Who's going skiing and where? 23-24

[48Valves]

Now we’re home, unpacked and the washing is done I thought I’d share my final thoughts. Apologies it’s not as exciting as some tales on here but here goes.

Obergurgl is a great place. It was end of season so not too busy. But the place generally had a great vibe.

Our apartment was nice and had enough space for 2 adults and 2 kids. What it was lacking was somewhere to dry and air our skiing gear. The place didn’t smell great at the end of the week.

We didn’t have a bad meal the whole week. Food and service were top notch, but given the prices I would expect nothing less.

The cost of food and drink. Holy st. I wasn’t quite ready for €7 glasses of Coke! Although most of the food was not too expensive. The 5 course meal we had at Hotel Madeline for €57 each would have been worth it at twice the price. Will definitely do much more cooking next time.

Our ski instructor was an older German guy and an absolute delight to be around. He looked after us and taught us well whilst taking us on a variety of slopes and conditions. Personally, having picked up the basics fairly quickly, I would have liked a bit more detailed instruction but I appreciate this is difficult in groups. I could have moved but stayed with the wife.

Next time I might get a couple of private lessons and do much more on my own. We typically skied 13 miles per day with a lot of stops to make sure everyone in the group stayed together. I think I could cover that distance in a couple of hours in good conditions.

I was not prepared for how much my calves and thighs would ache. I do think a lot of that was down to standing waiting on the slopes. An evening dancing on a bench at the Nederhuette did not help

The thing I was most impressed by other than a small number of bell ends, was just how helpful, courteous and understanding the experienced skiers were. Any time someone fell or lost a ski or pole, someone would stop to help whilst the instructor got back to them. I don’t know what I expected but it certainly warmed the heart. In some spots as a beginner you can feel like an outsider, but we all said we never felt like that.

As I said before, we will definitely be back on the slopes as soon as possible. I just need a massive pay rise or a lottery win to fund what could be a new addiction

Edited by 48Valves on Tuesday 16th April 09:53

[//j17]

48Valves said:

We didn’t have a bad meal the whole week. Food and service were top notch, but given the prices I would expect nothing less.

Thast's the usual experience of Austria - though I'd also guess "We had meat for every meal", another part of the Austrian experience

48Valves said:

The cost of food and drink. Holy st. I wasn’t quite ready for €7 glasses of Coke! Although most of the food was not too expensive.

I take it that was just at the top of the mountain? If not there's no justification for it and the only place you expect to see those prices is the top of a Swiss mountain.

48Valves said:

Our ski instructor was an older German guy and an absolute delight to be around. He looked after us and taught us well whilst taking us on a variety of slopes and conditions. Personally, having picked up the basics fairly quickly, I would have liked a bit more detailed instruction but I appreciate this is difficult in groups. I could have moved but stayed with the wife.

Next time I might get a couple of private lessons and do much more on my own. We typically skied 13 miles per day with a lot of stops to make sure everyone in the group stayed together. I think I could cover that distance in a couple of hours in good conditions.

I'm guessing you were in group ski school? If so that's normal - someone's always at the 'top' of the group/someone at the 'bottom'. Austria's normally very good at swapping people between groups based on ability though - if they want.

The main purpose of group lessons is to get you:
a) Stood up.
b) Sliding in snowplow.
c) Transitioned to parallel turns.

If you and your wife were still doing snowplow turns at the end of the week I'd probably say you'd benefit from going back to group lessons next year. If you've already transitioned though you're really just paying for someone to read the piste map for you and tell you to lean forward/put your weight on the downhill ski and you'll get more from spending the same amount on a few private lessons, spread across the week.

48Valves said:

I was not prepared for how much my calves and thighs would ache. I do think a lot of that was down to standing waiting on the slopes. An evening dancing on a bench at the Nederhuette did not help

Welcome to the snowplow. The standing around is just uncomfortable but doesn't actually work your muscles that much but in snowplow as soon as you set of you're using those muscles 100% of the time and that's what does you in (plus as a beginner inevitably so tensed you could st diamonds). Don't worry everything get SO much easier when you transition to parallel turns as you're only using the muscles when you turn and are in a relaxed condition the rest of the time. Unfortunetly my experience was it's also when you stop burning anything like the calories you're consuming (I lost weight on my first 2 ski trips/not so much the following ones ).

48Valves said:

The thing I was most impressed by other than a small number of bell ends, was just how helpful, courteous and understanding the experienced skiers were. Any time someone fell or lost a ski or pole, someone would stop to help whilst the instructor got back to them. I don’t know what I expected but it certainly warmed the heart. In some spots as a beginner you can feel like an outsider, but we all said we never felt like that.

