The best of the North Italian Lakes?

The best of the North Italian Lakes?

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Kewy

Original Poster:

1,462 posts

95 months

Monday 22nd January 2018
quotequote all
Hi all,

I've wanted to drive round northern Italy for a while now and plan on taking my own car down that way for a week or two sometime next year.

But for the meantime I've just managed to book a little weekend break to a villa near Varese in a couple of weeks time, and a bonus is that the deal included car hire. I'm sure whatever they give me won't even be able to pull the skin off a rice pudding, but its a means to travel about and see some good sights at least!

So my question is, what are the must to places to visit whilst we're down that way? We're only going to have 2 full days to travel about really, the other two days we'll probably stay a bit more local to our villa. The villa is about 10 mins outside of Varese, 40 mins to Como.

Any suggestions for some day trips and good driving routes?

TIA!

psi310398

9,112 posts

204 months

Monday 22nd January 2018
quotequote all
I have a house by Lake Maggiore, so am parti prissmile

If you drive to Laveno on Lake Maggiore (SP394), you can get the ferry over to Verbania/Intra. There is time for an espresso aboard and you get great views of the lake and the Borromenean Islands.

From Verbania head towards Gravellona Toce on SS34 until you find the sign for Mergozzo at Fondotoce. There is a Resistance museum by the turn-off into via F Turatti if you are interested (the area was a hive of partisan activity and the Ossola valley actually declared a short-lived republic between the fall of Mussolini and the German occupation).

Lake Mergozzo is small but beautiful. In Mergozzo village itself there is great little cafe by the waterfront. Leave Mergozzo and follow the signs for Gravellona Toce on SS33 until you find the sign for the road to Omegna (SP229) - on the early bits of SP229, there are a couple of long tunnels if you want to blat a V8 or similarsmile.

Omegna is at the top of Lake Orta. Follow Orta down SP229 along its East bank to Orta San Guilio (a beautiful village with unfeasibly small lanes - leave the car in the car park). Go in on foot. There are some good restaurants to have lunch there. If you have time, take the boat to the small island in the middle. Well worth the views.

Follow the road along the lake to Ameno and then (if you fancy some twisty roads) drive up to Mottarone. At the top there are fabulous views into Switzerland and down onto Lakes Maggiore and Orta. There are cafes and restaurants, too. There is also a cable car to Stresa. Drive out towards Stresa on the toll road and you will arrive at a turn for Levo. If you go to Levo, you end up in Baveno which is a charming little lakeside town. If instead you continue you will end up in Stresa (which is generally busier). From Baveno, you can get a boat out to Borromenean Islands.

Alternatively, leave Baveno/Stresa and head down SS33 towards Arona, past the lakeside towns of Belgirate, Lesa, Solcio and Meina - all perfectly pleasant places to stop to take in the views.

Arona itself has an old quarter which is worth a visit.

Past Arona, there is five miles' worth of American strip mall driving until you hit Sesto Calende. From here, there is either a fast road back to Varese (follow SS33 until you hit SS629), or the lakeside drive (SP69) past Angera (great castle overlooking the lake) and Ranco (nice waterfront with some pleasant cafes) as well as Ispra (where Euratom is based).

All this (bar one of the two boat trips - I think you'd have to choose one) can be done in a leisurely day with no brutal amount of driving. And no issue finding a decent place to eat in most of these places.

Edited by psi310398 on Monday 22 January 10:52

Kewy

Original Poster:

1,462 posts

95 months

Monday 22nd January 2018
quotequote all
psi310398 said:
I have a house by Lake Maggiore, so am parti prissmile

If you drive to Laveno on Lake Maggiore (SP394), you can get the ferry over to Verbania/Intra. There is time for an espresso aboard and you get great views of the lake and the Borromenean Islands.

From Verbania head towards Gravellona Toce on SS34 until you find the sign for Mergozzo at Fondotoce. There is a Resistance museum by the turn-off into via F Turatti if you are interested (the area was a hive of partisan activity and the Ossola valley actually declared a short-lived republic between the fall of Mussolini and the German occupation).

