Reversing Type 2 Diabetes
Discussion
C Lee Farquar said:
My one sin is ice cream, I've bought low carb but struggle with moderation. I'm
trying not to buy any. I did think potatoes, beer and bread would be difficult to give up but I've found that relatively easy.
Do you know what it is that you like about ice cream? Can you split it into component parts and substitute that way?trying not to buy any. I did think potatoes, beer and bread would be difficult to give up but I've found that relatively easy.
If you close your eyes, take a spoonful of ice cream what hits you? Is it the coldness or the sweetness or perhaps the flavour? Maybe you even enjoy the gentle melting of the ice cream and the subsequent washing of your mouth with dairy liquid or the feeling as it slides down the back of your throat.
If you can isolate what gives you the most pleasure you should be able to find something that triggers similar reactions. Perhaps double cream, super chilled with a touch of vanilla essence but not frozen mixed with crushed ice? Ice cream isn’t my vice so I haven’t looked very hard.
There are a few keto recipes eg https://www.gnom-gnom.com/keto-vanilla-ice-cream/
227bhp said:
C Lee Farquar said:
Perhaps most importantly I prefer what I'm eating now. I never feel bloated, I've found I can cook better Chinese and Indian than the take aways we were having.
How do you manage to eat an Indian or Chinese without bread, pasta or rice?oldbanger said:
There are a few keto recipes eg https://www.gnom-gnom.com/keto-vanilla-ice-cream/
Thank you. Thinking about what I like about ice cream, I think it's the coolness and the way it sits in my stomach. Currently trying just not buying it!227bhp said:
C Lee Farquar said:
Perhaps most importantly I prefer what I'm eating now. I never feel bloated, I've found I can cook better Chinese and Indian than the take aways we were having.
How do you manage to eat an Indian or Chinese without bread, pasta or rice?It's not better in the sense of having rice, naan, sides and three pints of lager, but the individual dishes generally taste better.
I admit the standard of our local Chinese take aways is appalling so the bar isn't high.
Coconut oil, fresh ginger and bok choy in stir frys are ingredients I'd never used before, I find them quite rewarding.
Seems like you’re making all the right moves if your MO is to put your diabetes into remission. It won’t do it of its own accord 
1000mg Metformin isn’t a huge daily dose. Over time on the real food diet you should be able to reduce that further and then stop entirely. The time this takes appears partially dependent on how far progressed your condition was when you intervened.
1000mg Metformin isn’t a huge daily dose. Over time on the real food diet you should be able to reduce that further and then stop entirely. The time this takes appears partially dependent on how far progressed your condition was when you intervened.
I think I had high blood sugar for about six months, I'd certainly had felt ill for six months. This gave me a good incentive to do more than take pills.
The alcohol isn't ideal, previously I used to drink 2 to 3 pints of beer a night. I enjoy it, I can go without or reduce but would rather not.
Overall I'm unsure if the improvements have come from weight loss, Metformin or the low carb diet, or a combination.
The plan is to have another blood test in Jan with a view to halving the Metformin dose. If my blood sugar levels don't increase I hope to look at giving it up altogether.
The alcohol isn't ideal, previously I used to drink 2 to 3 pints of beer a night. I enjoy it, I can go without or reduce but would rather not.
Overall I'm unsure if the improvements have come from weight loss, Metformin or the low carb diet, or a combination.
The plan is to have another blood test in Jan with a view to halving the Metformin dose. If my blood sugar levels don't increase I hope to look at giving it up altogether.
C Lee Farquar said:
I was diagnosed in June.
Gave up beer but have about 3 bottles of red wine a week. I have no rice, pasta, potatoes or bread. No cheat days. I did go to France for a week and did have a little bread with some of the meals.
We used to have take aways or eat out two or three nights a week. Stopped that, I've had a couple of kebabs without the pita bread.
No formal exercise but I do run rather than walk quite often. I don't go to a gym.
I have an apple a day, occasional strawberries and raspberries. No other fruit. I eat all meat and mainly above ground veg. No cook in sauces, pretty much all cooked from scratch.
