church repair insurance if you live near one!! advice wanted
Discussion
im purchasing a property which has a church on a near by street, its about 800 meters away.
the solicitors have written to me saying i have to take out chancel insurance for any future repairs to the church. £88 for insurance and a £25+vat set up fee from my nice solicitor.
Can anyone advise me on this. the property is a fair way away from the church, im not sure of its age,it looks old though, where would the chancel boundaries be found to see if i am definetley within the area liable to pay for any repairs.
do i have to have this insurance, would my mortgage company require me to have it? can anyone shed any light on the subject, its new to me. (i understand what the insurance if for)
the solicitors have written to me saying i have to take out chancel insurance for any future repairs to the church. £88 for insurance and a £25+vat set up fee from my nice solicitor.
Can anyone advise me on this. the property is a fair way away from the church, im not sure of its age,it looks old though, where would the chancel boundaries be found to see if i am definetley within the area liable to pay for any repairs.
do i have to have this insurance, would my mortgage company require me to have it? can anyone shed any light on the subject, its new to me. (i understand what the insurance if for)
Yes get insured stright away, your solicitors will be able to do a search to see if your property/you are responsible in part for repairs to your local church.
Link; http://tinyurl.com/nlh42a
Link; http://tinyurl.com/nlh42a
Ask to see the result of the chancel check before you buy the insurance just to be sure that you may be liable. A lot of people have got caught out with this liablity over the years and only recently have conveyancers started to do the checks in most cases. I don't see why they would charge you for arranging the cover though.
Edited by rlw on Tuesday 4th August 19:09
does this apply to chapels or just churches??
with the chancel check, isnt that a full blown check that indicated if you are 100% in the boundaries?
i think they do a basic check of the address 1st to see if you could potentially be in the boundary and if you potentialy are then they recomend you take out insurance.
if you have the full blown chancel check £100 roughly, then if you are in the boundaries then you have to notify HMRC and the insurace policy costs more.
at the moment insurance is £88.
with the chancel check, isnt that a full blown check that indicated if you are 100% in the boundaries?
i think they do a basic check of the address 1st to see if you could potentially be in the boundary and if you potentialy are then they recomend you take out insurance.
if you have the full blown chancel check £100 roughly, then if you are in the boundaries then you have to notify HMRC and the insurace policy costs more.
at the moment insurance is £88.
What are Chancel Repairs?
Chancel repairs originate from an ancient law which inflicts obligations on property owners, whose homes are situated within a parish, to repair and maintain the local church. The church can ask for money whenever it decides the church needs repair and there is no limit to the amount the church can demand.
Around 5,300 churches benefit from this ancient law and unless private individuals who may fall foul of the Chancel Repair Liability have taken steps to identify any potential liability at the time of purchasing their home, they could find themselves in the situation where they are required to pay to repair and maintain their local church.
The Wallbank Case
The revival of this law was brought about by a high profile case of Parochial Church Council of the Parish of Aston Cantlow and Wilmcote with Billesley, Warwickshire v Wallbank (2003).
Mr and Mrs Wallbank inherited a farm which was within the historical parish boundary. When they inherited the farm, they also inherited the chancel repair liability. The Parochial Church Council of Aston Cantlow ("the Church") wrote to the Wallbanks demanding money for repairs. Mr and Mrs Wallbank disputed the claim, however the final judgment found the Wallbanks liable for a bill for repairs totalling £186,986 plus VAT and costs, which brought the total to about £250,000.
What is the position now?
In October 2013 all chancel repair obligations will cease unless the Church has noted their interest in any particular property or land with the land registry prior to this date. This means that the Church of England still has until 2013 to register all land that is liable for chancel repairs and may lead to an increase in demands made by the church.
What can I do to protect against liability?
It is now possible to carry out a preliminary search which will disclose whether the property is situated in an affected area. If the search reveals that there is potential liability either a full search can be made or indemnity insurance taken out.
Chancel repairs originate from an ancient law which inflicts obligations on property owners, whose homes are situated within a parish, to repair and maintain the local church. The church can ask for money whenever it decides the church needs repair and there is no limit to the amount the church can demand.
Around 5,300 churches benefit from this ancient law and unless private individuals who may fall foul of the Chancel Repair Liability have taken steps to identify any potential liability at the time of purchasing their home, they could find themselves in the situation where they are required to pay to repair and maintain their local church.
The Wallbank Case
The revival of this law was brought about by a high profile case of Parochial Church Council of the Parish of Aston Cantlow and Wilmcote with Billesley, Warwickshire v Wallbank (2003).
Mr and Mrs Wallbank inherited a farm which was within the historical parish boundary. When they inherited the farm, they also inherited the chancel repair liability. The Parochial Church Council of Aston Cantlow ("the Church") wrote to the Wallbanks demanding money for repairs. Mr and Mrs Wallbank disputed the claim, however the final judgment found the Wallbanks liable for a bill for repairs totalling £186,986 plus VAT and costs, which brought the total to about £250,000.
What is the position now?
In October 2013 all chancel repair obligations will cease unless the Church has noted their interest in any particular property or land with the land registry prior to this date. This means that the Church of England still has until 2013 to register all land that is liable for chancel repairs and may lead to an increase in demands made by the church.
What can I do to protect against liability?