Lake Mergozzo is small but beautiful. In Mergozzo village itself there is great little cafe by the waterfront. Leave Mergozzo and follow the signs for Gravellona Toce on SS33 until you find the sign for the road to Omegna (SP229) - on the early bits of SP229, there are a couple of long tunnels if you want to blat a V8 or similarsmile.

Omegna is at the top of Lake Orta. Follow Orta down SP229 along its East bank to Orta San Guilio (a beautiful village with unfeasibly small lanes - leave the car in the car park). Go in on foot. There are some good restaurants to have lunch there. If you have time, take the boat to the small island in the middle. Well worth the views.

Follow the road along the lake to Ameno and then (if you fancy some twisty roads) drive up to Mottarone. At the top there are fabulous views into Switzerland and down onto Lakes Maggiore and Orta. There are cafes and restaurants, too. There is also a cable car to Stresa. Drive out towards Stresa on the toll road and you will arrive at a turn for Levo. If you go to Levo, you end up in Baveno which is a charming little lakeside town. If instead you continue you will end up in Stresa (which is generally busier). From Baveno, you can get a boat out to Borromenean Islands.

Alternatively, leave Baveno/Stresa and head down SS33 towards Arona, past the lakeside towns of Belgirate, Lesa, Solcio and Meina - all perfectly pleasant places to stop to take in the views.

Arona itself has an old quarter which is worth a visit.

Past Arona, there is five miles' worth of American strip mall driving until you hit Sesto Calende. From here, there is either a fast road back to Varese (follow SS33 until you hit SS629), or the lakeside drive (SP69) past Angera (great castle overlooking the lake) and Ranco (nice waterfront with some pleasant cafes) as well as Ispra (where Euratom is based).

All this (bar one of the two boat trips - I think you'd have to choose one) can be done in a leisurely day with no brutal amount of driving. And no issue finding a decent place to eat in most of these places.

Edited by psi310398 on Monday 22 January 10:52
Wow, can't ask for a much better response than that, thanks!

Given me plenty to Google and start planning this evening. Ideally I would like to plan two full days out, both days starting and finishing in Varese.

Now I've done a fair bit of driving on the continent, but only really between France and Holland. Is there anything I should know before driving round these areas? I've heard there can be quite a lot of tolls round that way?

Unfortunately I'm going to be stuck with whatever the car hire company gives me (unless I can upgrade), so theres going to be no V8 tunnel runs unfortunately but I'd still like to drive some scenic roads, maybe one or two of the famous passes. I'm hoping to go back down this way next year in my own car for a longer stay which would be a more driving focused trip smile

trumptriple

202 posts

132 months

Monday 22nd January 2018
quotequote all
Have to agree with the poster above. I lived and worked in Cadrezzate and Brebbia for a few months on and off over ten years ago now. I don't know all the places he mentioned, but I do know some. And I know that if I was going back for a visit now then I would love to follow the suggestions he has made!

I loved going up in the tiny cable car in Laveno Mombello to watch the paragliders jumping off the side of the hill.

psi310398

9,112 posts

204 months

Monday 22nd January 2018
quotequote all
Kewy said:
Wow, can't ask for a much better response than that, thanks!

Given me plenty to Google and start planning this evening. Ideally I would like to plan two full days out, both days starting and finishing in Varese.

Now I've done a fair bit of driving on the continent, but only really between France and Holland. Is there anything I should know before driving round these areas? I've heard there can be quite a lot of tolls round that way?

Unfortunately I'm going to be stuck with whatever the car hire company gives me (unless I can upgrade), so theres going to be no V8 tunnel runs unfortunately but I'd still like to drive some scenic roads, maybe one or two of the famous passes. I'm hoping to go back down this way next year in my own car for a longer stay which would be a more driving focused trip smile
Kewy,

The only tolls will be the cost of the ferry (ca €18 one way - depends on number of passengers) and the privately-owned road from Mottarone to Stresa (€8 IIRC), plus any boat trips. All the rest is on State or Provincial roads (even what looks like motorway between Mergozzo and Gravellona - the first booth is at Arona on that road).

