Reversing Type 2 Diabetes
Discussion
Also to add, the numbers that are currently used to define diabetes are far too high. Normal healthy people should run an a1c of between 5-6%. Anything higher is not good, irrespective of what any GP will tell you.
Secondly try not to get mugged off by the “pre-diabetes” comfort blanket that gets handed out. There is no clinical condition called pre-diabetes. It’s just a neat name that fits you into a numbered bracket. The underlying problem is absolutely always metabolic syndrome brought about by chronically elevated blood insulin concentration. Pre-diabetes just means “it’s not all that bad, yet.”
Secondly try not to get mugged off by the “pre-diabetes” comfort blanket that gets handed out. There is no clinical condition called pre-diabetes. It’s just a neat name that fits you into a numbered bracket. The underlying problem is absolutely always metabolic syndrome brought about by chronically elevated blood insulin concentration. Pre-diabetes just means “it’s not all that bad, yet.”
Thanks for the comments and agree I need some numbers. Personally reckon the difficulty in getting numbers out of the GP is piss poor.
On the porridge for breakfast scenario, that's not every day btw. Probably three days a week. Other days, two days it's either eggs or grilled bacon, moderate cooked breakfast anyway, not a monster full English anyway. Remaining two home made muesli, oats, nuts, dried fruit, fresh fruit, seeds, soaked overnight Swiss style, no added sugar obvs.
On the porridge for breakfast scenario, that's not every day btw. Probably three days a week. Other days, two days it's either eggs or grilled bacon, moderate cooked breakfast anyway, not a monster full English anyway. Remaining two home made muesli, oats, nuts, dried fruit, fresh fruit, seeds, soaked overnight Swiss style, no added sugar obvs.
Kenny Powers said:
Also to add, the numbers that are currently used to define diabetes are far too high. Normal healthy people should run an a1c of between 5-6%. Anything higher is not good, irrespective of what any GP will tell you.
Secondly try not to get mugged off by the “pre-diabetes” comfort blanket that gets handed out. There is no clinical condition called pre-diabetes. It’s just a neat name that fits you into a numbered bracket. The underlying problem is absolutely always metabolic syndrome brought about by chronically elevated blood insulin concentration. Pre-diabetes just means “it’s not all that bad, yet.”
Apparently there's a new diagnosis for those that have brought their hba1c down under the 42 threshold with diet and exercise. "Diabetes in remission" this means once you stray in and out of the diabetic range you are never again considered "normal".Secondly try not to get mugged off by the “pre-diabetes” comfort blanket that gets handed out. There is no clinical condition called pre-diabetes. It’s just a neat name that fits you into a numbered bracket. The underlying problem is absolutely always metabolic syndrome brought about by chronically elevated blood insulin concentration. Pre-diabetes just means “it’s not all that bad, yet.”
It may be a load of toss, sounds it to me, just something I heard at work (NHS).
Maybe it attracts bonus qof points for GPs? Maybe not.
dave_s13 said:
Apparently there's a new diagnosis for those that have brought their hba1c down under the 42 threshold with diet and exercise. "Diabetes in remission" this means once you stray in and out of the diabetic range you are never again considered "normal".
It may be a load of toss, sounds it to me, just something I heard at work (NHS).
Maybe it attracts bonus qof points for GPs? Maybe not.
Diabetes is really a symptom. Elevated glucose. The disease is metabolic syndrome and it encompasses pretty much every modern degenerative ailment, from hypertension to obesity. It’s caused by hyperinsulinemia, in turn caused by too much glucose in the body. Rinse repeat. That’s basically it in the simplest terms. It absolutely can be put into remission and reversed. I know because I’ve done it It may be a load of toss, sounds it to me, just something I heard at work (NHS).
Maybe it attracts bonus qof points for GPs? Maybe not.
Edited by Kenny Powers on Friday 26th October 23:09
dave_s13 said:
Apparently there's a new diagnosis for those that have brought their hba1c down under the 42 threshold with diet and exercise. "Diabetes in remission" this means once you stray in and out of the diabetic range you are never again considered "normal".
It may be a load of toss, sounds it to me, just something I heard at work (NHS).
Maybe it attracts bonus qof points for GPs? Maybe not.
Apologies, I think I misread this originally. You’re saying the assertion is that once a patient has been diabetic, they are always diabetic, according to the new diagnosis that you mention? For sure there’s a lot of debate on that subject, but in my opinion, and that of many others, it is flatly untrue.It may be a load of toss, sounds it to me, just something I heard at work (NHS).
Maybe it attracts bonus qof points for GPs? Maybe not.
Diabetes is characterised, defined and diagnosed by measuring too much glucose in the blood. The body is unable to achieve homeostasis without drugs or worse, injected insulin. If a patient can achieve homeostasis without drugs, they are no longer diabetic. It cannot be measured. Indeed it wouldn’t be detected with the regular blood tests of hbA1c or fasting glucose. They may remain carbohydrate intolerant for the rest of their life, but the point missed is that carbohydrate intolerance made them diabetic to begin with. More accurately it led to the symptoms (diabetes).
