Banging weights; wheres all my strength!?
Discussion
LordGrover said:
HarrySmith said:
Finally, one of the old timers! Yes, thank you for actually seeing that I do have at least half an idea rather than treating me like a kid. I have indeed looked at StrongLifts and Starting Strength and they seem fairly complex. Surely you would just get to a point where you would stall.
Yes, you will. That point is a way down the road and is no reason to not even start. At that point you will be substantially stronger than you are now. One day you will die - does that mean you give up now?HarrySmith said:
The deloading part is perhaps something I can add to my normal routine and then gradually transfer over to strong lifts. The example was helpful as well, thanks. Part of why I haven't gone to that already is because I just wanted to see how much I could "pick up and lift" before I tried anything "special" so to speak. It's just my own stubborness that has stopped me from giving something like SS a chance.
14 months is a long time to spend (waste) to find out how much or little you can lift.If you keep on doing the same thing expecting the outcome to become different you will be disappointed. Change something. You will not progress until you do so.
StrongLifts 5x5 is a beginners program for people like yourself (and me some time ago) to start. It is very effective. I am sure there are other programs which are as good or maybe even better.
HarrySmith said:
I have been banging weights heavily for 14 months now, I'm pretty sure that counts as "building into it".
Not always. It takes a long time for your body to physiologically learn how to provide a 100% contraction (or as close as possible, at least). You had a very basic, 3 day per week programme, that you say you haven't changed... It won't have done a lot to help.HarrySmith said:
I already have a basic understanding, I don't need you to give me one. Train hard, eat well, rest well, it's common sense really. I have been doing the same "programme" for about a year now, so I'm pretty sure you could learn a thing or two about commitment from me
I am not one of these idiots that runs around the gym with a notepad either, I DO record my results-IN MY HEAD!
As for eating yes, I eat fairly healthily (with a couple of snacks of crap) everyday and have a cottage cheese after each session.
So, all the really super-strong guys who record their weights do this because they like looking like idiots? Or like showing off? Ego perhaps? Wrong!! They record their results because it's almost impossible to remember exactly what weights you use, and how many reps / sets of exercise. it shouldn't be constantly 6 reps for 3 sets... I am not one of these idiots that runs around the gym with a notepad either, I DO record my results-IN MY HEAD!As for eating yes, I eat fairly healthily (with a couple of snacks of crap) everyday and have a cottage cheese after each session.
HarrySmith said:
I have not stated that I don't know a lot. I have read articles online for years and years; although I am under no illusions that that translates to years of real life experience. I thought you didn't know what you were talking about because you found the commonly accepted wisdom that focusing on compounds for strength was unusual.
Quote where I say, or even elude to compound exercises being an unusual key to strength? I employ deadlifts, squats, and all manner of Olympic lifts, along with kettle bell workouts, as a natural way to boost testosterone (and therefore overall muscle development), and build a very strong, very fit base, on which to build - in the same way you can't build a house without a good foundation. Big, compound lifts will give you a good overall strong base, on which you can develop more specific fitness or strength goals.HarrySmith said:
Haha, there you go again, if you haven't realised it yet you are PREACHING TO THE CHOIR!!! Have you even seen me train? No. I can assure you that I know all there is to know about hard graft. However, my training is based around a real world achievable diet, therefore I am NOT going to be eating something every 3 hours, that is against my training ethos.
I know what pain I can experience I've been there done that, like I said, preaching to the choir. You are coming across as though you think I'm one of these kids standing in the corner doing hundreds of curls with lightweight dumbbells.
To be honest, you come across like WIll Ferrel in Anchorman - you don't even do 1,000 curls, just like to act like it.... If you know ''all there is to know about hard graft'' - a direct quote, by the way, you wouldn't have needed to post on here at all. And I didn't say you should eat every three hours either! With all the jumping to conclusions you do, you shouldn't ever need to go to the gym!! I know what pain I can experience I've been there done that, like I said, preaching to the choir. You are coming across as though you think I'm one of these kids standing in the corner doing hundreds of curls with lightweight dumbbells.
All I said is ''regular meals''. That means that, eating one or two big meals per day is not a good way to achieve your required energy intake. If you can, 10 meals per day would be best, but for most it's unattainable. However, 5 small meals is easy, and MUCH better for your diet regarding your strength goals.Why would I have to prove you wrong? Getting strong is about focusing on compounds, training hard, eating well and resting, you have just told me what I already know.