As for other stuff, nothing beyond driving anywhere in Italy. I'd keep my lights on on the hill roads, watch out for loony motorcyclists and the Fiat 500 Sennas - unbroken white lines mean nothing in this neck of the woods. Also, the Carabinieri do tend to set up stops up in the hills as well as doing their speed checks on the lakeside roads, so make sure you always have your paperwork with you. Don't speed in built up areas.

If you want to do the Stelvio, it will take a day from where you are staying to get there and back. If it is a pleasant day, you will be sharing the pass with a million cyclists. If it is wet, it doesn't sound like the car that you will have will make it a safe or pleasant experience. The last two times I went, it was 37-40 celsius so the road was almost empty on both occasions, marred only by the number of (German) Hymers clogging up the roads and going at 10 mph.

Kewy

Original Poster:

1,462 posts

95 months

Monday 22nd January 2018
quotequote all
psi310398 said:
Kewy,

The only tolls will be the cost of the ferry (ca €18 one way - depends on number of passengers) and the privately-owned road from Mottarone to Stresa (€8 IIRC), plus any boat trips. All the rest is on State or Provincial roads (even what looks like motorway between Mergozzo and Gravellona - the first booth is at Arona on that road).

As for other stuff, nothing beyond driving anywhere in Italy. I'd keep my lights on on the hill roads, watch out for loony motorcyclists and the Fiat 500 Sennas - unbroken white lines mean nothing in this neck of the woods. Also, the Carabinieri do tend to set up stops up in the hills as well as doing their speed checks on the lakeside roads, so make sure you always have your paperwork with you. Don't speed in built up areas.

If you want to do the Stelvio, it will take a day from where you are staying to get there and back. If it is a pleasant day, you will be sharing the pass with a million cyclists. If it is wet, it doesn't sound like the car that you will have will make it a safe or pleasant experience. The last two times I went, it was 37-40 celsius so the road was almost empty on both occasions, marred only by the number of (German) Hymers clogging up the roads and going at 10 mph.
This is all such valuable information, I can't thank you enough. I knew PH wouldn't let me down.

Okay so it definitely sounds like the Stelvio is out the questions, what about St Bernards? Saying that, it sounds like there is plenty to do/see much closer to where we are staying and I'm not sure its going to be worth the longer drive (especially in a hire car) just to visit some of the well known driving routes.

What paperwork should I keep with me? Just driving license and then hire car documents? As for speeding, I'm under the impression that whatever I get, speeding is going to be a chore anyway laugh so I imagine its going to be mostly leisurely.

It looks as though the route you've suggested so far is heading west from Varese towards Maggiore (presumably as thats where your house is), do you know any of the routes heading east towards Como, or north into the mountains? I toyed with the idea of heading into Milan also, but that would eat up a day at least, and I imagine be a more stressful experience than its worth so I think I'm going to keep this trip as a fairly rural one.





psi310398

9,112 posts

204 months

Monday 22nd January 2018
quotequote all
Kewy said:
This is all such valuable information, I can't thank you enough. I knew PH wouldn't let me down.

Okay so it definitely sounds like the Stelvio is out the questions, what about St Bernards? Saying that, it sounds like there is plenty to do/see much closer to where we are staying and I'm not sure its going to be worth the longer drive (especially in a hire car) just to visit some of the well known driving routes.

What paperwork should I keep with me? Just driving license and then hire car documents? As for speeding, I'm under the impression that whatever I get, speeding is going to be a chore anyway laugh so I imagine its going to be mostly leisurely.

It looks as though the route you've suggested so far is heading west from Varese towards Maggiore (presumably as thats where your house is), do you know any of the routes heading east towards Como, or north into the mountains? I toyed with the idea of heading into Milan also, but that would eat up a day at least, and I imagine be a more stressful experience than its worth so I think I'm going to keep this trip as a fairly rural one.
Yes, I am much more familiar with the stuff to the west of Varese, so will leave it to others to recommend stuff around Como.

I have been once or twice and got the impression that the nice bits of Como are very nice indeed but are cursed with quite narrow roads and literally coach loads of Clooney starfkers.

