Summer Holidays 2021

[Phil.]

Greece saying that its EITHER a vaccine or a prior PCR test to visit this summer. I expect others to follow.

https://www.itv.com/news/2021-02-24/covid-britons-...

[Pete102]

Phil. said:

Greece saying that its EITHER a vaccine or a prior PCR test to visit this summer. I expect others to follow.

https://www.itv.com/news/2021-02-24/covid-britons-...

As I thought it will be. Not a cat in hells chance an EU wide approved and rolled out vaccine passport system will be in place.

Each country will handle individually.

I hope to return to this thread in the summer with lots of holiday pics

[anonymous-user]

Phil. said:

Greece saying that its EITHER a vaccine or a prior PCR test to visit this summer. I expect others to follow.

https://www.itv.com/news/2021-02-24/covid-britons-...

That’s what I saw a while ago too.

There’s all kinds of disinformation on these threads. You get a Spanish politician saying something, then it gets reported in the local rag, then misquoted in a U.K. tabloid, then ends up on here as fact.

The situation is constantly evolving and it’s still early days yet to see what any summer rules will be.

[Phil.]

Pete102 said:

As I thought it will be. Not a cat in hells chance an EU wide approved and rolled out vaccine passport system will be in place.

Each country will handle individually.

I hope to return to this thread in the summer with lots of holiday pics

The more holiday pics the better

[Deep Thought]

Phil. said:

Greece saying that its EITHER a vaccine or a prior PCR test to visit this summer. I expect others to follow.

https://www.itv.com/news/2021-02-24/covid-britons-...

I think thats how its likely to pan out. Relatively few of the target market for summer holidays will have had both vaccine jabs by the summer, so yes either a negative test prior to travel or evidence of full vaccine would make sense

[Deep Thought]

El stovey said:

Phil. said:

Greece saying that its EITHER a vaccine or a prior PCR test to visit this summer. I expect others to follow.

https://www.itv.com/news/2021-02-24/covid-britons-...

That’s what I saw a while ago too.

There’s all kinds of disinformation on these threads. You get a Spanish politician saying something, then it gets reported in the local rag, then misquoted in a U.K. tabloid, then ends up on here as fact.

The situation is constantly evolving and it’s still early days yet to see what any summer rules will be.

Agreed.

There doesnt seem to be much joined up thinking in Spain with regards to what they actually want / what will work. Lots of talk to appease various groups / align with particular political parties but the reality will be somewhat different if the choice comes down to no tourism for another summer or some sort of "arrangement" being made.

[anonymous-user]

Deep Thought said:

Agreed.

There doesnt seem to be much joined up thinking in Spain with regards to what they actually want / what will work. Lots of talk to appease various groups / align with particular political parties but the reality will be somewhat different if the choice comes down to no tourism for another summer or some sort of "arrangement" being made.

Last year the canaries particularly were up for doing their own thing. Especially when most infections were around the south east mainland regions which were actually closer to the U.K. than the canaries.

Eventually U.K. rules started to look at regions and individual Greek islands instead of countries as a whole.

Hopefully this year there’ll be more nuance and options especially if infections and deaths have dropped right down in U.K. and the destinations being considered.

[Wiltshire Lad]

Deep Thought said:

Wiltshire Lad said:

Biggest problems with flying anywhere this summer are as I see it:

1. Currently there are NO travel corridors so even coming back from non red list countries you will be expected to self isolate at home for min 5 days.
2.Proposed vaccination passport may well get you into other countries - but since vaccination only reduces the chances of catching Covid (it seems) - it won't get you back. Currently each individual will require negative PCR test - which are currently £120 or so a pop.
3. IF you do test positive - you're not getting on a flight home - so prepare for an extended stay at your expense.
4. Most foreign holidays are at least a week. Time from identifying a new variant somewhere and the UK government adding that destination to the Red List could be as little as 3 days. So you may well end up facing 10 days in a Gatwick Travellodge.

Not exactly the ingredients for a relaxing break .....I'm heading to the Lakes. My BA vouchers will wait..

1. Not insurmountable, particular with the likes of Spain so reliant on tourism. I think come mid May onwards they will be very keen to facilitate that.
2. See above.
3. Travel insurance covers this. Most policies now have a Covid update in them and facilitate hospital stays, extended stays because of Covid.
4. Not insurmountable either. If infection rates are tracking downwards which they are and will be, it wouldnt be difficult to offer an assurance that status wont change. Holiday companies are offering the option to change dates anyway, but yes, you would have to factor in the small risk of requiring quarantine upon return. It would have to take a massive and quick status change to move to Red, which i think would be unlikely and controlled.