In all walks of life you will find your share of bell ends but as you've noticed skiing seems to have fewer than average. Partly it's just because people are happy and relaxed, and aren't actually trying to get from A to B so stopping to check on/help someone and taking an extra minute to get to the chair lift doesn't make any difference. Plus there are few experienced skiers who haven't had a yard sale at some point and looked up to see a ski or pole half way back of the slope - and felt the relief of seeing another skier appear and stop to pick it up for them, saving a 10 minute slog back up the slope in ski boots. What goes around, come around.

[shunt]

Great stuff, we love Obergurgl and already booked for next year. Bear in mind you have been very spoilt in this very friendly resort and if you thought it was expensive don't ever think of going anywhere near the French Alps!

[EddieSteadyGo]

48Valves said:

...Next time I might get a couple of private lessons and do much more on my own. We typically skied 13 miles per day with a lot of stops to make sure everyone in the group stayed together. I think I could cover that distance in a couple of hours in good conditions.
...

I'd say distance isn't really that important when you are learning. So many chase bigger distances (and higher speeds) on Ski Tracks, but that often doesn't translate into better sking, mainly because going faster can mask poor technique. In fact, the slower you can make turns, whilst staying in balance, the better really.

I do think though many ski instructors on the mountain, whilst no doubt exceptional skiers, can often be glorified tour guides, rather than providing detailed instruction. That can be a benefit of private lessons.

[48Valves]

//j17 said:

48Valves said:

We didn’t have a bad meal the whole week. Food and service were top notch, but given the prices I would expect nothing less.

Thast's the usual experience of Austria - though I'd also guess "We had meat for every meal", another part of the Austrian experience

48Valves said:

The cost of food and drink. Holy st. I wasn’t quite ready for €7 glasses of Coke! Although most of the food was not too expensive.

I take it that was just at the top of the mountain? If not there's no justification for it and the only place you expect to see those prices is the top of a Swiss mountain.

48Valves said:

Our ski instructor was an older German guy and an absolute delight to be around. He looked after us and taught us well whilst taking us on a variety of slopes and conditions. Personally, having picked up the basics fairly quickly, I would have liked a bit more detailed instruction but I appreciate this is difficult in groups. I could have moved but stayed with the wife.

Next time I might get a couple of private lessons and do much more on my own. We typically skied 13 miles per day with a lot of stops to make sure everyone in the group stayed together. I think I could cover that distance in a couple of hours in good conditions.

I'm guessing you were in group ski school? If so that's normal - someone's always at the 'top' of the group/someone at the 'bottom'. Austria's normally very good at swapping people between groups based on ability though - if they want.

The main purpose of group lessons is to get you:
a) Stood up.
b) Sliding in snowplow.
c) Transitioned to parallel turns.

If you and your wife were still doing snowplow turns at the end of the week I'd probably say you'd benefit from going back to group lessons next year. If you've already transitioned though you're really just paying for someone to read the piste map for you and tell you to lean forward/put your weight on the downhill ski and you'll get more from spending the same amount on a few private lessons, spread across the week.

48Valves said:

I was not prepared for how much my calves and thighs would ache. I do think a lot of that was down to standing waiting on the slopes. An evening dancing on a bench at the Nederhuette did not help

Welcome to the snowplow. The standing around is just uncomfortable but doesn't actually work your muscles that much but in snowplow as soon as you set of you're using those muscles 100% of the time and that's what does you in (plus as a beginner inevitably so tensed you could st diamonds). Don't worry everything get SO much easier when you transition to parallel turns as you're only using the muscles when you turn and are in a relaxed condition the rest of the time. Unfortunetly my experience was it's also when you stop burning anything like the calories you're consuming (I lost weight on my first 2 ski trips/not so much the following ones ).

48Valves said:

The thing I was most impressed by other than a small number of bell ends, was just how helpful, courteous and understanding the experienced skiers were. Any time someone fell or lost a ski or pole, someone would stop to help whilst the instructor got back to them. I don’t know what I expected but it certainly warmed the heart. In some spots as a beginner you can feel like an outsider, but we all said we never felt like that.

In all walks of life you will find your share of bell ends but as you've noticed skiing seems to have fewer than average. Partly it's just because people are happy and relaxed, and aren't actually trying to get from A to B so stopping to check on/help someone and taking an extra minute to get to the chair lift doesn't make any difference. Plus there are few experienced skiers who haven't had a yard sale at some point and looked up to see a ski or pole half way back of the slope - and felt the relief of seeing another skier appear and stop to pick it up for them, saving a 10 minute slog back up the slope in ski boots. What goes around, come around.

Thanks for the comprehensive response.