I don't count calories but avidly avoid carbs. Generally I google keto recipes, I've found them very good. I don't know about the waist hip ratio.
HbA1c: On diagnosis 11.5, after 4 weeks with diet and 1000mg Metformin a day 8.5, 12 weeks 6.5.
I'd lost a stone in the 6 months prior to diagnosis and have lost a stone since. Currently 14 stone, 52 years old, 18.5% body fat, nearly all visceral.
I feel better than I have done for years, by some margin.
Perhaps most importantly I prefer what I'm eating now. I never feel bloated, I've found I can cook better Chinese and Indian than the take aways we were having.
My one sin is ice cream, I've bought low carb but struggle with moderation. I'm
trying not to buy any. I did think potatoes, beer and bread would be difficult to give up but I've found that relatively easy.
Out of interest, now you're being a bit more circumspect with you life choices, do you think that you were silly before? Gave up beer but have about 3 bottles of red wine a week. I have no rice, pasta, potatoes or bread. No cheat days. I did go to France for a week and did have a little bread with some of the meals.
We used to have take aways or eat out two or three nights a week. Stopped that, I've had a couple of kebabs without the pita bread.
No formal exercise but I do run rather than walk quite often. I don't go to a gym.
I have an apple a day, occasional strawberries and raspberries. No other fruit. I eat all meat and mainly above ground veg. No cook in sauces, pretty much all cooked from scratch.
I don't count calories but avidly avoid carbs. Generally I google keto recipes, I've found them very good. I don't know about the waist hip ratio.
HbA1c: On diagnosis 11.5, after 4 weeks with diet and 1000mg Metformin a day 8.5, 12 weeks 6.5.
I'd lost a stone in the 6 months prior to diagnosis and have lost a stone since. Currently 14 stone, 52 years old, 18.5% body fat, nearly all visceral.
I feel better than I have done for years, by some margin.
Perhaps most importantly I prefer what I'm eating now. I never feel bloated, I've found I can cook better Chinese and Indian than the take aways we were having.
My one sin is ice cream, I've bought low carb but struggle with moderation. I'm
trying not to buy any. I did think potatoes, beer and bread would be difficult to give up but I've found that relatively easy.
Zero regular exercise, takeways/restaurant food 3 times a week, a truck load of booze and overweight. Basically living like a wealthy student but actually in your 50s.
I don't say this to be rude - it's only information you've put here said back to you. I've said it just to see if you now see this as an unsustainable way of living or whether you think you've been unlucky with your diagnosis?
Badda said:
Out of interest, now you're being a bit more circumspect with you life choices, do you think that you were silly before?
Zero regular exercise, takeways/restaurant food 3 times a week, a truck load of booze and overweight. Basically living like a wealthy student but actually in your 50s.
I don't say this to be rude - it's only information you've put here said back to you. I've said it just to see if you now see this as an unsustainable way of living or whether you think you've been unlucky with your diagnosis?
I haven't really thought about it. If anything I was relieved with my diagnosis as I felt quite ill and didn't know why, it was nice to know that I could do something and could get better.Zero regular exercise, takeways/restaurant food 3 times a week, a truck load of booze and overweight. Basically living like a wealthy student but actually in your 50s.
I don't say this to be rude - it's only information you've put here said back to you. I've said it just to see if you now see this as an unsustainable way of living or whether you think you've been unlucky with your diagnosis?
I certainly didn't appreciate the implication of eating so many carbs.
My job is reasonably active and my scan suggested I was fitter than I thought. I didn't eat much in the way of junk food, mainly Indian and Chinese. I wasn't ever a huffing and puffing sweating mass.
However, now I'm thinner I notice how many people are fat. I also notice how much high sugar food is in the supermarkets.
C Lee Farquar said:
Badda said:
Out of interest, now you're being a bit more circumspect with you life choices, do you think that you were silly before?
Zero regular exercise, takeways/restaurant food 3 times a week, a truck load of booze and overweight. Basically living like a wealthy student but actually in your 50s.