Many hundreds of thousands of people had very successful foreign holidays last summer and that was before we had the vaccine rollout.

If you want to assume the worst possible scenarios then booking a foreign holiday is not for you though and have a (for most people) very expensive staycation instead.

Edited by Deep Thought on Thursday 25th February 11:57

Some good points but still some real risks (and I don't mean health - that doesn't worry me much) . UK government is rightly proud of it's vaccination programme - but also well aware that a new variant that resists the current crop of vaccines will scupper the lot. If one is identified anywhere the shutters will come down within days. Any change WILL be massive and it will be quick and there is NO WAY anyone - government or otherwise - is going to give any 'assurance that the status won't change' - I mean - really?

Spain may well be desperate for tourism but the establishment of a travel corridor is not their choice to make. I'd be surprised if the requirement to self isolate at home goes anytime soon. Anyone in full time employment won't take too much comfort from the fact that the travel insurance will cover an additional 10 days abroad...their boss may not be so understanding...

I cancelled our trip to the Dolomites last year - some went with the company we were booked with - and frankly having to wear a mask all the time, eat meals in their rooms and bars all closed - didn't sound particularly inviting. Bear in mind that most of Europe are so far behind in the vaccination stakes it's worth asking yourself what exactly the experience when you get there is going to be like.

Ultimately it's a personal choice and I wish anyone travelling a good holiday. I have vouchers for 2 Euro holidays from last year - but I'll wait until things are back to normal there before I use them.

[Pete102]

Wiltshire Lad said:

Some good points but still some real risks (and I don't mean health - that doesn't worry me much) . UK government is rightly proud of it's vaccination programme - but also well aware that a new variant that resists the current crop of vaccines will scupper the lot. If one is identified anywhere the shutters will come down within days. Any change WILL be massive and it will be quick and there is NO WAY anyone - government or otherwise - is going to give any 'assurance that the status won't change' - I mean - really?

Spain may well be desperate for tourism but the establishment of a travel corridor is not their choice to make. I'd be surprised if the requirement to self isolate at home goes anytime soon. Anyone in full time employment won't take too much comfort from the fact that the travel insurance will cover an additional 10 days abroad...their boss may not be so understanding...

I cancelled our trip to the Dolomites last year - some went with the company we were booked with - and frankly having to wear a mask all the time, eat meals in their rooms and bars all closed - didn't sound particularly inviting. Bear in mind that most of Europe are so far behind in the vaccination stakes it's worth asking yourself what exactly the experience when you get there is going to be like.

Ultimately it's a personal choice and I wish anyone travelling a good holiday. I have vouchers for 2 Euro holidays from last year - but I'll wait until things are back to normal there before I use them.

The risk of variants is going to be with us forever. The UK is actually at the forefront of genomic sequencing, giving us a decent heads up on emerging threats. I agree that there is a risk of the shutters coming down, but they never come down 'that' quick. Each to their own and all that.

[Deep Thought]

Wiltshire Lad said:

Some good points but still some real risks (and I don't mean health - that doesn't worry me much) . UK government is rightly proud of it's vaccination programme - but also well aware that a new variant that resists the current crop of vaccines will scupper the lot. If one is identified anywhere the shutters will come down within days. Any change WILL be massive and it will be quick and there is NO WAY anyone - government or otherwise - is going to give any 'assurance that the status won't change' - I mean - really?

Spain may well be desperate for tourism but the establishment of a travel corridor is not their choice to make. I'd be surprised if the requirement to self isolate at home goes anytime soon. Anyone in full time employment won't take too much comfort from the fact that the travel insurance will cover an additional 10 days abroad...their boss may not be so understanding...

I cancelled our trip to the Dolomites last year - some went with the company we were booked with - and frankly having to wear a mask all the time, eat meals in their rooms and bars all closed - didn't sound particularly inviting. Bear in mind that most of Europe are so far behind in the vaccination stakes it's worth asking yourself what exactly the experience when you get there is going to be like.

Ultimately it's a personal choice and I wish anyone travelling a good holiday. I have vouchers for 2 Euro holidays from last year - but I'll wait until things are back to normal there before I use them.