We spent the first morning on the nursery slope because the wife changed our booking to beginners, both us and the kids were in the mountain that afternoon.
I was doing parallel turns on the morning of the second day. The wife was a bit slower to have the confidence to use them, but I was happy to stay in the group and be guided round. To be fair to our instructor he challenged us and had us down some black runs on Thursday and Friday. I did stand at the top of a couple of slopes and thought fook that

I felt I took to it quite well. I used to play Ice Hockey and still skate a lot, so my balance is good and the concept of using the edges and where my weight/pressure needed to be was fairly simple to grasp.
As an experienced an proficient skater. I try to help people at the rink if the fall or look like they might want some tips to learn to skate, as do a few of the other ‘experienced’ shall we say skaters. So it shouldn’t really have been a surprise skiers would be the same. I think there is something about the more dangerous sports that creates that kind of behaviour.

My daughter is a decent level figure skater and ex gymnast, so she took to it quickly too.

We didn’t know what to expect or what we were doing, so being in the group every day really helped. We all did a bit on our own in the morning and later in the afternoon. Being guided round during the day helped knowing where to go when we were on our own. The people in our group were great too, we all got on and helped each other, which added to the experience for me.

Expensive drinks weren’t only up the mountain. There were a few places in the village too. But at the time we just accepted it for what it is. Next time we know and will do things differently some of the time.

I put 4 lbs on . I thought I’d lose weight, but eating well and the nice beer had other ideas.

As I said. I loved the whole experience and learned an awful lot about going skiing. We’ll do it better next time. Fewer private lessons is definitely the way we will go, and then explore on our own.

[//j17]

Yep, ski school's great for beginners as you can just focus on what you're learning, not worrying about ending up somewhere you can't get out of or on the wrong side of the mountain when the lifts close. It sounds like you're already past the need for that - though I would caution your "I've done a black" confidence the next time you go skiing. Conditions at the end of the season (this year much the rest of the season too!) have made difficult runs a lot less challenging. Hit one next season without looking first and you could find it's a sheet of ice! Not saying don't try it or knocking your achivements (took me 2 weeks to get parallel), just don't expect that same run to ski the same way if it's colder next year

For cheap beer in Austria just make a trip to the supermarket and buy a crate, taking the crate (full of empty bottles) back and hunting the magic crate return machine that will print you out a voucher for a few Euros.

[mikeiow]

48Valves said:

I put 4 lbs on . I thought I’d lose weight, but eating well and the nice beer had other ideas.

Heh heh!
Sounds like you did well - I've been skiing for over 15 years and still look at black slopes and think "fook that" :hehe
Our excuse is we didn't start until we were in our 40s

On the weight thing.....our first 3 holidays were with friends in catered chalets.....way too much food for us!
That's why we made the flip into self-catered....also enables us to eat out a little more (if we want) - the catered option gave us only 1 night out. Also keeps costs down, we find. Notice the slopes (in Les Arcs at least) have better options for taking sandwiches out and picnic'ing out, if you want.

Just had a notification for new snow in Les Arcs this week - forecast looks crazy - nicely sub-zero, should be great spring skiing for anyone still heading out!

[Burrow01]

//j17 said:

Yep, ski school's great for beginners as you can just focus on what you're learning, not worrying about ending up somewhere you can't get out of or on the wrong side of the mountain when the lifts close. It sounds like you're already past the need for that - though I would caution your "I've done a black" confidence the next time you go skiing. Conditions at the end of the season (this year much the rest of the season too!) have made difficult runs a lot less challenging. Hit one next season without looking first and you could find it's a sheet of ice! Not saying don't try it or knocking your achivements (took me 2 weeks to get parallel), just don't expect that same run to ski the same way if it's colder next year

.

Also Obergurgl is a pretty ski friendly place - the black runs there are not quite the same grade as black runs at other resorts. Be aware that there is no common standard for grading ski runs, and so it tends to be an approx 20% Black, 50% Red and 30% Blue split at any resort.

The "ski route" that you can see coming down from the Mohe Hutte (Run 1 on the ski map) used to be a Black Run, and I would say that would be more equivalent to black runs in other resorts.

Glad you had a great time and all the family enjoyed it, skiing is a great sport for bringing the family together and you can look forward to further future expense and fun !

[48Valves]

Burrow01 said:

//j17 said:

Yep, ski school's great for beginners as you can just focus on what you're learning, not worrying about ending up somewhere you can't get out of or on the wrong side of the mountain when the lifts close. It sounds like you're already past the need for that - though I would caution your "I've done a black" confidence the next time you go skiing. Conditions at the end of the season (this year much the rest of the season too!) have made difficult runs a lot less challenging. Hit one next season without looking first and you could find it's a sheet of ice! Not saying don't try it or knocking your achivements (took me 2 weeks to get parallel), just don't expect that same run to ski the same way if it's colder next year

.

Also Obergurgl is a pretty ski friendly place - the black runs there are not quite the same grade as black runs at other resorts. Be aware that there is no common standard for grading ski runs, and so it tends to be an approx 20% Black, 50% Red and 30% Blue split at any resort.