HarrySmith said:
You are right about the over training. There are two reasons for this: If I don't over train I feel as though I am slacking. In addition to this, I've got loads of free time whilst at uni, when I'm in a job I won't be training as much (unless I go into the military). My training is based around REAL WORLD fitness, so I won't be dropping cardio or eating every three hours. I was just hoping I could get to body weight compounds on my current regime but it seems that I was wrong
Why can you not get strong with bodyweight exercises? If you can do 100 heaves, without dropping off the bar, then you are strong. Ever done a set of 5,000 press-ups? I haven't, as I'm not strong enough. Look up Crossfit and Sealfit. For sure, there are a few bits of equipment like kettle bells, dumbbells, and ropes, but nothing too exotic that you couldn't use in a gym. Although, a lot of the workouts are based on no equipment, so you could go to your local park, and smash out a hard workout. And if you need confirmation (which, judging by your character, you probably do), check out the Crossfit finalists - these guys are CRAZY fit, and strong. By doing simple, ever-changing, HARD exercise. HarrySmith said:
Finally, one of the old timers! Yes, thank you for actually seeing that I do have at least half an idea rather than treating me like a kid. I have indeed looked at StrongLifts and Starting Strength and they seem fairly complex. Surely you would just get to a point where you would stall. The deloading part is perhaps something I can add to my normal routine and then gradually transfer over to strong lifts. The example was helpful as well, thanks. Part of why I haven't gone to that already is because I just wanted to see how much I could "pick up and lift" before I tried anything "special" so to speak. It's just my own stubborness that has stopped me from giving something like SS a chance.
So after all this, finally you praise someone who copied and pasted a workout from a website you say you are familiar with.... ARE YOU FOR REAL...????!!!?! ARGHH!!!Maybe you should remember (but no dis-respect to LordGrover), a high post-count, and a long time on the PH board doesn't make his word any more valid than anyone else's. The content does. Nothing what I've posted is contradictory, and it's all useful. Putting up a programme is easy (again, no dis-respect intended), but if you don't fully understand WHY it works, or how, it's of little use.
You wind me up, but you are very funny. In an idiotic, child-like way...
LordGrover said:
Chaz9950 said:
So after all this, finally you praise someone who copied and pasted a workout from a website you say you are familiar with.... ARE YOU FOR REAL...????!!!?! ARGHH!!!
I say! Should be close to SL5x5 from memory but copy and paste?
Chaz9950 said:
Oh, and 'bulking up to put on muscle' is BS. Fat cannot be 'turned into muscle'. Anyone who claims it can, probably needs to do a bit more research...
It's an urban legend that stems (I think) from what eventually boils down to common sense and basic maths.
If you require 2,000 calories / day to maintain your bodyweight, and you start pounding the gym, it's obvious you'll need more energy to maintain your bodyweight. Say, you do an extra 500 calories of 'work' down at the gym, so your daily calorie expenditure is 2,500. But this is to MAINTAIN your size and strength.
So, as long as you eat enough protein throughout the course of the day (about 1 gram for every POUND in bodyweight), at regular intervals, you'll gain size and strength. The reality is, though, you can't say precisely how much energy you burn day-to-day. Which means to ensure your body has enough energy to actually build muscle on top of it's 2,500 calorie day, you need to eat more. So, for arguments sake, your body needs an extra 500 calories to repair and build muscle. So, now you need to consume 3,000 calories per day.
Again, it is impossible to get a solid number, so it's easier to slightly over-eat, to ensure your body has enough energy to build the muscle you've worked so hard in the gym, to get.
There are a number of tests that will offer a precise measurement of how much energy you burn during exercise.It's easy enough to figure out how many calories a person burns during the day by measuring skinfolds,body fat although this may be slightly out becuse of possible heredity factors like visceral fat.Eating protein is no guarantee of muscle growth.Your body does not need extra calories to build and repair muscle,all things being balanced ie kcals/lean muscle mass/diet it will need extra cals to maintain a cal/RMR or BMR balance as lean muscle burns more calories than fat.It's an urban legend that stems (I think) from what eventually boils down to common sense and basic maths.
If you require 2,000 calories / day to maintain your bodyweight, and you start pounding the gym, it's obvious you'll need more energy to maintain your bodyweight. Say, you do an extra 500 calories of 'work' down at the gym, so your daily calorie expenditure is 2,500. But this is to MAINTAIN your size and strength.