I dont think there will necessarily be absolute assurances but i do think we will see if - for example - a new variant has been identified and MAY require an update in status of a country to RED (and thus requiring a full in hotel quarantining). I think there will need to be some capability / flexibility built in to any process because i dont think the current system could cope with tens of thousands / potentially hundreds of thousands of people being herded from their airplane on their way back from Spain in to buses and on to aTravelodge or wherever for a fortnight.

The variants seem so far seem to be - as predicted - the virus mutating in to something (even) more transmittable but potentially less lethal.

We are being promised - because of the vaccination programme - that we are on our way out of lockdowns and massive business disruption so any future actions cant lead to airlines / holiday companies having to suddenly shut up shop again after having been told it was safe to ramp up activities again.

Of course that doesnt mean it wont happen, but with a fortnight in the Canaries booked leaving last week in June, if i hear of any outbreak there that could lead to problems before we go we'll simply avail of the capability to change our holiday date. We would thus have to be very very very very unlucky to get there, have some rampantly deadly variant be identified when there, it be that prevalent that the UK promotes the Canaries to RED and forces tens of thousands of returning holiday makers in to a quarantine facility.

I can totally see if someone lives in a foreign RED listed country how they can be charged £1,750 and have to quarantine to come here right now, what i cant see is if the gov are telling people its ok to book a holiday, FCO guidance is clear thats its ok to go, people have left here in good faith on holiday based on that, that they can suddenly change that mid flight as it were to "sorry, you now have to spend £1,750 each to return home". Really cant see it.

Is it a possibility that they might - as last year - change to quarantine (at home) required when someone is out there? Yes, its a possibility. Personally, yes, my wife and i can cater for that and WFH. For those who are less able to do that then they need to bear that in mind and perhaps not go on a foreign holiday.

I do take your point about it being a risk. Last year we chose not to take the risk, but its now been a year, we will be fully vaccinated by the time we are going and we have travel insurance to cover COVID booked with the package holiday company we're using so i think the risk is very low.

Also - and its not normally what we do - we've booked a package holiday in an All Inclusive hotel. Granted we may well have to wear a mask when moving about but we have no need to leave the complex if we dont want to.

I think thats the route a lot of people who do holiday this year will be taking - package holiday, hotel, make it the providers problem if there is issues.

Totally get thats not for everyone, but genuinely drained by all of this now and NEED a holiday so if we can make it work this summer, we will.

[Deep Thought]

Pete102 said:

The risk of variants is going to be with us forever. The UK is actually at the forefront of genomic sequencing, giving us a decent heads up on emerging threats. I agree that there is a risk of the shutters coming down, but they never come down 'that' quick. Each to their own and all that.

Much more succinctly put than my response

[Tyre Smoke]

Add in that even without the vaccine last summer cases, deaths and hospitalisation dropped to virtually nil, this summer is going to open right up.

[blueg33]

I wouldnt put it past our government to mess it up despite our advanced genome sequencing a quick vaccine roll out.

Having just bough a holiday let, I hope they don't.

[Deep Thought]

blueg33 said:

I wouldnt put it past our government to mess it up despite our advanced genome sequencing a quick vaccine roll out.

Having just bough a holiday let, I hope they don't.

Agreed. I dont think we can over estimate the capability of our government to balls things up.

[anonymous-user]

Tyre Smoke said:

Add in that even without the vaccine last summer cases, deaths and hospitalisation dropped to virtually nil, this summer is going to open right up.

This is what I don’t get.

This time last year the first wave hadn’t even hit yet and people got away quarantine free to places with travel corridors during the summer holidays.

Why do people think that with the second wave winding down and a vaccine here it’s not going to be at least the same this year? Everything is miles better than last year.

Look at where we are now compared to the same date last year? And people still got away during last summer holidays,

[Wiltshire Lad]

Deep Thought said:

I dont think there will necessarily be absolute assurances but i do think we will see if - for example - a new variant has been identified and MAY require an update in status of a country to RED (and thus requiring a full in hotel quarantining). I think there will need to be some capability / flexibility built in to any process because i dont think the current system could cope with tens of thousands / potentially hundreds of thousands of people being herded from their airplane on their way back from Spain in to buses and on to aTravelodge or wherever for a fortnight.

The variants seem so far seem to be - as predicted - the virus mutating in to something (even) more transmittable but potentially less lethal.

We are being promised - because of the vaccination programme - that we are on our way out of lockdowns and massive business disruption so any future actions cant lead to airlines / holiday companies having to suddenly shut up shop again after having been told it was safe to ramp up activities again.

