Discussion
conkerman said:
smn159 said:
I believe that the Daily Sport printed similar evidence of a double decker bus and a B29 bomber on the moon a few years back - might be worth a look?
Sounds Legit.TwigtheWonderkid said:
conkerman said:
smn159 said:
I believe that the Daily Sport printed similar evidence of a double decker bus and a B29 bomber on the moon a few years back - might be worth a look?
Sounds Legit.
Here's my not-convincingly-explained spooky story:
I must have been about 10-12, that sort of age. It was the summer holidays and my grandmother was looking after for me for the day. We'd been into Fareham (grotty town in Hampshire near Portsmouth) and were driving back to my grandmother's place and we decided to stop for a snack in a pub. Across the road was (and still is...) the remains of a medieval abbey (Titchfield Abbey, if you want to look it up on Google Earth) and afterwards it was decided that we'd go for a stroll around - grandmother loved a good English Heritage information board.
We went through the entrance gate - the big impressive ruined gatehouse (of the big house that was built in the abbey's place after the Dissolution, nothing to do with the actual religous institution - this will be relevant, I promise) is at our 1-o-clock some distance away. The driveway runs straight from the gate and bisescts the original driveway leading to the gatehouse at a right angle, so you have to walk along the perimeter of the site. At your 3-o-clock as you do so are the surviving remains of the actual Abbey - just some knee-high wall foundations and cleared floors.
Our attention was naturally on the big gatehouse, so it wasn't until we were about half way along the drive (say 50 yards from the gate) that we looked over to that bit of the site. To get to that point we had had to pass a Transit minibus left with no-one in or around it on the driveway (it was a blue Mk3 - I can remember it clearly. I promise this all relevant!). This was a summer weekday, so the site was complete deserted apart from the minibus, with no-one else in sight.
We both looked over to the Abbey ruins at about the same time. Over on the far side of the ruins, near the further boundary wall - about 50 yards from us, on the site of what had been the Abbey church's quire - were a dozen or more (no more than 20) monks. Think absolutely stereotypical 'medieval monk' - brown robes with a cowl, drawn up over the head so the face was obscured, hands clasped so the sleeves of the robes met. They were stood in a cluster in two or three rows and were absolutely still and silent. I assumed they were statues put there as some part of recreation display. My grandmother obviously came to the same conclusion because she said "Look, Chevrons, those are monks. They used to live here" and she began leading me over the grass towards them - presumably to look at them more closely and in the hope of finding an information board.
We had only taken a few steps onto the grass when my grandmother gasped..because the monks (which had been perfectly still and silent for the 10 seconds or so we had been looking at them) had suddenly started moving. They turned, the two or three rows merged into a single file, I'm pretty sure they bowed, and then they walked off towards the gatehouse (which had been built across the nave of the original church). Completely silent and unfased and uncaring of our presence. "Oh, they gave me such a shock when they began to move! I didn't think they were real!", my grandmother said. It had surprised me, but almost simultaneously I was both reassured by my grandmother's conclusion that they were 'real' and came to the same conclusion myself - they were presumably historical reenactors spending a summer's day walking around a derelict Abbey in monk garb, perhaps practicing for a public event in the future. Nothing strange about that. Presumably they had arrived in the minibus.The monks glided across the grass and went out of sight into the gatehouse.
We continued our walk around the site and the monks didn't really enter my thoughts again, so confident was I at the time that they were just reenactors. We walked around, read the noticeboards etc. We'd been heading across the grass towards the monks when they moved off, and we kept going in that direction, across the ruin foundations and then turned left to go to the remains of the cloister. We then turned left again to enter the gatehouse from its rear. I remember seeing, in the middle of the central room of the gatehouse - where the monks had been heading - two blue plastic storage crates and some boxes in a small pile. Monk reenactor supplies, obviously.