So, as long as you eat enough protein throughout the course of the day (about 1 gram for every POUND in bodyweight), at regular intervals, you'll gain size and strength. The reality is, though, you can't say precisely how much energy you burn day-to-day. Which means to ensure your body has enough energy to actually build muscle on top of it's 2,500 calorie day, you need to eat more. So, for arguments sake, your body needs an extra 500 calories to repair and build muscle. So, now you need to consume 3,000 calories per day.
Again, it is impossible to get a solid number, so it's easier to slightly over-eat, to ensure your body has enough energy to build the muscle you've worked so hard in the gym, to get.
goldblum said:
There are a number of tests that will offer a precise measurement of how much energy you burn during exercise.It's easy enough to figure out how many calories a person burns during the day by measuring skinfolds,body fat although this may be slightly out becuse of possible heredity factors like visceral fat.Eating protein is no guarantee of muscle growth.Your body does not need extra calories to build and repair muscle,all things being balanced ie kcals/lean muscle mass/diet it will need extra cals to maintain a cal/RMR or BMR balance as lean muscle burns more calories than fat.
But, with variations in your day-to-day lifestyle, getting an accurate picture is very difficult to do. Hence why I suggested it's easier to *slightly* overeat, to ensure you don't stall your own development. It's not an excuse to eat 10 Domino's pizza's everyday though! The food quality and content still needs to be good!
Chaz9950 said:
Not always. It takes a long time for your body to physiologically learn how to provide a 100% contraction (or as close as possible, at least). You had a very basic, 3 day per week programme, that you say you haven't changed... It won't have done a lot to help.
Yes, you are right my routine is basic.Chaz9950 said:
So, all the really super-strong guys who record their weights do this because they like looking like idiots? Or like showing off? Ego perhaps? Wrong!! They record their results because it's almost impossible to remember exactly what weights you use, and how many reps / sets of exercise. it shouldn't be constantly 6 reps for 3 sets...
Not really I just find it easy to remember figures. If I do (for instace, OHP) two sets of 25 for six and then three sets of 30 for four I can remember that easily.Chaz9950 said:
Quote where I say, or even elude to compound exercises being an unusual key to strength? I employ deadlifts, squats, and all manner of Olympic lifts, along with kettle bell workouts, as a natural way to boost testosterone (and therefore overall muscle development), and build a very strong, very fit base, on which to build - in the same way you can't build a house without a good foundation. Big, compound lifts will give you a good overall strong base, on which you can develop more specific fitness or strength goals.
Your post was based on a myriad of assumptions. Something about "building a foundation" I can't remember now but it was 90% assumptions.Chaz9950 said:
To be honest, you come across like WIll Ferrel in Anchorman - you don't even do 1,000 curls, just like to act like it.... If you know ''all there is to know about hard graft'' - a direct quote, by the way, you wouldn't have needed to post on here at all. And I didn't say you should eat every three hours either! With all the jumping to conclusions you do, you shouldn't ever need to go to the gym!! All I said is ''regular meals''. That means that, eating one or two big meals per day is not a good way to achieve your required energy intake. If you can, 10 meals per day would be best, but for most it's unattainable. However, 5 small meals is easy, and MUCH better for your diet regarding your strength goals.
The reason I posted here is because I wish to know about these figures being thrown around the net like childs play. How can a 75kg man squat 100kgs? All I said is ''regular meals''. That means that, eating one or two big meals per day is not a good way to achieve your required energy intake. If you can, 10 meals per day would be best, but for most it's unattainable. However, 5 small meals is easy, and MUCH better for your diet regarding your strength goals.Chaz9950 said:
Why can you not get strong with bodyweight exercises? If you can do 100 heaves, without dropping off the bar, then you are strong. Ever done a set of 5,000 press-ups? I haven't, as I'm not strong enough. Look up Crossfit and Sealfit. For sure, there are a few bits of equipment like kettle bells, dumbbells, and ropes, but nothing too exotic that you couldn't use in a gym. Although, a lot of the workouts are based on no equipment, so you could go to your local park, and smash out a hard workout. And if you need confirmation (which, judging by your character, you probably do), check out the Crossfit finalists - these guys are CRAZY fit, and strong. By doing simple, ever-changing, HARD exercise.
By "bodyweight compounds" I mean putting my bodyweight (90kg) on the bar and pushing it.Hope that's clear enough for you.