Of course that doesnt mean it wont happen, but with a fortnight in the Canaries booked leaving last week in June, if i hear of any outbreak there that could lead to problems before we go we'll simply avail of the capability to change our holiday date. We would thus have to be very very very very unlucky to get there, have some rampantly deadly variant be identified when there, it be that prevalent that the UK promotes the Canaries to RED and forces tens of thousands of returning holiday makers in to a quarantine facility.

I can totally see if someone lives in a foreign RED listed country how they can be charged £1,750 and have to quarantine to come here right now, what i cant see is if the gov are telling people its ok to book a holiday, FCO guidance is clear thats its ok to go, people have left here in good faith on holiday based on that, that they can suddenly change that mid flight as it were to "sorry, you now have to spend £1,750 each to return home". Really cant see it.

Is it a possibility that they might - as last year - change to quarantine (at home) required when someone is out there? Yes, its a possibility. Personally, yes, my wife and i can cater for that and WFH. For those who are less able to do that then they need to bear that in mind and perhaps not go on a foreign holiday.

I do take your point about it being a risk. Last year we chose not to take the risk, but its now been a year, we will be fully vaccinated by the time we are going and we have travel insurance to cover COVID booked with the package holiday company we're using so i think the risk is very low.

Also - and its not normally what we do - we've booked a package holiday in an All Inclusive hotel. Granted we may well have to wear a mask when moving about but we have no need to leave the complex if we dont want to.

I think thats the route a lot of people who do holiday this year will be taking - package holiday, hotel, make it the providers problem if there is issues.

Totally get thats not for everyone, but genuinely drained by all of this now and NEED a holiday so if we can make it work this summer, we will.

Hope you have a great time - I think you are right - a package and all inclusive deal is the safest bet - we did consider it. It's not something we would normally do but the only way I would travel this summer. At least you've done your homework and you are aware of the potential pitfalls. Right - I'm off to book accommodation for Classic Silverstone.

[Deep Thought]

Wiltshire Lad said:

Hope you have a great time - I think you are right - a package and all inclusive deal is the safest bet - we did consider it. It's not something we would normally do but the only way I would travel this summer. At least you've done your homework and you are aware of the potential pitfalls. Right - I'm off to book accommodation for Classic Silverstone.

[Wiltshire Lad]

El stovey said:

Tyre Smoke said:

Add in that even without the vaccine last summer cases, deaths and hospitalisation dropped to virtually nil, this summer is going to open right up.

This is what I don’t get.

This time last year the first wave hadn’t even hit yet and people got away quarantine free to places with travel corridors during the summer holidays.

Why do people think that with the second wave winding down and a vaccine here it’s not going to be at least the same this year? Everything is miles better than last year.



Look at where we are now compared to the same date last year? And people still got away during last summer holidays,

The irony is that the reason we will get more restrictions this year is because the situation is better. Last year we had little to lose with travel corridors as most other countries were in a better place COVID wise. It’s the UK desire to protect the vaccine program that will keep travel restrictions in place. Look at NZ / Aus - think we would all agree their people are in a far better place - and they are going nowhere....people did get away last year (we did) but I also remember various mad scrambles to get back to the UK as restrictions were imposed. What we need is for the EU to sort themselves out...

[Coolbananas]

Pete102 said:

As I thought it will be. Not a cat in hells chance an EU wide approved and rolled out vaccine passport system will be in place.

Each country will handle individually.

I hope to return to this thread in the summer with lots of holiday pics

Don't be so sure....

https://www.portugalresident.com/portugals-pm-reve...

[Deep Thought]

Coolbananas said:

Pete102 said:

As I thought it will be. Not a cat in hells chance an EU wide approved and rolled out vaccine passport system will be in place.

Each country will handle individually.

I hope to return to this thread in the summer with lots of holiday pics

Don't be so sure....

https://www.portugalresident.com/portugals-pm-reve...

"The ‘sanitary certificate’ will show whether the citizen has been infected, if he/ she is vaccinated and whether he/ she has had a recent negative test for the virus." - doesnt sound much different to having evidence of being vaccinated and / or having a negative test before you go.

Cant see them getting that formally rolled out across Europe by the summer given, by their own admittance this is to be done “in a way not yet identified”

I think for all the postulation by various countries / individuals / politicians when the fit hits the shan and its either dont let people in at all or wait on a centrally european wide "certificate" of some sort to be widely available, they'll fall back on either vaccine or neg test before travel.

Edited by Deep Thought on Friday 26th February 15:58