The only thing we hadn't seem more of were the monks. We never saw or heard any of them for the rest of the time we were at the site. As we walked back down the drive to go back to the car in the pub car park across the road the Transit minibus had gone too. The reenactors had obviously left.
The non-supernatural, rational explanation is obvious, and the one I've already spelt out. It's also the explanation that I was perfectly happy with at the time, and it was only looking back on the events later that it occured to me that it was a bit...weird. I find it hard to believe that we wouldn't have seen or heard anything of the 10-20 people once they passed out of our initial view, especially as we crossed right behind their path with a clear view to their destination. And are monk reenactor groups a thing? I haven't found any information about such a group when I have tried. Would a reenactment group just ignore two visitors? Would they have no assistants or bystanders while they practiced their monk-ly routine? Would they do it in complete silence? And with their cowls up leaving all their faces obscured?
Maybe. Possibly. We were never more than about 50 yards from where the 'monks' would have been, even if they were corporeal beings who had packed up their things, got into their minibus and left. And yet we didn't see or hear anything. But we never heard the Transit minibus (hardly a quiet vehicle) leave either, and I'm not suggesting for a minute that it was a phantom Mk3 Transit, especially a phantom Transit used by phantom 14th-century Premonstratensian monks.
If that is a 'ghost sighting' then it's a pretty impressive one - over a dozen individual ghosts, seen by two people simultaneously. I've had other weird experiences but have always been happily convinced by a rational explanation. I'm still pretty sure of the non-supernatural explanation for this one, but I don't find it entirely satisfying.
I must have been about 10-12, that sort of age. It was the summer holidays and my grandmother was looking after for me for the day. We'd been into Fareham (grotty town in Hampshire near Portsmouth) and were driving back to my grandmother's place and we decided to stop for a snack in a pub. Across the road was (and still is...) the remains of a medieval abbey (Titchfield Abbey, if you want to look it up on Google Earth) and afterwards it was decided that we'd go for a stroll around - grandmother loved a good English Heritage information board.
We went through the entrance gate - the big impressive ruined gatehouse (of the big house that was built in the abbey's place after the Dissolution, nothing to do with the actual religous institution - this will be relevant, I promise) is at our 1-o-clock some distance away. The driveway runs straight from the gate and bisescts the original driveway leading to the gatehouse at a right angle, so you have to walk along the perimeter of the site. At your 3-o-clock as you do so are the surviving remains of the actual Abbey - just some knee-high wall foundations and cleared floors.
Our attention was naturally on the big gatehouse, so it wasn't until we were about half way along the drive (say 50 yards from the gate) that we looked over to that bit of the site. To get to that point we had had to pass a Transit minibus left with no-one in or around it on the driveway (it was a blue Mk3 - I can remember it clearly. I promise this all relevant!). This was a summer weekday, so the site was complete deserted apart from the minibus, with no-one else in sight.
We both looked over to the Abbey ruins at about the same time. Over on the far side of the ruins, near the further boundary wall - about 50 yards from us, on the site of what had been the Abbey church's quire - were a dozen or more (no more than 20) monks. Think absolutely stereotypical 'medieval monk' - brown robes with a cowl, drawn up over the head so the face was obscured, hands clasped so the sleeves of the robes met. They were stood in a cluster in two or three rows and were absolutely still and silent. I assumed they were statues put there as some part of recreation display. My grandmother obviously came to the same conclusion because she said "Look, Chevrons, those are monks. They used to live here" and she began leading me over the grass towards them - presumably to look at them more closely and in the hope of finding an information board.
We had only taken a few steps onto the grass when my grandmother gasped..because the monks (which had been perfectly still and silent for the 10 seconds or so we had been looking at them) had suddenly started moving. They turned, the two or three rows merged into a single file, I'm pretty sure they bowed, and then they walked off towards the gatehouse (which had been built across the nave of the original church). Completely silent and unfased and uncaring of our presence. "Oh, they gave me such a shock when they began to move! I didn't think they were real!", my grandmother said. It had surprised me, but almost simultaneously I was both reassured by my grandmother's conclusion that they were 'real' and came to the same conclusion myself - they were presumably historical reenactors spending a summer's day walking around a derelict Abbey in monk garb, perhaps practicing for a public event in the future. Nothing strange about that. Presumably they had arrived in the minibus.The monks glided across the grass and went out of sight into the gatehouse.