HarrySmith said:
The reason I posted here is because I wish to know about these figures being thrown around the net like childs play. How can a 75kg man squat 100kgs?
Well, I'm 90kgs, and I can deadliest over 180kgs, and squat around 160kgs. It's not impossible with training.I'm not Mr. Universe, or even close, but I have had a few years of strength training, running, cycling and swimming. I know some of this might be difficult to grasp for you, but what I've told you is all useful.
I assume you don't have a gym buddy? Try and get someone who is stronger than you, and is really up for training. That way, he/she will push you harder than you would have done on your own, and for heavy, low rep-high weight exercises it's a lot safer.
But then, slow and steady bench-press or bicep curl IS NOT real-world strength. When do you ever bicep-curl up a heavy box, or bench-press your garden into shape? You don't. I'd STRONGLY suggest you check out Crossfit and Sealfit workouts. They, in a small amount of time, will rocket your fitness and REAL WORLD strength up. Fitter, leaner, stronger and better looking. Who could say no?
Chaz9950 said:
Well, I'm 90kgs, and I can deadliest over 180kgs, and squat around 160kgs. It's not impossible with training.
I'm not Mr. Universe, or even close, but I have had a few years of strength training, running, cycling and swimming. I know some of this might be difficult to grasp for you, but what I've told you is all useful.
I assume you don't have a gym buddy? Try and get someone who is stronger than you, and is really up for training. That way, he/she will push you harder than you would have done on your own, and for heavy, low rep-high weight exercises it's a lot safer.
But then, slow and steady bench-press or bicep curl IS NOT real-world strength. When do you ever bicep-curl up a heavy box, or bench-press your garden into shape? You don't. I'd STRONGLY suggest you check out Crossfit and Sealfit workouts. They, in a small amount of time, will rocket your fitness and REAL WORLD strength up. Fitter, leaner, stronger and better looking. Who could say no?
Crossfit is good for REAL WORLD strength if you intend to get you garden into shape by running from spade to lawn mower, to gnome clean n press, then back to spade for 45 second bursts then collapsing after 15 minutes I'm not Mr. Universe, or even close, but I have had a few years of strength training, running, cycling and swimming. I know some of this might be difficult to grasp for you, but what I've told you is all useful.
I assume you don't have a gym buddy? Try and get someone who is stronger than you, and is really up for training. That way, he/she will push you harder than you would have done on your own, and for heavy, low rep-high weight exercises it's a lot safer.
But then, slow and steady bench-press or bicep curl IS NOT real-world strength. When do you ever bicep-curl up a heavy box, or bench-press your garden into shape? You don't. I'd STRONGLY suggest you check out Crossfit and Sealfit workouts. They, in a small amount of time, will rocket your fitness and REAL WORLD strength up. Fitter, leaner, stronger and better looking. Who could say no?
Strong is strong. If you can deadlift 300kg and sprint up a flight of stairs, then you can do the f
k what you want in your garden and bicep curl boxes for fun 
Chaz9950 said:
Well, I'm 90kgs, and I can deadlift over 180kgs, and squat around 160kgs. It's not impossible with training.
I'm not Mr. Universe, or even close, but I have had a few years of strength training, running, cycling and swimming. I know some of this might be difficult to grasp for you, but what I've told you is all useful.
I assume you don't have a gym buddy? Try and get someone who is stronger than you, and is really up for training. That way, he/she will push you harder than you would have done on your own, and for heavy, low rep-high weight exercises it's a lot safer.
But then, slow and steady bench-press or bicep curl IS NOT real-world strength. When do you ever bicep-curl up a heavy box, or bench-press your garden into shape? You don't. I'd STRONGLY suggest you check out Crossfit and Sealfit workouts. They, in a small amount of time, will rocket your fitness and REAL WORLD strength up. Fitter, leaner, stronger and better looking. Who could say no?
I don't have a gym buddy, I don't want one. They can't push me more than I can push myself.I'm not Mr. Universe, or even close, but I have had a few years of strength training, running, cycling and swimming. I know some of this might be difficult to grasp for you, but what I've told you is all useful.
I assume you don't have a gym buddy? Try and get someone who is stronger than you, and is really up for training. That way, he/she will push you harder than you would have done on your own, and for heavy, low rep-high weight exercises it's a lot safer.