It is quite easy to pop over the border to Switzerland near Varese even on the backroads and Lake Lugano is also worth a visit. Beware, however, the prices. I popped in to Locarno to get my watch serviced and a two course lunch and coffee for two in a nondescript taverna cost me almost £100 (no wine).

If you want some scenic stuff, get to Bellinzona past Lugano (Swiss road 2 - you'll need a vignette and permission from the hire people to leave Italy in their car), then take the 13 past Chur, turn off towards Montespluga (SS36) down to Chiavenna, turn onto SS37 towards St Moritz (Swiss Road 27) and go all the way to Nauders in Austria. At Nauders, turn south towards Curon down SS40 until you get to Sponding. In Sponding, you can get used to ordering pizza in German! Leaving Sponding, you will get the sign for the Eastern ramps up to the Stelvio Pass (SS38). I think the signs are in Italian but if not it's called the Stilfser Joch by the locals. You arrive at Bormio on the other side and continue on the SS38 to Sondrio on to Lecco, then Como and over to Varese. My recollection of the last 100km (last summer) was of several road works and it was dark when I covered Bormio to Stresa, so I can't add much useful to the stock of knowledge there.

Milan is easy enough to get to but the autostrada can be daunting, and by the time you've paid for petrol, parking and tolls, the train from Varese makes much more sense.





Kewy

Original Poster:

1,462 posts

95 months

Wednesday 24th January 2018
quotequote all
The more I read up and plan for this trip, the more excited I'm getting rotate


I emailed the hire car company about upgrading to something slightly 'higher performance', they say that they would possibly be able to upgrade me but it would depend on what is available on the day, which is annoying as I was hoping to be able to prearrange it. If not then it looks like I've got a Renault Clio (or similar) – should be interesting.

I don't think I'm going to bother with any long distance driving, so probably won't venture towards Stelvio or Austria (although I went to Austria last year and it was probably one of my favourite trips). But I may drive north slightly into Switzerland if I can find some roads that don't require the Vignette.

Definitely going to do the drive west and around Maggoire on one day. Possibly venture towards Lake Como and Bellagio on day 2 – got a couple of weeks to decide on routes and stop offs smile

Condi

17,211 posts

172 months

Wednesday 24th January 2018
quotequote all
I went to Como and Garda and much preferred Como of the 2. Went slightly out of season, and it was great. Lovely and quiet, but everything was still open, not far at all to go to into Switzerland. Not sure there were any 'amazing' roads, but I only had a Fiat 500 and so it was more a case of enjoying the places than looking for enjoyable Alpine roads.

Yipper

5,964 posts

91 months

Wednesday 24th January 2018
quotequote all
Blue lakes up in the Dolomites.

Jmorgan93

380 posts

134 months

Sunday 28th January 2018
quotequote all
Hi all,

I’m staying in Bellagio for a few days mid road trip in late June - what are the ferries like for cars? Are they easy to get on with something that’s a bit low and sporty? Can you purchase tickets in advance?

Will need to do a crossing that leaves bellagio early on a Monday morning!

Thanks

scunnylad

1,726 posts

170 months

Monday 29th January 2018
quotequote all
Jmorgan93 said:
Hi all,

I’m staying in Bellagio for a few days mid road trip in late June - what are the ferries like for cars? Are they easy to get on with something that’s a bit low and sporty? Can you purchase tickets in advance?

Will need to do a crossing that leaves bellagio early on a Monday morning!

Thanks
I took the Varenna to Bellagio ferry last August,I was on motorbike but a few low sporty cars seemed to get on and off
With no issues.
We just turned up and bought a ticket at the office,most other people seemed to be doing the same.
Last year the timetable was online so maybe worth checking out as some ferries listed are foot passengers only so you
need to be sure your early morning one takes vehicles

psi310398

9,112 posts

204 months

Monday 29th January 2018
quotequote all
Jmorgan93 said:
Hi all,

I’m staying in Bellagio for a few days mid road trip in late June - what are the ferries like for cars? Are they easy to get on with something that’s a bit low and sporty? Can you purchase tickets in advance?

