Obesity, is it really an illness or a lifestyle choice?

Obesity, is it really an illness or a lifestyle choice?

Author
Discussion

hotchy

4,476 posts

127 months

Sunday 20th June 2021
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Some people genuinly put weight in easier. My pal and his brother prime example. Ate identical as kids, one was a stick, while the other a we round fat ball.

Although majority of the time its because they are pure greedy. I have another friend. 27 stone last time I heard. McDonald's... Big mac meal, 3 double cheese burgers, milkshake and 20 nuggets. Then would eat a tub of Ben and jerries once home. I do believe he has a mental health issue with food though the way he talks about it. He goes on a diet say Monday, so he will "eat double" since he won't get any for a while. Then breaks his diet by lunch time, rinse repeat. He will die before he's 40 and I keep saying that. Nope doesn't believe me.

MC Bodge

21,657 posts

176 months

Sunday 20th June 2021
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I'm not sure how much difference it makes, but some people consistently move/use their muscles more than others throughout the day -which might be walking up stairs, the way they sit, stand, readily go to get things that they need (rather than not bothering) , carry things and even "fidget" more than others.

GloverMart

11,833 posts

216 months

Sunday 20th June 2021
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I'm posting this before I've read any of the thread (which is probably unwise but anyway...) hehe

I'm 6'4" and always had issues with my weight since the age of 22. At school, I was a little chubby but sprang up in my late teens and was going well until I got a sales rep's job selling sweets. Always had some in the car = always eating and plumped up a lot. Got to Slimming World a few times and lost the same three stone fairly often but hovered around 19 stone.

Gradually over the past 20 years since I moved here, I've piled on the weight. Lost six stone in ten months back in 2015 (23 stone down to 17 stone) by going to the gym then put it all back on again. In 2019/20, I lost 5 stone in 10 months (23 stone to 18 stone), this time through walking but then lockdown came, I lost work, got a job that meant the walking stopped and ta-dah, I put that 5 stone on again inside twelve months.

So as I type, I'm 23 stone 6 and really beginning to feel every pound. It is psychological, I'll admit that but whether it's an illness or not, who knows. I think it possibly might be a by-product of something else; I've always struggled a bit with my mental health, I don't have much money and to be honest, buying the wrong stuff is often cheaper than buying what you should. I could binge eat for England, and often do, which I know is no good for me physically, mentally and health-wise but some days, I can't stop. I thought that maybe the threat of COVID might open my eyes up to the possibility of, well, you know, but somehow I avoided it, more luck than judgement.

Right, off to read the thread now. thumbup


Monkeylegend

26,465 posts

232 months

Sunday 20th June 2021
quotequote all
GloverMart said:
I'm posting this before I've read any of the thread (which is probably unwise but anyway...) hehe

I'm 6'4" and always had issues with my weight since the age of 22. At school, I was a little chubby but sprang up in my late teens and was going well until I got a sales rep's job selling sweets. Always had some in the car = always eating and plumped up a lot. Got to Slimming World a few times and lost the same three stone fairly often but hovered around 19 stone.

Gradually over the past 20 years since I moved here, I've piled on the weight. Lost six stone in ten months back in 2015 (23 stone down to 17 stone) by going to the gym then put it all back on again. In 2019/20, I lost 5 stone in 10 months (23 stone to 18 stone), this time through walking but then lockdown came, I lost work, got a job that meant the walking stopped and ta-dah, I put that 5 stone on again inside twelve months.

So as I type, I'm 23 stone 6 and really beginning to feel every pound. It is psychological, I'll admit that but whether it's an illness or not, who knows. I think it possibly might be a by-product of something else; I've always struggled a bit with my mental health, I don't have much money and to be honest, buying the wrong stuff is often cheaper than buying what you should. I could binge eat for England, and often do, which I know is no good for me physically, mentally and health-wise but some days, I can't stop. I thought that maybe the threat of COVID might open my eyes up to the possibility of, well, you know, but somehow I avoided it, more luck than judgement.