We continued our walk around the site and the monks didn't really enter my thoughts again, so confident was I at the time that they were just reenactors. We walked around, read the noticeboards etc. We'd been heading across the grass towards the monks when they moved off, and we kept going in that direction, across the ruin foundations and then turned left to go to the remains of the cloister. We then turned left again to enter the gatehouse from its rear. I remember seeing, in the middle of the central room of the gatehouse - where the monks had been heading - two blue plastic storage crates and some boxes in a small pile. Monk reenactor supplies, obviously.
The only thing we hadn't seem more of were the monks. We never saw or heard any of them for the rest of the time we were at the site. As we walked back down the drive to go back to the car in the pub car park across the road the Transit minibus had gone too. The reenactors had obviously left.
The non-supernatural, rational explanation is obvious, and the one I've already spelt out. It's also the explanation that I was perfectly happy with at the time, and it was only looking back on the events later that it occured to me that it was a bit...weird. I find it hard to believe that we wouldn't have seen or heard anything of the 10-20 people once they passed out of our initial view, especially as we crossed right behind their path with a clear view to their destination. And are monk reenactor groups a thing? I haven't found any information about such a group when I have tried. Would a reenactment group just ignore two visitors? Would they have no assistants or bystanders while they practiced their monk-ly routine? Would they do it in complete silence? And with their cowls up leaving all their faces obscured?
Maybe. Possibly. We were never more than about 50 yards from where the 'monks' would have been, even if they were corporeal beings who had packed up their things, got into their minibus and left. And yet we didn't see or hear anything. But we never heard the Transit minibus (hardly a quiet vehicle) leave either, and I'm not suggesting for a minute that it was a phantom Mk3 Transit, especially a phantom Transit used by phantom 14th-century Premonstratensian monks.
If that is a 'ghost sighting' then it's a pretty impressive one - over a dozen individual ghosts, seen by two people simultaneously. I've had other weird experiences but have always been happily convinced by a rational explanation. I'm still pretty sure of the non-supernatural explanation for this one, but I don't find it entirely satisfying.
Martin350 said:
I love these threads, just read this one from the start.
I'm in the 'it could be explained scientifically and we don't understand everything yet' camp.
I had an experience which certainly highlighted to me the tricks our brain can play on us.
Some years ago I went through a period of several months with things going on in my life which caused me to have very little sleep.
One sunny summer morning I woke up and immediately saw a swarm of flies up around the opposite wall/ceiling, all flying about.
I got out of bed huffing and puffing about having to deal with it, opened a big window, grabbed a magazine (not one of those sorts, probably Autocar) and started swiping at them towards the open window, but they weren't going.
After a good 30 seconds or so they just faded away and vanished, I then assumed it was a hallucination and went back to bed.
A week or so later I woke up and there was a spider (which I hate), and I mean an enormous, dinner plate sized spider, crawling up the same wall.
I knew it couldn't be real because it was so ridiculously massive so I just watched it crawl around until that faded away too.
A short while later I woke up another morning and (I'm glad this wasn't the first one, to be honest!) there was either a young girl or very small lady (I didn't see the face) in a long white dress standing on the window sill right next to my bed,
I wasn't scared as I knew it was not actually there, and again it eventually faded away.
I've hallucinated spiders a few times since but sensible sized ones and after looking online it seems spiders are the most common hallucination.
If the girl/lady had been my first and only sleep deprivation induced hallucination I might have thought that it was a ghost, I don't know.