There are two sides to this coin. Either the patient has purged the glucose and glycogen from thier body, no longer consumes carbohydrate and thus doesn’t need their own insulin to function maximally. Or, the patient is achieving glucose control through the regulation provided by their own insulin, as their pancreas is no longer clogged up with fat. Either way, someone in remission couldn’t be diagnosed. If I walked into my GP surgery today for the first time ever and asked for a midlife MOT, I wouldn’t be diagnosed as prediabetic, let alone diabetic. My a1c is 31, wake up glucose today was 5.1 mmol/L and my circulating insulin levels cannot be anything other than very low. I fail to see how any doctor could diagnose “diabetes in remission” simply by not finding diabetes. By that rationale everyone has it
There’s so much misunderstanding and misinformation out there, it’s scary. Worse, the majority of GPs are unwittingly playing their part in perpetuating the myth. Much to the silent approval of certain organisations.
So in summary, if someone says “you haven’t beaten it you’re just controlling it” they invariably don’t know what they’re talking about. Controlling it is the whole point. Achieving glucose homeostasis naturally without medication or indeed any medical assistance at all. In fact it requires shunning all current medical advice in order to achieve. It can be done even in someone with seriously advanced diabetes, they just have to stop consuming the one macronutrient that screwed them up to begin with. Moreover, when you understand that this macro is not required to support human life, you begin to see all the pieces of the puzzle falling into place.
It’s an unbelievably complicated subject, yet at the same time, at its core it’s very simple and very simple to fix the condition. Sorry for rambling on excessively again. I could, and very often do, go on all day
ETA: by “certain organisations” I mean the one that sells the food which brings about diabetes, and the one that sells you drugs that hide it by moving the glucose from your blood into your tissues where it can spend the next decade quietly killing you.
Edited by Kenny Powers on Saturday 27th October 11:21
dave_s13 said:
Apparently there's a new diagnosis for those that have brought their hba1c down under the 42 threshold with diet and exercise. "Diabetes in remission" this means once you stray in and out of the diabetic range you are never again considered "normal".
I sort of agree with that. If you look a few pages back that is more or less what I said about myself (no GP or outside input). I started at 80 something and am now 38 within 6 months. But I think the damage has been done, and the underlying cause has not gone away I'm just maintaining a healthier lifestyle and avoiding all carbs and hence not spiking my blood sugar. If I went back to eating 'normally' (in quotes as I use that word to mean as others eat) then I'm sure I would be back where I started in a year.
The underlying cause though is carbohydrate. You’re carbohydrate intolerant, which is why you became diabetic. Don’t eat carbs and you won’t ever be diabetic again. The human body has absolutely zero biological requirement for carbohydrate. Maybe it’s everyone else that isn’t eating “normally”?
Kenny Powers said:
The underlying cause though is carbohydrate. You’re carbohydrate intolerant, which is why you became diabetic. Don’t eat carbs and you won’t ever be diabetic again. The human body has absolutely zero biological requirement for carbohydrate. Maybe it’s everyone else that isn’t eating “normally”?
Yes I agree with you. I try and phrase it as 'in remission' or 'managing' as others seem to think that they can go on a diet for a few months and then all will be well whereas it is a permanent change if you want to stay healthy, boxst said:
Yes I agree with you. I try and phrase it as 'in remission' or 'managing' as others seem to think that they can go on a diet for a few months and then all will be well whereas it is a permanent change if you want to stay healthy,
Yeah I hear you. Incidentally I was only trying to offer encouragement that what you’re doing is worthwhile and a noble endeavour. Having the view that you ‘can’t ever go back to normal’ breeds a mindset of resignment to deprivation. I don’t know about you but I don’t even want to go back to ‘normal’. Becoming temporarily diabetic for a while was the best thing I ever did. f
k carbs Kenny Powers said:
Yeah I hear you. Incidentally I was only trying to offer encouragement that what you’re doing is worthwhile and a noble endeavour. Having the view that you ‘can’t ever go back to normal’ breeds a mindset of resignment to deprivation. I don’t know about you but I don’t even want to go back to ‘normal’. Becoming temporarily diabetic for a while was the best thing I ever did.
fk carbs
Yes, that is a phrase I use that mystifies people. I say that being diagnosed with Diabetes was the best thing that happened to me. It was a huge wake up call to get a grip and stop my sedentary lifestyle. To be honest and open here, my Mother died two months before so I was already a bit .... erm .... fragile. So it could have gone two ways: Diagnosis pushing me over the edge or the way I thankfully chose which was try and sort myself out.f
k carbs 
I’ve been reading recently about something that I didn’t know was a thing but now seems obvious. Double diabetes.