Right, off to read the thread now. thumbup
You do post some good jokes though smile

grumbledoak

31,548 posts

234 months

Sunday 20th June 2021
quotequote all
MC Bodge said:
I'm not sure how much difference it makes, but some people consistently move/use their muscles more than others throughout the day -which might be walking up stairs, the way they sit, stand, readily go to get things that they need (rather than not bothering) , carry things and even "fidget" more than others.
It won't make any difference. Your body is a collection of feedback mechanisms. If you burn extra calories it makes you hungry until you eat them back. This is why "you cannot outrun a bad diet".

Johnnytheboy

24,498 posts

187 months

Sunday 20th June 2021
quotequote all
MC Bodge said:
I'm not sure how much difference it makes, but some people consistently move/use their muscles more than others throughout the day -which might be walking up stairs, the way they sit, stand, readily go to get things that they need (rather than not bothering) , carry things and even "fidget" more than others.
I've often thought this. I'm in pretty good shape despite eating and drinking a lot, but I am naturally a very fidgety, active person, despite not doing what you would refer to as formal exercise.

My OH is a chunky delight; one of the key differences between me and her as when she is at rest she sits so still I almost think she may have died.

I've often speculated how much calories all those individual micro-movements add up to.

MC Bodge

21,657 posts

176 months

Sunday 20th June 2021
quotequote all
grumbledoak said:
MC Bodge said:
I'm not sure how much difference it makes, but some people consistently move/use their muscles more than others throughout the day -which might be walking up stairs, the way they sit, stand, readily go to get things that they need (rather than not bothering) , carry things and even "fidget" more than others.
It won't make any difference. Your body is a collection of feedback mechanisms. If you burn extra calories it makes you hungry until you eat them back. This is why "you cannot outrun a bad diet".
But not everybody eats them back and more though, do they? If they did, everybody, and not just most people, would be overweight in the UK.

Regularly moving about more appears to have a number of positive effects.

grumbledoak

31,548 posts

234 months

Sunday 20th June 2021
quotequote all
MC Bodge said:
But not everybody eats them back and more though, do they? If they did, everybody, and not just most people, would be overweight in the UK.
Don't confuse the two.

Fat people are fat because they eat too much, not because they are overcompensating for all the exercise they get.

MC Bodge

21,657 posts

176 months

Sunday 20th June 2021
quotequote all
grumbledoak said:
MC Bodge said:
But not everybody eats them back and more though, do they? If they did, everybody, and not just most people, would be overweight in the UK.
Don't confuse the two.

Fat people are fat because they eat too much, not because they are overcompensating for all the exercise they get.
I'm not.

I was suggesting that some people may "burn" more calories -without realising it- than others who eat similarly, which could *partially* explain why some are not as overweight as others. People who move, jump up from their chairs, fidget etc. are different in possibly a number of ways to those who conserve their energy far more (attitude towards/relationahip with food/hunger/habit snacking, activity, getting things done etc.)


Edited by MC Bodge on Sunday 20th June 10:00

GloverMart

11,833 posts

216 months

Sunday 20th June 2021
quotequote all
Monkeylegend said:
GloverMart said:
I'm posting this before I've read any of the thread (which is probably unwise but anyway...) hehe

I'm 6'4" and always had issues with my weight since the age of 22. At school, I was a little chubby but sprang up in my late teens and was going well until I got a sales rep's job selling sweets. Always had some in the car = always eating and plumped up a lot. Got to Slimming World a few times and lost the same three stone fairly often but hovered around 19 stone.

Gradually over the past 20 years since I moved here, I've piled on the weight. Lost six stone in ten months back in 2015 (23 stone down to 17 stone) by going to the gym then put it all back on again. In 2019/20, I lost 5 stone in 10 months (23 stone to 18 stone), this time through walking but then lockdown came, I lost work, got a job that meant the walking stopped and ta-dah, I put that 5 stone on again inside twelve months.

So as I type, I'm 23 stone 6 and really beginning to feel every pound. It is psychological, I'll admit that but whether it's an illness or not, who knows. I think it possibly might be a by-product of something else; I've always struggled a bit with my mental health, I don't have much money and to be honest, buying the wrong stuff is often cheaper than buying what you should. I could binge eat for England, and often do, which I know is no good for me physically, mentally and health-wise but some days, I can't stop. I thought that maybe the threat of COVID might open my eyes up to the possibility of, well, you know, but somehow I avoided it, more luck than judgement.