It is now possible to carry out a preliminary search which will disclose whether the property is situated in an affected area. If the search reveals that there is potential liability either a full search can be made or indemnity insurance taken out.
Had a similar thing when I bought my house - you can pay a one-off fee to cover you whilst you live there, and then the next purchaser needs to sort their own out, OR you can get a perpetual one, which alleviates the need for future purchasers to take out the insurance as it is already in place.....
Steve
Steve
Ive got a perpetual policy on my house. I negotiated with the sellers for them to buy it for the property before we exhcanged contracts. It was only about £100 if I remember correctly and its there for life. Dont see why you would have to notify HMRC though what has it got to do with them?!?
Although the risk is miniscule Churches arent cheap to repair if you get caught!
Although the risk is miniscule Churches arent cheap to repair if you get caught!
Wings said:
Mr and Mrs Wallbank inherited a farm which was within the historical parish boundary. When they inherited the farm, they also inherited the chancel repair liability. The Parochial Church Council of Aston Cantlow ("the Church") wrote to the Wallbanks demanding money for repairs. Mr and Mrs Wallbank disputed the claim, however the final judgment found the Wallbanks liable for a bill for repairs totalling £186,986 plus VAT and costs, which brought the total to about £250,000.
That sounds completely wrong and immorale to me. If the church can't raise enough money to fix it themselves then obviously it isn't wanted there enough by local residents and they should get rid of it or turn it into a house/flats. Not force the payment of exorbitant amounts of money from unlucky local residents to pay for the upkeep of a building which is a benefit to only a small minority of church goers.Madness in my opinion.
Try getting your own insurance from Chancelcheck or whatever their associated insurance company is called. We have a block policy - £10 gets you cover.
It's a total scam really; chancel repair liability does exist, but there's no definitive record of properties affected. They would have to be within the historic boundaries of a pre-reformation church which still exists.
It's a total scam really; chancel repair liability does exist, but there's no definitive record of properties affected. They would have to be within the historic boundaries of a pre-reformation church which still exists.
We were told by solicitor if we do a check the insurance is void. The check costs about the same as the insurance.
rlw said:
Ask to see the result of the chancel check before you buy the insurance just to be sure that you may be liable. A lot of people have got caught out with this liablity over the years and only recently have conveyancers started to do the checks in most cases. I don't see why they would charge you for arranging the cover though.
Edited by rlw on Tuesday 4th August 19:09[/footnote]
[footnote]Edited by Pabl0 on Wednesday 5th August 12:42I've never heard of this before. I owned a terraced house immediately next to a church and had no inkling that such a thing existed.
"Buy this insurance through us - you need it, honest. But if you independently check if you need it, we'll void it". Rigggggght.
Pabl0 said:
We were told by solicitor if we do a check the insurance is void.
Sorry, what? That sounds fishier than Baldrick's Plum Duff. "Buy this insurance through us - you need it, honest. But if you independently check if you need it, we'll void it". Rigggggght.
if you do a full search/check and iirc it shows the property is on church land, then the cheap insurance cannot be offered.
you have to notify inland revenue and tell the insurance company its on church land for definite and they charge a high premium then.
if you are on church land it is in your intrest to have chancel insurance otheriwse any repairs needed or accidents that occur to the church, part of the bill will have to come out of your pocket.
you have to notify inland revenue and tell the insurance company its on church land for definite and they charge a high premium then.
if you are on church land it is in your intrest to have chancel insurance otheriwse any repairs needed or accidents that occur to the church, part of the bill will have to come out of your pocket.
plumAJP said:
if you do a full search/check and iirc it shows the property is on church land, then the cheap insurance cannot be offered.
you have to notify inland revenue and tell the insurance company its on church land for definite and they charge a high premium then.
if you are on church land it is in your intrest to have chancel insurance otheriwse any repairs needed or accidents that occur to the church, part of the bill will have to come out of your pocket.
Not being silly here but what does it have to do with Inland Revenue?you have to notify inland revenue and tell the insurance company its on church land for definite and they charge a high premium then.
if you are on church land it is in your intrest to have chancel insurance otheriwse any repairs needed or accidents that occur to the church, part of the bill will have to come out of your pocket.
Pabl0 said:
We were told by solicitor if we do a check the insurance is void. The check costs about the same as the insurance.
You can do a chancel liability risk check and it will not void the any insurance cover. If you do a definative check ie go to speak to the local church and verify with their records then if it is positive you will not be able to get any insurance or indeed sell the house afterwards, coz not one will want it.rlw said:
Ask to see the result of the chancel check before you buy the insurance just to be sure that you may be liable. A lot of people have got caught out with this liablity over the years and only recently have conveyancers started to do the checks in most cases. I don't see why they would charge you for arranging the cover though.
Edited by rlw on Tuesday 4th August 19:09[/footnote]
[footnote]Edited by Pabl0 on Wednesday 5th August 12:42Road2Ruin said:
You can do a chancel liability risk check and it will not void the any insurance cover. If you do a definative check ie go to speak to the local church and verify with their records then if it is positive you will not be able to get any insurance or indeed sell the house afterwards, coz not one will want it.
So this means that if you know somebody that you dont like that may be affected, you could get definate proof that they live within the affected area... thereby preventing them from ever selling their house?the ultimate revenge imo
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