Who's going skiing and where 2020
Discussion
I've worked myself into a complete state trying to book next years trip 
We always ski in Chamonix. Planning two weeks next year. My youngest is disabled so we have a sit ski and instructor for him (which he loves and he was featured on Ski Sunday this week so he is effectively a celebrity!! )
We can't really take the boys out of school for two weeks so we are planning on either the week leading into half term and half term week or the week leading in to Easter (21/3) and Easter week.
Half term is probably going to be heaving so no good for young un in the sit ski, or anyone else for that matter, but will there be enough snow late March/early April (crystal ball required I know)
I'm really unsure what to do!! Travel isn't an issue really as we drive.
The decision is driving me mad
We always ski in Chamonix. Planning two weeks next year. My youngest is disabled so we have a sit ski and instructor for him (which he loves and he was featured on Ski Sunday this week so he is effectively a celebrity!!
)We can't really take the boys out of school for two weeks so we are planning on either the week leading into half term and half term week or the week leading in to Easter (21/3) and Easter week.
Half term is probably going to be heaving so no good for young un in the sit ski, or anyone else for that matter, but will there be enough snow late March/early April (crystal ball required I know)
I'm really unsure what to do!! Travel isn't an issue really as we drive.
The decision is driving me mad
jammy-git said:
Given how warm it is in February already, is there even going to be any snow left by April!?
From memory, last year went along the lines of;Massive dump = everyone got excited
January - Mid Feb = nothing
Mid Feb - March big dump
Then in mid March i had +12C on Monday
High Winds and cold on the Tuesday
Whited/Winded out on the Wednesday
Skied Thursday
Windy on Friday
Following week, massive dump on the Tues/Weds
wrencho said:
We can't really take the boys out of school for two weeks so we are planning on either the week leading into half term and half term week or the week leading in to Easter (21/3) and Easter week.
That's an easy decision - go for Easter.Will be much, much quieter on the slopes, the boys won't miss any school time, and will likely also be better weather.
Got back from Cortina last Friday and it was incredible.. My first time to the resort and the first few days it was empty, we had the runs all to ourselves.. wait time for chair lifts was around 1 min max. Went over to the Alta Badia a little busier but not crazy.. Did the Sella Ronda.. I think we hit it at just the right time! fantastic place and views are breathtaking...
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If you were considering buying a pied a terre in the Alps to be used all year round, not just for skiing, would you go for
1 : somewhere ski-in-ski-out at a small resort and a short free bus-ride to a very large area
2: somewhere further away, a bit out of the way even and half-an-hour's drive from the same large area (20 from the small one) BUT is either significantly bigger OR significantly cheaper?
The first option is on the edge of a small town with most amenities, the second is about 15 minutes from the same town.
I'm torn because option 1 is more likely to generate some rental income if I go down that route, but the second option would be more comfortable if I got somewhere larger with at least 1 more bedroom.
FWIW, I can't think of an occasion when I wouldn't drive out so will always have the car with me
1 : somewhere ski-in-ski-out at a small resort and a short free bus-ride to a very large area
2: somewhere further away, a bit out of the way even and half-an-hour's drive from the same large area (20 from the small one) BUT is either significantly bigger OR significantly cheaper?
The first option is on the edge of a small town with most amenities, the second is about 15 minutes from the same town.
I'm torn because option 1 is more likely to generate some rental income if I go down that route, but the second option would be more comfortable if I got somewhere larger with at least 1 more bedroom.
FWIW, I can't think of an occasion when I wouldn't drive out so will always have the car with me
Edited by feef on Wednesday 19th February 13:50
feef said:
If you were considering buying a pied a terre in the Alps to be used all year round, not just for skiing, would you go for
1 : somewhere ski-in-ski-out at a small resort and a short free bus-ride to a very large area
2: somewhere further away, a bit out of the way even and half-an-hour's drive from the same large area (20 from the small one) BUT is either significantly bigger OR significantly cheaper?
The first option is on the edge of a small town with most amenities, the second is about 15 minutes from the same town.
I'm torn because option 1 is more likely to generate some rental income if I go down that route, but the second option would be more comfortable if I got somewhere larger with at least 1 more bedroom.
So me personally, I wouldn't necessarily insist on ski-in/out but I would want to be at a good altitude, and for it to feel like I was living in the alps i.e. nice mountain scenery etc. Hence I'd be looking at properties more related to option 1. 1 : somewhere ski-in-ski-out at a small resort and a short free bus-ride to a very large area
2: somewhere further away, a bit out of the way even and half-an-hour's drive from the same large area (20 from the small one) BUT is either significantly bigger OR significantly cheaper?