Type 1 who inject so much insulin to counter their carbohydrate intake that they become resistant to it and develop type 2 as well.
Type 2 who totally brick their pancreas by continuing to consume carbohydrate and become type 1.
What a metabolic shambles we’re getting ourselves into. But apparently all diabetics should follow the NHS advice to keep munching the starchy carbohydrates. Unbelievable
Type 1 who inject so much insulin to counter their carbohydrate intake that they become resistant to it and develop type 2 as well.
Type 2 who totally brick their pancreas by continuing to consume carbohydrate and become type 1.
What a metabolic shambles we’re getting ourselves into. But apparently all diabetics should follow the NHS advice to keep munching the starchy carbohydrates. Unbelievable
Kenny Powers said:
I’ve been reading recently about something that I didn’t know was a thing but now seems obvious. Double diabetes.
Type 1 who inject so much insulin to counter their carbohydrate intake that they become resistant to it and develop type 2 as well.
Type 2 who totally brick their pancreas by continuing to consume carbohydrate and become type 1.
What a metabolic shambles we’re getting ourselves into. But apparently all diabetics should follow the NHS advice to keep munching the starchy carbohydrates. Unbelievable
Yes I heard about this on a course I was on recently. Type 1 who inject so much insulin to counter their carbohydrate intake that they become resistant to it and develop type 2 as well.
Type 2 who totally brick their pancreas by continuing to consume carbohydrate and become type 1.
What a metabolic shambles we’re getting ourselves into. But apparently all diabetics should follow the NHS advice to keep munching the starchy carbohydrates. Unbelievable
Incidentally I've been type 1 for 40 yrs, not obese (5' 10" and 11.5 stone) and pretty well controlled. I eat a lot of rice/pasta/bread, not excessive amounts obvs
PositronicRay said:
Yes I heard about this on a course I was on recently.
Incidentally I've been type 1 for 40 yrs, not obese (5' 10" and 11.5 stone) and pretty well controlled. I eat a lot of rice/pasta/bread, not excessive amounts obvs
I guess as a type 1 you’d have to be pretty unlucky to also be otherwise naturally carbohydrate intolerant. I would imagine the bigger and far more common risk is type 2’s continuing to eat what caused their condition and thus melting their pancreas.Incidentally I've been type 1 for 40 yrs, not obese (5' 10" and 11.5 stone) and pretty well controlled. I eat a lot of rice/pasta/bread, not excessive amounts obvs
Edited by Kenny Powers on Wednesday 7th November 08:58
Kenny Powers said:
PositronicRay said:
Yes I heard about this on a course I was on recently.
Incidentally I've been type 1 for 40 yrs, not obese (5' 10" and 11.5 stone) and pretty well controlled. I eat a lot of rice/pasta/bread, not excessive amounts obvs
I guess as a type 1 you’d have to be pretty unlucky to also be otherwise naturally carbohydrate intolerant. I would imagine the bigger and far more common risk is type 2’s continuing to eat what caused their condition and thus melting their pancreas.Incidentally I've been type 1 for 40 yrs, not obese (5' 10" and 11.5 stone) and pretty well controlled. I eat a lot of rice/pasta/bread, not excessive amounts obvs
Edited by Kenny Powers on Wednesday 7th November 08:58
Kenny Powers said:
PositronicRay said:
Yes I heard about this on a course I was on recently.
Incidentally I've been type 1 for 40 yrs, not obese (5' 10" and 11.5 stone) and pretty well controlled. I eat a lot of rice/pasta/bread, not excessive amounts obvs
I guess as a type 1 you’d have to be pretty unlucky to also be otherwise naturally carbohydrate intolerant. I would imagine the bigger and far more common risk is type 2’s continuing to eat what caused their condition and thus melting their pancreas.Incidentally I've been type 1 for 40 yrs, not obese (5' 10" and 11.5 stone) and pretty well controlled. I eat a lot of rice/pasta/bread, not excessive amounts obvs
Edited by Kenny Powers on Wednesday 7th November 08:58
Kenny Powers said:
PositronicRay said:
Yes I heard about this on a course I was on recently.
Incidentally I've been type 1 for 40 yrs, not obese (5' 10" and 11.5 stone) and pretty well controlled. I eat a lot of rice/pasta/bread, not excessive amounts obvs
I guess as a type 1 you’d have to be pretty unlucky to also be otherwise naturally carbohydrate intolerant. I would imagine the bigger and far more common risk is type 2’s continuing to eat what caused their condition and thus melting their pancreas.Incidentally I've been type 1 for 40 yrs, not obese (5' 10" and 11.5 stone) and pretty well controlled. I eat a lot of rice/pasta/bread, not excessive amounts obvs
Edited by Kenny Powers on Wednesday 7th November 08:58
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