Right, off to read the thread now. thumbup
You do post some good jokes though smile
Thanks. But even that is fat-connected; people like me have low self-esteem so use humour to try to become popular.

Good to know it's working! hehethumbup

Having skim-read the thread, or should that be semi-skim-read.... I'd say that the times that I've lost the weight before, it's been down to exercising moreso than cutting out the crap food. For instance, the last time I lost weight, I'd still be having two slices of toast & marmalade for breakfast, white bread cheese sandwiches for lunch and a non-healthy tea too. It was just that walking an average of 3-4 miles a day was clearly helping me into calorie deficit.

I know now how my body works. Walking is a good form of exercise for me (don't have a bike, not fond of gyms or swimming, too fat to run) so once I get my head straight, I need to get out walking again.

Ayahuasca

27,427 posts

280 months

Sunday 20th June 2021
quotequote all
GloverMart said:
Monkeylegend said:
GloverMart said:
I'm posting this before I've read any of the thread (which is probably unwise but anyway...) hehe

I'm 6'4" and always had issues with my weight since the age of 22. At school, I was a little chubby but sprang up in my late teens and was going well until I got a sales rep's job selling sweets. Always had some in the car = always eating and plumped up a lot. Got to Slimming World a few times and lost the same three stone fairly often but hovered around 19 stone.

Gradually over the past 20 years since I moved here, I've piled on the weight. Lost six stone in ten months back in 2015 (23 stone down to 17 stone) by going to the gym then put it all back on again. In 2019/20, I lost 5 stone in 10 months (23 stone to 18 stone), this time through walking but then lockdown came, I lost work, got a job that meant the walking stopped and ta-dah, I put that 5 stone on again inside twelve months.

So as I type, I'm 23 stone 6 and really beginning to feel every pound. It is psychological, I'll admit that but whether it's an illness or not, who knows. I think it possibly might be a by-product of something else; I've always struggled a bit with my mental health, I don't have much money and to be honest, buying the wrong stuff is often cheaper than buying what you should. I could binge eat for England, and often do, which I know is no good for me physically, mentally and health-wise but some days, I can't stop. I thought that maybe the threat of COVID might open my eyes up to the possibility of, well, you know, but somehow I avoided it, more luck than judgement.

Right, off to read the thread now. thumbup
You do post some good jokes though smile
Thanks. But even that is fat-connected; people like me have low self-esteem so use humour to try to become popular.

Good to know it's working! hehethumbup

Having skim-read the thread, or should that be semi-skim-read.... I'd say that the times that I've lost the weight before, it's been down to exercising moreso than cutting out the crap food. For instance, the last time I lost weight, I'd still be having two slices of toast & marmalade for breakfast, white bread cheese sandwiches for lunch and a non-healthy tea too. It was just that walking an average of 3-4 miles a day was clearly helping me into calorie deficit.

I know now how my body works. Walking is a good form of exercise for me (don't have a bike, not fond of gyms or swimming, too fat to run) so once I get my head straight, I need to get out walking again.
Losing weight starts in the supermarket. You can’t eat it if you don’t buy it! Less willpower not to buy something than not to eat it once you have bought it.


grumbledoak

31,548 posts

234 months

Sunday 20th June 2021
quotequote all
MC Bodge said:
I'm not.

I was suggesting that some people may "burn" more calories -without realising it- than others who eat similarly, which could *partially* explain why some are not as overweight as others. People who move, jump up from their chairs, fidget etc. are different in possibly a number of ways to those who conserve their energy far more (attitude towards food, activity, getting things done etc.)
Those people will just eat slightly more than the others. But they will remain at *constant* weight. Equilibrium. Homeostasis.

People who gain weight are doing something distinctly different. They are eating more than they need, day after day, week after week, and usually year after year. Middle age spread takes twenty years.


GloverMart

11,833 posts

216 months

Sunday 20th June 2021
quotequote all
I think I'd add that in my personal case, a complete lack of organisation and motivation is my biggest issue. Life has no routine or structure right now (like millions of other people, I know) but I always struggle when I lose control of what I do in life.