The first option is on the edge of a small town with most amenities, the second is about 15 minutes from the same town.
I'm torn because option 1 is more likely to generate some rental income if I go down that route, but the second option would be more comfortable if I got somewhere larger with at least 1 more bedroom.
EddieSteadyGo said:
So me personally, I wouldn't necessarily insist on ski-in/out but I would want to be at a good altitude, and for it to feel like I was living in the alps i.e. nice mountain scenery etc. Hence I'd be looking at options related to option 1.
Option 2 is still very much in the Alps with plenty of mountain scenery. It's on a col a little further down the valley from the ski areas. Plenty of snow on the ground there atm, and if you fancied a bit of ski touring (which I do) there's a few routes in the immediate vicinity which would make it tour-in-tour-out rather than ski-in-ski-outfeef said:
Option 2 is still very much in the Alps with plenty of mountain scenery. It's on a col a little further down the valley from the ski areas. Plenty of snow on the ground there atm, and if you fancied a bit of ski touring (which I do) there's a few routes in the immediate vicinity which would make it tour-in-tour-out rather than ski-in-ski-out
Ah, well that makes all the difference. Nice problem to have!EddieSteadyGo said:
Ah, well that makes all the difference. Nice problem to have!
hence the dilemma 
I have a gut feeling that option 2 has the potential for future development, so there's that at the back of my mind, but 'investment potential' is pretty far from any rationale.
A spot of rental income might be nice tho, which is what brings me back to option 1
feef said:
hence the dilemma
I have a gut feeling that option 2 has the potential for future development, so there's that at the back of my mind, but 'investment potential' is pretty far from any rationale.
A spot of rental income might be nice tho, which is what brings me back to option 1
Whenever I "do the numbers" (usually after a beer) all I conclude is buying in the alps is pretty much one of the worst investment decisions you can make. Simply because you are liable for all of the risks of owning a property, the fact that ownership rules and local taxes can change on a political whim, and the yield most of these properties generate is poor compared to the cost of the asset.I have a gut feeling that option 2 has the potential for future development, so there's that at the back of my mind, but 'investment potential' is pretty far from any rationale.
A spot of rental income might be nice tho, which is what brings me back to option 1
Far better from a financial point of view to invest in pretty much anything else and use the profit to rent the type of place you want, when you want it.
Having said that, I still want to do the same as you and buy somewhere, so I appreciate the dilemma!
EddieSteadyGo said:
feef said:
hence the dilemma
I have a gut feeling that option 2 has the potential for future development, so there's that at the back of my mind, but 'investment potential' is pretty far from any rationale.
A spot of rental income might be nice tho, which is what brings me back to option 1
Whenever I "do the numbers" (usually after a beer) all I conclude is buying in the alps is pretty much one of the worst investment decisions you can make. Simply because you are liable for all of the risks of owning a property, the fact that ownership rules and local taxes can change on a political whim, and the yield most of these properties generate is poor compared to the cost of the asset.I have a gut feeling that option 2 has the potential for future development, so there's that at the back of my mind, but 'investment potential' is pretty far from any rationale.
A spot of rental income might be nice tho, which is what brings me back to option 1
Far better from a financial point of view to invest in pretty much anything else and use the profit to rent the type of place you want, when you want it.
Having said that, I still want to do the same as you and buy somewhere, so I appreciate the dilemma!
wrencho said:
We always ski in Chamonix. Planning two weeks next year. My youngest is disabled so we have a sit ski and instructor for him (which he loves and he was featured on Ski Sunday this week so he is effectively a celebrity!! )
awesome!!! i absolutely love seeing everyone enjoying snow sports. I guess your logistics are a bit tougher, but on the slope your boy will get the exact same feeling and enjoyment as we all do on the slopes. )as for skiing at easter- wouldn’t worry about it, pick a resort with high enough slopes if you are really worried but it’ll be fine.
I was in Garmisch last season on ‘closing’ weekend (end of march) and it was awesome. perfect bluebird days, nice and warm for sitting out at lunch. enjoyable to walk about town later in day. still tons of snow with top to bottom riding.
now don’t get me wrong, the snow was very spring like, getting quite warm and slushed up later in the day. but for some standard piste skiing, cruising around, it was definitely better than the -15deg, zero vis flat light days you get in january!
most ski resorts close because it’s not commercially viable with skier numbers not because of lack of snow.
feef said:
If you were considering buying a pied a terre in the Alps to be used all year round, not just for skiing, would you go for
1 : somewhere ski-in-ski-out at a small resort and a short free bus-ride to a very large area
2: somewhere further away, a bit out of the way even and half-an-hour's drive from the same large area (20 from the small one) BUT is either significantly bigger OR significantly cheaper?
