Discussion
Boxer b
h, just about to turn 12. Fittest and most energetic dog of that age I'd ever seen. Had bad arthritis the past few years in her back legs but never stopped her leaping around like a pup any time I called down to mums.
Stuck in work and got a call to say she was out running around chasing leaves in the wind then came inside. Half an hour later mum found her in her bed. Vet reckons it was just a heart attack. Brother is in the process of burying her in the back garden.
Anyway, silly post, just devastated
h, just about to turn 12. Fittest and most energetic dog of that age I'd ever seen. Had bad arthritis the past few years in her back legs but never stopped her leaping around like a pup any time I called down to mums.Stuck in work and got a call to say she was out running around chasing leaves in the wind then came inside. Half an hour later mum found her in her bed. Vet reckons it was just a heart attack. Brother is in the process of burying her in the back garden.
Anyway, silly post, just devastated
So sorry to hear this. But, as said, she was happy right until the end, can't really ask for more - other than a few more years.
Our old lad, was fine at 10:30, eating his biscuits and generally all fine with the world and was dead at 10:40. It is, however, utterly devestating. I feel for you.
Our old lad, was fine at 10:30, eating his biscuits and generally all fine with the world and was dead at 10:40. It is, however, utterly devestating. I feel for you.
otolith said:
Art0ir said:
she was out running around chasing leaves in the wind then came inside. Half an hour later mum found her in her bed. Vet reckons it was just a heart attack.
Probably doesn't make you feel any better, but if I were a dog, that's how I would want to check out.But it doesn't mean I'm not sorry for your loss.
There is a condition called 'Boxer cardiomyopathy' characterised by an occasional rhythm disturbance in the heart which is not detectable without an ECG. Can affect dogs of different ages, unfortunately one of the presenting signs is sudden death, where the heart suddenly starts to fibrillate and the patient very quickly loses consciousness and dies. There is no pain involved (unlike a human myocardial infarction) and the end is very quick. This may have been what happened here, as sudden death in pet species is very uncommon in comparison to humans. If this is the case it would have happened at some point (with or without medication) and the dog will not have suffered at all. Condolences.
There is a condition called 'Boxer cardiomyopathy' characterised by an occasional rhythm disturbance in the heart which is not detectable without an ECG. Can affect dogs of different ages, unfortunately one of the presenting signs is sudden death, where the heart suddenly starts to fibrillate and the patient very quickly loses consciousness and dies. There is no pain involved (unlike a human myocardial infarction) and the end is very quick. This may have been what happened here, as sudden death in pet species is very uncommon in comparison to humans. If this is the case it would have happened at some point (with or without medication) and the dog will not have suffered at all. Condolences.
fistofsteel said:
There is a condition called 'Boxer cardiomyopathy' characterised by an occasional rhythm disturbance in the heart which is not detectable without an ECG. Can affect dogs of different ages, unfortunately one of the presenting signs is sudden death, where the heart suddenly starts to fibrillate and the patient very quickly loses consciousness and dies. There is no pain involved (unlike a human myocardial infarction) and the end is very quick. This may have been what happened here, as sudden death in pet species is very uncommon in comparison to humans. If this is the case it would have happened at some point (with or without medication) and the dog will not have suffered at all. Condolences.
That sounds exactly like it. She was curled up in her bed in position she always sleeps in so she wasn't struggling or in pain which is one positive I guess.fistofsteel said:
There is a condition called 'Boxer cardiomyopathy' characterised by an occasional rhythm disturbance in the heart which is not detectable without an ECG. Can affect dogs of different ages, unfortunately one of the presenting signs is sudden death, where the heart suddenly starts to fibrillate and the patient very quickly loses consciousness and dies. There is no pain involved (unlike a human myocardial infarction) and the end is very quick. This may have been what happened here, as sudden death in pet species is very uncommon in comparison to humans. If this is the case it would have happened at some point (with or without medication) and the dog will not have suffered at all. Condolences.
I am assuming this is Dilated Cardiomyopathy or DCM but just called "Boxer" when in boxer breeds!?Jasandjules said:
fistofsteel said:
There is a condition called 'Boxer cardiomyopathy' characterised by an occasional rhythm disturbance in the heart which is not detectable without an ECG. Can affect dogs of different ages, unfortunately one of the presenting signs is sudden death, where the heart suddenly starts to fibrillate and the patient very quickly loses consciousness and dies. There is no pain involved (unlike a human myocardial infarction) and the end is very quick. This may have been what happened here, as sudden death in pet species is very uncommon in comparison to humans. If this is the case it would have happened at some point (with or without medication) and the dog will not have suffered at all. Condolences.
I am assuming this is Dilated Cardiomyopathy or DCM but just called "Boxer" when in boxer breeds!?Common DCM is relatively easy to diagnose with a fair quality ultrasound scan. For BCM the scan may be normal initially and the only evidence of disease is abnormal ECG complexes which may only appear once or twice a day (a Holter monitor continuous ECG harness is often necessary). These dogs can progress to have changes on ultrasound, but it is not necessary for this to occur before BCM can become fatal. To confuse things, Boxers can also suffer from the traditional DCM.
fistofsteel said:
Common DCM is relatively easy to diagnose with a fair quality ultrasound scan.
Are you sure? Dogs can be clear for years then die suddenly. I've read a few research papers and the two fundamental difficulties are detection and then determining transmission. I know of no-one as yet who can detect it every time - if you know of such a person please let me know as I will be screening my two with them immediately.Jasandjules said:
Are you sure? Dogs can be clear for years then die suddenly. I've read a few research papers and the two fundamental difficulties are detection and then determining transmission. I know of no-one as yet who can detect it every time - if you know of such a person please let me know as I will be screening my two with them immediately.
I mean clinical DCM, where there is discernible evidence of disease. Even very early cases can be picked up by a good cardiologist (not me) and a top of the range US machine. This is not a screening test, and cannot be used to determine susceptibility in the future. The survival times after diagnosis with clinical DCM are variable but some breeds tend to do a lot better with it than others, eg German shepherds >> wolfhounds. There is currently no genetic screening test, but this will likely change in the next 10-15 years.Boxer CM is different as the dogs can have the disease for a while, but it is frequently not symptomatic, you need to pick up the abnormal heart electrical activity on a continuous ECG as it frequently doesn't show on ultrasound.
They are two different diseases in essence.
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