Monkeylegend

26,465 posts

232 months

Sunday 20th June 2021
quotequote all
GloverMart said:
Monkeylegend said:
GloverMart said:
I'm posting this before I've read any of the thread (which is probably unwise but anyway...) hehe

I'm 6'4" and always had issues with my weight since the age of 22. At school, I was a little chubby but sprang up in my late teens and was going well until I got a sales rep's job selling sweets. Always had some in the car = always eating and plumped up a lot. Got to Slimming World a few times and lost the same three stone fairly often but hovered around 19 stone.

Gradually over the past 20 years since I moved here, I've piled on the weight. Lost six stone in ten months back in 2015 (23 stone down to 17 stone) by going to the gym then put it all back on again. In 2019/20, I lost 5 stone in 10 months (23 stone to 18 stone), this time through walking but then lockdown came, I lost work, got a job that meant the walking stopped and ta-dah, I put that 5 stone on again inside twelve months.

So as I type, I'm 23 stone 6 and really beginning to feel every pound. It is psychological, I'll admit that but whether it's an illness or not, who knows. I think it possibly might be a by-product of something else; I've always struggled a bit with my mental health, I don't have much money and to be honest, buying the wrong stuff is often cheaper than buying what you should. I could binge eat for England, and often do, which I know is no good for me physically, mentally and health-wise but some days, I can't stop. I thought that maybe the threat of COVID might open my eyes up to the possibility of, well, you know, but somehow I avoided it, more luck than judgement.

Right, off to read the thread now. thumbup
You do post some good jokes though smile
Thanks. But even that is fat-connected; people like me have low self-esteem so use humour to try to become popular.

Good to know it's working! hehethumbup

Having skim-read the thread, or should that be semi-skim-read.... I'd say that the times that I've lost the weight before, it's been down to exercising moreso than cutting out the crap food. For instance, the last time I lost weight, I'd still be having two slices of toast & marmalade for breakfast, white bread cheese sandwiches for lunch and a non-healthy tea too. It was just that walking an average of 3-4 miles a day was clearly helping me into calorie deficit.

I know now how my body works. Walking is a good form of exercise for me (don't have a bike, not fond of gyms or swimming, too fat to run) so once I get my head straight, I need to get out walking again.
To me you don't come across as a low esteem person, just a normal guy with a good sense of humour smile

MC Bodge

21,657 posts

176 months

Sunday 20th June 2021
quotequote all
grumbledoak said:
People who gain weight are doing something distinctly different. They are eating more than they need, day after day, week after week, and usually year after year. Middle age spread takes twenty years.
Of course. This is obvious. The people who don't, aren't, for whatever reason(s).

Mr Whippy

29,071 posts

242 months

Sunday 20th June 2021
quotequote all
Monkeylegend said:
GloverMart said:
Monkeylegend said:
GloverMart said:
I'm posting this before I've read any of the thread (which is probably unwise but anyway...) hehe

I'm 6'4" and always had issues with my weight since the age of 22. At school, I was a little chubby but sprang up in my late teens and was going well until I got a sales rep's job selling sweets. Always had some in the car = always eating and plumped up a lot. Got to Slimming World a few times and lost the same three stone fairly often but hovered around 19 stone.

Gradually over the past 20 years since I moved here, I've piled on the weight. Lost six stone in ten months back in 2015 (23 stone down to 17 stone) by going to the gym then put it all back on again. In 2019/20, I lost 5 stone in 10 months (23 stone to 18 stone), this time through walking but then lockdown came, I lost work, got a job that meant the walking stopped and ta-dah, I put that 5 stone on again inside twelve months.

So as I type, I'm 23 stone 6 and really beginning to feel every pound. It is psychological, I'll admit that but whether it's an illness or not, who knows. I think it possibly might be a by-product of something else; I've always struggled a bit with my mental health, I don't have much money and to be honest, buying the wrong stuff is often cheaper than buying what you should. I could binge eat for England, and often do, which I know is no good for me physically, mentally and health-wise but some days, I can't stop. I thought that maybe the threat of COVID might open my eyes up to the possibility of, well, you know, but somehow I avoided it, more luck than judgement.

Right, off to read the thread now. thumbup
You do post some good jokes though smile
Thanks. But even that is fat-connected; people like me have low self-esteem so use humour to try to become popular.