The "ski route" that you can see coming down from the Mohe Hutte (Run 1 on the ski map) used to be a Black Run, and I would say that would be more equivalent to black runs in other resorts.

Glad you had a great time and all the family enjoyed it, skiing is a great sport for bringing the family together and you can look forward to further future expense and fun !

I’m under no illusion that I encountered any a competent skier would find challenging. Some of the reds were more challenging first thing in the morning when they were still icy. Which once I got used to it I preferred to the soft slush in the afternoon. But would probably struggle with if the slope was much steeper or more difficult.

Now I’m in my 40s I am much more cautious than I once was as I don’t quite bounce as well as I used to

[interstellar]

I didnt go last week but am looking again this morning at going to Val D'isere tomorrow or saturday.

The webcams are looking seriously good

https://www.valdisere.com/en/live/webcams/

and the forecast is 67 cm in the next 6 days evenly spread.

Apart from cost I cant see a reason not to go this late?

[Harry Flashman]

Do it, post pics!

Wish I could...

[timlongs]

Woke up to snow in Bourg Saint Maurice this morning, bloody freezing! I just put the summer tyres on the van!

[Speed 3]

Harry Flashman said:

Free to any PHer who wishes to collect (SW London).

- Atomic Redster S9 Servotec, 153cm. Literally skiied once, as way too short for me (but man, were they great in moguls on the Swiss Wall - easiest way I have ever skiied that run!). Track binding so totally adjustable to any boot sole length. May well suit an advanced/expert lady - too short for my tall wife, and she hates SL skis anyway.

They sound promising for my younger daughter, she's slightly outgrown her 149cm Dynastars now she's finished growing at 5'5". She's pretty advanced, what are they like for general black pistes ?

[Jambo85]

interstellar said:

I didnt go last week but am looking again this morning at going to Val D'isere tomorrow or saturday.

The webcams are looking seriously good

https://www.valdisere.com/en/live/webcams/

and the forecast is 67 cm in the next 6 days evenly spread.

Apart from cost I cant see a reason not to go this late?

YSE have some stupidly good deals on too, cheaper than staying at home!
https://www.yseski.co.uk/offers/

Wish I could...

[interstellar]

My pal cant go until late next week so am considering going on my own for a few days. That deal would be quite good but I want to be in Val D centre so can walk everywhere. I have found similar deals though bearing in mind I would have to pay single occupancy with YSE but thanks for the link.

Edited by interstellar on Thursday 18th April 16:58

[Jambo85]

No worries - for what it’s worth we stayed in that chalet in January and even with two toddlers getting the bus to the centre was a doddle.

[interstellar]

Jambo85 said:

No worries - for what it’s worth we stayed in that chalet in January and even with two toddlers getting the bus to the centre was a doddle.

I know Val D well and I want to be by the Solaise/Bellevarde area for the bars and restaurants, if I go on my own they want double the price for the room for single occupancy at that chalet unfortuantely.

I am only desperate to go as during our week in Morzine in Jan I missed all but one day as was in bed with a chest infection and even the day I did was hard work as I felt like st.

[Jambo85]

interstellar said:

Jambo85 said:

No worries - for what it’s worth we stayed in that chalet in January and even with two toddlers getting the bus to the centre was a doddle.

I know Val D well and I want to be by the Solaise/Bellevarde area for the bars and restaurants, if I go on my own they want double the price for the room for single occupancy at that chalet unfortuantely.

I am only desperate to go as during our week in Morzine in Jan I missed all but one day as was in bed with a chest infection and even the day I did was hard work as I felt like st.

It's not double the way I'm reading it but appreciate there's probably even better deals around for single travellers. Hope you have a great trip anyway.

[interstellar]

Jambo85 said:

interstellar said:

Jambo85 said:

No worries - for what it’s worth we stayed in that chalet in January and even with two toddlers getting the bus to the centre was a doddle.

I know Val D well and I want to be by the Solaise/Bellevarde area for the bars and restaurants, if I go on my own they want double the price for the room for single occupancy at that chalet unfortuantely.

I am only desperate to go as during our week in Morzine in Jan I missed all but one day as was in bed with a chest infection and even the day I did was hard work as I felt like st.

It's not double the way I'm reading it but appreciate there's probably even better deals around for single travellers. Hope you have a great trip anyway.

You are right Jambo, it says £200 lift for single occupancy. I am sure that said £500 yesterday when I looked

[Jambo85]

interstellar said:

You are right Jambo, it says £200 lift for single occupancy. I am sure that said £500 yesterday when I looked

Quite possible - if I was approaching my 50th ski season on the bounce, which the YS of YSE is, I'd make the odd typo!