Will we end up renting EVERYTHING ?
Discussion
jjones said:
Rostfritt said:
If we didn't have an obsession with home ownership.
Not really an obsession. Basic human instinct, a shelter that belongs to us.I own a house and would much rather own than rent, so there is the conundrum!
selym said:
I tend to agree with jjones. House ownership is not such an obsession on the continent - it's just a mindset we can't shake.
I own a house and would much rather own than rent, so there is the conundrum!
Switzerland is a prime example having the lowest rate of home ownership anywhere and it is one of the worlds most competitive economies.I own a house and would much rather own than rent, so there is the conundrum!
Home ownership was originally promoted here as a way of encouraging people to have a nest egg for retirement.
It’s a victim of it’s own success. Now, the obsession and high property values significantly reduces liquidity and willingness to take risks or find new work. In effect, it’s one of many reasons why our economic growth is lacklustre.
However, good rental properties, long term leases and good landlords are hard to find here so there are also push factors towards ownership which don’t exist on the continent.
Grrbang said:
selym said:
I tend to agree with jjones. House ownership is not such an obsession on the continent - it's just a mindset we can't shake.
I own a house and would much rather own than rent, so there is the conundrum!
However, good rental properties, long term leases and good landlords are hard to find here so there are also push factors towards ownership which don’t exist on the continent.I own a house and would much rather own than rent, so there is the conundrum!
JamesD74 said:
It's all part of a wider plan. Got to keep the worker bees going for longer and longer and the taxes will keep flowing in.
Rent your car, phone, TV, sofas, gym memberships etc. Add subscriptions for music, films etc and you very quickly slide on to the hook for a good amount every month that is very difficult to get away from. But hey you have 'rented' lots of new shiny stuff so that's cool and of course your life is now more complete
Keep the very effective (and old as the hills) illusion of aspirational marketing of 'stuff' you don't need but your neighbours have so you now want it. And surely you must also be entitled? You work hard and deserve it. And it's only a couple of hundred £ a month more so why not!
Add easy access cheap credit (aka debt) to the mix for the holidays and daily coffees and treats to keep the personal debt rising at the same time and before you know it you are stuck. Forever.
Still think that shiny A4, new iPhone and your 'gold' debt card are worth being caught in the trap forever?
Sounds like a quote from Trainspotting.Rent your car, phone, TV, sofas, gym memberships etc. Add subscriptions for music, films etc and you very quickly slide on to the hook for a good amount every month that is very difficult to get away from. But hey you have 'rented' lots of new shiny stuff so that's cool and of course your life is now more complete
Keep the very effective (and old as the hills) illusion of aspirational marketing of 'stuff' you don't need but your neighbours have so you now want it. And surely you must also be entitled? You work hard and deserve it. And it's only a couple of hundred £ a month more so why not!
Add easy access cheap credit (aka debt) to the mix for the holidays and daily coffees and treats to keep the personal debt rising at the same time and before you know it you are stuck. Forever.
Still think that shiny A4, new iPhone and your 'gold' debt card are worth being caught in the trap forever?
Peter911 said:
Baldchap said:
ChocolateFrog said:
I'd pity someone if they genuinely rented a new car to impress other people.
Barring literally a very tiny number of very vain people, I genuinely don't believe anyone drives what they drive to impress other people.I have a horror if a high run rate - a high proportion of income devoted to fixed exoenses. I prefer the comfort of ownership. Then if things go sideways or we have a recession I have less exposure.
I am well aware that buying new cars is folly financially for instance but the experience of a factory pickup is worth it. As was said earlier we leave it all behind. Not the experience nor the variety we put in our lives.
I rent music though. It is simply convenient to do so.
I am well aware that buying new cars is folly financially for instance but the experience of a factory pickup is worth it. As was said earlier we leave it all behind. Not the experience nor the variety we put in our lives.
I rent music though. It is simply convenient to do so.
Baldchap said:
Peter911 said:
Baldchap said:
ChocolateFrog said:
I'd pity someone if they genuinely rented a new car to impress other people.