I don't say this to be rude - it's only information you've put here said back to you. I've said it just to see if you now see this as an unsustainable way of living or whether you think you've been unlucky with your diagnosis?
I haven't really thought about it. If anything I was relieved with my diagnosis as I felt quite ill and didn't know why, it was nice to know that I could do something and could get better.Zero regular exercise, takeways/restaurant food 3 times a week, a truck load of booze and overweight. Basically living like a wealthy student but actually in your 50s.
I don't say this to be rude - it's only information you've put here said back to you. I've said it just to see if you now see this as an unsustainable way of living or whether you think you've been unlucky with your diagnosis?
I certainly didn't appreciate the implication of eating so many carbs.
My job is reasonably active and my scan suggested I was fitter than I thought. I didn't eat much in the way of junk food, mainly Indian and Chinese. I wasn't ever a huffing and puffing sweating mass.
However, now I'm thinner I notice how many people are fat. I also notice how much high sugar food is in the supermarkets.
Good to hear it's working for you. Do you feel like the metformin is a temporary thing and you can reverse this?
Badda said:
Do you feel like the metformin is a temporary thing and you can reverse this?
It's possible that I'm very receptive to Metformin and the diet has made little difference. I think it's too early to test this.I have to say I find it hard to believe that simply going on a low carb diet reverses diabetes and that the myriad of researchers studying the disease haven't noticed.
Simplistically It seems to make sense that if you have issues with blood sugar levels you do what you can to avoid ingesting sugar, so that's what I've looked to do.
One of Metformin’s standout benefits is its ability to discourage gluconeogenesis. Type 2 diabetics have insulin resistant livers. This means their liver tends to manufacture glucose even in the presence of insulin. Or in other words their blood glucose goes up if they don’t eat. Metformin is good at dulling this effect, particularly in the morning.
boxst said:
227bhp said:
C Lee Farquar said:
Perhaps most importantly I prefer what I'm eating now. I never feel bloated, I've found I can cook better Chinese and Indian than the take aways we were having.
How do you manage to eat an Indian or Chinese without bread, pasta or rice?Don't talk to me about cauliflower bloody rice! Tesco were having a clear out and i've got freezer drawers full of it
Right just wanted some input. Not diagnosed, just advised to watch it, we will test you again in a year.
Which wasn't at all helpful as there was no discussion of numbers, which we used to get after the annual test, but now it's been have the review, take blood, we'll call if anything. Nothing for a few years, until this year, with the watch it message.
So I can't report numbers, sorry. However two things happened, I made a decision that it's about time I went down at least a trouser size. Not a skinny mini by any means, but not a fat knacker either, but could do with losing some definitely. Second thing was to make a call and see if there was any help, which so far no reference to one of these courses, but promised a discussion with the specialist nurse. That date was a month and a half away at the time.
So I thought my diet wasn't that bad, though recognised portion control was an issue, biscuits, ice cream, and probably too much carbs. My Fitness Pal installed, set my target, losing 0.5 kg per week, it gave me a calorie target of under 2070 cals.
Which seemed a lot, so I went to find out my BMR, online seemed to average out at 1870, so I set my target to not break that, and aim about 10% below.
So far three weeks later only broken the 10% below limit twice and the BMR/MFP limits never. Over 5 kg gone already and can already tell by Christmas will be having to buy some new trousers.
What's amazed me is what I thought was a good diet was anything but. Porridge, proper porridge not instant crap, that's good for breakfast, right? Well apart from the portion control, the spoonful of raisins/sultanas I'd bung into the mix, along with a couple of dates, seemed to be using up a lot of the sugar allowance.
Eat oily fish they say. Smoked mackerel salad, not only used up sodium allowance but blasted it into the weeds.
So essentially aiming for low GI stuff where possible, but eating normally, but really controlling portions, and avoiding stuff like biscuits, ice cream, cakes and chocolate.
