dosh racking up fortunes in "credit"
I

[dickymint]

Condi said:

dickymint said:

I'm pretty sure you were OK with many of these suppliers going 'bust' as their pricing models were unsustainable - Bulb springs to mind.

Do you agree that Price Rationing is a well known economic method?

I was okay with them going bust as their risk management was non existent for those who sold fixed price contracts and didnt cover their exposure, but I did also very much disagree with forcing suppliers to buy power and sell it to customers at a loss.

Price rationing/Time based pricing is very common, and I see no reason it shouldn't be applied to energy. Energy at peak times is distinctly more expensive than energy at low demand points, exposing consumers to some of that price spread has a lot of benefits and few drawbacks.

Nowhere will you be banned from boiling a kettle though.

Thank you


As regards "the kettle" I was banned from using it in 1972 and 1974

[The Three D Mucketeer]

dickymint said:

Thank you


As regards "the kettle" I was banned from using it in 1972 and 1974

You can thank Mick McGahey and the NUM for that
But Miliband eating a bacon butty is funnier

Edited by The Three D Mucketeer on Sunday 31st March 15:33

[TonyRPH]

Why would 'energy rationing' even be required in the UK though?

We are constantly assured that there is sufficient capacity on the grid.

As for net zero - that's just a pipe dream.

[dickymint]

The Three D Mucketeer said:

dickymint said:

Thank you


As regards "the kettle" I was banned from using it in 1972 and 1974

You can thank Mick McGahey and the NUM for that
But Miliband eating a bacon butty is funnier

Edited by The Three D Mucketeer on Sunday 31st March 15:33

Depends on your politics who to blame - I did see your Scargill attribution by the way

But facts are facts it happened.

[dickymint]

TonyRPH said:

Why would 'energy rationing' even be required in the UK though?

We are constantly assured that there is sufficient capacity on the grid.

As for net zero - that's just a pipe dream.

Not enough 'pipes'

[The Three D Mucketeer]

dickymint said:

Depends on your politics who to blame - I did see your Scargill attribution by the way

But facts are facts it happened.

I noticed the year , I was at Newcastle Uni then , fortunately the pubs didn't have electric pumps then just candles

[QuickQuack]

There needs to be a further I was happy with ours but now realise that the poll needs a further option:

Have a smart meter, a SMETS2 meter no less, but need a new meter and the current meter probably shouldn't have been installed.

We have 3-phase supply to the house, we've always had it, no idea why. It a big house and our usual electrician had commented on the 3-phase supply when he was first working at ours 10-12 years ago. When OVO wanted to fit smart meters, we held out for a while, then eventually relented when they promised a 2nd gen SMETS2 meter. However, it looks like they've only connected a single phase to it.

That hasn't caused us any issues till now. Problem is, we're now considering getting an EV for me, as we already have 3-phase, I'd like a 22kW charger, especially as my new office is 140 miles away, I'll only be spending 1 or 2 days every week/every other week so I need the car fully charged as I won't stay overnight, and not infrequently, I may need to travel to it 2 days in a row, so getting 280 mile range back into an EV overnight is only really going to be possible with a 22kW home charger. Apart from the difficulty of finding a 22kW home charger compatible with smart charging tariffs, we need a 3-phase smart meter first...

[BigBen]

QuickQuack said:

There needs to be a further I was happy with ours but now realise that the poll needs a further option:

Have a smart meter, a SMETS2 meter no less, but need a new meter and the current meter probably shouldn't have been installed.

We have 3-phase supply to the house, we've always had it, no idea why. It a big house and our usual electrician had commented on the 3-phase supply when he was first working at ours 10-12 years ago. When OVO wanted to fit smart meters, we held out for a while, then eventually relented when they promised a 2nd gen SMETS2 meter. However, it looks like they've only connected a single phase to it.

That hasn't caused us any issues till now. Problem is, we're now considering getting an EV for me, as we already have 3-phase, I'd like a 22kW charger, especially as my new office is 140 miles away, I'll only be spending 1 or 2 days every week/every other week so I need the car fully charged as I won't stay overnight, and not infrequently, I may need to travel to it 2 days in a row, so getting 280 mile range back into an EV overnight is only really going to be possible with a 22kW home charger. Apart from the difficulty of finding a 22kW home charger compatible with smart charging tariffs, we need a 3-phase smart meter first...

Sounds like what you want is a 7kW charger connected to one of the unmetered phases......