But then, slow and steady bench-press or bicep curl IS NOT real-world strength. When do you ever bicep-curl up a heavy box, or bench-press your garden into shape? You don't. I'd STRONGLY suggest you check out Crossfit and Sealfit workouts. They, in a small amount of time, will rocket your fitness and REAL WORLD strength up. Fitter, leaner, stronger and better looking. Who could say no?
Again, ASSUMPTIONS. When did I say I do steady bench press? I train for strength, I power the bar up there fast. And I don't even do bicep curls so I'm not sure where you got that from
didelydoo said:
OP- you're doing it wrong. Stop 'banging' weights and lift them instead. What the feck were your starting weights if thats what you are lifting after 14 months of 'strength training'?
Either a troll or a moron, probably both.
HTH.
Oh dear I've got to deal with you again have I? Oh dead oh dear. my starting weights were as follows:Either a troll or a moron, probably both.
HTH.
Bench 30 kg
Squat 30 kg
Deadlift 60 kg
overhead press 10 kg
didelydoo said:
Crossfit is good for REAL WORLD strength if you intend to get you garden into shape by running from spade to lawn mower, to gnome clean n press, then back to spade for 45 second bursts then collapsing after 15 minutes
Strong is strong. If you can deadlift 300kg and sprint up a flight of stairs, then you can do the fk what you want in your garden and bicep curl boxes for fun
This large clumsy ogre is funny, can we keep him, please, pretty please?Strong is strong. If you can deadlift 300kg and sprint up a flight of stairs, then you can do the f
k what you want in your garden and bicep curl boxes for fun HarrySmith said:
I don't have a gym buddy, I don't want one. They can't push me more than I can push myself.
Bench 30 kg
Squat 30 kg
Deadlift 60 kg
overhead press 10 kg
Well apparently you can't push yourself very hard......so maybe think again.Bench 30 kg
Squat 30 kg
Deadlift 60 kg
overhead press 10 kg
You must be trolling, surely no-one is as arrogant as to ask for help and then act like Mr Universe when people start giving genuine advice.
You say you know all the basics, know how to eat and train properly, that you don't need to write down what you do (which is a very good way of tracking progress and increasing motivation), yet you can't lift jack s**t.
I bet you're that guy in the gym who calls everyone else "bro", wears gloves to lift those MASSIVE weights and slams down your weights once you've done a set.
Have a humble pill and stop being such an a-hole, everyone whos given you advice can probably lift more than you, listen to them
LordGrover said:
BenM77 said:
@LordGrover
If you read the whole thread it is pretty obvious he is trolling
I suspect there is a nugget or more of truth within.If you read the whole thread it is pretty obvious he is trolling
I'm outta here. :whoosh:
I suspect a PH regular having a bit of fun or an ex PH'er, harmless enough but I am impressed with the amount of people offering help. Must be the nicest training forum on the net
Stats now:
Squat: 60kg
Deadlift: 90kg
Bench: 50kg
Overhead press 25kg
Squat: 60kg
Deadlift: 90kg
Bench: 50kg
Overhead press 25kg
gmh23 said:
Well apparently you can't push yourself very hard......so maybe think again.
You must be trolling, surely no-one is as arrogant as to ask for help and then act like Mr Universe when people start giving genuine advice.
You say you know all the basics, know how to eat and train properly, that you don't need to write down what you do (which is a very good way of tracking progress and increasing motivation), yet you can't lift jack s**t.
I bet you're that guy in the gym who calls everyone else "bro", wears gloves to lift those MASSIVE weights and slams down your weights once you've done a set.
Have a humble pill and stop being such an a-hole, everyone whos given you advice can probably lift more than you, listen to them
You are mistaken, I don't talk to anyone in the gym. I lift, cool down, then get the hell out. It's not a question of pushing myself I push myself very hard thank you, it's just that I don't have physical strength due to my long limbs.You must be trolling, surely no-one is as arrogant as to ask for help and then act like Mr Universe when people start giving genuine advice.
You say you know all the basics, know how to eat and train properly, that you don't need to write down what you do (which is a very good way of tracking progress and increasing motivation), yet you can't lift jack s**t.
I bet you're that guy in the gym who calls everyone else "bro", wears gloves to lift those MASSIVE weights and slams down your weights once you've done a set.
Have a humble pill and stop being such an a-hole, everyone whos given you advice can probably lift more than you, listen to them
Edited by HarrySmith on Friday 11th May 14:26
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