Barring literally a very tiny number of very vain people, I genuinely don't believe anyone drives what they drive to impress other people.They have a long list of requirements, I usually suggest a Kia or similar nearly new, then owning for as long as possible
90% of em are massive badge snobs, so much so that I was showing them the new stinger, all very impressed by the performance and general smartness of the car. I then let them know it’s a Kia and they start comparing it to an Audi R8 or something daft to belittle it
Spare tyre said:
A lot of my (non car ) friends come to me asking what car they should buy
They have a long list of requirements, I usually suggest a Kia or similar nearly new, then owning for as long as possible
90% of em are massive badge snobs, so much so that I was showing them the new stinger, all very impressed by the performance and general smartness of the car. I then let them know it’s a Kia and they start comparing it to an Audi R8 or something daft to belittle it
They have a long list of requirements, I usually suggest a Kia or similar nearly new, then owning for as long as possible
90% of em are massive badge snobs, so much so that I was showing them the new stinger, all very impressed by the performance and general smartness of the car. I then let them know it’s a Kia and they start comparing it to an Audi R8 or something daft to belittle it
had similar. i've started saying i don't know, it's just easier then.
wrt debt this is something i've thought about and changed my behaviour around a lot over the last few years. i've always saved up for things i want as i'd feel trapped by having to make a payment on a car every month. what i have found in the last few years is that i've stopped thinking so much about new cars, bikes etc and just thrown everything spare at finishing my mortgage early.
there's a lot to be said for stoicism.
bluezedd said:
Wacky Racer said:
If it appreciates buy it
If it depreciates rent/lease it
You realise that if the cost of rental didn't include the cost of depreciation then the businesses renting these items out wouldn't make any money?If it depreciates rent/lease it
My car, (a new Mazda 6 estate) is costing me roughly per month the same to lease as it is losing value (give or take), I have no road tax to pay, and only had to find £900 up front instead of £27,000 if I had paid cash.
Oppo said:
You can't call it renting a car in that sense. It's leasing.
People get very tetchy on here about it being called renting.
Leasing. Or PCP'ing if you will.
..even though it is renting.
Do you really own anything anyway?
As my friend Patek said, you never really own anything, you just pass it on to the next generation.
PCP isn't rental as you can / do buy it at the end of term. Contract hire is though, capiche! People get very tetchy on here about it being called renting.
Leasing. Or PCP'ing if you will.
..even though it is renting.
Do you really own anything anyway?
As my friend Patek said, you never really own anything, you just pass it on to the next generation.
TX.
bluezedd said:
I think people financing or renting newer cars means less demand for the second hand cars, which is good for me.
I've been thinking about that aspect recently. The problem is that something like only 3% of car sales are private. People on PCP schemes trade the cars in, and the dealer just add a huge wedge so the used car sale costs those (who don't want PCP or new purchase) a small fortune. WBAC and similar have cornered the market. Even buying a new car it's difficult to get a discount because the dealer would prefer you to take PCP. Not good.rossub said:
JamesD74 said:
It's all part of a wider plan. Got to keep the worker bees going for longer and longer and the taxes will keep flowing in.
Rent your car, phone, TV, sofas, gym memberships etc. Add subscriptions for music, films etc and you very quickly slide on to the hook for a good amount every month that is very difficult to get away from. But hey you have 'rented' lots of new shiny stuff so that's cool and of course your life is now more complete
Keep the very effective (and old as the hills) illusion of aspirational marketing of 'stuff' you don't need but your neighbours have so you now want it. And surely you must also be entitled? You work hard and deserve it. And it's only a couple of hundred £ a month more so why not!
Add easy access cheap credit (aka debt) to the mix for the holidays and daily coffees and treats to keep the personal debt rising at the same time and before you know it you are stuck. Forever.
Still think that shiny A4, new iPhone and your 'gold' debt card are worth being caught in the trap forever?
Sounds like a quote from Trainspotting.Rent your car, phone, TV, sofas, gym memberships etc. Add subscriptions for music, films etc and you very quickly slide on to the hook for a good amount every month that is very difficult to get away from. But hey you have 'rented' lots of new shiny stuff so that's cool and of course your life is now more complete
Keep the very effective (and old as the hills) illusion of aspirational marketing of 'stuff' you don't need but your neighbours have so you now want it. And surely you must also be entitled? You work hard and deserve it. And it's only a couple of hundred £ a month more so why not!
Add easy access cheap credit (aka debt) to the mix for the holidays and daily coffees and treats to keep the personal debt rising at the same time and before you know it you are stuck. Forever.
Still think that shiny A4, new iPhone and your 'gold' debt card are worth being caught in the trap forever?
ceesvdelst said:
It will only become a renting society if we as consumers allow it. And sadly we are in the main dumb enough to be that stupid. for Convenience and whatever sake.
So yes it will probably happen.
Indeed. Take houses.... buyes wouldn't go to a shop and say "Oh that Tv is £400 - I'll give you £450" but they do with houses.So yes it will probably happen.
The PCP thing - It really irritated me when a guy tried to sell it to us.... "after 3 years you get this sum - the bubble". The DEBT I said, and my Wife just nodded. Crikey, they now try to make out a debt is ok if they give it a 'nice' name. When will people haggle again?
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