So my question, is this the right way to continue, will I benefit from the diabetic nurse consultation, ditto the course. Wifey is type 2 so has spare tester, strips, sharps, pen etc. Avoided using this so far as don't want to confuse myself. Is that the correct thing to do seeing as I've had no numeric feedback from GP yet.
Keeping on with MFP and diet feels the right thing to do personally and enjoying losing the kgs and inches. Any advice or support welcome.
Which wasn't at all helpful as there was no discussion of numbers, which we used to get after the annual test, but now it's been have the review, take blood, we'll call if anything. Nothing for a few years, until this year, with the watch it message.
So I can't report numbers, sorry. However two things happened, I made a decision that it's about time I went down at least a trouser size. Not a skinny mini by any means, but not a fat knacker either, but could do with losing some definitely. Second thing was to make a call and see if there was any help, which so far no reference to one of these courses, but promised a discussion with the specialist nurse. That date was a month and a half away at the time.
So I thought my diet wasn't that bad, though recognised portion control was an issue, biscuits, ice cream, and probably too much carbs. My Fitness Pal installed, set my target, losing 0.5 kg per week, it gave me a calorie target of under 2070 cals.
Which seemed a lot, so I went to find out my BMR, online seemed to average out at 1870, so I set my target to not break that, and aim about 10% below.
So far three weeks later only broken the 10% below limit twice and the BMR/MFP limits never. Over 5 kg gone already and can already tell by Christmas will be having to buy some new trousers.
What's amazed me is what I thought was a good diet was anything but. Porridge, proper porridge not instant crap, that's good for breakfast, right? Well apart from the portion control, the spoonful of raisins/sultanas I'd bung into the mix, along with a couple of dates, seemed to be using up a lot of the sugar allowance.
Eat oily fish they say. Smoked mackerel salad, not only used up sodium allowance but blasted it into the weeds.
So essentially aiming for low GI stuff where possible, but eating normally, but really controlling portions, and avoiding stuff like biscuits, ice cream, cakes and chocolate.
So my question, is this the right way to continue, will I benefit from the diabetic nurse consultation, ditto the course. Wifey is type 2 so has spare tester, strips, sharps, pen etc. Avoided using this so far as don't want to confuse myself. Is that the correct thing to do seeing as I've had no numeric feedback from GP yet.
Keeping on with MFP and diet feels the right thing to do personally and enjoying losing the kgs and inches. Any advice or support welcome.
FiF said:
So essentially aiming for low GI stuff where possible, but eating normally, but really controlling portions, and avoiding stuff like biscuits, ice cream, cakes and chocolate.
That's a good start, bin the obvious sugars and lose the extra weight. Keep it up! Your fasted serum insulin levels would be the thing to get measured, before and after the changes, if you are the geeky type. But "are you getting thinner", "do you need new trousers", "do you feel good/better" are all good questions you can answer for yourself.
And I wouldn't worry about the salt intake from smoked mackerel. Those guidelines were only ever made up numbers, and they have been reduced at least twice to be seen to be doing something. Just avoid ready meals.
Regular calorie deficit will just stall your BMR. You’ll lose a bit of weight but then regain it all and more. More importantly for you, the calorie restriction will drive your fat consumption down, making any blood sugar problems far worse due to the mathematically inevitable compensatory increase in carbohydrate intake.
Really though you need to know the data. A1c ideally but failing that just grab your wife’s meter and test your glucose. If it’s higher than 7 you’re probably on the way. If it’s higher than 7 after fasting for 10 hours then you have some serious choices to make, which aren’t really worth discussing until we know where you currently stand.
Oh and no, porridge is most definitely not a good breakfast choice for anyone with a question mark hanging over their glucose control. People will disagree with that statement, but they’re wrong
Really though you need to know the data. A1c ideally but failing that just grab your wife’s meter and test your glucose. If it’s higher than 7 you’re probably on the way. If it’s higher than 7 after fasting for 10 hours then you have some serious choices to make, which aren’t really worth discussing until we know where you currently stand.
Oh and no, porridge is most definitely not a good breakfast choice for anyone with a question mark hanging over their glucose control. People will disagree with that statement, but they’re wrong
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