Option 1 for me - when I ski in Val Cenis we quite often drive across to one of the other resorts on the ski pass (Aussois, or Bonneval for example) and the half an hour drive is fine for a day or two across a week but the downsides would be significant if your only option was a half an hours drive to get to the slopes.1 : somewhere ski-in-ski-out at a small resort and a short free bus-ride to a very large area
2: somewhere further away, a bit out of the way even and half-an-hour's drive from the same large area (20 from the small one) BUT is either significantly bigger OR significantly cheaper?
Just the variability in weather would be enough without considering the effort of packing up the car, the inability to go back to the apartment for lunch, if you're there for the season you are more likely to be going out for an afternoon or a morning and not on the slopes for a day at a time - spending an hours driving for 2 or 3 hours skiing isn't that appealing on a day to day basis.
I'd be looking at resorts which can offer a balance of what you need.
EddieSteadyGo said:
Whenever I "do the numbers" (usually after a beer) all I conclude is buying in the alps is pretty much one of the worst investment decisions you can make. Simply because you are liable for all of the risks of owning a property, the fact that ownership rules and local taxes can change on a political whim, and the yield most of these properties generate is poor compared to the cost of the asset.
Far better from a financial point of view to invest in pretty much anything else and use the profit to rent the type of place you want, when you want it.
It depends on what value you place on having your own pad, to use when you like. Not everything has to be justified simply in terms of money. Far better from a financial point of view to invest in pretty much anything else and use the profit to rent the type of place you want, when you want it.
Once you can choose your own weeks, fly hand luggage only, and still manage to rent it out for 2 months of the season then while it might not make much, it will comfortably cover the costs and basically allow you to ski for free. As a rental property your flights out there can be offset against tax too (checking the property), and any work is tax deductible.
Ownership rules and taxes can change for any asset, be that a property in the UK, pensions, stocks and shares etc. A place in the alps is no more or less at risk of that than anywhere else, is it?
Condi said:
EddieSteadyGo said:
Whenever I "do the numbers" (usually after a beer) all I conclude is buying in the alps is pretty much one of the worst investment decisions you can make. Simply because you are liable for all of the risks of owning a property, the fact that ownership rules and local taxes can change on a political whim, and the yield most of these properties generate is poor compared to the cost of the asset.
Far better from a financial point of view to invest in pretty much anything else and use the profit to rent the type of place you want, when you want it.
It depends on what value you place on having your own pad, to use when you like. Not everything has to be justified simply in terms of money. Far better from a financial point of view to invest in pretty much anything else and use the profit to rent the type of place you want, when you want it.
Once you can choose your own weeks, fly hand luggage only, and still manage to rent it out for 2 months of the season then while it might not make much, it will comfortably cover the costs and basically allow you to ski for free. As a rental property your flights out there can be offset against tax too (checking the property), and any work is tax deductible.
Ownership rules and taxes can change for any asset, be that a property in the UK, pensions, stocks and shares etc. A place in the alps is no more or less at risk of that than anywhere else, is it?
Other than that, the money is still there, it's just in bricks and mortar (or cedar-clad concrete)
A few trips a year and it would pay for itself in terms of costs of upkeep vs costs of renting somewhere... and I'd probably go out more often than I do now, purely due to the convenience.
Gio G said:
Got back from Cortina last Friday and it was incredible.. My first time to the resort and the first few days it was empty, we had the runs all to ourselves.. wait time for chair lifts was around 1 min max. Went over to the Alta Badia a little busier but not crazy.. Did the Sella Ronda.. I think we hit it at just the right time! fantastic place and views are breathtaking...
Great pics!! Sella ronda is fantastic, I agree with you on the views, I love that everywhere you look is so beautiful, Occasionally the freccia tricolori are also there having fun too which is awesome to see. I have actually fallen over watching them do there stuff :/
Im lucky enough to spend a lot of time up there over the winter and we may even have crossed paths as we came back last Saturday.
CAPP0 said:
Carbon Sasquatch said:
My apologies then! I'm sure we've always called it carte, maybe I misunderstood when I first heard of it. It's definitely referred to as carte in lots of other places, Snowheads for example, maybe it's one of those words which has been corrupted into something else (ie carte) over the years.EDIT:
OK, not trying to prove a point here, just trying to understand why I thought it was different:
seetignes.com said:
Carré Neige and Carte Neige insurances are both types of French winter insurance cover that can be purchased by anyone living in the EU.
Honours even then! Edited by CAPP0 on Tuesday 18th February 20:52
Carte Neige is the annual version, valid for a season across all of Europe. Better option for multiple trips.
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