Good to know it's working! hehethumbup

Having skim-read the thread, or should that be semi-skim-read.... I'd say that the times that I've lost the weight before, it's been down to exercising moreso than cutting out the crap food. For instance, the last time I lost weight, I'd still be having two slices of toast & marmalade for breakfast, white bread cheese sandwiches for lunch and a non-healthy tea too. It was just that walking an average of 3-4 miles a day was clearly helping me into calorie deficit.

I know now how my body works. Walking is a good form of exercise for me (don't have a bike, not fond of gyms or swimming, too fat to run) so once I get my head straight, I need to get out walking again.
To me you don't come across as a low esteem person, just a normal guy with a good sense of humour smile
Mood and gut health are linked, likely in both directions.

Having white bread at breakfast and dinner is like eating bars of sugar for breakfast and dinner.
And sugar is what the bad gut bacteria crave.
The less good your gut health the less good you feel mentally.

https://www.eatthismuch.com/

Go on that website and if nothing else use it for breakfast and lunch ideas that avoid straight sugars/refined carbs.

One of my faves is one green banana and one egg blended up. Cooked as small pancakes, low heat with olive or coconut oil. A few blueberries and pecans.

grumbledoak

31,548 posts

234 months

Sunday 20th June 2021
quotequote all
MC Bodge said:
Of course. This is obvious. The people who don't, aren't, for whatever reason(s).
At the most basic it is nutrient density. If you eat low nutrient density food you will have to eat more calories to get the same quantity of nutrients. Your body will make you eat until it gets them.

On top of that we can add empty calories, like sweets and alcohol, and food engineered for the "bliss point".

All come under "diet" as in "choice of food". Which is often based on ignorance and miseducation, and the miseducation was not accidental.


98elise

26,644 posts

162 months

Sunday 20th June 2021
quotequote all
smn159 said:
MC Bodge said:
AW111 said:
An aunt of mine was obese.

She lived on low-fat meals (weight watchers), and there was no sugar, biscuits or sweets in the house unless she was having visitors.

She also worked full time and then some.


So yes, some people do have a genetic disposition.
Not everyone who is fat does, but some do.

I had the reverse - I ate whatever I felt like, did no exersize, and was skinny as a rake until well into my fourties.

So according to some of the idiots posting here, I am virtuous and she was lazy, despite her putting a lot more effort into losing weight than me.
rolleyes
I didn't know your aunt, but we can't, at this sort of level, as far as we know, contravene the laws of thermodynamics.

"Low fat" weight watchers meals aren't necessarily a good thing anyway.
It's hard to think of a worse diet than heavily processed ready meals, even if they do say 'low fat' on the lid.
If you look at say low fat mayo and normal mayo side by side, the low fat one will be full of sugar.

Sticks.

8,777 posts

252 months

Sunday 20th June 2021
quotequote all
GloverMart said:
I know now how my body works. Walking is a good form of exercise for me (don't have a bike, not fond of gyms or swimming, too fat to run) so once I get my head straight, I need to get out walking again.
If you don't mind me saying, I think you've hit the nail on the head here. You know what's good for you but you make decisions which aren't. A lot of us will have done that, still do perhaps.

All the guidance re exercise and diet appeals to our rational brain, we understand it. But often the decisions we make are from our emotional brain, which is very good at overriding the rational part. So we do things we know are 'bad for us'.

We respond to an emotional urge to feel better, then we feel we shouldn't have and feel bad. We feel bad so we respond to an emotional urge to feel better etc etc. This is tied in with self esteem. In the longer term we adopt a negative self image, we're a failure. You're not btw.

You know how your body works but perhaps spend some time reading up on how your mind works. Losing weight like you have before is a great achievement so you've obviously got a lot of drive, you just need to take control of the steering wheel, as it were. My guess is your starting point is believing you can. It's true about buying the right food. Your taste does change over time so you move from 'being good' to eating what you enjoy.

I'm sure others have studied this sort of thing and can explain it better.







eldar

Original Poster:

21,798 posts

197 months

Sunday 20th June 2021
quotequote all
Mexico is an interesting study in the growth of obesity. Not much mention anything but poor diet.

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/landia/article/...