Will need to do a crossing that leaves bellagio early on a Monday morning!

Thanks
I can only report on the Lake Maggiore ferry (Intra-Laveno) but there you just rock up and pay. The timetables are on t'interweb.

I take both my Alfas - 156 GTA (with an unfeasibly low splitter) and S4 Spider (with the very low sump guard) on the ferry regularly. The only issue is the hump at the top of the exit up ramp on both sides of the lake but I find that approaching the top slowly at a slight angle avoids any nasty graunching.

As another posted has observed, low slung cars are not unusual on the ferries in that neck of the woods. I've seen Italian supercars, Nobles and Alfa 4Cs get on and off without incident.

Puggit

48,468 posts

249 months

Monday 29th January 2018
quotequote all
Managed to get our S2000 on and off the Bellagio - Cadenabbia ferry, only minor scrapes underneath! The ticket seller ensured we got to board the ferry first, so that everyone saw the nice car at the front of the ferry. Italians just don't get that it's not a supercar.

In Bellagio we couldn't find a parking space outside a pizzeria we wanted to visit, so the owner rushed out in to the road on our 3rd pass and ushered us in to her neighbour's garage! rofl

minimoog

6,895 posts

220 months

Monday 29th January 2018
quotequote all
I can recommend water skiing at Bellagio Water Sports in Pescallo on Como. - Edit: Hmm just checked and it looks like the water ski school might have closed down. You can sail and kayak from there though.

Of the 3 main lakes, Como is my favourite (most picturesque), then Maggiore. On Maggiore Cannobio, Cannero Riviera and just over the Swiss border, Ascona are all worth a look, though obviously I defer to the local knowledge you've received above.

Edited by minimoog on Monday 29th January 08:52

Jmorgan93

380 posts

134 months

Monday 29th January 2018
quotequote all
Thanks guys, appreciate the responses! Will check the timetable beforehand and just make sure I’m there promptly!

I’ve got 2 and a half days in Bellagio so i’ll No doubt get the hang of the ferries for hopping about and exploring anyway!

The Leaper

4,961 posts

207 months

Monday 29th January 2018
quotequote all
There are vehicle/passenger ferries that operates regularly throughout the day between Bellagio, Varenna, Cadenabbia and Menaggio. There are passenger only ferries to these places and also to others on Lake Como, eg Lenno.

You can get multi trip tickets from the ferry dock in each town.

There can be queues for vehicles.

Can recommend The Metropole Hotel in Bellagio: get a lake view room.

A great venue for lunch is the Plino Auberge in Lenno: get a ferry to Lenno, enjoy lunch seated lakeside, and a nice cruise back to Bellagio.

R.

Kewy

Original Poster:

1,462 posts

95 months

Wednesday 21st February 2018
quotequote all
Just an update that we're back from our trip to the lakes and it took my breath away.

I'll try do a little write up with some photos when I get a moment. I was lumbered with a Skoda Fabia (brand new, but couldn't pull the skin off a rice pudding). So despite doing over 1000km of driving, it wasn't the most exhilarating. Although I did drive the Maloja pass up to the top of the mountain which was a good experience.

Huge thanks to psi310398 and everyone else who chipped in with hints and tips, they were priceless.

psi310398

9,112 posts

204 months

Wednesday 21st February 2018
quotequote all
Kewy said:
Just an update that we're back from our trip to the lakes and it took my breath away.

I'll try do a little write up with some photos when I get a moment. I was lumbered with a Skoda Fabia (brand new, but couldn't pull the skin off a rice pudding). So despite doing over 1000km of driving, it wasn't the most exhilarating. Although I did drive the Maloja pass up to the top of the mountain which was a good experience.

Huge thanks to psi310398 and everyone else who chipped in with hints and tips, they were priceless.
Kewy,

Glad you enjoyed it!


minimoog

6,895 posts

220 months

Wednesday 21st February 2018
quotequote all
Must admit I'd read past where you said you were going in February - I'd have held off the water skiing idea if I'd known biggrin

Glad you enjoyed!