I'm not saying that hallucinations can explain everyone else's experiences, but it did go to show for me that in the right circumstances you can certainly 'see' things that aren't there at all.
I have had a few other experiences that have been a bit weird which I can't explain, but I'm not suggesting they couldn't be.
I hallucinate sometimes in the night, I've noticed it more if I get too hot. I've seen allsorts, spiders hanging from the ceiling, Dracula hovering at the side of my bed, a creature not unlike Gollum at the foot of the bed. The list is endless. All absolutely ridiculous things that I know aren't real! Its a form of sleep paralysis apparently (although I don't get the paralysis bit!) I'm in the 'it could be explained scientifically and we don't understand everything yet' camp.
I had an experience which certainly highlighted to me the tricks our brain can play on us.
Some years ago I went through a period of several months with things going on in my life which caused me to have very little sleep.
One sunny summer morning I woke up and immediately saw a swarm of flies up around the opposite wall/ceiling, all flying about.
I got out of bed huffing and puffing about having to deal with it, opened a big window, grabbed a magazine (not one of those sorts, probably Autocar) and started swiping at them towards the open window, but they weren't going.
After a good 30 seconds or so they just faded away and vanished, I then assumed it was a hallucination and went back to bed.
A week or so later I woke up and there was a spider (which I hate), and I mean an enormous, dinner plate sized spider, crawling up the same wall.
I knew it couldn't be real because it was so ridiculously massive so I just watched it crawl around until that faded away too.
A short while later I woke up another morning and (I'm glad this wasn't the first one, to be honest!) there was either a young girl or very small lady (I didn't see the face) in a long white dress standing on the window sill right next to my bed,
I wasn't scared as I knew it was not actually there, and again it eventually faded away.
I've hallucinated spiders a few times since but sensible sized ones and after looking online it seems spiders are the most common hallucination.
If the girl/lady had been my first and only sleep deprivation induced hallucination I might have thought that it was a ghost, I don't know.
I'm not saying that hallucinations can explain everyone else's experiences, but it did go to show for me that in the right circumstances you can certainly 'see' things that aren't there at all.
I have had a few other experiences that have been a bit weird which I can't explain, but I'm not suggesting they couldn't be.
Edited by Martin350 on Tuesday 13th October 00:02
TwigtheWonderkid said:
Martin350 said:
TwigtheWonderkid said:
liner33 said:
As I said, there is absolutely no video or photo that could ever be posted that could in any way prove the existence of ghosts.
Yes there is, a genuine one. Doesn't exist though. liner33 said:
TwigtheWonderkid said:
Martin350 said:
TwigtheWonderkid said:
liner33 said:
As I said, there is absolutely no video or photo that could ever be posted that could in any way prove the existence of ghosts.
Yes there is, a genuine one. Doesn't exist though. Either way, there is no evidence for any ghosts existing, but there is evidence for how they cannot exist.
Shuvi McTupya said:
MJ85 said:
What is going on in this pic, Is the 'green thing' actually there?Or
It’s a ghost. Yeah definitely that...
MikeM6 said:
Not quite, one says there could never be a photo that proves it. The other says there isn't one (inference being there could, but currently isn't).
Either way, there is no evidence for any ghosts existing, but there is evidence for how they cannot exist.
It's impossible to say for certain.Either way, there is no evidence for any ghosts existing, but there is evidence for how they cannot exist.
TwigtheWonderkid said:
ruprechtmonkeyboy said:
It's impossible to say for certain.
Can you give me an example of something we can say for certain?
'Russell' and 'teapot' rather spring to mind...
paulguitar said:
I was informed recently when saying there is no evidence that heaven and hell exist that I COULD NOT prove that they didn't. There seems little point in engaging further, really.
'Russell' and 'teapot' rather spring to mind...
I suspect it's along the lines of having to define what something is before you can prove it does or doesn't exist. In the absence of a definition you either believe it does or doesn't. 'Russell' and 'teapot' rather spring to mind...
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